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NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveillance

By Jeralyn, Section War on Terror
Posted on Thu Jan 05, 2006 at 01:19:46 PM EST
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Meet Russ Tice, a whistleblower in the NSA warrantless electronic surveillance program and former NSA official, fired last year, who is asking to testify at Congressional hearings on the program.

"I intend to report to Congress probable unlawful and unconstitutional acts conducted while I was an intelligence officer with the National Security Agency and with the Defense Intelligence Agency," Mr. Tice stated in the Dec. 16 letters, copies of which were obtained by The Washington Times.

The letters were sent the same day that the New York Times revealed that the NSA was engaged in a clandestine eavesdropping program that bypassed the secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) court. The FISA court issues orders for targeted electronic and other surveillance by the government.

....In his Dec. 16 letter, Mr. Tice wrote that his testimony would be given under the provisions of the 1998 Intelligence Community Whistleblower Protection Act, which makes it legal for intelligence officials to disclose wrongdoing without being punished.

[hat tip Patriot Daily.]

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    NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveillance | 26 comments (26 topical)
    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#1)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Jan 05, 2006 at 03:27:49 PM EST
    Wonder how long before Mr. Tice has a auto accident?

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#2)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Jan 05, 2006 at 03:57:08 PM EST
    Since he's already been found to be psychologically unstable, it'll probably be a suicide.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#3)
    by Edger on Thu Jan 05, 2006 at 04:43:08 PM EST
    His mail is probably being forwarded to Guantanamo Bay by now...

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#4)
    by Che's Lounge on Thu Jan 05, 2006 at 05:11:12 PM EST
    "Wait for my signal, then unleash smear."

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#5)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Jan 05, 2006 at 06:42:31 PM EST
    The radio/tv news program Democracy Now broke this story earlier this week when Amy Goodman conducted a 40-minute on-camera interview with Russell Tice. The transcript of the interview and video/audio files are online here.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#6)
    by Edger on Thu Jan 05, 2006 at 06:58:34 PM EST
    Good links, MB99; The interview of Tice by Goodman is an eye opener well worth reading...

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#8)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Jan 05, 2006 at 09:43:31 PM EST
    You miss a few things 1) There's a procedure for whistle blowers, and it doesn't involve the press. 2) Tice was fired. Do you have any idea how hard it is to get fired from a government job? It's a near impossibility, unless you are a political appointee. Which leads me to believe that something stinks, and it's not what Tice says it is.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#9)
    by Edger on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 12:10:34 AM EST
    Was that the signal, Che?

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#10)
    by Edger on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 12:24:28 AM EST
    Which leads me to believe that something stinks
    Don't worry about it... it's just the rotting corpse of that quaint old idea of freedom. The smell will dissipate soon. You'll never know anything died here. No big deal, in a couple of minutes the program will be over and they'll cut to the commercials... Everything's fine and dandy.... Go shopping, James.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#11)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 05:13:53 AM EST
    edger, Do you have a substantive response? There's a legal procedure for people who want to report what they see as illegal action. It involves going to the IG's office. Not the Press. Neither Tice, the Times, you, or I get to decide what should or should not be classified. Revealing classified information is a crime, and intentions don't enter into it. You can spin he story any way you want, but at the end of the day, he committed a crime by talking about it. There's also the whole getting fired thing, and I wasn't kidding when I said that it's a near impossibility to get fired from a govt agency.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#12)
    by Edger on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 05:41:02 AM EST
    Yes, there are legal procedures for this. Tice is using them. Testifying to Congress under the Whistleblower Protection Act is one of them, if not the only one. I suggest you read the articles and the interviews, do some research, and generally inform yourself with more than your wishlist. I realize the "whole getting fired thing" is a great starting point for dismissing anything Tice might say as if he were a some kind of leper or moral failure for getting fired, but that is irrelevant and just desperation for some way to discredit him. And I have been a federal government employee in the past myself. You're right, it's difficult to get fired. I quit after they tripled my salary in three years, because one more year and I would have been trapped in a gilded cage. I don't take well to traps, thanks, gilded or not.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#13)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 06:34:10 AM EST
    "I realize the "whole getting fired thing" is a great starting point for dismissing anything Tice might say as if he were a some kind of leper or moral failure for getting fired, but that is irrelevant and just desperation for some way to discredit him." It's a simple fact. He had to do something pretty awful to get fired, because the civil service laws make it very, very hard. Normal practice is to shuffle people with problems around to make them someone else's problem. To actually get fired? There had to be a huge problem - which does call his judgement into question. As to whistleblowing - sure, going to Congress - i.e., the relevant oversight committee - is fine. Announcing it in the press and being a source for the NY Times is not it. I'd invite you to read the relevant statute Of interest:
    Whoever knowingly and willfully communicates, furnishes, transmits, or otherwise makes available to an unauthorized person, or publishes, or uses in any manner prejudicial to the safety or interest of the United States or for the benefit of any foreign government to the detriment of the United States any classified information— (1) concerning the nature, preparation, or use of any code, cipher, or cryptographic system of the United States or any foreign government; or (2) concerning the design, construction, use, maintenance, or repair of any device, apparatus, or appliance used or prepared or planned for use by the United States or any foreign government for cryptographic or communication intelligence purposes; or (3) concerning the communication intelligence activities of the United States or any foreign government; or (4) obtained by the processes of communication intelligence from the communications of any foreign government, knowing the same to have been obtained by such processes— Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both.
    The Times is not authorized to receive such information - and yet that's where Tice went. You can spin all you want edger - Tice clearly broke the law. Seeing as how TL is a lawyer, I'd love to see TL trying to explain away that statute. Leaking in public isn't part of the deal.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#14)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 07:09:39 AM EST
    If this is the same Russ Tice, here is why he was fired.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#15)
    by Edger on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 07:33:47 AM EST
    To actually get fired? There had to be a huge problem - which does call his judgement into question. I'm sure there was a huge problem. It appears that it was a problem he saw happening. Some of the down and dirty actual details of lawbreaking within the NSA that the agency was conducting at the direction of the president's Executive Order, extended on several occasions – directing or allowing the NSA to monitor the international telephone calls and e-mail messages of American citizens. I am not a lawyer, so I won't attempt to debate the law here, except to say that I understand one of the purposes of the Whistleblower Protection Act to be to make it possible for people, who would by other statutes be prohibited from disclosing classified information, to report illegal activities they might witness or know of in cases where that reporting reguires classified dislosure. Granting an interview to the NYT or any other media is not illegal at all. Nor is Tice talking to them about what he plans to reveal to Congress. Perhaps dislosing details to the NYT would be, but if you read Tices interview with Goodman you know he took pains to not do that. But smear away if you wish... don't let the facts get in the way.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#16)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 09:11:45 AM EST
    edger, have you ever worked in the defense sector? I have, and I have plenty of friends who still do. At NSA, the kind of "payback" that Tice says happened is laughable. I'd be interested in hearing what actually happened, but NSA, as is its wont, is silent.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#17)
    by Quaker in a Basement on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 09:19:23 AM EST
    Do you have any idea how hard it is to get fired from a government job? It's a near impossibility, unless you are a political appointee.
    I bet Bunnatine Greenhouse would be surprised to learn that.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#18)
    by SeeEmDee on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 09:24:21 AM EST
    This kind of thing is nothing new; the withdrawal of security clearences as politically motivated retaliation for someone who has stepped on the hooves of scared cows in the course of their duties has been happening since the early 1960's: Google Search String for "Otto Otepka"

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#19)
    by SeeEmDee on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 09:26:08 AM EST
    Sorry, that was obviously meant as 'sacred' cows, but, as Sibel Edmonds has prett much proved, thay are also 'scared', too.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#20)
    by SeeEmDee on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 10:03:32 AM EST
    Gotta slow down and use SpellCheck...

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#21)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 10:52:59 AM EST
    Yeah...it's so hard to get fired from an NSA position. All you have to do is "voice concerns".

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#22)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 11:16:43 AM EST
    et al - The link provided by macromanic is very intersting. It appears that the first problem was:
    In 2001, Tice, who was then working at DIA, reported his suspicions that a co-worker might have been a Chinese spy, POGO said. Two years later, after Tice had transferred to NSA, an FBI investigation into the DIA co-worker prompted Tice to raise his concerns again.
    So it appears that he objected to the outcome of the FBI investigation. Now, what did the evaluation say about Tice? Cox News
    The Defense Department psychologist concluded that Tice suffered from psychotic paranoia, according to Tice... He did this even though he admitted that I did not show any of the normal indications of someone suffering from paranoia," Tice wrote in a statement to the inspector general.
    Now if you read the article, there was a fair amount of back and forth. But Tice, who started this journey with a claim that a co-worker is spying for China, then pushed the envelope again.
    In the summer of 2003, Tice told the NSA that he was considering talking to his congressional representatives about waste and abuse at NSA security.
    It is a long jump from spying going on at DIA to waste and abuse at the NSA.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#23)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 11:41:30 AM EST
    So it appears that he objected to the outcome of the FBI investigation.
    No it does not! The article states that, "...an FBI investigation into the DIA co-worker prompted Tice to raise his concerns again." Where did you come up with Tice objecting to the outcome of the FBI investigation?

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#24)
    by Edger on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 12:35:33 PM EST
    Macro: That's an old hijacking trick used often. Attribute to someone something they did not say that is remotely similar to what he's claiming they said, hoping someone will bite and say "wait a minute - he never said that", then come in with "of course he did - what do you think he meant when he said..." and make reference to the original remotely similar statement to support what he claimed they said

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#25)
    by Edger on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 12:54:02 PM EST
    If that makes sense you're way ahead of me. :-)

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#26)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 01:36:42 PM EST
    The impeachment remark on the FISA court thread is another example, FWIW.
    Pick, pick, pcik. Boring!
    There, PPJ, I did your response for you.

    Re: NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveil (none / 0) (#27)
    by Edger on Fri Jan 06, 2006 at 03:19:31 PM EST
    Looks like Tice's offer to testify to Congress will likely be welcomed... Nonpartisan Congressional Research Service legislative attorneys have issued a report finding that Bush's claim of executive power was not "well grounded" in law, according to RawStory january 06/06.
    The report said it was impossible to determine the legality of the taps without access to classified information surrounding the decision.
    NSA Whistleblower Seeks to Testify Re: Surveillance | 26 comments (26 topical)