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Sheehan Arrested

By TChris, Section War In Iraq
Posted on Mon Sep 26, 2005 at 01:12:04 PM EST
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Update (TL):

Caption from Jane at Firedoglake: DC Police Study for Gyno Exams.

************
Original Post by TChris

Cindy Sheehan was arrested today while protesting outside the White House.

Others who were arrested also cooperated with police. Sgt. Scott Fear, spokesman for the U.S. Park Police, said they would be charged with demonstrating without a permit, which is a misdemeanor.

So much for free speech, and the right to assemble, and the right to petition the government for redress of grievances.

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    Sheehan Arrested | 98 comments (98 topical)
    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#1)
    by kdog on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    I guess the founding fathers simply forgot to add an asterisk to the first amendment. ***All inalienable rights subject to govt. issued permits. Some restrictions may apply. Void where prohibited. Is true freedom really that scary?

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#2)
    by Al on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    kdog,
    Is true freedom really that scary?
    Oh, yeah. To the Bushes and Cheneys of this world, who have made a fantastic living by bamboozling, intimidating, and cheating, freedom is the scariest thing imaginable. And with good reason.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#3)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    kdog - That dog won't hunt. There is no evidence she was denied a permit, she just didn't bother to get one. So, she got arrested. Tough.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#4)
    by Edger on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    Is true freedom really that scary? To those who gain power through deceit and the point of a gun...yes. link link

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#5)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    TChris.... So much for free speech So... I'm 'free' to shout "fire" in a movie theater? C'mon dude... you know better than that. BTW - They were warned 3 times to move along & refused. Sounds like a ploy for more anti-Bush trash to me. The left is certainly getting their moneys worth out of her aren't they?

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#7)
    by Lww on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    Weed-wacker, where was the point of a gun used in the national election? Some men can never state an ordinary fact in ordinary terms - all their geese are swans, till you see the birds.- J. B. Owen

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#8)
    by kdog on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    BB...Sheehan didn't shout "fire". She has every right to be there according to the bill of rights. Free speech by permit only is not the country my grandfathers fought for. My grandfathers fought for absolute free speech. I'd say the same if right-to-lifers got locked up. It ain't right in a free country.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#9)
    by Sailor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
    I don't see anything about 'unless they don't have a permit.' From the LA Times:"group sat down in front of the executive mansion, after being refused an opportunity to meet with a White House staff member. They sought to present a petition calling for the withdrawal of the U.S. troops in Iraq." They were peaceably assembled to petition the gov't for a redress of grievances. One doesn't have to obey an unconstitutional order, even from a cop.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#10)
    by ras on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    Um, no one cares if she protests. What she was really doing was blocking the sidewalk, deliberately, prob in order to force an arrest<.a> in an attempt revive a sagging pr campaign. As Rove's minions in the Associated Press put it: Sheehan and several dozen other protesters sat down on the sidewalk after marching along the pedestrian walkway on Pennsylvania Avenue. Police warned them three times that they were breaking the law by failing to move along, then began making arrests. But why listen to anyone else's take when a pic is worth a thousand words, esp if taken with a grin. She couldn't be happier. I know, I know, this takes all the fun out of it for some, no playing the wounded virgin while nobly battling the dragons of free-speech oppression and all that, sorry. Damn facts.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#11)
    by scarshapedstar on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    Jim, This may come as a surprise to you, but many key players in the Civil Rights movement were arrested and later vindicated. Can you imagine? They broke the LAW! The infalliable LAW handed down by God! Tough! And yet the American people somehow got this crazy idea that the government should have let these people alone in the interests of promoting the "freedom" they so conspicuously tout. Anyway, what I'm saying is, preach it, brother. You should cut out the "SHEEHAN ARRESTED WHILE BUSH WATCHES" headlines from the paper tomorrow and run around telling everyone how great it is. Never forget. Check back with me on November 3, 2008, and let me know how well it works out.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#12)
    by scarshapedstar on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    Also, ras, would you really have us believe that this is the first time in history that a political prisoner has had a smile on their face as they're tossed in the wagon? Good lord, you must be from another planet.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#13)
    by Mike on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    I was there. I watched the whole thing. Pennsylvania Ave. is like a six lane pedestrian highway in width. No one. No one at all was prevented from passing by, seeing the WH, enjoying their visit if they so chose. The protestors, about 100 of them actually in the "arrest zone" out of a total of perhaps 500 total (not just Cindy Sheehan) took up a small space in front of the WH fence. As I left, the police were slowly processing all of those in the small area (maybe 75' x 40') for arrest. These were mostly Gold Star parents, Code Pink folks, Iraq Veterans, I even saw one WWII vet. BTW, I stood in one place on Penn. Ave in front of the arrestee section for well over an hour. I wasn't told to move along nor was I arrested. A final note. This experience has been a real eye opener. The left wing blogosphere, the main players, have either ignored this protest or have been critical. I'm so pissed about this I can hardly type. Their words of anger about the Bush administration or the media will forever ring hollow because of their purposeful neglect. As I said on Kos, the GOP can take a turd and turn it into a gourmet dinner. The liberals are handed a grassroots turnout of hundreds of thousands against Bush, and make a turd out of it. Then they're amazed when the media calls liberals, weak, fragmented, divided, lacking cohesion, lacking leadership. I'm now convinced. Dems deserve to lose because they have zero idea how to work as a unit to amplify each other's positives....they seem to only know how to tear apart each other. BTW, my blog has pictures from the last 3 days in DC, and I'll be putting up more of today's event in front of the WH for the 3 or 4 liberals who give a ***t.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#14)
    by kdog on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    I'm sure Cindy is happy at the press an arrest generates. But that is irrelevant to the fact that her arrest violates the first amendment. To the lawyers, how can "protesting without a permit" laws survive appeals? To a laymen, such laws are blatantly unconstitutional.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#15)
    by ras on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    SSS, The pt is not that she's happy - tho that look on her face does tend to confirm that she wanted to be arrested - but why it happened. And as is amply clear, it had nothing to do with her anti-Bush rhetoric. She was blocking a public sidewalk, and would have been welcome to continue her protest had she merely moved over so that others could use it too. She might as well have been pulled over for speeding. The Left, at least judging from some of the above comments, has either jumped to a conclusion unsupported by the facts or is simply being a bunch of drama queens over this. I repeat: she sat down and blocked a sidewalk. Whether it's to protest a war or to sell trinkets, she was blocking others from using it. The cops gave her ample warning to just move over a little. Oh, and as for myself, why yes, I am from a different planet: Earth. Thx for asking. And take care :)

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#16)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    Kdog.. Sheehan didn't shout "fire". Ol buddy....you missed the point. We can all go on & on about 'free' speech.. but the facts are (and have been ... so don't blame it on GW) you can't just say anything you want anytime you want. My 'fire' analogy was but one example. I distictly remember getting wacked with a ruler by my nazi nun for talking in class. Don't think the 'free speech' thing would have played well with her! Unfortuanetly, loitering around national monuments is a no no right now. Instead of blaming our Government, why not point the finger at the real culprits?

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#17)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    The vile disputants in this thread have no honor. I suggest a return to the rule of NOT responding to trolls. "So much for free speech, and the right to assemble, and the right to petition the government for redress of grievances." I wish you would stop exaggerating, TChris. Ms. Sheehan is going to be arrested many, many times. She is completely fine with that -- she intends to make as much of a nonviolent fuss as possible, until Bush's FALSE AND IMPEACHABLE CLAIMS LEADING TO WAR are exposed to as many Americans as possible. Shaming the Federal police, shaming the Congress, shaming the American people -- these are important tasks in the path of exposing Bush's lies and his utter lack of concern for the innocent lives he is destroying. Such nonviolent civil disobedience is not the 'end' of democracy -- it is the Gandhian form of democracy. It is an EXPRESSION of the inherent rights of humans to oppose tyranny, oppression, corruption, and lies. We won't stop until Bush resigns and his crimes are investigated and prosecuted. Bush Must Resign

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#18)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    I think she's smiling cause that guy has his hand up her skirt.....

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#19)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    [Our soldiers] were placed [in Iraq] unjustly, dishonestly and as a result now, nearly 2,000 of them, American men and women, have lost their lives. Approximately 45,000 have been wounded and injured - many very, very seriously, in ways that will impede their actions for the rest of their lives, that will impact negatively on their entire future. And also as many as 100,000 Iraqis have been killed and probably about half that number were civilians - mostly women and children.
    Congressman Speaks Out in Defense of Nonviolent Protest

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#20)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:19 PM EST
    "Posted by BB: "I think she's smiling cause that guy has his hand up her skirt..... " If Army Specialist Casey was still alive, you would have a handful of teeth. COWARD.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#21)
    by kdog on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    BB Ol' Buddy
    you can't just say anything you want anytime you want
    Oh yes you can, as long as it doesn't put others in direct danger, a la shouting fire in a crowded theater. That's exactly what free speech is, saying what you want when you want. You feeling ok? I figured a couple patriots like us could agree on that.
    so don't blame it on GW
    I don't, I blame this instance on the DC police. I agree the erosion of free speech is bi-partisan, we even have free speech zones and bogus, illegal arrests in the liberal bastion of NYC. It's still wrong.
    Unfortuanetly, loitering around national monuments is a no no right now. Instead of blaming our Government, why not point the finger at the real culprits?
    The only culprits here are the DC police. You can't blame foreigners for our self-imposed free assembly restrictions.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#22)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Posted by Paul in LA at September 26, 2005 02:56 PM "Posted by BB: "I think she's smiling cause that guy has his hand up her skirt..... " If Army Specialist Casey was still alive, you would have a handful of teeth. COWARD.
    Very nicely said.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#23)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    scar - This may come as a surprise to you, but the people you refer to may have, or may not have applied for a permit. But no matter, they would have been denied. Now. Repeat after me. That is not the case of Mrs. Sheehan. And to compare her to them is a gross insult to those giants of the civil rights movement. You should be ashamed. btw - Bush is not running in '08. Just thought you'd want to know. kdog writes:
    I'm sure Cindy is happy
    I'm just curious. Why does the Left call her Cindy? Do you know her? And when they stop giving out permits, let me know and I'll join the demonstration. Until then I see it as a way to get orderly use of a public space. And for fading media made stars to get some attention.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#24)
    by roger on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Of course, this is what Sheehan wanted. She set the trap, and the DC police fell right in. This is not a win for W, it will just look bad, arresting a dead soldier's mother. Sadly, Sheehan is better at propoganda than W

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#25)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Sadly, Cindy Sheehan has to spend her time fighting the bastards who lied us into this war. Who was Casey Sheehan? A model American. By killing him, Bush has impoverished our country. Who was Pat Tillman? A model American. By killing him, Bush has impoverished our country. By killing 2,000 of our BEST, most courageous, most intelligent, most dedicated Americans, Bush has impoverished our country. Impoverishing our country financially is one thing. We always think we can make more money, repair the loss. But how do you repair the loss of these soldiers? Pat Tillman's NFL career would have made millions of dollars for the American economy. Money that won't be made. Someone like Casey Sheehan would have been the pillar of his community. Bush is the pillor of his community in hell. And the lapddogs who haunt this blog in order to spread his damnation are worthy only of their rightful place at his left hand.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#26)
    by Quaker in a Basement on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    No permit to own a gun, but a permit required to shoot off your mouth? Bah!

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#27)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Posted by charley: "when a mother, supposedly mourning her lost son, is led away smiling and waving, people will realize what a phony she is." No, actually charley, people realize what a phony YOU are. But if you want to believe that her arrest is good propaganda for you, g'head. Hurricane Cindy has been incredibly successful in tearing down Bush's love shack with inattentive Americans. Gold Star Mother vs. the Traitor-in-Chief. He's the one in the mask.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#28)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    So Sailor - you'll be just a-ok with the idea of any number of anti-abortion types standing on the sidewalk outside of an abortion clinic, chanting, waving signs, failing to move when asked - right? And TChris - I'll care about Cindy Sheehan when you care about the speech rights of everyone else. I have yet to notice you giving a hoot about the rights of activists on the other side.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#29)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    This poor woman is being used by just about all of you, stop it, her son was killed in iraq?...good god. Let her say anything she wants let her hit bush who cares, in 5 years she will still be looking for her son, do any of you get that?

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#30)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    PIL writes:
    Sadly, Cindy Sheehan has to spend her time fighting the bastards who lied us into this war.
    Has to? Why? What person or organization is forcing her to do these things? Perhaps they are the same people who want us to have 15 airbases in Iraq. Undoubtedly they are racists. Fred - You know, sometimes you almost make sense. Problem is, her son was raised by his father and his stepmother, not Mrs. Sheehan. Now that doesn't mean she doesn't feel grief, it just bothers me that she is all that upset, now. BTW - Welcome back. Been missing you. Hope all is well.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#31)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Jim, you are just about a raving lunatic. Do you really think you're selling your points? It's hilarious. As for the fifteen permanent airbases, do some research, you lazy sod. Actually, you know that the info is correct -- you just don't want to address it, because it exposes exactly what Bush's policy has been from the start. It is obviously against the law, which is why the complex and ever-changing LIE. And you, not a fool, but a cowardly fellow liar, who won't admit the obvious, for fear of having to give up your innocent act.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#32)
    by Al on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Oh my goodness, Cindy Sheehan and her friends may or may not have blocked a sidewalk! The humanity! Here is a description of Daniel Ellsberg and friends blockading the Federal Building in Boston in 1971:
    We had a circle of people all the way around the building, shoulder to shoulder, so no one could get in or out except by stepping over us. Behind us were crowds of people with posters who were supporting us but who hadn't chosen to risk arrest. In front of us, keeping us from getting any closer to the main entrance to the building, was a line of policemen, with a large formation of police behind them. All the police had large plastic masks tilted back on their heads and they were carrying long black clubs, about four feet long, like large baseball bats.
    Who do you think is the better citizen, Ellsberg or "I'm-not-a-crook" Nixon? Silly trolls, feigning outrage about sidewalks and permits. Damn your sidewalk. Damn your permits. Stop the war.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#33)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    when a mother, supposedly mourning her lost son, is led away smiling and waving, people will realize what a phony she is.
    Charley, it is possible for people to experience more than one emotion at the same time. If you don't understand understand this, you just need to grow up a bit. But until you do, just take it from us that your attempt at logical reasoning is inherently flawed as a result of your mistaken assumption that Cindy Sheehan could not possibly be sad and angry about the loss of her son, and at the same time happy that she is contributing to the war protest in a tangible way. On the other hand, if you actually do understand this, you need to explain why you are deliberately posting arrant nonsense.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#34)
    by desertswine on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Silly trolls, feigning outrage about sidewalks and permits.
    Yes. Cindy Sheehan grows in stature every day, while Little Georgie becomes more and more invisible.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#35)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Silly trolls, feigning outrage about sidewalks and permits. Damn your sidewalk. Damn your permits. Stop the war. Yes, poor Conservatives. Rallying in favor of War Corporatism. No one in the halls of power to listen to their cries. If only those who cry loudest for war could all be sent to the front lines, perhaps the rest of us could finally find peace. Our 18 year old impoverished children should be relieved and replaced with the fat warmongers whose bad values sent them there.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#36)
    by Sailor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    As a matter of fact protestors against women's rights are constantly outside my local planned parenthood clinic, yelling, waving placards and refusing to move when asked. But Sheehan's case is much more than just free speech, tho it is exactly the 1st amendment.
    after being refused an opportunity to meet with a White House staff member.
    They sought to present a petition
    ... or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
    I know bush hasn't read the US Constitution, but I thought you guys might at least have heard of it.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#37)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Quaker: Come out of the Basement already; I want to shake your hand! Right on the money, my friend, right on the money. And since we are talking free speech here, I have four words for you (well, okay, six). Here we go: Impeach; Remove; Prosecure; Execute. Any questions?

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#38)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    TChris said: "So much for free speech, and the right to assemble, and the right to petition the government for redress of grievances." Oddly, I've never seen TChris complain about the far more draconian regulations that are applied to abortion protesters. Some speech is more equal than others, hmm?

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#39)
    by Ernesto Del Mundo on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Our 18 year old impoverished children should be relieved and replaced with the fat warmongers whose bad values sent them there.
    They can't go. They have anal cysts. Or is it because they are anal cysts? War is swell when you can profit from other people's kids dying in it.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#40)
    by Kitt on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Someone way up top had this to say:
    kdog - That dog won't hunt. There is no evidence she was denied a permit, she just didn't bother to get one. So, she got arrested. Tough.
    From Jim Lehrer's 'Newshour' on PBS:
    KWAME HOLMAN: And for the first time in ten years, demonstrators were granted a permit to stage their protest directly in front of the White House.
    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#43)
    by Ernesto Del Mundo on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    The 101st Keyboard Klickin' Klowns will be happy to know that the real 101st is being sent to the desert.
    This is just the 5th time in the history of the 101st that the entire division has been deployed all at once. The soldiers will be gone a year.
    Here comes the Neocons foray into Syria and Iran?

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#44)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    PIL - Aw come on, the question is why we want 15 airbases. It's your claim. Of course you never provide links, just claims. But at least we know you know how to Google up snappy comebacks.... You write:
    I support both Pat Tillman and Casey Sheehan. I support the troops.
    No, you do not. If you did you would not write the things you do.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#45)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:20 PM EST
    Here is an analysis of "Rebuilding America's Defenses" that was issued 5 years ago to the month from PNAC.
    The Air Force presence in the Gulf region is a vital one for U.S. military strategy, and the United States should consider it a de facto permanent presence, even as it seeks ways to lessen Saudi, Kuwaiti and regional concerns about U.S. presence
    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#46)
    by Sailor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    The best way to support the troops is to bring them home.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#47)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    Paul in La LA / Laberynth13.. Jeeez.. get sense of humor will ya? It was a joke. Paul... some of your posts are quite interesting... too bad you have to resort to childish name calling in almost all of them. Am I wrong in assuming you're an 'adult'? Oh and BTW... if you must call names...at least get them right. Joking on Cindy doesn't make me a coward... any more than repeating things I hear makes me a liar. I asked you on another post to define Liar and you never did. Apperently a liar is anybody that disagrees with you.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#48)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    Kdog... You feeling ok? I figured a couple patriots like us could agree on that. Yes... I agree 100%. But...the facts are ...she was told to move & didn't. She wanted to get arrested. So what's the big scmoo? Roger... This is not a win for W. I'm sure he personally put the word out to arrest her. LOL... Man you guys are sure certain that GW has his finger on the pulse of everything aren't you? Pretty good for an idiot that supposedly knows nothing isn't it? Paul in la la.. Nice work on posting the obvious...except you left out one minor detail... both these guys volunteered. Hello...anybody home? Oh yes & one other small point that goes along with that... Islamic crazies are responsible for their deaths.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#49)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    desertwine... Cindy Sheehan grows in stature every day, Yes...by all you on the left that have used her for your own aganda. But most of the rest of the population thinks she's a joke. Any sorrow I felt for her has long evaporated. Al... Silly trolls, feigning outrage about sidewalks and permits. LOL...The only ones outraged here are you guys about her being arrested. Most of the rest of us could care less Tampa..... Rallying in favor of War Corporatism. Clueless as usual. What are you a student of again? The rally was not in support of the war...(despite what all you would like to believe... nobody is in favor of war...but most of us realize sometimes it becomes a necessity) it was a rally against the anti-American rally you lefties were trying to hold.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#50)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    Sailor - you might look at this. There's been a long effort to suppress speech - by both left and right - when the speech in question is speech they don't like. The left obsesses over anti-abortion protesters, and the right obsesses over flag burning. Both need to grow the heck up.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#51)
    by roger on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    BB, Of course W did not personally order the arrest, but it did occur right outside his house. Perception is more powerful than fact. I stand by my statement (except for her smiling- dumb move on her part IMHO)

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#52)
    by kdog on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    But...the facts are ...she was told to move & didn't. She wanted to get arrested. So what's the big scmoo?
    Being ordered to "move" aka breaking up a peaceable assembly, is an illegal order. They are just cops BB, not gods. They had no legal right to force her to move, and no legal right to arrest her. No big scmoo I guess, but I just hate seeing the original intent of the Bill of Rights getting pissed on by cops who should be trained to know better, and I especially hate the apathy of the people when it comes to the Bill of Rights being ignored. I was checking out a right wing blog and commenters were cheering her arrest! To me, that is akin to muslim crazies cheering for death to America. Quite simply, America IS the Bill of Rights. Without it, we are just another banana republic.
    There's been a long effort to suppress speech - by both left and right - when the speech in question is speech they don't like. The left obsesses over anti-abortion protesters, and the right obsesses over flag burning.
    Absolutely right JR. Freedom is having to hear what you don't want to hear. Anyone at a first grade reading level can see that this arrest was un-american, just the same as the arrest of pro-life protesters peaceably assembled outside a clinic is un-american. I thought this was something all americans could agree on? Has the Bill of Rights become the latest battlefield of partisan bickering? I certainly hope not.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#53)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    DA - A five year old strategy is like last week's newspaper.... Interesting perhaps, but out of date. BTW - Nice non-partisan blog you link to. sailor writes:
    The best way to support the troops is to bring them home.
    That's what the French said.
    All the men gathered in Hitler's study had feared that French armies would march against Germany. At the time, German defense forces on the Western front had been feeble. Their commander, General Wilhelm Ritter yon Leeb, had warned Brauchitsch that he could do little to stop French troops from walking in and taking over the Ruhr River Valley.
    It is always best to take the initative. As Patton said, "I don't want to pay for the same ground twice."

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#54)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    Want to see an example of freedom of speech in action? Check out this link. Brian Haw, the guy in question, has been protesting the War in Iraq on the pavement outside the Houses of Parliament in London 24 hours a day for 1500 days. That's right - over 4 whole years.. He has been there through rain, snow, summer and cold British winter, all day and all night. He sleeps under a tarpaulin. I'm no fan of the UK authorities or Tony Blair and I'm saddened that they have decided to create new legislation to outlaw this kind of protest. But it makes me feel proud of the Metropolitan Police that they acknowledge that Brian Haw's protest is legitimate and haven't tried to suppress his right to be heard by some phony concern for "keeping the pavement clear". As Jim would say, that's just a load of Horse Hockey. He has no permit. His protest takes up about 40 yards of pavement RIGHT OUTSIDE the main entrance to the Houses of Parliament. Apparently, early on in his protest a policeman asked him how long he intended to stay. His reply: "As long as it takes". True dedication. No-one ever said that peace was the easy path. "Blocking the pavement" Pah. Tell me again about the Land of the Free, guys. Land of the Free, my arse.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#55)
    by kdog on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    Ian...major props to the London Metro police for their understanding of freedom. Maybe we could send the DC and NY police dept.'s over the pond for freedom training.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#56)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    Ian, It's now the land of the fee, and the home of the chickenhawks.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#57)
    by BigTex on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:21 PM EST
    She said Rita is just a little wind and a little rain. A little wind? A little rain? I'd go into a verbal diatribe here, but am off to look for my missing brother in law. But having fled into an area that the NE eyewall passed through it was more than a little wind and a little rain. I am truly sorry her son was killed, but her comments are inexcusible. The worst part is that she had to be shamed into saying she was sorry for those comments. I hope she shows up in Houston again. She needs to be held accountable for her actions.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#58)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:22 PM EST
    The troll Jim: "DA - A five year old strategy is like last week's newspaper.... Interesting perhaps, but out of date." "FOB Bernstein [Tuz Khurmatu AB] FOB Chosin [Al Iskandariyah AB] FOB Cooke [Taji AB] FOB Delta [Kut AB] FOB Endurance [Quyarrah AB] FOB Ferrin-Huggins [Rasheed AB] FOB Glory [Mosul AB] FOB Grant [Tal Ashtah AB] FOB Guardian City [Al Taqaddum AB] FOB Gunner [Taji AB] FOB Headhunter [Baghdad AB] FOB Manhattan [Habbaniyah AB] FOB McKenzie [Samarra East AB] FOB Morgan [Baghdad IAP] FOB Muleskinner [Rasheed AB] FOB Pacesetter [Samarra East AB] FOB Q-West [Quyarrah AB] FOB Ridgway/Ridgeway [Al Taqaddum AB] FOB Speicher [al-Sahra AB] FOB Warhorse [Baquba AF] FOB Warrior [Kirkuk AB] FOB Webster [Al Asad AB] FOB Wyatt [Balad AB] Occupation Bases Camp Victory North • Senator John Kerry outed the permanency of these US bases in the first debate in 2004, in front of 60 million Americans. • Former Senator Gary Hart, on the Huffington Post, specifically said (paraphrase) "It's simple: either we are withdrawing from Iraq, or we have permanent airbases. If we have permanent airbases, we are not withdrawing." • The first $87 billion fund for Iraq '(re)building' included $10 billion for polymer cement, needed for MASSIVE permanent improvements of airfields. • A tiny fraction of the rebuilding money has been spent on rebuilding. Most of it has been spent on BUILDING OUT those airbases, as can be seen in the Victory North comparative photos. This is not at all meant to be an inclusive survey of this issue. This is five minutes with Google doing what Jim cannot. All Jim can do is lick the arse of a dog.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#59)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:22 PM EST
    Oh, I believe 'Victory North' is otherwise known as 'Headhunter.' I could easily be wrong on the nomenclature, since I'm not a military hobbyist, just a DISGUSTED American. Invading a sovereign country on trumped up charges in order to install airbases is GENOCIDE. Invading Afghanistan in order to install airbases and oil and LNG pipelines is also a war for profit, especially when the primary target is allowed to leave. Whether through incompetence or negligence, allowing OBL to escape was and is an impeachable offense. Bush Must Resign.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#60)
    by Ernesto Del Mundo on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:22 PM EST
    BigTex...did you see this.
    ...we came out of this in pretty good shape," Perry said.
    Kind of insensitive, huh? Hope your kinfolk are all safe.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#61)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:22 PM EST
    Totally off-topic of me but... BigTex: I'm so sorry about your brother-in-law! I hope he turns out to be safe and sound, and I'm glad you're OK. That hurricane sounded like a nightmare.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#62)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:22 PM EST
    "In mid-September 2004, as part of an Army-wide effort to give its facilities around Baghdad friendlier connotations, and try to resolve the issue of constantly-changing facility names, Camp Gunslinger was renamed Camp Solidarity." *Please make a note of it.*

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#63)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:22 PM EST
    Jim said: "It is always best to take the initative." Yes, that's what Hitler said as well.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#64)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    Paulie.... I will be driving through the fair city of LA LA next week....(probably next Tues the 4th) Praytell... where will your latest protest be? I'd love to join in...

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#65)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    Everyone is welcome in Los Angeles, except racists. Stay out of LA, BB. We don't want your kind of hatred-mongers here.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#66)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    Cindy Sheehan -- what a hero -- I am especially proud of her when her anti-American/Western incendiary statements and actions(RIP Casey - a volunteer) inspire an islamist radical to blow himself up, killing innocent Iraqi children, political figureheads, Americans, or any of the other 100,000+ "Caseys" still serving this country. Is it Bush who is "killing" Iraqi's and Americans? NO -- Cindy Sheehan has blood on her hands and dripping off her newfound limelight - Congratulations -- can't wait for the book, movie, interview, merchandise... (darn capitalists!) What a sick pup

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#67)
    by soccerdad on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    No, the people who have blood on their hands is this administration and all their supporters for continuing to support a war based on lies in which many innocent civilians have been killed by US forces while destroying much of their country. So it is you hannityiscrazy who has much blood dripping from your hands. But since I doubt you have a conscience or a shred of morality you don't care. BTW standard Rethug tactic of trying to destroy the person instead of dealing with the issue. So what else is new.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#68)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    Issue: anti-American feeding islamic fundamentalist fire resulting in death of perfectly good Americans. I will continue to lash out against anyone putting more good boys and girls in greater danger than they otherwise would have been. BTW -- majority of Americans voted in BUsh, 2x. Also, your "golden boy" Kerry supported the war in Iraq. So... I don't understand where you are coming from.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#69)
    by Ernesto Del Mundo on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    Issue: anti-American feeding islamic fundamentalist fire resulting in death of perfectly good Americans.
    Nope, actually it's the occupation of a country that was no threat to U.S. causing those deaths. And it doesn't matter whether 51 percent voted for Bush or Kerry. It's still wrong and illegal and stupid. And where I am coming from is based on facts, not fantasy and false patriotism.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#70)
    by soccerdad on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    anti-American feeding islamic fundamentalist fire resulting in death of perfectly good Americans
    So I take it you will condemn the US military for arresting, torturing, andkilling innocent Iraqis which inflames anti-american feelings? Don't worry I wont hold my breath you are just another pantload of hypocrisy.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#71)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    BB, who consistently writes in support of American leaders that choose to send our inexperienced young men and women to foreign lands to kill foreigners so that unaccountable American led Corporations can obtain cheap raw materials to boost Corporate profits, spews the following garbage... "The rally was not in support of the war...(despite what all you would like to believe... nobody is in favor of war...but most of us realize sometimes it becomes a necessity) it was a rally against the anti-American rally you lefties were trying to hold." You protest against those protesting the status quo, you are telling America that you support the status quo. The bogus, intentionally vague "Support Our Troops" propaganda in this country means, "remain silent and let our government do what it is doing." Your post is not only disingenuous, it is intentionally dishonest -- which is a nice way of calling you a liar. The difference between your post and mine is that I do not mince words or deal in vaguery.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#72)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    soccer -- I don't condemn anything the US is military is doing b/c it is for oil -- all us American consumers demand that resource, do not discuss the possiblity of not having it, only using less. Don't like how that smells? F!ck you next time you fill up your gas tank

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#73)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    "BTW -- majority of Americans voted in BUsh, 2x. Also, your "golden boy" Kerry supported the war in Iraq." About 123 Million people voted in the last election. There were about 283 Million people counted in the most recent Census. Once (1) subtract out people under 18, (2) people who answered the census but were ineligible to vote, (3) add the hordes of people living in this country who aren't citizens, and finally, (4) understand that the main demographic seperating eligible voters who did/did-not choose to participate is wealth. It is a minority made up of the wealthiest people in our economy that are split 48/48 between voting for Republicans and Conservatives masquerading as Republicans. That other tier of people contribute no less (perhaps more) to our overall economy yet do not participate in our elections for a variety of reasons. One thing is certain, neither party is representing their interests.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#74)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    Conservatives masquerading as Democrats -- rather.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#75)
    by Edger on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    Tampa Student: The difference between your post and mine is that I do not mince words or deal in vaguery. Thanks for being you, TS... ------ “See, in my line of work you got to keep repeating things over and over and over again for the truth to sink in, to kind of catapult the propaganda.” — George W. Bush (looking for his wagon) , May 24, 2005

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#76)
    by soccerdad on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    soccer -- I don't condemn anything the US is military is doing b/c it is for oil -- all us American consumers demand that resource, do not discuss the possiblity of not having it, only using less.
    So at least there is one honest neocon who is willing to admit that killing women and children is ok as long as it keeps your SUV going. Gets my vote for most morally bankrupt troll.
    Don't like how that smells? F!ck you next time you fill up your gas tank
    MY! MY! I know that TL bans people for obscenity. Between PPJ and this guy we have been reminded of the kind of people we are dealing with. Selfrightous, morally bankrupt, and without a conscience. With these kind of people leading our country it shouldn't be too long before we are completely in the crapper.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#77)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    SD writes:
    So I take it you will condemn the US military for arresting, torturing, andkilling innocent Iraqis which inflames anti-american feelings?
    Do you still beat your wife?

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#78)
    by soccerdad on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    PPJ - you still need those reading comprehension classes we have been talking about. You are really missing your mark today.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#79)
    by squeaky on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    Congressman John Conyers writes:
    ' September 27, 2005 Office of the Chief United States Park Police Dwight E. Pettiford 1100 Ohio Drive S.W. Washington, D. C. 20242 Dear Chief Pettiford: I am writing to request information regarding the treatment of individuals arrested on September 26, 2005 in front of the White House and processed at the United States Park Police Anacostia Station. Yesterday 384 protestors, including peace activist Cindy Sheehan, were arrested outside the White House and were brought to United States Park Police Anacostia Station. I was very surprised to learn that many of those arrested were kept handcuffed in vans and buses for up to 12 hours before they were charged and released. Some of those were released at 4:30 in the morning after being arrested at 4:00 the previous afternoon. Many of those held captive the longest were grandmothers and senior citizens. Those released after midnight were unfamiliar with Washington, DC and had no means to travel back to their hotels once the metro had closed. Anacostia is not frequented by taxicabs after midnight. I have the following questions regarding the treatment of those arrested yesterday: 1. Why was the Anacostia Station chosen as the sole location to process all 384 arrestees when there were several other Park Police stations in the greater Washington, DC area? 2. In what other circumstances have arrestees been detained by U.S. Park Police for periods exceeding twelve hours before being charged with a crime? 3. In what other circumstances have arrestees been detained by U.S. Park Police, and kept handcuffed on buses for periods exceeding ten hours? 4. What is the established U.S. Park Police procedure for processing large numbers of arrestees in the Washington, DC area? Please respond to the Judiciary Committee Minority Office at 2142 Rayburn House Office Building, Washington, DC 20515, telephone number 202-225-6504, fax number 202-225-4423. Sincerely, John Conyers, Jr. Ranking Member House Committee on the Judiciary ' Via Jonathan Godfrey [jonathan.godfrey a_t_ mail d o t house.gov, Conyers's Internet Communications Director
    via Juan Cole

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#80)
    by Che's Lounge on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    I will continue to lash out against anyone putting more good boys and girls in greater danger than they otherwise would have been. The White House is awaiting your call.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#81)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    soccer - if you denounce the war in iraq as an unjust war for oil -- quit using any product composed of or mfg'd with petroleum. We (and that means you and me, as Americans) cannot fathom our current society without the energy-dense aid and use of oil or petroleum based products. Query: if gasoline were priced at $10 tomorrow, what would happen? What would you do? Who would you blame? How about $20? $30? Individuals like yourself dismiss this as ridiculous and farfetched, but the foregoing is a very real scenario. Don't like it? Take a look at "Party's Over: Oil, War and the Fate of Industrial Societies" (written by Richard Heinberg, a fellow liberal), and other similar writings. People have been killing others for thousands of years to gain access to resources. But now, you, in the comfort of your (probably) petroleum heated home, using your petroleum powered vehicle, using items and devices, the majority of which are either composed of or processed/mfg'd with petroleum, feel empowered to speak out against our young men and women killing others to ensure access to this resource? Does the expression "smacks of hypocrisy" ring any of your bells? The strangest part about this discussion is that, never once, will you actually consider the possibility that by speaking against the killing others for oil, you completely contradict yourself and are nothing more than gasoline-using hypocrite. If a war for oil is unjust, then stop your dependency. Otherwise, zip it, "pal". Do you understand the concept of dependency?

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#82)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    Oh yea: Cindy Sheehan is a great and noble hero to be always remembered for... ahh...ahh...ahh........Bush is a liar and killer! Death to the neocon! I want to see Ralph Nader naked!

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#83)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:23 PM EST
    "The strangest part about this discussion is that, never once, will you actually consider the possibility that by speaking against the killing others for oil, you completely contradict yourself and are nothing more than gasoline-using hypocrite. If a war for oil is unjust, then stop your dependency. Otherwise, zip it, "pal"." There is a difference between calling for change, being a hypocrite, and revelling in decadence. You're apparently a proud member of the latter group. Change could come simply - and without people sacrificing their children's well-being to stand on principle, if only publically traded energy corporations had an incentive to do something other than endanger our livelihoods, our societies, even our planet for the sake of quarterly gains and capital appreciation.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#84)
    by soccerdad on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:24 PM EST
    hannityiscrazy Boy is that illogical and nonsense. You are a truly clueless follower of the neocons. Here's an idea why don't we do what the Chineese do, i.e. sign major contracts with oil producing countries such that for a guaranted supply of oil we will invest in projects in their country. Oh that who be toooo hard. Not enough profits. Lets kill people instead. God what an idiot. Your answer to everything - kill, attack, invade etc pathetic

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#85)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:24 PM EST
    SD writes:
    i.e. sign major contracts with oil producing countries such that for a guaranted supply of oil we will invest in projects in their country.
    Actually not a bad idea, except we are not a state ran economy, so how do you make GM build a plant in SA? And then we did have the Arabian American Oil Company in SA to find and get the flow started. I think SA has thrown them out. We did try and put in a modern telephone system in Iran, it got siezed in 1980. Last I heard it had fallen apart. And Castro has never paid a nickel for the Cuban Telephone Company... That stuff makes investors edgey.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#86)
    by swingvote on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:24 PM EST
    I'll give Cindy Sheehan this much: She has figured out a way to beat Andy Warhol's prediction to death. She has turned her 15 minutes of fame into 15 hours of infamy. Can't wait for the almost inevitable talk show "Cindy!" to debut. Any odds on who the first guests will be?

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#88)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:24 PM EST
    Its quite humorous to me to read all the complaints about obtaining a permit. This is a standard practice throughout the US. It is by no means a Republican/Democratic process. If anyone chose to do some research you could easily see how many people were arrested for the same offense in the same place during the Clinton administration. I did a quick search of public records and found 14 thus far. Secondly, why is no one paying attention to the fact that this woman chose to pursue her activist agenda rather than raise her own son. Upon her divorce from her husband she chose to allow her husband custody of her son. However, after he joins the military(which again is volunteer and with the thought of wartime action always prevalent) rather than talk him out of it, she continues her agenda. It is only after his death that she takes an active role in her sons life. Fortunately her sons death got her exactly what she wanted, Icon status. Fortunately for the rest of us we can see through her despicable nature. God Bless her son, his sacrifice was ultimate, as is the sacrifice of the countless others who came before and after him. I only wonder what her son would think of his ABSENT mothers actions today. I am sure he would of enjoyed this type of committment much more when he was alive.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#89)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:24 PM EST
    Paul in LA LA... Stay out of LA, BB. We don't want your kind of hatred-mongers here. Too late...I'm coming anyway. You don't know me ... and I actually only hate people that hate & want to kill me, and dispite all your reems of BS on here, you can't prove otherwise. C'mon Paulie.... I'll even buy you a beer!

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#90)
    by kdog on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:24 PM EST
    This is a standard practice throughout the US
    It sure is, and it is an unconstitutional practice that I despise. Whether enacted by Dem or Repub leaders is irrelevant to me. It's simply wrong to require a citizen to obtain a permit for the redress of grievances from the very people they have grievances against.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#91)
    by swingvote on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:24 PM EST
    BB, You're forgetting a few helpful details that make Sideshow Paul's comments a little more comprehensible, if no less intelligable. First off: Paul believes that all conservatives, of any stripe or nature, are, by definition, racists. If you show even the slightest hint of a conservative nature or even utter a single thought that might be possible to interpret as "conserative", you are a racist hate monger by default. Paul also believes that anyone who disagrees with him, on anything, is a conservative racist hate monger. So you are doubly damned if you say anything which might be considered even the slightest bit conservative with which Paul disagrees. Finally, Paul also believes that liberals are, by some immutable law of the universe, absolutely incapable of having even the slightest racist tendencies. This is why Paul finds it so easy to ignore his own blatant racism when it rears its ugly head (such as in comments about Michelle Malkin); for Paul, his being a racist in anyway is an impossibility, just as your not being one is an impossibility. This is why, in the larger context of TalkLeft, it is simply best to ignore Sideshow Paul's comments. They are, for the most part, simply cut and pasted from other, more extremist liberal sites, with no original thought and a limited comprehension at best. The rest of the comments are attacks and insults. Hardly worth the effort. I hope this helps. And yes PIL, feel free to prove me right.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#92)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:25 PM EST
    soccer daddy -- I'm Baaaaack kill, invade, attack -- not my policies, just the policies of the government, from whose teet we all feed from, to allow further extravagences in our Western society (As hard as you scream "I don't belong!", you do, consumer:) Attack the policy, not those who try to give fact-based rational explanations based on our own dependencies, for the benefit of head-in-the-clouds ideologues who refuse to provide any fact-based explanation for their position other than to label anyone who disagrees an "idiot", "illogical", or "pathetic". Insults are a sure way to convince me you have no basis for your opinions other than incompetence as to proper opinion formation.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#93)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:25 PM EST
    Masterful, justpaul. Especially the last paragraph.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#95)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:27 PM EST
    May I just ask a question, what is with the devout anger liberal extremists share in common. You constantly preach(and yes, I use the word preach because it is like a sad cult of sheep) the idea that asserting power through the use of a gun is wrong, yet you consistently throw around words like hate and make death threats to anyone who disagrees with you. So much for compassion, openness and understanding. In addition, stop dwelling on the permit issue, she wanted to get arrested, that was the point! Also, the arrest were not actually for failure to get a permit, it was for sitting. Demonstrators are free to gather and voice their issues. However, they are not allowed to impede public access to free travel. If you are going to argue, calm yourself down first, then do your research, organize your thoughts and then make sense. Lastly, it is astounding to me how liberals will not comment on Cindy's total lack of parenting and involvement in her son's life prior to his death. Mother of the Year! There is a reason even Democrats are distancing themselves from her. Find a new master folks. C

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#97)
    by Edger on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:28 PM EST
    Very, very good Adair! adair1813: ..it is astounding to me how liberals will not comment on Cindy's total lack of parenting and involvement in her son's life prior to his death. I'm truly impressed. The awsome skill and reasoning power you've displayed here in coming up with the most twisted, backhanded ad hominem attack on the messenger is astonishing. Well done. You must be so proud. Send a framed copy to your mother. Adair? "..organize your thoughts and then make sense."

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#98)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:28 PM EST
    Edger, I believe the whole point of this particular site is to discuss Sheehan. So may I give props to you for completely avoiding the topic at hand. Once again, I hear no discussion of her motivations from any of you. Where was she before his death? Why have her comments altered dramatically during the course of this scam? She is a puppet. She is your spokesperson. Are you aware of the quotes she made prior to the Leftist Radicals getting their claws into her? Let me refresh your memory. After her meeting with President Bush she made these comments, "I know he's sincere about wanting freedom for the Iraqi's", "I know he's sorry and feels some pain for our loss. And I know he's a man of faith.", as well as "That was the gift the President gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together." These are her original statements after her first meeting. Do you have any actual thoughts or facts to offer or are you just the typical Liberal who lives in fantasy and bases everything on emotion. I apologize for living in reality and facing the world head on. I apologize for searching for genuine truth, rather than a puppet master. And yes, by the way, my mother is very proud of me. It is very nice knowing that while I am ALIVE.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#99)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:28 PM EST
    justpaul... Thanks for that very informative post. Of course I know all that about our friend in LA LA land, but nice to see someone else sees it too. It's hard not to I guess? I'm serious about buying him a beer too. Just to show there are no hard feelings. But alas.... like most libs, he would rather stand in the shadows of TL and toss out names. He feels protected that way. Adair.... Welcome to the club. You'll see, if you haven't already, that the more on target your posts are, the more you'll tick these guys off & the more bad names you'll receive.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#100)
    by squeaky on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:28 PM EST
    ad-Want some quotes from Bush while he was dealing coke at Yale. Or from Cheney just before he got kicked out of Yale the first time while he was throwing beer bottles at people from atop a yale building. You are a Troll trying to be class montor. Unfortunately no one here is going to give you your sought after gold star for being such a goodboy. Edgar, nor anyone here, needs you to set them straight as to what is off topic. You are off topic and not adding anything with your antique wingnut rhetoric. Go back to your wayback machine and stay there.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#101)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:28 PM EST
    Squeaky, all I can say is typical. I thought this was a place for discussion, but apparently you are incapable. Thanks for the stereotypical response to valid info. You can give me all the quotes you want, lets just hope they apply to what we are actually discussing. In addition, if you want to call names, thats cool, but could you expand on the Troll thing. I have always thought of Trolls as people living under a bridge in the dark pestering those that carry on in the real world. After reading your response wouldn't the Troll reference better suit you since you offer nothing valuable and obviously live in the dark. Thanks though for validating my thoughts about liberals.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#102)
    by squeaky on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:28 PM EST
    ad-there is nothing in your comment that has a hope of eliciting honest discussion. I am so glad to validate your thoughts about the left. Now you can go back to your real world wingnut heaven and engage your pals with stale RNC talking points (your idea of discussion). Bye Bye. Win win situation.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#103)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:28 PM EST
    Squeaky- "stale talking points"? How many times will you use the reference "wingnut" today? By the way, any relation to the Squeaky who failed at killing Ford? I guess the saying "what's in a name" should be answered with incompetence. Well according to Squeak I am back to my RNC meeting where we actually talk about things. I guess I'll be seeing you next time I cross the bridge and you want to impede progress.

    Re: Sheehan Arrested (none / 0) (#104)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:04:28 PM EST
    Sorry Squeak, meeting was delayed. Just wanted to add something in reference to your "stale RNC talking points" comment, how's Air America doing? Never heard of a radio station not only forcing customers to listen to their commercials, but also asking them for donations to stay afloat. I guess the riveting talk on Air America drove the sponsors away. Face it, people want facts, not your "guess what Bush said when he was dealing coke at Yale" comments. So when your puppet master inserts his hand does it tickle your intestines?

    Sheehan Arrested | 98 comments (98 topical)