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'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture

By Jeralyn, Section Terror Detainees
Posted on Tue Aug 02, 2005 at 08:39:25 AM EST
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Benyam Mohammed, an alleged accomplice of 'dirty bomb' suspect Jose Padilla, has been around the block. Beginning as a 'ghost detainee' picked up in Pakistan, he spent two and one half years in prisons in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Morrocco and Guantanamo Bay. The Pentagon recently declassified his lawyer's 28 page diary of notes taken in interviews with Mohammed describing the torture inflicted on him which the Guardian has obtained and printed today.

In an statement given to his newly appointed lawyer, Mohammed has given an account of how he was tortured for more than two years after being questioned by US and British officials who he believes were from the FBI and MI6. As well as being beaten and subjected to loud music for long periods, he claims his genitals were sliced with scalpels.

....The lawyer, Clive Stafford Smith, says: "This is outsourcing of torture, plain and simple. America knows torture is wrong but gets others to do its unconscionable dirty work.

Here's the diary entry describing the slicing of his genitals.

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    'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture | 46 comments (46 topical)
    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#1)
    by The Heretik on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    Thanks for the update. It's a sad world where people do so much wrong when they just know they are right.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#2)
    by desertswine on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    An absolutely horrible story.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#3)
    by peacrevol on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    wow.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#4)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    Boy those Morrocans are nasty! I bet he wishes he went to Gitmo?

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#5)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    Let's see:
    In recent days the Bush administration is reported to have lobbied to block legislation, supported by some Republican senators, to prohibit the military engaging in "cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment", and the hiding of prisoners from the Red Cross.
    Now, why would they want to block this kind of legislation? Not hard to figure out.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#6)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    BB, What do you get out of making a snarky comment here? When faced with United States' complicity and active involvement in torture, your response is "bet he wishes he went to gitmo?" Yes, I bet he does wish he went to Gitmo where it seems we stick to more conventional means of brutalization. At least no reports of systematic genital mutilation. Yet.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#7)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    BTW, am I alone in being completely ashamed of our government?

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#8)
    by Quaker in a Basement on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    Cue Lee Greenwood.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#9)
    by peacrevol on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    Lee Greenwood sucks.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#10)
    by peacrevol on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    BTW, am I alone in being completely ashamed of our government?
    Many of us are disturbed by what we are finding out about our government. Perhaps this could offer a better answer in 2008.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#11)
    by Darryl Pearce on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    What goes around comes around.... Information Misinformation Double-crossing Double super-secret background and no girls allowed! Life is absurd... and worse.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#12)
    by theologicus on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    I wish that I could love my country and still love justice. --Camus

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#13)
    by Andreas on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    There will come a time when George W. Bush, Donald Rumsfeld etc. are put on trial, convicted and punished in line with the rules which were designed during the Nuremberg war crimes tribunal.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#14)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    c-law... What do you get out of making a snarky comment here? I dunno... a scolding from you? For all the talk about how nasty we treat these guys.... Gitmo isn't that bad .... considering what Morroco does, is it? Oh wait... I bet you'll tell me we are responsible for that too... right? We sent him there purposely knowing they'd do that...right? Yeah...we are so "brutal"... when I listened to big "Dick" Durbin describe how some of them were shivering on the floor because we turned the AC down too low, I just wept.... oh the humanity!

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#15)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    Yes, I think we probably did have a pretty good idea of what would happen to him in Morroccan hands, considering our penchant for turning over prisoners (I'm sorry, detainees) to countries that will torture in even more creative ways than the U.S. It's news to me that our only abuse at gitmo has been turning "the AC down too low." Thanks for putting my mind at ease.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#16)
    by txpublicdefender on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    BB, when our government intentionally sends individuals to countries that are well-known for using torture, we are just as guilty of the torture as the torturers. So, I don't really see any point in saying, "Hey, at least we don't torture people like those other countries." I cannot imagine it ever happening, but I would love to see the day that Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, etc. are indicted and tried for violation of the torture laws. Their intentional, flagrant, flouting of the law, and their repeated lies to the American people about it are despicable.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#17)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    c-law... It's news to me that our only abuse at gitmo has been turning "the AC down too low." Thanks for putting my mind at ease. I didn't say it was the only "abuse" did I? I'm sorry I left out these other "atrocities" --- We also turned the AC off (gasp) and the poor guys got too hot. Also...(hold your breath for this one) I understand barking dogs & loud rap music was used! Such torture! I'm sure it would be much better (they would hate us less) if we kissed them goodnight, tucked them in & read them a bedtime story....from the Koran maybe? Oh wait...that's right......we infidels can't soil the Koran by touching it...never mind.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#18)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    txpublicdefender... when our government intentionally sends individuals to countries that are well-known for using torture, we are just as guilty of the torture as the torturers. Ok...so we can't send them anywhere else...and we shouldn't send them to Gitmo. (You guys complain either way) So I'll bite...what would you do with them? Let them go and make them promise to be good?

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#19)
    by scarshapedstar on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    Harmless fratboy prank! Next he'll say they cut up a Koran! If his penis wasn't sliced the war on terror would have lost / troops wouldn't have been supported / Karl Rove wouldn't have gotten his latest raise!

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#20)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    How about we treat them like human beings? you can sned them to Gitmo, just stop abusing and torturing them. And let's give them a tribunal and letteing those that have done nothing wrong go free.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#21)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    BB
    We also turned the AC off (gasp) and the poor guys got too hot.
    Is that what happened in these cases? link link

    I can find a couple more, if you need them.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#22)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:50 PM EST
    BB, here's one more.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#23)
    by Randinho on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    BB, I have a suggestion: why not spend the night lying in your own feces and then writing about how you found the experience.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#24)
    by john horse on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    Lets play moral relativism. Guantanamo is not as bad as Abu Ghraib. Abu Ghraib is not as bad as what is practiced in Egypt and Uzbekistan. Uzbekistan is not as bad as Auschwitz and Buchenwald. And so it goes. You point the finger at someone worse in order to lessen the impact of what you did. Is there any sorrier excuse than we are not as bad as (fill in the blank)?

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#25)
    by Johnny on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    Yeah BB, that extraordinary rendition thing... Why don't you get a grip? If Al Qaeda were genitally mutilating Americans you would be frothing at the mouth about how it was all the liberal's fault. You are sick. You need help re-finding your humanity. Your callous disregard for human life and dignity would gaurantee a position of prominence in such noteworthy regimes as Hussein's, Stalin's, and Hitler's. Go blow your torture pipe on some narrow minded, bigoted, war mongering wrong wing blog.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#26)
    by ppjakajim on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    et al - Hate to be a stick in the mud, but outside of the prisoner's claims, do we have any proof? In the meantime:
    Mohammed, 26, who grew up in Notting Hill in west London, is alleged to be a key figure in terrorist plots intended to cause far greater loss of life than the suicide bombers of 7/7. One allegation, which he denies, is of planning to detonate a "dirty bomb" in a US city; another is that he and an accomplice planned to collapse a number of apartment blocks by renting ground-floor flats to seal, fill with gas from cooking appliances, and blow up with timed detonators.
    Sounds like a "he said - he said" to me.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#27)
    by john horse on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    PPJ I don't believe it, but I'm in agreement with you. We should be skeptical about the claims of either side. The Guardian article, for example states that Al Queda members are allegedly told to claim abuse in prison if captured. However, it also states that some of what he says is corraborated by flight records and the Human Rights report on Temara detention center in Morocco. However, lets not take what anyone says at face value. I hope you join me in calling for an open and independent investigation of these allegations. As Senator McCain said "We are Americans, and we hold ourselves to humane standards of treatment of people no matter how evil or terrible they may be. To do otherwise, as I have noted, undermines our security, but it also undermines our greatness as a nation."

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#28)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    Well said john horse. Arguing for legislation (opposed by republicans) that would prohibit cruel treatment of detainees in American custody, McCain also said the issue isn't "about who they are, it's about who we are." He's right. PPJ, I guess he could be lying, but one would expect some lasting physical damage--he says he suffered the razor treatment "about once a month"--absent that I think these claims could be dismissed as false. But the fact that they haven't been, when such an easy test of veracity exists, makes me think there's something to them.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#29)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    PPJ-

    "Sounds like a 'he said - he said' to me." Exactly. That implies there are two opposing views of the same story. That is the very reason we need an open and honest investigation. No one is saying they know all the facts. Here's what I am saying: If we've done nothing wrong, what's the fear of having an open and honest investigation.

    And let's add impartial to that list.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#30)
    by ppjakajim on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    John H - I too am astounded. c-law - He may have cuts. Who did them and when is another question.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#31)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    Very true. My point is that lasting physical damage would add a great deal of substance to his claim that he was the victim of torture. And if he did "have cuts," wouldn't suspicion fall first on his captors? I doubt wounds of this nature would be self inflicted.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#32)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    steve.... you can sned them to Gitmo, just stop abusing and torturing them. Well Steve...the problem is I don't believe a word of what the Bush hating left wing media reports. Has there been abuse...? Probably. Is it as bad as they say...? Probably not. Is this a war...? YES! Is the protection of the American public the FIRST priority of the president...?YES! DO these guys treat Americans with any respect? You can answer that one. Cheetah... We were talking about Gitmo. You can send all the left wing propoganda links you want. I can send just as many saying it's mostly BS. Randy Paul... I have a suggestion for you... How about not believing EVERYTHING that the media tells you. How about giving your country & your government the benefit of the doubt and not siding with our enemies... how about that? Oh and guess what? They'll cut your head off just as fast as mine. Johnny... If Al Qaeda were genitally mutilating Americans you would be frothing at the mouth Hello...anybody home? Not sure what cave you have been in but just to catch you up... Several Americans have had their heads cut off! Why aren't all you guys screaming about that! I'm sure Mr. Nick Berg would have opted to have his balls scraped or forced to lie in his own feces if given the choice. What do you think?

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#33)
    by kdog on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    "The Bush admin., 50% less inhumane than Al Qaeda!" Now that's a campaign slogan, eh? We should even be in the same ballpark as the animals who cut heads off. Thanks to the Bush admin., we are.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#34)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:51 PM EST
    BB,
    We were talking about Gitmo.
    FYI the story you were commenting on was not only about Gitmo, but Pakistan, Morrocco, and Afghanistan as well.

    Got that?

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#35)
    by Randinho on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:52 PM EST
    Randy Paul... I have a suggestion for you... How about not believing EVERYTHING that the media tells you. How about giving your country & your government the benefit of the doubt and not siding with our enemies... how about that? Oh and guess what? They'll cut your head off just as fast as mine. I have an even more valuable suggestion for you: Get control of the facts before you react. It wasn't the media making the allegations, it was the FBI:
    "On a couple of occasions, I entered interview rooms to find a detainee chained hand and foot in a fetal position to the floor, with no chair, food or water," the FBI agent wrote on Aug. 2, 2004. "Most times they had urinated or defecated on themselves, and had been left there for 18 to 24 hours or more." In one case, the agent continued, "the detainee was almost unconscious on the floor, with a pile of hair next to him. He had apparently been literally pulling his own hair out throughout the night."
    Think first next time, get facts on your side and don't just react

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#36)
    by ppjakajim on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:53 PM EST
    c-law writes:
    I doubt wounds of this nature would be self inflicted.
    They could have been inflicted by anyone at anytime exclusive of the dates of his imprisonment. Their existence, if they do exist, prove nothing. I would guess, however, that a good forensic doctor or pathologist could give us a guess as to the age of the cuts.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#37)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:53 PM EST
    Jim, again, that's true. Anything's possible. But if he was in the hands of the Moroccan's, who engage in torture, and he claims he was tortured, and he has scars that indicate he probably was tortured (enter forensic patholigist), see where I'm going with this? Yes, the wounds could have been inflicted at any time, but given the circumstances it's more likely he came by them in the manner he describes.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#38)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:53 PM EST
    sorry, pathologist

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#39)
    by john horse on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:53 PM EST
    PPJ, I can't understand why you are not joining me in calling for an open independent investigation. When there are two sides and you can't resolve them, you take it to an impartial third party. You're not scared of the truth now, are you? BB re:"Is this a war...? YES!" The Great Leader has decreed that what was once referred to as the "war on terror" will now be referred to as "the struggle against the enemies of freedom." Did you not receive the new party line or are you a running dog revisionist?

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#40)
    by Ernesto Del Mundo on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:53 PM EST
    I can't understand why you are not joining me in calling for an open independent investigation.
    Cuz that would allow the possibility of the Neocons looking bad again...and we can't have that since there is a war (errr...struggle) going on ya know.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#41)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:53 PM EST
    John H... the "war on terror" will now be referred to as "the struggle against the enemies of freedom. yes...because all you lefties complained about the monicker...So it's more politically correct now... but alas...still complaints from the doom & gloom party. That's it...from now on the Dems will be known as the "Doom Every Morning Sigh" party

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#42)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:54 PM EST
    Yes BB, they changed the name because "the lefties complained about it," not because when people hear "war" they tend to think of the "war" in Iraq which is responsible for driving Bush's approval rating to an all-time low. Even though you already know this, I'm going to explain it. They are changing "war" to "struggle" because people still have relatively positive feelings about Bush's record on terror and the admin would like to be able to talk about terror without conjuring up the disastrously negative feelings people have about the war in Iraq.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#43)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:54 PM EST
    BB-Since when does Bush, or any of his cronies, do anything the left wants him to do?

    I thought you wingnuts liked him because he never changes his mind, or his stance, on anything. You must be so terribly disappointed in your guy over this.

    Why, a person could say he's FLIP-FLOPPING!

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#44)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:54 PM EST
    The global struggle against the enemies of freedom
    The word struggle implies something that is open ended, whereas, the word war leaves only two options, win or lose. Bush knows that he is losing his war and he knows he can't hide the facts as easily anymore. So it's no longer a "war", it's a "struggle".

    "Conflict", "Police action", and now "Struggle", no matter what the war, when the U.S. is losing, it's not a war anymore.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#45)
    by Randinho on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:54 PM EST
    BB, So now that I have established that it is a representative of the US government who witnessed what he described as "torture techniques" and reported it to his superiors (which you apparently lack the courage to acknowledge), perhaps you can - if you haven't already done so as an adult - spend 18-24 hours in your own feces and report back to the rest of us what it's like.

    Re: 'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture (none / 0) (#46)
    by john horse on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:01:55 PM EST
    BB, The Great Leader has decreed that what once referred to as the "global struggle against violent extremism" will now be referred to once again as the "war on terror." Please make sure that what you think and what you say reflects the new party line. According to one of the party members, the cause of the change to the old moniker was because "lefties" complained about the new moniker. (Previously, BB claimed that the change to the previously new moniker was that "lefties" complained about the old moniker.)

    'Ghost Detainee' Tells of Torture | 46 comments (46 topical)