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Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawal Proposal

By Jeralyn, Section War In Iraq
Posted on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 10:34:12 AM EST
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Action Alert: Time to contact your senators. From Sen. John Kerry, who today introduced S. 2766 calling for troop withdrawal from Iraq by the end of the year:

In the next 24 hours, it is likely that the Senate will vote on my amendment which calls for the withdrawal of American combat troops from Iraq by the end of this year. For months, you and I have been pressing for this step. We've made it clear that we needed to set deadlines in Iraq -- and with the formation of an Iraqi unity government and the killing of Al-Zarqawi, this is a moment of truth in Iraq.

Now a critical vote is at hand. Our brave soldiers have done their work. It's time to put the future of Iraq in the hands of the Iraqi people.

Urge your Senators today to support withdrawal of combat troops by the end of 2006.

You can read excerpts from Kerry's Amendment to S. 2766 here.

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    Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawal Proposal | 20 comments (20 topical)
    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#2)
    by soccerdad on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 12:21:02 PM EST
    Aside from losing face, there is no down side
    You can kiss all that ME oil goodbye.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#3)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 12:23:34 PM EST
    Narcissism and Paternalism as Foreign Policy, and Kerry's Profoundly Objectionable and Dishonest Article
    Keep the scope of this catastrophe in mind -- and never forget that we chose to launch an utterly unjustified, aggressive invasion and occupation of a nation that did not threaten us in any serious manner whatsoever. Given the incomprehensible horror that Iraqis now must live with every minute of every day -- horror that is the direct result of our actions -- who the hell are we to be making demands of anyone? We ought to beg their forgiveness, with every fiber of our being. But for Kerry, and for all our other national leaders, none of this matters and it is hardly ever discussed in any detail in terms of how it affects the Iraqis themselves. Oh, no: it's all and only about us. The nauseating depths of the Western conviction of its own "exceptionalism" and its unquestionable "right" to coerce the rest of the world to act as we demand are revealed in Kerry's final paragraph: For three years now, the administration has told us that terrible things will happen if we get tough with the Iraqis. In fact, terrible things are happening now because we haven't gotten tough enough. With two deadlines, we can change all that. We can put the American leadership on the side of our soldiers and push the Iraqi leadership to do what only it can do: build a democracy.
    There is none more supportive of a troop withdrawal than I. But let us not forget the enormity of the crimes that have been committed in the name of our free democratic western societies. Kerry, Bush, Blair, I piss on you. And every last one of all the self righteous drum beating flag waving despicable excuses for men, left and right, I piss on you. I beg you read the article that lies at the bottom of the web page, and perhaps, as I, you might take some moments to hang your heads in shame.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#5)
    by soccerdad on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 12:32:42 PM EST
    No I mean all, none from anybody. That will be the eventual outcome

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#6)
    by soccerdad on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 12:35:14 PM EST
    Where was Kerry in 2004. Yeah now its in the toilet he's ready to get out. Pathetic opportunist.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#7)
    by james on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 12:39:29 PM EST
    I am not sure a specific date for total withdrawal is a great idea but a staged 'timeframe' that does not include performance targets would be nice. Cutting large numbers of troops would be a good idea while leaving a progressively smaller number of troops. Stopping patrols on the level they are at now until they are eventually zero and there's some small force there to maybe feed intelligence to the defense ministry (signals, sats, video from drones, etc) from a few bases. Then total exit. The problem with this open ended commitment is that we are allowing the Shiites and Sunnis time to stall and make no progress. The exit of their security would be helpful to focus minds. So would the withdrawal of all US security contractors that are currently protecting the bigwigs in the Iraqi government (they are the ones with power). I'm sure they are less confident in their gunmen's abilities. A 'smart' proposal would be a staged timeline (say remove enough troops to reduce patrols to X at stage 1) and see how they 'like' the results of the Infidel leaving. Stage 2: no regular patrols but allow for intervention at the Iraqi request. Stage 3: Intelligence and a force, maybe 10k, to intervene in any real civil war). Real as in very massive mass killings. (as the current state is mass slaughter on a daily basis). Also: focusing lots of resources on the borders - in terms of intelligence and logistical help in the end. That's where the 'problem' would be if there were to be a civil war (extra Sunnis would be needed...). Of course, the Kurds can take care of themselves. People also fail to note Iraq's big neighbor that is being snubbed by the EU: Turkey. Things are not looking bright for EU membership and the generals are getting more power, especially after the recent slayings of the justices and Erdogan's pathetic response (wouldn't attend the funeral of a head judge who was shot because of the headscarve rulings). There is a renewed problem in Turkey with the PKK and various offshoots. If Iraq was to destabilize enough the Turks would probably respond because of their fear of another Kurdish uprising. That's because the Kurds are good at using chaos to consolidate power (which isn't such a bad thing...). The best 'peacekeepers' Iraq could get at this point would be the Turks. The military is a serial human rights abuser that has lots of experience in putting down restive areas (basically destroy your homes and relocate you and kill and terrorize any potential sympathizers). Of course they wouldn't intervene as long as the US was there for fear of being labeled patsies of the infidels. Anyway, that can cut two ways: for that to happen the Republican party in Turkey would have to eject the Islamists from government or the military would essentially force it. That would happen if they saw a real threat to the south. So a destablization of turkey would be bad too.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#8)
    by james on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 12:52:08 PM EST
    off topic, deleted

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#9)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 12:54:34 PM EST
    The only question is how big a defeat this measure will face. Here's a handy translation for how the bad actors in Iraq would take passage: "Time to hold off on further attacks for now, and gather strength for a big push after the US leaves".

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#10)
    by jondee on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 01:06:00 PM EST
    Yeah this situation has nothing in common with Vietnam, nothing at all.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#11)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 01:06:37 PM EST
    The troops wont be pulling out until Haliburton finish'es rebuilding New Orleans. The No Bid Contract in Iraq is looking pretty good right now. Who's John Kerry anyway's. Why not look at the whole picture. Of course it's not right and Senator Kerry may be good of heart but that won't replace the routine that seems destined to happen. Perhaps if the Dems take over in November Senator Kerry's voice would make a difference.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#12)
    by Andreas on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 02:08:40 PM EST
    Where is the complete text of that proposed amendment? I did not find it on either senate.gov nor johnkerry.com

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#13)
    by jimcee on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 08:39:46 PM EST
    James' idea is not a bad proposition. At some point the Iraqi gov't has to learn to be able to deal with the internicine conflict that seems to be brewing. Perhaps a trial by fire and a bit of a 'fledgling' distraction from the US is not out of order afterall they will eventually have to take care of themselves. Using the Murtha approach would be effectively abandoning the nascent democracy that is the Iraqi gov't. Whether you agreed with the invasion is beside the point as that that has already happened. What really matters now is to leave the mid-east a little better than when we 'found' it. I would like to hear from others on how to help the Iraqis and to help speed thier freedom from foreign occupiers whether they are Westerners or others, i.e. Jihadists, who have invaded Iraq to kill innocents for the media audience to drive some Westerner's remorse and attempt to create a civil war amongst the Iraqis. The pull-out-now crowd needs to come up with some ideas that don't reek of abandonment and aquiessence to Zarqawi's like-minded, foreign cohorts. Some folks seem to think that retreat is the answer but I would posit that the opposite is true. Whether you like it or not it is up to the US to create a working country in Iraq. Abandonment of the people there will not only encourage more chaos but damage the US credibility whenever support is pledged to anyone by anyone. But then again perhaps that is what some folks would prefer.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#14)
    by Ernesto Del Mundo on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 10:01:58 PM EST
    Abandonment of the people there will not only encourage more chaos but damage the US credibility whenever support is pledged to anyone by anyone.
    If you were worried about credibility you never should have shilled for the lying clowns who came up with this disastrous adventure in empire building.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#15)
    by Ernesto Del Mundo on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 10:10:23 PM EST
    As for solutions...how about we use the billions now being pissed away into the black hole of Iraq occupation into developing sustainable energy and making cars and buildings more energy efficient. And the best way to make peace in the region is to give Iran as many nukes as Israel has.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#16)
    by squeaky on Mon Jun 12, 2006 at 10:27:21 PM EST
    The, er, timing of the WH's production of al-Zarqawi's body, in his final breaths no less, is at last clear apparent: It kicks off the brand new Rovian Warplan designed to castrate the democrzts and win the November elections. Maintaing the war, in other words keeping bedwetters well fed, is the keystone of the plan. The details of the Zarqawi's final episode seem scripted for the enemy, as much as they are created for american voters. He had to be found alive. It adds to the epic heroics and lends authenticity to the story. He can now go down as a almost invincible having survived two 500lb bombs. What a martyr. Rove wants to bring 'em on to enhance the status of republicans. He emphasizes the necessity of war and maintaining current levels of troops as an indispensible for keeping America's bedwetters safe. The war will escalate as planned and we will continue to get the bad guys, whether or not they exist. That is good for Bush. His election message is that in rough seas you don't want a democrat in charge. From the NYT:
    ......Republicans began a new effort to use last week's events to turn the war to their political advantage after months of anxiety, and to sharpen attacks against Democrats. On Monday night, the president's top political strategist, Karl Rove, told supporters in New Hampshire that if the Democrats had their way, Iraq would fall to terrorists and Abu Musab al-Zarqawi would not have been killed. "When it gets tough, and when it gets difficult, they fall back on that party's old pattern of cutting and running," Mr. Rove said at a state Republican Party gathering in Manchester. [...] On Capitol Hill, leading Republicans in the House were preparing for a week of legislative maneuvers meant to portray them as better equipped to fight terrorism and Democrats as blanching in the face of a tough enemy.
    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#17)
    by Ernesto Del Mundo on Tue Jun 13, 2006 at 12:08:33 AM EST
    That schtick never gets old does it. "We can send other peoples' kids off to die for muuuuch longer than they can!" Should play well in the red states.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#18)
    by Slado on Tue Jun 13, 2006 at 08:45:08 AM EST
    Ernesto do you purposely avoid answering jimcee's questions or are you even aware that you're doing it. We all understand your position. Bush is a chimp, the war is bad, we shouldn't have gone etc... Excuse me but you are crying over spilt milk and every second you keep crying and not offering solutions the milk continues to run off the table. You lost the debate. We invaded Iraq and basing all you positions and decisions on what will never happen, us not invading, will do no one any good. Withdrawl is an option. What do you say to the likely outcome that jimcee proposed to you.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#19)
    by squeaky on Tue Jun 13, 2006 at 09:27:44 AM EST
    You lost the debate. We invaded Iraq and basing all you positions and decisions on what will never happen, us not invading, will do no one any good.
    Nice mumble Slado. We will have to save this for the war crimes trial.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#20)
    by squeaky on Tue Jun 13, 2006 at 10:10:13 AM EST
    Rep King has good news about Iraq. It is safer that the predominantly democratic streets of DC. The unwashed massed are more likely to kill you than an Iraqi insurgent.
    27.51 Iraqis per 100,000 die a violent death on an annual basis. 27.51. Now what does that mean? To me, it really doesn't mean a lot until I compare it to people that I know or have a feel for the rhythm of this place. Well I by now have a feel for the rhythm of this place called Washington, D.C., and my wife lives here with me, and I can tell you, Mr. Speaker, she's at far greater risk being a civilian in Washington, D.C. than an average civilian in Iraq. 45 out of every 100,000 Washington, D.C. regular residents die a violent death on an annual basis.
    Of course King is lying. Why not? It is fashionable these days amongst republican leaders, so why should he be any different?
    Apparently, Bush hasn't read King's study. On his trip into Iraq today, Bush employed "extraordinarily-tight protective measures," which were deemed necessary "because of Iraq's tenuous security situation." Bush "never seriously considered" staying overnight, wanting to leave Iraq immediately for the safety of Washington, D.C. 
    link

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#21)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Tue Jun 13, 2006 at 03:30:07 PM EST
    Hi. My name is Matt, and I'm working on the Lee Harris for Memphis campaign down in Tennessee. Lee feels that it is important that we target a timeframe for bringing the soldiers home from Iraq. Like Kerry, Lee believes it is important that we set deadlines in Iraq. If anyone is interested in learning more about Lee, you can check out his website at www.leeharrisformemphis.com.

    Re: Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawa (none / 0) (#22)
    by Edger on Sun Jun 18, 2006 at 09:00:21 AM EST
    Matt: Lee feels that it is important that we target a timeframe for bringing the soldiers home from Iraq. Like Kerry, Lee believes it is important that we set deadlines in Iraq. Personally, I liked the plan Kerry gave in Greg Palast's dream about the '04 presidential debates:
    Mr. Tall could have won my vote with two words. It's the two-word answer John Kerry gave three decades ago when asked the same question -- "How can we get our troops out of a disastrous war?" Then, the clear-minded, tall young man said, "In ships."
    Senate to Vote on Kerry's Iraq Troop Withdrawal Proposal | 20 comments (20 topical)