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    amazing (5.00 / 2) (#5)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:28:36 AM EST
    Amy Goodman sues over arrests 08 GOP convention (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by DFLer on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:28:44 AM EST
    Amy Goodman, host of the syndicated "Democracy Now!" news program, and two of her producers filed suit against the cities of St. Paul and Minneapolis and other defendants Wednesday over their arrests while covering the 2008 Republican National Convention.

    The three were among an estimated 40 to 50 journalists who were arrested covering street protests at the convention in downtown St. Paul...

    AP story

    Star Trib short report


    Give 'em hell Amy... (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:35:30 AM EST
    and make them pay.  We might not be able to stop state agents from going nutso with the chains and cages, but at least we can still make their employers pay through the nose for it via the courts.  It's something.

    Parent
    I remember that (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:45:23 AM EST
    Amy started to cry when they arrested her--and asked the cops to not arrest her.

    The whole incident shows how getting arrested is humiliating and frightening....

    Parent

    She's a pretty good journalist (none / 0) (#34)
    by Cream City on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:09:21 PM EST
    so I would bet that she also was crying because she was being taken away for others to get the scoops.

    Not to downplay in the least your cogent comment -- I cannot imagine how scary that scenario would be.

    Parent

    Smart and reliable (none / 0) (#41)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:20:10 PM EST
    Minor point, but Amy "crying" may be (none / 0) (#107)
    by brodie on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:33:41 PM EST
    overstating it.  

    Looking at the video of her arrest, she seems none too pleased and is shouting that "this is outrageous", and is probably a bit shocked at how quickly she was grabbed by the police thugs, pushed away towards the police van as she had her arms pulled forcibly behind her body for cuffing.  But I actually don't see any tears nor signs she is breaking down emotionally.

    But, yes, it is outrageous how the police and local authorities overreact these days to peaceful protest, while progressive pols who should be speaking out largely stay silent.  (see similar police overreaction and brutality at FDL today, a drug raid)

    Parent

    So, it would seem (none / 0) (#152)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:30:23 PM EST
    Eyewitness memories....

    Parent
    I know she was very (none / 0) (#159)
    by brodie on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:40:28 PM EST
    emotionally upset -- for obvious reasons -- back in the 90s while covering the popular uprising in East Timor, but that was because right in front of her, her colleague Alan Nairn was being brutally beaten by military thugs as hundreds of protesters were lying dead or injured around her.  You can clearly hear her voice break up and she's barely able to continue to report the ongoing slaughter, but that was a dire life and death situation, unlike the unnecessary but manageble rough treatment she experienced by the St Paul police thugs.

    Parent
    Nairn did a lot of work (none / 0) (#172)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:30:17 PM EST
    on Guatemala....

    Parent
    Change you can BELIEVE in? (5.00 / 2) (#22)
    by MO Blue on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:06:10 PM EST
    As part of a comprehensive Immigration bill, Democrats are planning to make everyone who wants to work in this country get a national ID embedded with biometric data. This will be a requirement for both citizens and immigrants. Under this plan, the government would create a national biometric database cataloging every person in the country. On top of that, Democrats chose possibly the creepiest, Orwellian name they could think of for this national ID card (which, in true 1984 fashion, they are refusing to acknowledge is a national ID card): the BELIEVE program. link


    The government that can't even work a (5.00 / 2) (#25)
    by coast on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:11:39 PM EST
    no fly list is going to create a national database cataloging everyone's biometric data.  Right!  How much are we going to toss away on this one?

    Parent
    Scary with a capital S... (none / 0) (#46)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:27:35 PM EST
    God help us if that proposal becomes law, we think identity theft is a problem now, you wait...nevermind the general dsytopian nightmare of it.

    Parent
    No, I can't (none / 0) (#94)
    by Zorba on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:18:50 PM EST
    believe in this change.  This is a terrible idea, and I hear echos of "Your papers, please?"  And what about retirees who no longer work?  I suppose they'll have to get one, too, in order to get their Social Security checks.  

    Parent
    And the Social Security Check... (none / 0) (#100)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:21:51 PM EST
    will only be available via direct deposit...that one is coming, and that one makes me wet the bed.

    Parent
    Direct deposit is a good thing. (none / 0) (#110)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:38:10 PM EST
    No means to steal from mail box.  

    Parent
    it only works (none / 0) (#111)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:40:19 PM EST
    if you have a checking account.
    K is a sort of special case.

    Parent
    Social Security, Veteran's payments (none / 0) (#141)
    by Zorba on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:17:15 PM EST
    and other federal payments are mandated to switch to "paperless" in 2013.  Your only other choice besides direct deposit into your bank account is the Direct Express Debit Mastercard (and I think there are fees for some transactions with that card).  I realize that this will save the government money in the long run, but very frankly, I like checks.  I pay all my bills with checks.  Everyone wants us to pay online or via automatic withdrawal, and I realize this is the "greener" alternative, but I like to use checks, and I would prefer to get those canceled checks back every month, but unfortunately, most banks no longer do this.  You can get an image of the canceled checks online and print them out (except for those checks that wind up as "electronic" checks, and I also don't like this).  Call me a Luddite (and I don't go as far as Kdog does), but the more our information is zinging around electronically, the better the chances of your money and your identity being stolen.

    Parent
    I dont think I agree (none / 0) (#144)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:21:11 PM EST
    just because its paperless doesnt mean it is any more or less electronic.  it is electronic and has been for a long time.
    it just saves trees.  I sign up for paperless at every opportunity.
    I have used direct deposit for as long as I can remember and I cant imagine doing it the old way.


    Parent
    oh (none / 0) (#146)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:21:58 PM EST
    and I have never had my identity stolen and never lost a check.

    Parent
    one more (none / 0) (#149)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:23:25 PM EST
    I even signed up for this bill pay thing my bank does now for bills that cant be done with an account number.

    I pay them through my bank bill pay and they cut them an electronic check.  I pay every bill this way now.

    Parent

    Well, our kids think (none / 0) (#187)
    by Zorba on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:06:45 PM EST
    that my husband and I are dinosaurs, since they never use paper checks.  All automatic bill pay and debit card for them.  Different strokes for different folks (and we did get our Visa number stolen once- I was able to cancel it right away, though, before there were any charges on it, and got a new card with another number).  I suspect that, as time goes on, we'll basically have no choice but to switch to automatic bill pay, e-checks, and debit cards for everything.  Doggone it, what's with all these newfangled ideas?  Gold coins, gold-backed paper money, and the horse and buggy were okay for our great-great grandparents, by golly.  ;-)

    Parent
    heh (none / 0) (#196)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:36:01 PM EST
    dont remember the last time I wrote a check

    Parent
    So the big shady switch... (none / 0) (#199)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:59:27 PM EST
    is official, at least for government benefits.  Ouch.

    I'd be really sick with worry if I expected to ever collect on a government benefit...but I don't see the odds being good that Social Security is gonna make it another 35 years or so.  And if I'm wrong, the bush doctor has gotta be accepting plastic Direct Express Debit Mastercard in 2045 right?

    Whats their slogan btw?  "There are some things money can't buy...so you shouldn't mind when we leech on your every transaction. Mastercard... we're everywhere we've no right to be."?

    Parent

    Plenty of means.. (none / 0) (#117)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:47:19 PM EST
    to steal electronically though...I like my tax returns the way they come, in the mailbox, ty very much.

    Even better if I could go to a government office and pick up my refund in cash...that would be cool...bring in your tax forms, reviewed on site, and bam!...cash in hand in an hour.  Same for SS benefits, pick 'em up in cash every month.

    When I become Mile Hi's Vice-President I'm gonna propose this:)

    Parent

    hey (none / 0) (#121)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:53:18 PM EST
    question.  on your recent trip did you pay cash for the ticket?
    after the most recent KeyStone Terrorist thing I think that will no longer be possible.  that is one of the things they say will be "fixed".


    Parent
    Nah... (none / 0) (#130)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:01:31 PM EST
    I loaded up the prepaid CC for the plane tickets...cheaptickets.com

    Though another big positive in Mexico was the smaller hotels we stayed at didn't require a CC to check-in...not even a deposit.  Paid cash at checkout at those spots...felt so good to be trusted and not to let a bank and transaction precessor leech a few cents off our transaction.

    Parent

    The problem w/your scenario is a (none / 0) (#125)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:58:23 PM EST
    savvy person with intent to relieve your of that cash would spot you walking out the door.  This has happened to others, espec. the elderly.

    Parent
    I'm more worried... (none / 0) (#131)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:02:41 PM EST
    about the Brooks Brothers predators myself...but to each their own boogeyman:)

    Parent
    Good thing you are a dedicated touch (none / 0) (#133)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:07:09 PM EST
    football player.  Now about that predisposition to violence!  <snk.>

    Parent
    I may not be a particularly strong... (5.00 / 1) (#137)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:13:26 PM EST
    or smart man, but I can run like the wind blows:)

    Parent
    No idea if you are fast or strong. (none / 0) (#140)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:16:01 PM EST
    But I do not doubt your intelligence.  Wrong sometimes, but still, . . .

    Parent
    Dog, I sympathize with your feelings, (none / 0) (#142)
    by Zorba on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:18:29 PM EST
    but nobody can outrun a bullet.  May you be safe, my friend.

    Parent
    My loony-ness... (none / 0) (#157)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:38:17 PM EST
    gives a false impression sometimes I think...my everyday life is the last thing I'd call dangerous Z...don't worry about little old mild-mannered me....somebody pulls a piece they can help themselves to whatever I got on me...a knife, then I might break into my 100 meter dash, it depends:)

    Parent
    I dont quite get the handwringing (none / 0) (#103)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:26:42 PM EST
    about this.  seems to me it might not be a bad idea from the whole Terrorism standpoint as well.

    BUT
    the "teapartyatperrysburg" agrees with you.

    I know quite a few people who would object to this. What's insidious is that they (liberals) want to tie an ID card required for all individuals to work, so naturally you couldn't work unless you had a Dem inspired card that you would have to buy and that would have all your information stored on it. Sound apocalyptic? Yeah. The ACLU wakes up. More government, more intrusion, more wacky ideas from liberals, more tracking. And, funny, why do I have the feeling somehow illegals will get out of having one? What's this new ID called? BELIEVE. Do I see a half crescent moon somewhere?


    Parent
    I don't quite get the handwringing either. (none / 0) (#128)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:59:34 PM EST
    As so many other countries do have national id. cards, require leaving passport at hotel desk, fingerprint people entering the counrty, take photos of same, etc.

    Parent
    my general rule of thumb - (none / 0) (#135)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:10:26 PM EST
    if it has the teabaggers wetting their pants it is probably a good thing.

    Parent
    Funny photo on Huff Post of a woman (none / 0) (#136)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:12:15 PM EST
    wearing a broad-brimmed hat trimmed with tea bags hanging from the brim.  

    Parent
    ha (none / 0) (#143)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:18:56 PM EST
    under a headline about something I commented about yesterday

    Republican Voter Enthusiasm Advantage Halved In Past Month: Gallup

    BUT BUT
    the MEME the MEME
    what about the MEME

    Parent

    ACLU also agrees (none / 0) (#176)
    by MO Blue on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:44:01 PM EST
    The American Civil Liberties Union, a civil liberties defender often aligned with the Democratic Party, wasted no time in blasting the plan.

    "Creating a biometric national ID will not only be astronomically expensive, it will usher government into the very center of our lives. Every worker in America will need a government permission slip in order to work. And all of this will come with a new federal bureaucracy -- one that combines the worst elements of the DMV and the TSA," said Christopher Calabrese, ACLU legislative counsel.
    ...
    The ACLU said "if the biometric national ID card provision of the draft bill becomes law, every worker in America would have to be fingerprinted."
    ...
    Implementing a nationwide identification program for every worker will be a difficult task.

    The Social Security Administration has estimated that 3.6 million Americans would have to visit SSA field offices to correct mistakes in records or else risk losing their jobs. link



    Parent
    From the CNN s--ks file (5.00 / 3) (#27)
    by ruffian on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:22:54 PM EST
    Feminist writer tells of her attempts to get her viewpoints about  girls "raunch culture" and media coverage of rape accurately portrayed on CNN. It does not go well.

    Stories like this really make me sad/mad/despairing. How are feminist, or any sort of liberal viewpoints, supposed to catch on with the general public if the spokespeople cannot even get their real viewpoint aired? this is CNN, not FOX.

    Answer: they're not (supposed to get fair airtime) (5.00 / 2) (#51)
    by Ellie on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:31:31 PM EST
    How are feminist, or any sort of liberal viewpoints, supposed to catch on with the general public if the spokespeople cannot even get their real viewpoint aired?

    In addition to the practice of keeping real liberalism and progressive voices off mainstream media, the lopsided, unfair pile-ons try to serve as a scary repellant.

    "See what happens when we get our hooks in you DFH Hot Pinko Types?"

    Thing is, most of the general public is already more liberal and progressive on most of the issues the falsely Real America-luvvin media purport to represent.

    Draft Cream City to write that textbook now! ;-) (Just so no one gets disoriented, jump is to an onsite threadlet that's directly on point about this media lag.)

    Parent

    Feminism is pretty much dead anyway (5.00 / 2) (#60)
    by Dr Molly on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:46:47 PM EST
    these days. I love this article from Barbara Ehrenrich's blog where she opines that, in today's society, feminism has pretty much been reduced to cute pink ribbons


    Parent
    A common mistake (none / 0) (#55)
    by Cream City on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:37:39 PM EST
    unfortunately, and often made by those who don't watch much teevee -- or don't watch it critically, not as a consumer but as a potential producer.  So they don't know how to manage the media, rather than be managed.  

    Never give media a 20-minute interview and expect it all to be on the air.  At most, two minutes.  More likely, 20 seconds.  So of course, anything said will be taken "out of context" aka edited.

    Teevee is no place for context.  Come up with two or three soundbytes and say them over and over again, no matter what is asked.  And then hope.  Or stay home, write long articles, and let someone else be media lunchmeat.

    Parent

    I know that is the way it has to be done (none / 0) (#62)
    by ruffian on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:47:44 PM EST
    But sigh...no wonder there is nothing worth watching in the TV opinion media.

    Parent
    All too true. (none / 0) (#86)
    by brodie on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:13:05 PM EST
    This is the way tv news has been operating for at least 45 yrs, probably longer.  The producers have a story and an angle on it, they're going to want to cut the material to fit the pre-fabbed storyline, and no one is usually the wiser for all the interesting stuff left on the cutting room floor.

    Recall when Bill and Hill tried to get 60 Minutes to air live their famous interview during the early 1992 primary season.  They didn't get live, and they didn't get the full thing uncut.  Such is the power of the media.  Probably only presidents and high-ranking Republican pols are in a position to dictate tight terms.

    Parent

    Is Heckuva Job Brownie the biggest moran (5.00 / 1) (#33)
    by Joan in VA on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:05:34 PM EST
    on the planet? He says that Prez Obama wanted the Horizon to explode because he's against offshore drilling even though he just opened up many areas to new drilling. wtf?

    Brown is just... (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:20:47 PM EST
    ...a hired gun spouting the latest talking points from those who can't afford politically to do it themselves, but can afford to pay him to do so.

    He's a moran, but certainly not the biggest one.

    Parent

    Breaking news.... (none / 0) (#1)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:04:25 AM EST
    Lawrence Taylor just got arrested on rape charges.

    I really hope these allegations are false...but if they are true, Taylor's gonna get a taste of how he treated QB's when he hits the joint...and rightly so...these are disgusting allegations.

    The report I read said the girl texted a relative as the pimp drove her back to NYC, or wherever, and the relative called the police and the police stopped the car. Then the police went to the hotel room where they knocked and, lo and behold, LT opened the door.

    My bet is that if he'd beaten the girl, he wouldn't be lounging in the hotel room hours later where he did it.

    But, hey, what do I know...

    Parent

    We need to legalize prostitution... (none / 0) (#20)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:00:39 PM EST
    to try and minimize this type of heinous child exploitation and child rape....the prohibition only fuels it, imo.

    Parent
    If someone feels like (5.00 / 4) (#26)
    by Dr Molly on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:19:34 PM EST
    raping and beating up a 15-year-old (or anyone else for that matter), legalized prostitution is not going to stop them.

    Parent
    Of course not... (none / 0) (#39)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:18:49 PM EST
    but legalized prostitution just might put less children in harms way.

    Parent
    not seeing the connection. (5.00 / 1) (#45)
    by Dr Molly on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:26:58 PM EST
    See my reply to sarc... (none / 0) (#54)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:37:26 PM EST
    for where I'm comin' from and see if that explains my position better.

    Parent
    Never mind - we'll just agree to disagree. (5.00 / 2) (#57)
    by Dr Molly on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:43:10 PM EST
    Legalization does not stop women and children from getting raped or beaten up. The focus here is wrong, imo, but let's drop it.

    Parent
    Or put it this way... (none / 0) (#63)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:49:09 PM EST
    I don't think a minor has ever turned a trick at the Bunny Ranch in Nevada.

    Parent
    I still disagree with you, my friend. (5.00 / 1) (#64)
    by Dr Molly on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:50:55 PM EST
    On to other topics!

    Parent
    Probably a good idea... (none / 0) (#73)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:59:19 PM EST
    this one always gets me in hot water 'round here...and its gotten nasty in the past.

    Thanks for disagreeing civilly...I will shut up now!

    Parent

    Last time I was there.... (none / 0) (#72)
    by coast on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:59:03 PM EST
    oh cr$#.  Never mind.

    Parent
    and if someone wants to prostitute (none / 0) (#52)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:34:01 PM EST
    themselves the fact that it is illegal will not stop them.  if it was legal they might have some bit of protection.


    Parent
    fewer underage girls would be involved in it, and fewer children would be raped? How so?

    Parent
    I would think... (none / 0) (#37)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:15:39 PM EST
    if prostitution were legalized, it is taken out of the backalley and into the storefront.  It's always easier to keep an eye on the storefront than the backalley.

    Women in the prostitution business would have nothing to fear from John Law if they report rape or abuse.  

    They would not necessarily require the services of shady pimps and madams either...half the reason to have one is to have someone to bail you out when you get pinched, and for protection.  

    And just like the drug trade where dealers don't ask for ID, sc*mbag pimps and organized crime ain't asking for ID either.    

    Would ending the prohibition end the child sex trade or the rape of child prostitutes?  Of course not, that sick sh*t has plagued mankind for a long time...but I think its safe to say bringing the industry out of the dark and into the light would certainly make it less prevalent...I'm assuming the vast majority of johns ain't looking for kids.

    Parent

    Nevada is the only U.S. state to allow (5.00 / 2) (#56)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:39:23 PM EST
    Nevada is the only U.S. state to allow some legal prostitution, [1]
    Child prostitution is also a problem in Nevada.[28][29][30] Las Vegas was identified by the FBI as one of 14 cities around the country with high rates of child prostitution.[31] Las Vegas Metro Police say "roughly 400 children are picked off the streets from prostitution each year."[32]


    Parent
    Oddly enough... (none / 0) (#68)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:55:39 PM EST
    prostitution is illegal within Las Vegas city limits....I wonder if the stats would differ if that was not the case.

    But like anything else, if people want it, no matter how sick it may be, someone equally sick will provide it for a fee...sad but true.  I just think it could be minimized if we brought the consenting adult portion of the industry outta the black market...and we could protect more sex workers from becoming victims of violent crime.  Plus, all the resources used to bust the Eliot Spitzers of the world could be focused on busting those who force children into sex work.

    But what do I know either:)

    Parent

    Sorry, my friend, I don't see it. (5.00 / 4) (#109)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:36:47 PM EST
    Nothing I have googled suggests legalizing adult prostitution will have any significant reductive affect at all on the rates of child prostitution or child rape.

    In fact, it looks like just the opposite:

    Another argument for legalizing prostitution in the Netherlands was that it would help end child prostitution. In reality, however, child prostitution in the Netherlands has increased dramatically during the 1990s. The Amsterdam-based ChildRight organization estimates that the number has gone from 4,000 children in 1996 to 15,000 in 2001. The group estimates that at least 5,000 of the children in prostitution are from other countries, with a large segment being Nigerian girls (Tiggeloven: 2001).

    Child prostitution has dramatically risen in Victoria compared to other Australian states where prostitution has not been legalized. Of all the states and territories in Australia, the highest number of reported incidences of child prostitution came from Victoria. In a 1998 study undertaken by ECPAT (End Child Prostitution and Trafficking) who conducted research for the Australian National Inquiry on Child Prostitution, there was increased evidence of organized commercial exploitation of children.

    Most children that end up in prostitution in the Netherlands are boys or young under aged asylum-seekers - particularly Nigerian girls. ChildRight claims this group numbers some 5,000 children. But recent years have seen a significant rise on the number of Dutch girls forced into the sex industry. Among them are an estimated 5,000 runaway or homeless children, many of whom are mentally retarded. Another large group (also 5,000) are `ordinary' Dutch schoolgirls, aged 13 or 14 from a "regular home environment" who are lured into prostitution by so-called "lover-boys".
    Typically, arguments for legalisation/decriminalisation are based on the mistaken assumption that a regulated industry will contain the growth of the brothel and street trade, eliminate organised crime and end child prostitution and sex trafficking.

    Significantly however, there is absolutely no evidence to support these claims. On the contrary, in countries such as the Netherlands, Australia and Germany, where this policy was adopted - the exact opposite is true.  These nations have all experienced a dramatic increase in legal and illegal prostitution, child prostitution and trafficking in persons for sexual purposes. The Mayor of Amsterdam, Job Cohen, admitted that the policy of legalisation has been a failure and has instituted a reversal. He conceded that organised crime dominated the industry in which sex trafficking, exploitation, drug abuse and money laundering was rife.



    Parent
    Don't be sorry... (none / 0) (#113)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:42:50 PM EST
    Thank you for the food for thought...those stats are an eye-opener.

    Parent
    Interesting (none / 0) (#76)
    by lilburro on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:03:22 PM EST
    I don't think legalizing prostitution will make much of a dent in the child/adolescent sex trade anyway. It's not like you're going to be able to divert that type of desire onto more appropriate objects through legalization of "of age" prostitution.  IMO anyway.

    I'm not sure where I stand on this issue, but I do like that if legal sex workers would have a lot more protection than they do now.

    Parent

    I don't get who would be protecting them. (none / 0) (#82)
    by Dr Molly on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:08:56 PM EST
    Surely not the police?

    Parent
    What? (none / 0) (#91)
    by lilburro on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:15:08 PM EST
    Yeah, if prostitution were legal, sex workers would/could conceivably be protected by the police.  And certainly wouldn't be put in the slammer for it.

    Parent
    Sorry (5.00 / 2) (#95)
    by Dr Molly on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:20:29 PM EST
    We weren't talking about prostitutes being put in the slammer, we were talking about how to stop people from raping and beating up underage children - at least that was the discussion I originally entered.

    I have a hard time believing that legalization of prostitution would solve any of that, that's all. This child was a runaway, not a prostitute.

    Parent

    Damn you burro... (none / 0) (#90)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:15:00 PM EST
    sucking me back in! (Sorry Doc)

    No, it won't put a dent in those sickos who seek out children...but it would put a dent in those who are seeking an adult companion and the sc*mbag black-market pimp sends a 14, 15, 16 year old.  If it was legal, at least that scenario would be a lot more rare, and thats something.  As it is now I think minors are being exploited through no desire of the john....that can be minimized through legalization.

    Parent

    Don't apologize, everyone has their opinions. (5.00 / 1) (#101)
    by Dr Molly on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:25:05 PM EST
    I think our disagreement can be summarized in this statement:
    As it is now I think minors are being exploited through no desire of the john....that can be minimized through legalization.

    I don't buy it. I also don't have any confidence that police will protect women and children in the way that you think. Now, really, let's stop!

    Parent

    well, that is a good point (none / 0) (#96)
    by lilburro on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:20:41 PM EST
    sometimes I wonder though about the "but she looked 18!" arguments.  They generally reek of BS to me but that's case by case I guess.

    Parent
    By "industry"... (none / 0) (#38)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:17:49 PM EST
    I mean your normal sex industry...willing sex workers of legal age and willing clients...of course the child sex trade should always be illegal and severely punished...thats as heinous as crime gets.

    Parent
    Well (none / 0) (#79)
    by squeaky on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:06:20 PM EST
    The definition you like to use, means everyone under age who participates in consensual sex is getting raped.

    Parent
    Laugh Away (none / 0) (#84)
    by squeaky on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:12:35 PM EST
    The difference which you love to blur is quite significant.

    According to your's, the states, and several other commenters here, I was raped, and raped others 100's of times, and both me and my partners loved every second of it.

    But of course rape is always a crime of violence, not sex. It makes no sense to throw your puritanical spin onto those engaged making love.

    Parent

    perhaps this would help with context (none / 0) (#88)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:13:52 PM EST
    Parents Don't Think Their Own Teens Are Having Sex

    Many parents don't think their kids are interested in sex, but believe that everyone else's kids are, a new study reveals.

    "Parents I interviewed had a very hard time thinking about their own teen children as sexually desiring subjects," said study researcher Sinikka Elliott, an assistant professor of sociology at North Carolina State University. "At the same time, parents view their teens' peers as highly sexual, even sexually predatory."



    Parent
    No, it doesn't help. (5.00 / 2) (#114)
    by Dr Molly on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:43:56 PM EST
    In fact, it's completely irrelevant. Because teenagers having consensual sex with each other (whether their parents know it or not) doesn't really have anything to do with Lawrence Taylor being accused of raping and beating up a 15-year-old girl.

    Parent
    Indeed. (5.00 / 1) (#124)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:57:59 PM EST
    wasnt actually (none / 0) (#115)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:45:40 PM EST
    responding to you.

    Parent
    Maybe, but (none / 0) (#43)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:21:28 PM EST
    she is still only 15--that'll be hard to explain....

    Parent
    Indeed. (5.00 / 1) (#122)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:54:30 PM EST
    I thought he had turned his life (none / 0) (#2)
    by jeffinalabama on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:23:47 AM EST
    around.

    The accused actions are heinous.

    People convicted of child rape don't do to well in general populations. Celebrities don't tend to fare well, either, from what I've heard.

    Parent

    Not Surprised (none / 0) (#8)
    by squeaky on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:34:05 AM EST
    Not that I know anything about him, but anyone who is trained,  encouraged, to be violent for most of their life, and immensely rewarded for that behavior, not to mention the requisite steroids, winds up being a violent person.

    It would probably be a good idea for these modern gladiators to go through some sort of intensive re-hab when they retire.

    Parent

    Not gonna go there... (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:42:07 AM EST
    with ya brother...I enjoy my positive outlet for aggression every fall and winter Sunday playing rough touch football...in fact I credit it for me being such a non-violent go lucky guy the other 166 hrs. of the week...I don't see any connection to the game, just that LT is a sick f*ck if he done what they say he done.

    Parent
    Yep, kdog, (none / 0) (#14)
    by jeffinalabama on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:46:38 AM EST
    if you study the statistics, which I must say I haven't, is there a significant difference between ex-athletes and  nonathletes in terms of crimes like these? then the question becomes why... why is there difference or why is there no difference.

    I'm not interested enough to look into it, but domrbody could get a master's thesis out of it, I'm sure.

    Parent

    somebody-- typing challenged. (none / 0) (#17)
    by jeffinalabama on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:50:20 AM EST
    somebody could get a master's thesis out of it, I'm sure.


    Parent
    You And YOur Pals (none / 0) (#15)
    by squeaky on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:48:35 AM EST
    With all due respect, are hardly pros. And even if you were playing tackle FB, there is no comparison to you and the pros.

    That would be like someone playing paintball, or shoot em up videogames,  compared to an Iraqi veteran, imo.

    Parent

    We definitely ain't pros... (none / 0) (#19)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:58:42 AM EST
    but the animal instincts are the same...when someone comes in my zone to catch a ball I'm thinking knock his freakin' head off.  Our rough touch can get rough...guys have gotten concussions and busted bones.

    Then the final whistle blows, I shake the same guys hand, and we laugh about it over a beer or a smoke before limping back home.  Ya get those violent tendencies outta your system in a positive way through athletic competition.

    I just don't buy football makes you violent off the field...though I suppose the naturally violent type might be drawn to football over other sports.

     

    Parent

    Yeah (none / 0) (#24)
    by squeaky on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:10:51 PM EST
    Fine, most of us have some aggression, and sports is a great way to blow off steam.

    The cultivation and life of a Pro FB player is an entirely different animal, imo.

    Parent

    kdog, do you guys do the (none / 0) (#44)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:23:15 PM EST
    three Mississippis for rushing the QB?

    Parent
    5 second... (none / 0) (#50)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:31:19 PM EST
    rush, but depending on the referees cadence it can range from 3-8 seconds....they count it out.

    The QB never really gets creamed though, unless he's running full steam and gets clobbered...the worst of it comes when defender, receiver, and pass come together at once...then guys get creamed.

    But everybody keeps it clean for the most part, aggressive but clean...we all gotta go to work on Monday.  It's the best:)

    Parent

    Save your generalizations (5.00 / 1) (#23)
    by coast on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:07:35 PM EST
    for another topic.

    NFL players are no more prone to violence than you or I.  There are about 7,000 retired players.  I don't think that LT is really representative of a majority, or even a fraction, or the population.

    Also, small point.  He hasn't been charged with anything.

    Parent

    15 year old? (none / 0) (#10)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:41:35 AM EST
    A defense of consent would seem hard to make....

    Wonder what Joe Theismann is thinking...

    Parent

    the link disappeared from YouTube (none / 0) (#3)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:25:45 AM EST
    but its still on AICN

    MACHETTE

    Happy CINCO DE MAYO! Spread this Everywhere!!!


    5-5-10! (none / 0) (#7)
    by DFLer on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:29:34 AM EST
    cosmic numerology ;)

    Parent
    lol (none / 0) (#13)
    by squeaky on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:45:41 AM EST
    Good one. I always like his films. Grindhouse was an excellent collaboration between Rodriguez and Tarantino... (Death Proof & Planet Terror)

    Never imagined that De Niro could look like Dubya.

    Parent

    JC (none / 0) (#4)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:27:13 AM EST
    Comedy Central might censor every image of the Prophet Muhammad on "South Park," yet the network is developing a whole animated series around Jesus Christ.

    In the show, God is preoccupied with playing video games while Christ, "the ultimate fish out of water," tries to adjust to life in the big city.

    Looks like a funny cartoon... (none / 0) (#74)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:01:30 PM EST
    hopefully, by some miracle, Viacom grows a pair and allows Muhammed to make a cameo.

    Parent
    Miracle...Have faith, it is a cartoon about Jesus. (none / 0) (#77)
    by coast on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:03:38 PM EST
    how do we know its a cartoon (none / 0) (#80)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:07:17 PM EST
    the pic is from the original Jesus vs Santa thing that launched South Park but I didnt see where they said it was going to be animated.

    live action would be fun too.


    Parent

    I think they say animated in the article, right? (none / 0) (#85)
    by coast on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:12:58 PM EST
    If live, who would be good for the part?

    Parent
    I dont think so (none / 0) (#98)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:21:01 PM EST
    my pick would be Sam Rockwell

    Parent
    I could go along with that. (none / 0) (#105)
    by coast on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:27:50 PM EST
    why not a reality show? (none / 0) (#99)
    by jeffinalabama on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:21:49 PM EST
    "I heard Allah and Buddha were singing at the Savior's feast
    And up the sky and Arabian rabbi
    Fed Quaker Oats to a priest"

    Ahhh, John Prine.

    Parent

    a "reality" show (none / 0) (#108)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:36:35 PM EST
    about religion.
    sounds like gold to me.  might possibly be the reality show I would watch.

    but I think Maher already did that in film format with Religulous

    Parent

    wow (none / 0) (#200)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 06:07:37 PM EST
    it only says ANIMATED in the first paragraph.
    thanks for not calling me blind.

    cool.
    animated jesus.


    Parent

    Tommy Chong and Cyril Wecht (none / 0) (#18)
    by scribe on Thu May 06, 2010 at 11:52:11 AM EST
    team up for a fundraiser to defeat former Loyal Bushie USAtty Mary Beth Buchanan in her House bid.

    Interesting tidbit from the article:  Chong would have been deported after his conviction had he not been invited by the USG to become a citizen back in the '80s and accepted the invite.  I wonder what Lieberman thinks about that.

    I saw Butthead Buchanan... (none / 0) (#21)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:02:30 PM EST
    was running...glad Tommy is haunting that piece of work.  I, for one, will never forget how dirty she and the state did Tommy...I hope Penn voters don't forget either.

    Parent
    Examples of what's wrong in our school systems (none / 0) (#28)
    by BTAL on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:23:03 PM EST
    Don't care which side of the aisle you reside or what your race may be, these two events are out and out wrong and teaches the wrong lessons to our kids.

    Students Kicked Off Campus for Wearing American Flag Tees

    Field trip for black students sparks controversy at Ann Arbor elementary school

    From Drudge, those articles, no? (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:41:06 PM EST
    I got them from another discussion forum (none / 0) (#31)
    by BTAL on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:48:17 PM EST
    that I participate on.  

    What would it matter even if Drudge did have them listed?  Care to address the topic?

    Parent

    No sympathy on the flag tee shirts (5.00 / 1) (#35)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:10:50 PM EST
    The U.S. Supreme Court held in a 2007 case that kids off campus were subject to a school anti-drug speech code, and thus were properly subject to school discipline for holding up a sign that said "Bong Hits 4 Jesus"--which they did while off-campus to get noticed on t.v.

    Conservative darling Justice Roberts issued the opinion.  Justice Thomas issued a concurring opinion saying that he believed that school kids have no First Amendment rights at all.

    Funny thing about conservatives and the First Amendment--it sometimes takes them awhile to discover its benefits...

     

    Parent

    Apples to oranges (none / 0) (#40)
    by BTAL on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:19:42 PM EST
    comparing the On/Off campus ruling to the t-shirt issue.  

    They had every right to wear those shirts but were singled out on a racial basis leveraged with a non-US holiday boneheaded "logic".

    Parent

    See, there you go (5.00 / 2) (#48)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:29:04 PM EST
    The conservatives' cause celebre are always different and unique when compared to the speech deemed offensive that liberals often defend.

    A little consistency.....not finding it...

    No two situations are exactly alike, so you can always find a difference, as strained as it might be...  

    Parent

    I wasn't taking a position (none / 0) (#61)
    by BTAL on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:46:54 PM EST
    on the "bong" ruling just pointing out that it has nothing to do with this situation.

    In this case the attire was fully acceptable (and had been worn on a regular/daily basis) on all times EXCEPT May 5th.

    The vice principle was flat out wrong and needs to be disciplined.

    Parent

    "racial" basis? (5.00 / 1) (#59)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:44:29 PM EST
    I didn't see any reference in the article to the race or ethnicity of the boys asked to turn their tee shirts inside out....  

    It was a matter of not raining on the parade of the Latino kids....An issue of discipline, I suppose....

    I would let all kids wear whatever flag tee shirts they wanted whenever....It is all part of the First Amendment...But conservatives often seem quite selective in how they honor that concept...

     

    Parent

    Sorry, that reference is in a different (none / 0) (#65)
    by BTAL on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:51:42 PM EST
    story -

    http://cbs5.com/local/american.flag.shirts.2.1677973.html

    "raining on the parade"  GMAFB, it is the American flag not even anything negative towards the Latinos, Mexico or even the celebration.  

    Not a discipline issue either as, again, they are permitted to wear the shirts on all other days.

    Your hypocrisy slip is showing.

    Parent

    You got it backwards (none / 0) (#81)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:07:57 PM EST
    I am close to a free speech absolutist, so I do not support asking those boys to change their tee shirts....

    It is the hypocrisy of those who would censor in other occasions that I note....If you are going to have an exception for discipline and order, then the teachers on site should be given the discretion to ask people to change tee shirts in order to avoid a confrontation, as a matter of just being practical....

    But gotta love these Drudge-trumpeted stories showing how oppressed the non-Latinos are, and how oppressive, and unAmerican, the Latinos are....Oh how persecuted the majority is!....Great Rush Limbaugh style jujitsu.

    Parent

    Did you even read the stories (none / 0) (#93)
    by BTAL on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:16:08 PM EST
    or look a the sources?  

    Drudge did not produce them.  All are from the CA media so far from some Conservative "trumped up".  Nice attempt at deflection but no cigar.

    Nowhere have I made mention of restricting anyone's speech just as I would not support anyone telling an Irishman to take off his orange and green apparel on July 4th, etc.  So again, nothing "trumped up" or Limbaugh-esque or hypocritical in calling out a pure BS PC action on the part of the two school administrators.

    Parent

    "Trumpeted" (5.00 / 1) (#102)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:25:19 PM EST
    Classic Drudge....takes a local story and features it....to make a political point.

    I just found it interesting that the very two local stories you cited are currently the second and third featured stories on Drudge--right next to each other.  And were most likely the top two Drudge stories at the time you were posting about them here.

    The conservative machine is well-oiled.  Drudge cherry picks the right story to push the meme of the day, and the conservatives in unision echo those points and each other, with you bringing them here to this Left-leaning site....  

    Parent

    The other forum posters (none / 0) (#106)
    by BTAL on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:31:16 PM EST
    may have gotten them from Drudge, but I did not.

    Additionally, it is included in Google's US News page.

    http://news.google.com/news/section?pz=1&cf=all&ned=us&topic=n&ict=ln

    And on the msnbc.com home page top stories section.

    That dog won't hunt.

    Parent

    You cite the two articles (5.00 / 1) (#148)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:22:54 PM EST
    here in the same order they are found on Drudge.  I did not find them cited that way in any of the other sources you cite.

    But, I do not dispute that you found them on your discussion forum, not on Drudge....That would tell us the articles went from Drudge to your discussion forum to here.....Still very impressive messaging and message discipline by conservatives....But we all knew that anyway.

    Parent

    "Bong Hits" obviously flies in the face (none / 0) (#47)
    by coast on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:28:33 PM EST
    of any school's anti-drug stance.  The schools dress code with regards to clothing and symbols is as follows:

    Garments exposing any portion of the torso or stomach

    §         Bare midriffs, net shirts, backless shirts, shirts without straps, tube tops and garments that are see-through

    §         Shirts that are low-cut or expose excessive amounts of the chest region

    §         Undershirts in place of regular shirts (boys)

    §         Shorts/dresses/skirts must be of an appropriate length and are subject to administrative approval.  (Items, when worn at the waist, may not have a hemline that rests at mid-thigh or shorter when the student is seated.)

    §         Clothing or symbols which show obscene pictures or gestures, sexually suggestive statements, swear words, substances illegal to juveniles (tobacco, alcohol or drugs), weapons, words/pictures depicting death, violence or gore.

    §         Clothing, headgear, or symbols related to gang activities or clothing determined to be gang related by administration or resource officer

    §         Doo rags or bandanas of any color

    §         Wearing of one glove on either hand (as it is a gang related action)

    §         Sagging pants.  Pants must be worn at waist level in a manner in which underwear is not exposed or would not be exposed if shirts were raised

    §         Spiked attire or safety pins

    §         Red, burgundy or blue of any shade shoelaces or canvas belts

    If you can show me where an American flag falls into any of these categories or contradicts a specific policy of the school (i.e. anti-drug), please direct me.

    The most telling quote from the atricle is when the student says that he/she would not wear a Mexican flag on July 4th.  The student should be reminded that the great thing about being in America is that you should be able to wear the flag of any nation anytime you want.  If he/she wants to where an Iranian flag shirt on the 4th of July, so be it.

    Parent

    Not following your point (none / 0) (#53)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:37:22 PM EST
    They were off campus in the Bong Hits case....

    And, the idea is that Free Speech should not be judged by its content and whether it is offensive or not....

    The standard reason given for school dress and speech codes is to maintain school discipline.  But these kids were off campus....

    And, if a school administrator has an inherent ability to censor speech to maintain discipline, then all speech is potentially on the choppping block.....You don't get to pick and choose between good speech and bad speech--that is the point.....You don't like the result in the flag tee shirts case, cry me a river......Go take it up with Justices Roberts and Thomas....

    For me, I am pretty much a Skokie purist...

    Parent

    Doesn't matter where it occurred (none / 0) (#69)
    by coast on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:57:25 PM EST
    it was a school event.

    Flag tee shirt issue wasn't a case, it was a decision by one administrator.

    For me, country is way too PC.  Rather than worrying about what is on someone's shirt or that you may be "disrespected", try thinking about the next test you've got in a week or what you can around your house to help out.

    Hardest lesson I'm trying to teach my kids is to not worry about what someone else, including your sibling, is saying about you.  Its not worth the  time debate.

    Parent

    Actually, it was not a school event (none / 0) (#89)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:14:45 PM EST
    The kids were allowed to miss class to see the Olympic torch bearer run by....

    It was across the street from the school--and that is how the administrator saw the banner.  The kid who was expelled never even attended school that day...He just showed up and held the banner....

    It seems like free speech to me--off campus at a non-school event. But the long arm of school discipline reaches quite far....as far as snooping on kids while at home via their school computers....

    Parent

    you know (none / 0) (#36)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:13:50 PM EST
    I am not a sociologist but this does not sound to me like the way to go:

    While there's no clear agreement between the two sides about exactly what happened, most of the controversy centers on a field trip taken last week by the Lunch Bunch for African American boys and girls to hear a black rocket engineer talk.

    possibly in a perfect world but we do not live in one.  this was a pretty dumb idea IMO.

    then there is this:


    "He wasn't yelling at them. He was very passionate about it," Margolis said.

    Parents have complained he was yelling at the class and belittled a Muslim girl who said she also had experienced racism and discrimination.

    yelling and elementary school students, not good.
    no matter how "passionate" you are.  again just MO.


    Parent

    also (5.00 / 1) (#173)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:34:00 PM EST
    worth mentioning the flag thing was on cinco de mayo which gives an added dimension.

    one which I think Ebert captured well in this tweet:

    "Kids who wear American Flag t-shirts on 5 May should have to share a lunchroom table with those who wear a hammer and sickle on 4 July"


    Parent
    FCC will soon seek public comment on (none / 0) (#29)
    by ding7777 on Thu May 06, 2010 at 12:29:29 PM EST
    Genachowski's new proposal

    The proposal is intended to strike a balance that can satisfy both Internet service providers, which oppose any new broadband regulations, and public interest groups that are demanding greater consumer protections.



    Has everybody seen (none / 0) (#49)
    by lilburro on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:30:47 PM EST
    that Family Research Council cofounder George Rekers has apparently been having a rentboy he found on a gay sex site "carry his luggage" on trips?  This story is so AWESOME.  Read it here:  Miami New Times.  Plus, it was broken by this newspaper/newsmag that I've never heard of...I like it when the not so mainstream media breaks the story.

    Papa's---got a Brand New Bag ninga linga lingling (5.00 / 1) (#58)
    by Ellie on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:44:17 PM EST
    "Carry my luggage" is THE BEST lame excuse evah. ('Zat what the kids are calling it these days?)

    He needed a RentBoy to tote the old sac 'mkay? What? A bad back, (sez he)?

    This is just so fun.

    Parent

    I am loving this (none / 0) (#87)
    by lilburro on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:13:08 PM EST
    (and you know it's going to get way wackier) but I feel sad for Rekers too.  Especially because it's difficult to find a rational basis for the vitrolic hatred some Christian churches feel for homosexuality/homosexual acts.  Of course that sounds like a no-brainer...but I am reading John Boswell and he makes a convincing argument that anti-gay sentiment came from forces outside the Church.

    Parent
    sad for Rekers? (none / 0) (#92)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:15:32 PM EST
    why on earth?
    also show me a church with no anti gay sentiment and I will show you a Unitarian Church.

    Parent
    When the Reverend Dr. Rekers (5.00 / 1) (#123)
    by KeysDan on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:56:24 PM EST
    was observed traveling with his "bag handler", Lucien, he gave a slick tap dance the likes of which we have not seen since Fred Astaire glided through 'Singing in the Rain'.  Now maybe the Reverend believed that his source for Lucien, rentboys.com, related to strong landlord collection agents, but call me skeptical if you must.  Schadenfreude abounds, but this antigay activist has done much damage, thanks to politicians such as Bill McCollum, Florida's Attorney General and now Republican candidate for governor (also of House Manager fame in the Clinton impeachment trial). Rev. Rekers was one of only two (the other Reker's dear friend) who were asked by McCollum to testify in the Gill trial to maintain the state ban on adoption by gays. Rekers got a seemingly inordinately high stipend from the state ($97,000) for expert testimony wherein he called gays mentally unstable and advised that the ban be expanded to Native Americans because they are a higher risk for mental illness and substance abuse. Miami-Dade Circuit Judge Cindy Lederman struck down the adoption ban as "illogical to the point of irrationality" (the state is appealing). Moreover, the judge said the Reverend was biased and his beliefs were motivated by strong ideological and theological convictions, and based on his testimony and demeanor at trial, the Court cannot consider his testimony to be credible nor worthy of forming the basis of public policy".  How about Judge Lederman for the SC vacancy?

    Parent
    if I could rate this (none / 0) (#126)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:58:23 PM EST
    a "10" I would

    Parent
    Woulda been a "10" but (5.00 / 2) (#132)
    by brodie on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:06:16 PM EST
    for the glaring early error about Astaire and Singin'.  That would be Gene Kelly, thank you.  (or you could also have mentioned the able Donald O'Connor, whom I once met at a pool party, or even the capable Debbie Reynolds, no slouch at dancing she).

    Parent
    Sorry, that mistake deserves (5.00 / 1) (#147)
    by KeysDan on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:22:06 PM EST
    quite a few points off--you can give them to Lucien.  Fred Astaire did have a little role (but not enough to get me off the hook) in that he was on set when he noted that Debbie Reynolds was crying owing to a perceived insult from Gene Kelly regarding her dancing abilities at the time.  She had been a gymnast.  Astaire coached her, thereafter, to notable success.   (based on WIkI)

    Parent
    Well, you've earned back (5.00 / 1) (#153)
    by brodie on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:34:13 PM EST
    most of the deduction for that interesting behind the scenes info about Astaire and Reynolds that I wasn't aware of.  It rings true.  Kelly was a well-known task master and perfectionist on a movie set, and Reynolds took great pride in her "keeping up with the pros" dancing on that movie.

    Singin' isn't my favorite musical, but it's probably my favorite dancing movie.  

    Parent

    ha (none / 0) (#139)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:15:36 PM EST
    I always fail the "musical theater" questions.
    I think I have a deficient homo gene or something.


    Parent
    I'm for not hatin' on these sinners, too ... (none / 0) (#104)
    by Ellie on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:27:20 PM EST
    ... but dayum if they keep wrecking my most solemn efforts not to laff my ass off at them,

    Every. New. Time.

    Oh puh-leeeeeeeeeeaze, gawd, let there be audio. Please please pretty puh-leeeeeeeeeeaze.

    Parent

    me? (none / 0) (#112)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:42:41 PM EST
    100% down with hatin on them.
    they have been hatin on me all my life while getting "rubdowns" from rent boys.

    IMO
    if there is a hell they will find a special place there.

    Parent

    the ole reliable fallback (none / 0) (#67)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:55:11 PM EST
    Bible 'Teaches The Fallen Nature Of All People'

    didnt Eddie Murphy say something like that when he got caught bonking transvestites?  

    Parent

    omg (none / 0) (#78)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:05:57 PM EST
    he talking:

    the best quotes are not reprintable here.

    George Rekers Is a Homosexual, Escort Says

    Parent

    Seems to be the case (5.00 / 1) (#129)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:01:11 PM EST
    that the proponents of gay "reparative therapy" always end up proving it is total nonsense....

    Parent
    was reading a fairly (none / 0) (#134)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:08:41 PM EST
    Fascinating (none / 0) (#151)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:29:02 PM EST
    A straight male who was one year undercover in a gay conversion group....That is a new angle....And for one year--that is a long time to fake it.....but I guess some gay men do the opposite for a lifetime.

    I'll go back and read in detail.....

    Parent

    long (none / 0) (#154)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:34:38 PM EST
    but worth it.  and not the hack and slash you might expect.

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    Sad (none / 0) (#179)
    by MKS on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:47:50 PM EST
    Such an obvious fraud.   How could such a retreat ever presume to change one's orientation?

    And the odd sort of denial--they are all going on a retreat with other gay men and engaging in hugging exercises with other gay men....and this is supposed to make them more straight?

    But the sadness gives way to alarm when we learn at the end of the article that one of the graduates goes on to become the poster-child for the Ugandan anti-gay statute....

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    Market Slip (none / 0) (#66)
    by waldenpond on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:54:12 PM EST
    The market was down 900.  People were freaking, then it jumped up real quick and is now down 480.  Funny to watch the CNBC guys make @sses of themselves ..... again.

    Good rule of thumb. Whenever everybody (5.00 / 1) (#71)
    by tigercourse on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:58:52 PM EST
    starts saying, "hey, it looks like happy days are here again, and will stay forever!" SELL.

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    at least its not us (none / 0) (#70)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 01:58:46 PM EST
    well MOSTLY not us, this time.

    Dow Plunges Amid Europe Lending Worries

    Breaking: Dow in freefall over Greece fears

    Parent

    On Marketplace yesterday afternnon, (none / 0) (#75)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:02:16 PM EST
    a Greek "person on the street" blamed Greece's financial ills on Obama.  Not sure why.  Something about him letting our financial market sell bad deals to benefit U.S. but not Greece.

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    And it propped up the dollar like hell (none / 0) (#118)
    by Militarytracy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:50:13 PM EST
    That European economist that I put a link up to the other day was claiming that this was what Wall Street was trying to do, pump up the dollar in the wake of the destruction of Greece.  How sad is that?

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    Is too us (none / 0) (#116)
    by waldenpond on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:47:04 PM EST
    On multiple levels.  We have the same fake financial system and over leverage they do with govts printing paper and allowing banks to lie about their capital. We will be doing additional bail-outs (fed printing money they plan to steal from future tax dollars)  We are also tied more closely to the European markets than the Asian.

    The only thing to the benefit of the elites in this country is Americans are pretty lazy.  They seem to be content to plug along even knowing they are being ripped off while their govt funnels more money to the elites..... or maybe I should just stop reading Tiabbe and listening to Ratigan.

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    I would say a (none / 0) (#119)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:50:50 PM EST
    definite yes on the Ratigan thing.

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    Do you actually buy (none / 0) (#120)
    by Militarytracy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:51:25 PM EST
    that market recovery?  The FED can buy whatever it wants to now to "save" the market.  That looked like a FED rescue to me :)

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    yet another tragedy from the war on drugs (none / 0) (#97)
    by ahazydelirium on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:20:57 PM EST
    reason magazine blog has a story and video of a swat raid in missouri. they were executing a warrant to arrest a man for drug possession, paraphernalia and child endangerment. the man had a very small amount of mary -- a misdemeanor. and the family dogs were shot in the presence of a 7 year old boy. the video is disturbing.

    Kdog had posted this earlier but I hadn't checked (none / 0) (#127)
    by Raskolnikov on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:59:20 PM EST
    it out...

    So unnecessary to send a SWAT team when his response is this:

    "what is happening?"
    "search warrant, narcotics"
    "then go ahead search, I don't care"

    They wait until the middle of the night, then don't wait enough time for the people to get to the door for what?  To needless terrorize a family?  The moment when he realizes they killed his dog is heartbreaking, I could barely watch that video.


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    Pray tell, how does law enforcement (none / 0) (#138)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:14:02 PM EST
    know how person inside the residence will react until they do so?

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    The severity of the charge (5.00 / 1) (#145)
    by Raskolnikov on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:21:16 PM EST
    could be an indication.  Admittedly I don't know what the police suspected going in, but what kind of force were they expecting to meet, three armed gunmen crouching inside?  Is this pretty much standard operating procedure for marijuana drug busts (serious question)?  Having known a few pot dealers over the years, this seems excessive, considering not a one owned a firearm or had any violent tendencies.  If the suspect had a previous criminal record of violent crime, guns charges, or registered firearms, I could understand this approach a bit better.

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    I once represented law enforcement (none / 0) (#150)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:28:23 PM EST
    in a case in which task force had a search warrant for suspected possession of marijuana for sale.  Young man of about 19 years of age was in his bedroom with door closed with loaded handgun aimed at the closed doo.  He was shot and killed after he fired the first shot.  

    Parent
    no one opened fire. (none / 0) (#156)
    by ahazydelirium on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:37:17 PM EST
    and i seriously question whether killing their dog and wounding another (in front of the kid) is a reasonable use of force -- particularly since these swat members were clearly armed to the teeth.

    Parent
    According to the linked article, (none / 0) (#163)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:55:25 PM EST
    law enforcement stated the bull dog was acting in a threatening manner.  And, of course, law enforcement executing a search warrant did not have information prior to entering the residence in this case person inside the resident did not have access to weapones.  

    Parent
    i imagine that if a fully armed swat team broke (5.00 / 1) (#182)
    by ahazydelirium on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:54:01 PM EST
    down my front door, my cats would even act in a threatening manner, if for no other reason than out of fear. is it normal for swat teams to execute search warrants?

    Parent
    Hmmm (none / 0) (#164)
    by squeaky on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:57:34 PM EST
    I guess that tasers are now only used on children, the infirm and those without a gun.

    Parent
    Hmmmm. Hasn't TL spent lots of (none / 0) (#165)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:59:44 PM EST
    works condemning tasers for their possible lethal effect?

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    Yeah (none / 0) (#170)
    by squeaky on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:11:08 PM EST
    Sorry for not putting the irony alert on...  but seeing that they killed someones pet....  

    the pro taser BS obviously has nothing to do with using it as a substitute for deadly force..

    which is why I mentioned that they only seem to use it as a torture device on children and the infirm.

    Parent

    I've always thought of Taser as less (none / 0) (#175)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:40:01 PM EST
    fprce than firearm, but it doesn't always turn out that way.  Forked tongue response at TL though.  See Palin's trooper bro-in-law.

    Parent
    Call to National Day of Prayer. Um, no. (none / 0) (#155)
    by Dr Molly on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:36:05 PM EST
    NOW, THEREFORE, I, BARACK OBAMA, President of the United States of America, by virtue of the authority vested in me by the Constitution and laws of the United States of America, do hereby proclaim May 6, 2010, as a National Day of Prayer.  I call upon the citizens of our Nation to pray, or otherwise give thanks, in accordance with their own faiths and consciences, for our many freedoms and blessings, and I invite all people of faith to join me in asking for God's continued guidance, grace, and protection as we meet the challenges before us.

    IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand this thirtieth day of April, in the year of our Lord two thousand ten, and of the Independence of the United States of America the two hundred and thirty-fourth.BARACK OBAMA


    I'd love to Barack... (5.00 / 2) (#160)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:50:16 PM EST
    but my sacrament is illegal...allright I'll do it anyway...but know I'll be asking for protection from you and yours down in DC and up in Albany...Amen.

    Parent
    Hmm, I would have thought (5.00 / 1) (#161)
    by brodie on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:51:13 PM EST
    Thanksgiving Day in Nov would have covered all this national prayer territory, but apparently not.  And I understand (wiki) this thing has been going on since 1952, after the Rev Billy YouKnowWho came to D.C. with his tent show and suggested we needed yet another day set aside for national prayer.  

    Sadly, Harry Truman went along with the bible thumping crowd, and we've had this thing -- which I was blissfully unaware of until just now -- for the past 58 yrs.

    Not that I expect that some first-term president by the name of Barack Hussein Obama would do anything but quietly continue this unfortunate tradition ...

    Parent

    the thing is (5.00 / 2) (#162)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:54:00 PM EST
    no one much cares if he continues it.
    and plenty of people would have gone completely ape sh!t if he had not.


    Parent
    Agree. Analogy to U.S. flag lapel pin. (none / 0) (#167)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:00:47 PM EST
    This is why it is so necessary: (5.00 / 1) (#168)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:02:29 PM EST
    which I was blissfully unaware of until just now

    I'm betting  you did not grow up in the Midwest.  Could not escape National Day of Prayer.

    Parent

    As a life long resident of the Midwest, (5.00 / 1) (#197)
    by MO Blue on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:38:15 PM EST
    I somehow escaped the National Day of Prayer experience. At one time even belonged to a church.

    Probably a good thing that it has flown under my radar since it goes against my strong belief in separation of church and state.

    Parent

    Interesting Wiki article on this phenom. (none / 0) (#198)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:50:54 PM EST
    Lincoln purportedly called for such a day, stating God was maybe punishing for sins by way of the Civil War and a day of prayer might help.

    Parent
    Uhhhhm... (none / 0) (#177)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:44:28 PM EST
    ...I grew up in the Midwest, same state as you even and I managed to "escape" it.  

    Parent
    Were you "unchurched" or not (none / 0) (#180)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:49:27 PM EST
    Protestant?  Des Moines really was the big bad city maybe.

    Parent
    I don't know of any... (5.00 / 2) (#183)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:00:23 PM EST
    Polish Protestant's.  Is being a Catholic considered "unchurched"?  'Cause if so, I've got a bone to pick with someone about all those wasted Wednesday nights/Saturday mornings and Sundays.

    Parent
    Ha. Well, we Lutherans considered (none / 0) (#184)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:02:05 PM EST
    Catholics to be "churched" but that is about as far as we would go.  Very mysterious.  Latin, incense, etc.  Not sure if National Day of Prayer was observed by Catholics back in the day.

    Parent
    hilarious (none / 0) (#158)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:38:32 PM EST
    management requesting names for a vampire like alien in our game and some one suggests the "Devourers".

    oh yeah.
    that rolls right off the tongue

    May I suggest... (5.00 / 1) (#166)
    by kdog on Thu May 06, 2010 at 03:59:50 PM EST
    "The Bankers"?

    Parent
    Masters of the Universe? (none / 0) (#169)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:03:24 PM EST
    for some reason (5.00 / 1) (#171)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:11:22 PM EST
    reminds me of the "Rural Juror" episode on 30 rock

    Parent
    "revised and extended" (none / 0) (#174)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:38:27 PM EST
    Florida GOP Senate candidate Marco Rubio got himself into hot water with conservatives when he argued that Arizona's new illegal immigration law went "too far" and could possibly turn Arizona into a "police state."

    but now?

    But right now, for the people of Arizona, this is not (from I gathered) this is not even an immigration issue. This is a public safety issue. And the fact is that Mexican drug violence has tragically crossed over the border and into an American state and American cities. So I congratulate them on taking steps to clarify even further the intent of the law.


    Well (none / 0) (#178)
    by squeaky on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:46:05 PM EST
    Florida House GOP contender, Dan Fanelli is running against Alan Greyson is all for racial profiling. He thinks it is time to stop being politically correct and go after people who look like bad guys.

    Parent
    if the recent (none / 0) (#181)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 04:53:08 PM EST
    incident taught us anything its that is it the single brow people we should be watching out for.


    Parent
    I think this fellow is good looking and (none / 0) (#185)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:03:07 PM EST
    a good candidate to play Jesus.

    Parent
    I cant believe (none / 0) (#186)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:06:17 PM EST
    Jesus had a single eyebrow.
    but other than that.  yep.  pretty cute.


    Parent
    Does the Shroud of Turin (none / 0) (#188)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:08:08 PM EST
    indicate the eyebrow(s)?

    Parent
    well (none / 0) (#189)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:11:35 PM EST
    OT. Is your Garuda male or female? (none / 0) (#190)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:15:13 PM EST
    after that conversation the other day (none / 0) (#191)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:18:53 PM EST
    I was wondering the same thing.  I am not entirely sure I have seen a sex applied.  but perhaps.

    I think since he is reborn from his ashes (note chauvinistic use of pronouns), like the phoenix, I think plumbing might be irrelevant.

    Parent

    hmmm (none / 0) (#192)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:20:30 PM EST
    Fed up with quarreling, they eventually settled on a bet. Whoever was proven wrong would become the other's slave. Kadru was indeed wrong. The horse had no black tail, but before her rival knew it, she concocted a deception. She had her children the snakes, spray the tail of the horse with their white poison. Thus the tail turned black. Winata then became Kadru's slave. The moment of enslavement for the mother was the moment of birth for the son. The egg was hatching.

    Garuda eventually came to life shining like fire, his glaring light filling the firmament in all directions. The amazed gods thought that doomsday was coming and that at last, the time had come for the burning of the three worlds. But Agni, the god of fire, knew the truth, and he harangued the other gods with these words: "O you gods, don't you be frightened. The time has not come for my burning of the world. Doomsday is still far away. What light is it you see? It is Garuda's light. Powerful among the birds, he is none other than Kasiapa's son, begotten of Winata. His brilliance equals my own."



    Parent
    funny thing (none / 0) (#193)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:25:12 PM EST
    about the "glaring light filling the firmament in all directions" thing.

    one of the first things you notice when you look closely at the thing is that the "front" is unbelievably dense with decoration and the "back" is pretty much a flat red color.  at least the back of the huge wing arrangement.
    I always thought this was because the "back" went against the wall and you dont see it.  then when I lived in LA my house was small and the only place for him was in front of a window with his back to it.  a window which happened to face the rising sun.
    one morning I woke at very early and walked into the room and the rising sun was hitting his back and it was amazing.
    the entire room looked like it was literally on fire.  the color was picking up and reflecting the light and FILLING the room.
    since then he as always sat with his back to the rising sun.

    Parent

    That settles it? No physical evidence (none / 0) (#194)
    by oculus on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:26:22 PM EST
    on your Garuda?

    Parent
    nope (none / 0) (#195)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:32:33 PM EST
    the almost all have a strategically placed sort of loin cloth thing.

     

    but after reading that I do remember he is definitely the son.

    Parent