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Tuesday Morning Open Thread

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Blog Related
Posted on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 09:33:24 AM EST
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I'll be back today flying solo on Daily Kos Radio from 11 to noon Eastern today. Discussing tonight's debate.

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Open Thread.

Here is yesterday's show (skip the first minute, technical difficulties):

The 11 Show October.15.2012 by Netroots Radio

< Macho Macho Man | Tuesday Afternoon Open Thread >

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    Tuesday Morning Open Thread | 35 comments (35 topical)

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    Romney Tax Plan (5.00 / 4) (#1)
    by indy in sc on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 10:24:58 AM EST
    Finally, an explanation of the plan I understand.

    Awesome (none / 0) (#8)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 11:05:25 AM EST
    Those details are really something.

    Parent
    Yep, even a dummy like me can understand (none / 0) (#10)
    by Angel on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 11:20:26 AM EST
    this one.

    Parent
    That's pretty funny n/t (none / 0) (#17)
    by Yman on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 12:21:19 PM EST


    Parent
    Paul Ryan Photo Op (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 10:59:42 AM EST
    LINK

    Republican Rep. Paul Ryan stopped by a soup kitchen in Youngstown, Ohio, over the weekend for what seemed to be your typical campaign photo opportunity. During his 15-minute visit on Saturday morning, the vice presidential candidate donned a white apron and offered to wash some dishes that--as several bloggers and a pool reporter later pointed out--did not appear to be dirty.

    IOW he volunteered to wash clean pots and pans because it would make a great photo.

    From the President of the charity:

    "We are apolitical because the majority of our funding is from private donations.  It's strictly in our bylaws not to do it. They showed up there, and they did not have permission. They got one of the volunteers to open up the doors."

    "The photo op they did wasn't even accurate.  He did nothing. He just came in here to get his picture taken at the dining hall."

    This is the prefect analogy of republican rule, do what looks best, accomplish nothing, then be less than honest about the motives.  The only thing missing is Ryan didn't manage to burn the place to the ground and blame Obama.

    Shameful. Absolutely shameful. And disgusting. (5.00 / 2) (#11)
    by Angel on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 11:23:44 AM EST
    And this comes from a person who has volunteered at the food bank in my community for over eleven years.  

    What a despicable thing the Ryans have done.  They don't care about the hungry or the hopeless, they care only about making people think they do.  

    Parent

    Priceless analogy... (5.00 / 3) (#13)
    by kdog on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 11:39:43 AM EST
    good thing the soup kitchen let the poser in, or else the Romney/Ryan stormtrooper supporters might well have burned the soup kitchen down...remember what they did to the Mexican restaurant in Denver when they refused to be used as GOP tools.

    Parent
    OT (not "overtime"): do you (5.00 / 1) (#19)
    by oculus on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 12:33:31 PM EST
    anticipate posting a follow-up re the family wedding?

    Parent
    For you, but of course... (5.00 / 1) (#24)
    by kdog on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 01:18:16 PM EST
    Nice little Catholic Church ceremony...we feared the torture of the full mass but the priest was cool, he kept the superstitious mumbo jumbo movin' to focus on the good stuff.  My cousin was cool as a cucumber, impressive.

    My aunt, the groom's mom, is doing battle with her second bout of cancer.  You'd never guess it lookin' at her...she looked ravishing and danced up a storm with me at the reception, as well as her 82 year old mom who can still do the lindy like a spry young chick.  The smiles on those two ladies lighting up the dance floor made my night.  Great band...mixed the old school and the new school well, closed with a killer rendition of Queen's "Bohemian Rhapsody".  "Born to Run" was another highlight.

    Loaded up on raw oysters and shrimp cocktail at the cocktail hour...then the procession of shots began..."to the bride!" "to the groom!" "to my pops!" "to Uncle Harold!" and on and on and on.  Plus 10 or so Captain & Gingers I was totally sh*tfaced, a twenty dollar tip out the gate ensures strong drinks;)...but I held it together enough to resist the feminine wiles of some bridesmaid jailbait.  Perhaps I'm a better drinker than I thought.

    My cousin seemed happier than ever, he gave a great speech that had tears flowing all over the joint.  We all joked he should get into politics;)

    A nice touch was after the reception they had a mobile brick oven pizza guy slinging pies while we waited for the shuttle bus...much needed alcohol sponges, good call Cuz!  The after-party at the hotel bar was a washout because they had this heavy metal cover band that was too sh*tty to be playing so loud, so we moved right to the after-after party in my hotel room cuz I got a balcony room, where the doobies flared and booze flowed till about 5 am.  We had randoms knockin' on the door asking "can we party with you guys?"  Funny sh*t.

    Sorry if the recap is all over the place, some recollections are cloudy.  Ain't no party like a McArab party...I'm sure the bride's family was wondering wtf they were marrying into;)

    And we won't be waitin' long for the next one, another cousin of mine proposed to his special lady the next day and she accepted.  Another one down, another one down, another one bites the dust...

    Parent

    Could you see your "fate" written on (none / 0) (#27)
    by oculus on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 01:42:39 PM EST
    the wall?  When will your special lady attend one of these blow-outs?

    Parent
    Dum Diddly Dee... (none / 0) (#29)
    by kdog on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 01:51:50 PM EST
    it's a bachelors life for me kid.  Don't start sounding like my moms! ;)

    I wish the special lady coulda accompanied me...maybe for the next one in the spring.  If circumstances were better I could totally see a committed monogamous common law thing between us, but I just don't believe in marriage.   Like my special lady says..."I love you today, tomorrow I don't know yet."  I like that philosophy of love.

    Parent

    SCOTUS (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by CoralGables on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 11:58:05 AM EST
    shuts down Ohio's blatant attempt keep people from voting. Sadly, just as in many states, it's still a BS method going forward.

    LINK

    The radio show is (none / 0) (#2)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 10:32:34 AM EST
    like a pre-funeral :)

    I'm as nervous about (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by brodie on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 11:12:12 AM EST
    tonight as our resident Nervous Misanthrope. Obama had geedee better deliver the goods or we's sunk.

    Scheduling an early evening pre-debate workout to ease the tension.  

    Still glad I only have the 20 yo teevee -- in case things don't go well and I can't control my impulses.

    Parent

    I take it BTD is worried about the polls? (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by ruffian on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 01:51:25 PM EST
    I know I am. But then I remember how much they have been moving around. Just glad Ohio is holding pretty firm - that looks like the firewall.

    Parent
    Any idea what became of (none / 0) (#3)
    by oculus on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 10:42:28 AM EST
    M of T?

    Parent
    I see he is writing more (none / 0) (#6)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 11:01:36 AM EST
    Tech difficulties seem to have gotten him down.

    Parent
    So says George Romney's Aide (none / 0) (#5)
    by vicndabx on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 10:59:51 AM EST
    "While it seems that Mitt would say and do anything to close a deal - or an election," he wrote, "George Romney's strength as a politician and public officeholder was his ability and determination to develop and hold consistent policy positions over his life."

    NY Times Link

    Well...Obama had better bring the goods (none / 0) (#7)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 11:02:50 AM EST
    I don't read polls well, but Armando does.

    Missed the show, as I was out raking leaves (none / 0) (#12)
    by DFLer on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 11:30:19 AM EST
    Can someone point me to a way to hear it after the live-cast?
    Thanks

    Another opportunity for gamblers: (none / 0) (#14)
    by oculus on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 11:45:59 AM EST
    It [the Man Booker Prize] also sparks a flurry of betting, and a blaze of literary debate.
     [NYT.]

    If women were so easily swayed (none / 0) (#16)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 12:19:49 PM EST
    By the sudden appearance of a Moderate Mitt all I can say is what a bunch of idiots.  How many anti women bills did the Republicans assault us with in the past 24 months?

    It reminds me of how about 5 years ago posters at DailyKos used to fight with us feminazis about how the Republicans were not serious about overturning Roe v. Wade.  They said it was all bluster and show, while many women who were born women knew in our souls it was much more than that.

    There are all sorts of low information voters out there, but those of my own sex pi$$ me off the most.

    Apparently Gallup organization will select (5.00 / 2) (#18)
    by oculus on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 12:23:00 PM EST
    the "undecided" voters who will comprise tonight's debate audience and submit questions, from which the moderator will select the questioners.  Is there a lie detector requirement as to "undecided"?  

    Parent
    Funny you should mention lie detectors. (5.00 / 3) (#23)
    by Anne on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 01:13:57 PM EST
    Charlie Pierce:

    The "ordinary voters" selected to participate on Tuesday evening are all "undecided voters" chosen by Gallup. All due respect to their honesty, and to Gallup's due diligence, but that data indicate that, given the fact that they need enough people to fill up a ninety-minute debate, some of those people lied their asses off to get the gig.

    Seriously.

    Parent

    I am looking for James O'Keefe to pop up (none / 0) (#33)
    by ruffian on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 03:55:22 PM EST
    But what costume will he wear?

    Parent
    Yeah (5.00 / 3) (#20)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 12:43:56 PM EST
    but here's the thing: Mitt has been all over the place on this kind of stuff so he can blur the lines on it. Now if Santorum or Newt was up there and saying this exact same thing people would be rolling in the aisles laughing.

    There are lot of women who have become complacent about this issue and I talked to many young women back in '08 who I warned Obama would not be strong enough to stand up to the GOP to defend women. They refused to listen or would not believe me but here we are. Now what?

    Parent

    A lot of the young 'uns (5.00 / 4) (#25)
    by Towanda on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 01:33:07 PM EST
    still are not listening, based upon what I have seen since and am seeing in classes that deal with the very topics of abortion, birth control, etc.

    The information on the history of this country's political swings on these issues is all there for them, as well as current data and more, all put together by yours truly to be but a click away.  So are pointed questions to focus their thinking about what they read.  

    This has helped to sort out some confusions -- typical from some whose pastors seem to have agendas to lead them astray on basic definitions -- but I see no sign that most women of a crucial age on this issue see that it could affect them.  It's always somebody else in some other place, it seems.  

    I hope that I am wrong and that they are just being guarded, wisely in my volatile area, on these issues.  But I also am so sorry to see that the years of this war on women -- on all sides; MT notes the DKos battles -- have taken their toll on enrollment in women's studies courses, which are well down from what they used to be.  There are few other areas of study in which women -- and a few good men -- can gain information that may enlighten them, counter misinformation all around them for decades now, etc.

    I worry for them.  I must resist the temptation to stop simply providing information and instead to act as politicians do and appeal to their emotions.  I've got some devastating video, such as a speech at the Million Women March by a woman who, when she was a girl, saw newspaper photos of the corpse of her mother on a hotel floor, having died alone after a coathanger abortion. . . .  

    I cannot go there, I cannot take them there, I must fulfill my task not to lecture but to "guide from the side" and hope that they get it -- that it is not about the past or another place but about the here and now.  About them!  Aarrgghh.

    Parent

    I worry for them as well (5.00 / 1) (#34)
    by shoephone on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 04:18:59 PM EST
    They take so much for granted -- the things that have always been available to them, the freedom to choose on a number of issues.  Maybe "Big Yellow Taxi" should be the camapaign theme song for women under the age of 40. And without you going all emotional on them, what will get them to care? It must be very frustrating for you.

    Parent
    Yes, I agree (none / 0) (#35)
    by Zorba on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 05:24:21 PM EST
    The young'uns do not know any women who had to go to an illegal, back-alley abortionist and who wound up not only lucky to be alive, but with their insides so messed up that they could never carry a baby afterwards.  I knew some of those women.


    Parent
    Not Just Women (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 01:00:29 PM EST
    At this point in the race, if you haven't decided, well....  But that is understandable, what I don't get is the people who shift weekly.  

    The polls keep shifting, that means something like 1-3% of the voting population switches pretty much on a weekly basis.  

    Who are these people and the F is wrong with them ?  Some of these shifts are over a gaff, not even real politics, yet hundreds of thousands, maybe even millions, change who they were going to vote for because of a gaff.

    And these are the idiots who will most certainly determine the next President of the United States.  This is the big defect of democracy, people who are easily swayed, know nothing of politics, but vote, or just big issues with making up their minds.

    Parent

    Saw a WaPo story today on Wisconsin (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by Towanda on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 01:39:52 PM EST
    undecided voters, or so it was billed -- and they really were not undecided, most of them.  They were couples or families split down the middle, one for Obama and one for Romney.  They were voters (and really voters, as Wisconsinites vote more than almost anyone in the country) informed on a lot of issues and the candidates' stances, and they were fairly certain but admitting to still sorting out their priorities on this issue over that one.  (Many are issues voters, as is evident in many having voted for Bush and Obama, or having voted for Walker and Obama.)  

    Or they were being typically reticent, Midwestern nice, about what they plan to do in the privacy of the polling booth, and the reporter did mention that regional survival tactic but not seem to think that it may have influenced the interviews.

    Anyway, the story made me wonder whether there really are as many undecideds as we are told.  Or maybe they're elsewhere, but in the swing state that has been the closest state a couple of times recently, maybe people are more informed.  I don't know, but it was an intriguing glimpse.

    Parent

    Have you a proposed solution? (none / 0) (#22)
    by oculus on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 01:02:28 PM EST


    Parent
    Pretty Sure... (none / 0) (#30)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 02:40:34 PM EST
    ...if there was a solution democracies everywhere would be using it.

    But I would love to see a reality show of the person or people who are vote back and forth.  I just assume they are idiots.  From Reagan to Clinton to Bush to Obama to possibly Romney, that in my mind is just plain crazy.  Is there a legitimate reason or do they just like to pick a winner, the favorite.

    Someone is doing it and I would love to know why.

    In Australia you are fined for not voting.  That must multiply the problem of uniformed voters.

    In Mexico, there are no incumbents, the President is limited to one term and their Congress cannot hold office back-to-back.  I like this, yet their government is no model.

    Parent

    I suspect they are the people that (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by ruffian on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 03:54:11 PM EST
    don't know or care that much about the issues and just vote for the guy that looks and acts the part the best.

    Much like most of the MSM, as a matter of fact. The voters have been reinforced in this behavior by the behavior of the media that tells them looks and demeanor are very important information.

    Parent

    Mexico is a complete mess. (none / 0) (#31)
    by oculus on Tue Oct 16, 2012 at 02:50:37 PM EST


    Parent
    Tuesday Morning Open Thread | 35 comments (35 topical)

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