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Max Baucus

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Other Politics
Posted on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 10:06:49 AM EST
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Via Corrente:

Senate Finance Chairman Max Baucus, who has a history of going his own way on major policy matters, Friday announced plans to unveil his own “specific goals and policy options for comprehensive health care reform in 2009” next week — without waiting for the detailed proposals of President-elect Barack Obama .

If you know anything about Max Baucus, you know this is bad news. Ironically, the proponents of health care reform and President-Elect Obama may need Senator Hillary Clinton to get into it with Baucus. She probably is the one person with enough credibility and political muscle to knock Baucus around on this. You think the blogs would welcome that? I doubt they care.

By Big Tent Democrat, speaking for me only

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    Max Baucus | 34 comments (34 topical)

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    Seems to me that anything with the word Reform (5.00 / 1) (#8)
    by blogtopus on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 11:00:32 AM EST
    is doing just the opposite nowadays.

    Health Care Reform? How about just plain Health Care, Max? That's because he isn't providing it.

    Max, you ignorant slut.

    Again!!!! (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by Pepe on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 11:19:21 AM EST
    So Obama needs Hillary Clinton to fight his battles again?

    How about calling on Rahm who people seem to love now and forget all about his DLC roots? Or Biden?

    Hillary didn't get any love after Obama won for winning over all those White voters for Obama. Not the MSM, not one blogger I read gave Hillary Clinton any credit for that. No, it was Obama who won over the White voters according to all post-election account. BS.

    She sucked it up and worked hard to win over Whites in general and specifically her supporters for Obama was instrumental in putting him over the top big time and what thanks and recognition did she get from both the MSM and the bloggers I read? ZERO.

    I say go on vacation Hill, you deserve it. Treat yourself and pat yourself on the back - no one else has. Let Obama fight his own transition battles, it's not your fight right now. You did more that was expected with no reward.

    Hillary persuaded me to vote (5.00 / 2) (#15)
    by ding7777 on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 11:38:11 AM EST
    for Obama (and still I did not want to vote FOR Obama so I just voted straight Democratic)

    Parent
    Can't imagine what TV (5.00 / 0) (#21)
    by gyrfalcon on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 01:00:14 PM EST
    you've been watching.  I heard her repeatedly praised and given major credit for Obama wins particularly in Florida on MSNBC, CNN and even a couple of dips into Fox.  I heard it repeatedly said that the Obama camp was over the top with pleasure and gratitude for her efforts on his behalf.

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    I don't watch (none / 0) (#22)
    by Pepe on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 01:16:16 PM EST
    those garbage stations who are full of people with an agenda and are a waste of my time in trying to filter out all the BS.

    Like I said in my post I didn't "read" any people giving her credit. I get all the info I need from reading and can even just skip by paragraphs the are fluff or BS agenda quotes. It saves a tremendous amount of time and aggravation so I can do other things.

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    Kevin Drum (none / 0) (#28)
    by lilburro on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 02:01:00 PM EST
    Here

    we all owe her some recognition and gratitude for her role in tonight's victory. Hillary has always been unambiguously dedicated to the Democratic Party and the cause of liberalism, and I think she proved that in the most concrete way possible over the past two months.


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    Good for him (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by Pepe on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 02:11:47 PM EST
    I don't read him as I don't/can't read everybody. As I said I didn't see anybody mention Hillary in what I had read and I read a pretty wide swath of what is out there.

    IMO not enough people recognized her important contribution. I don't read every post on the front pages here but in what I did read I read nothing on the front pages of Clinton's contributions either.

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    Didn't Nancy Pelosi say (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by BackFromOhio on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 12:30:53 PM EST
    on Wed. that healthcare is off the table? And is it not widely believed that she said this in coordination with the Obama team?

    Got a link? (none / 0) (#25)
    by oldpro on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 01:34:24 PM EST
    I can't find that anywhere and I've looked...

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    Here's the link (none / 0) (#31)
    by BackFromOhio on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 07:47:34 PM EST

    House Speaker Nancy Pelosi is seeking to limit expectations on what a new Democratic regime will be able to achieve in the 111th Congress.
    "We have to choose our priorities" and decide "what is achievable," Pelosi told reporters this morning, adding: "A lot of it is about time." She saied that the current economic conditions and budget deficit "are going to make it harder" to do some big things dear to Democrats, like comprehensive health care reform, but said that smaller, "discrete," initiatives, i.e. SCHIP and stem cell funding, could be done quickly.

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    Link - sorry (none / 0) (#32)
    by BackFromOhio on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 07:48:40 PM EST


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    Can't get link to work so (none / 0) (#33)
    by BackFromOhio on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 07:49:11 PM EST
    http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/11/05/1651482.aspx

    typed out above.....

    Parent

    Many thanks... (none / 0) (#34)
    by oldpro on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 11:26:49 PM EST
    bye, bye healthcare.

    Doesn't sound like a 'time' problem to me...sounds like a $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ problem and a leadership problem.

    Parent

    Hhillary has no leverage (5.00 / 2) (#23)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 01:17:23 PM EST
    at all with Congress on this issue.  In fact, the following article might be evidence that any effort she might make toward healthcare will be shot down.

    WaPo

    She lost.  She's completely powerless, a non-sequitor.  She doesn't exist.  She needs to go away.  Obama  beat her and his faction is darned sure they're going to make sure she doesn't even get a bone.

    Maybe someday she'll learn the lesson that rolling over and submitting for your party is a stupid idea.  

    Hillary's historic run in the primary (none / 0) (#30)
    by MyLeftMind on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 02:30:46 PM EST
    leaves her with huge politcal capital.  I hope she's very careful in how she uses it.  It's not just that she ran, it's the amount of support she generated and the number of people she reached.  In spite of the split in the party, many of us are expecting some pay off in terms of her Senate responsibilities.  But UHC is a contentious, complicated area, with big special interests that will block solutions that prioritize the public over pharmaceutical and insurance companies.  I'm guessing history will not look kindly on whatever solutions Congress creates, since America's middle class will probably end up paying more for lower quality.  

    On the other hand, economic recovery provides lots of areas with potential to change our economic stability and rebuild America's bleeding middle class.  Hillary's support of HOME/HOLC is a good example, and sets her apart from congressional Dems who jumped on the bandwagon to fleece taxpayers with the recent bailout.  Now that we've socialized Wall Street without guaranteeing public returns, the field's wide open for someone like Hillary committed to bailing out Main Street.  That's an area that would establish and/or reaffirm her commitment to the middle class and blue collar workers, while providing the foundation our country needs for economic recovery.


    Parent

    Or maybe Baucus is going Obama's way. (none / 0) (#1)
    by ThatOneVoter on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 10:13:54 AM EST
    I find the timing of this announcement odd, unless you think he is working at Obama's behest.


    I don't think he's going Obama's way (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by rdandrea on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 11:09:16 AM EST
    Or else he wouldn't be trying to get his proposal on the table first.

    Parent
    It will be interesting to see (5.00 / 2) (#13)
    by Pepe on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 11:31:16 AM EST
    what he comes up with. Knowing Bacus he want to make sure the health insurance corps make lots of money with the new policy but it is hard to envision how he would be able to line their pockets any more than Obama's plan will.

    But then again maybe the poster up top is on to something sorta. You see Obama already started to walk back on his campaign promises the night he got elected. I fully expect him to do more of that but he isn't going to come out and say it himself. If he can have centrist surrogates present legislation that undercuts his own thin promises then what is he, cough, to do? It's congress after all who write the bills not him. So to get someone like Baucus to do your dirty work is not beyond reason in the world of Democratic politics.

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    Obama began walking back his campaign promises (5.00 / 4) (#18)
    by jawbone on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 12:38:34 PM EST
    weeks before the election.

    I posted about his statements at a private PA fundraiser, where he said he was going to have to cut back on the big expensive programs like healthcare and education things. Said privately. Also said he was going to have to fight against his own party in Congress...sounded pretty worrisome to me.

    He's begun to "tamp down expectations" shortly before the election and definitely Tuesday night.

    Now, he can say he always told the public not to expect too much too soon.

    I'll look for a link for fundraiser comments.

    Parent

    This: (none / 0) (#24)
    by Thanin on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 01:18:52 PM EST
    "Now, he can say he always told the public not to expect too much too soon."

    kind of sounds like a WORM, but we'll see.

    Parent

    Healthy Americans Act (none / 0) (#26)
    by caseyOR on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 01:39:01 PM EST
    Ron Wyden (D-OR) serves on the Finance Committee with Baucus. For a couple of years now Ron has been touting his plan. It calls for coverage of all Americans by private insurers. It ends employer paid insurance. It makes insurance portable. It requires everyone to buy health insurance. Is it possible Wyden's plan is the one Baucus is supporting?

    I don't particularly care for Ron's plan because it still leaves health insurance in the hands of for-profit companies. I haven't seen any mechanisms in Ron's plan that provide for system-wide negotiation on the cost of medications or treatments.

    HR676, Medicare for All, is still the best proposal for Americans.

    Parent

    Not unlikely... (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by oldpro on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 01:47:37 PM EST
    he and Kennedy are set to brief Obama on healthcare this week or next...the three of them will decide who/how and when...and yes, the insurance companies will be favored (duh).

    Universal ACCESS is the Obama plan and will not ever lead to universal healthcare.  That is why Hillary's plan was better.

    Remains to be seen what deals Hil and Bill made with Obama.  There clearly were some and he owes them bigtime.  Problem is, he owes others more...including the insurance industry, so we're probably screwed on healthcare.

    Parent

    A couple links (none / 0) (#2)
    by Steve M on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 10:14:10 AM EST
    Ezra Klein had a blog post on the issue of whether Baucus's or Ted Kennedy's committee will be writing the initial health care bill.  Kennedy is obviously better from a progressive standpoint, but for procedural reasons a bill from his committee may have a tougher time making it through the process.  It's complicated.

    Ezra also had a lengthy profile of Max Baucus and how he intends to approach this issue.  I'll just say this, I firmly believe Baucus was one of the heroes in the battle with Bush over privatizing Social Security, but for some reason the blogosphere has collectively decided he was one of the bad guys.  Probably it's because the blogs are incapable of anything other than a binary, good vs. evil narrative when it comes to legislators, and Baucus has certainly been a centrist compromiser on many issues.  Either way, he's a key figure right now.

    Excuse me (none / 0) (#3)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 10:20:47 AM EST
    Baucus was no hero in the fight. He wanted to do business with Bush on privatizing SS. He was shouted down.

    Baucus is poison.

    Parent

    Well (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by Steve M on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 10:26:43 AM EST
    That's the standard blog narrative, I agree, but I am sticking to my guns on this one.  I was there just like you were.

    Parent
    Then (none / 0) (#5)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 10:29:12 AM EST
    you ignored what Baucus said and did.

    Watch him on health care and see if you keep defending him.

    Parent

    Come on (none / 0) (#9)
    by Steve M on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 11:00:54 AM EST
    Give me at least a little credit here.  There are plenty of reasons to dislike Baucus on other issues, but even David Sirota - who hates Baucus on trade - acknowledged that "Baucus was pivotal in stopping President Bush's Social Security privatization plan."

    Let's look at the record.  We all know Bush brought up his plan to privatize Social Security shortly after his November 2004 reelection.  Where was Baucus?

    1/6/05: Senator Max Baucus of Montana, a Democrat whose support was essential to the enactment of President Bush's tax cuts in 2001 and his Medicare legislation in 2003, said on Thursday that he would oppose the president's Social Security plan this year.

    Mr. Baucus's position will make it difficult for the White House to obtain the Democratic votes necessary for the measure to get through the Senate.

    "I seriously doubt I'm going to be the linchpin this time," Mr. Baucus, the senior Democrat on the Finance Committee, said in an interview.

    The president's plan to allow workers to divert part of their Social Security taxes into private investment accounts would "exacerbate the problem, not solve it," the senator said.

    2/4/05: Mr. Baucus, the senior Democrat on the Senate Finance Committee, was sounding the alarm against Mr. Bush's core idea - allowing younger workers to divert part of their payroll taxes into private investment accounts. "All this talk you hear about private accounts," he told a standing-room-only audience of several hundred here, "it really has nothing to do with the solvency of the Social Security trust fund. In fact, it makes the solvency of the Social Security trust fund much worse. Much worse."

    4/5/05: U.S. Senator Max Baucus, the senior Democrat on the Senate Finance Committee, said President George W. Bush's proposal to create private Social Security accounts has no chance of passing Congress.

    "Privatization is dead," Baucus, a Montana lawmaker, said on Capitol Hill today. The Bush proposal "won't pass, no way, no how."

    4/26/05: Any close analytic look at the actual effect of the private accounts indicates why, because the private accounts, despite what some say they are, leave virtually nothing left to the private account holder, because almost all that has to go back in the form of reductions in Social Security benefits, on top of the other benefits in the president's plan...

    The administration has said publicly that they want to indulge in a bait-and-switch strategy. That is, they want to bait us, the Democrats and others, into sitting down and negotiating out the solvency issues and taking private off the table. That's the bait.

    The switch is, at a later date, because the president and the Republicans have majority votes, especially in the House, the switch will be putting private accounts back on the table, and we're just back in the soup again. And that's not going to reach result...

    MARGARET WARNER: Okay, but let me ask, though, to be clear, Sen. Baucus, are you saying that before you'll go forward, the president has to agree that private accounts are off the table because you're afraid you'll be sandbagged otherwise?

    SEN. MAX BAUCUS: That's exactly right.

    I think the record is clear.  I would be interested to see you make the case that Baucus was not opposed to private accounts every step of the way.

    Parent

    He was pivotal BECAUSE (none / 0) (#10)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 11:05:13 AM EST
    he was the weak link who was shored up.

    I'll give you some credit on this when you exibit something to give you credit for.

    Righty now you are acting rather foolish in my view.

    Parent

    He was only the weak link (none / 0) (#14)
    by Steve M on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 11:32:16 AM EST
    because he had previously worked with Bush on other issues and people were worried about him.

    I've given you quotes and dates.  Show me where he was weak on SS privatization prior to that.  Show me where other leading Democrats were way out in front of Baucus in terms of opposing this.

    One of the annoying things about the SS debate was that even the Democrats who were on the right side didn't have any kind of grasp of the real issues, so they were consistently ineffectual on the talk shows and such.  Baucus was one of the few who truly understood the perils of privatization from the start, and I think the record backs that up.

    This is really a side issue, but I am happy to leave it to the jury to decide if I am acting foolish.  I am not contending that Baucus is guaranteed to be a progressive hero on health care, by any means.  He is a mixed bag.

    Parent

    Since I don't know that much about Baucus, links (none / 0) (#19)
    by jawbone on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 12:42:30 PM EST
    Please!

    I know he is a deficit hawk along with Kent Conrad of North Dakota (who always gave detailed presentations on how BushBoy's budgets were full of red ink--he'll probably do the same to Obama's).

    So, I'd love to learn more about Baucus.

    Do you have any details of his healthcare/insurance/reform plans?

    Parent

    Missed your ealier post--but anything on UHC? n/t (none / 0) (#20)
    by jawbone on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 12:43:52 PM EST


    Parent
    Couldn't be worse than Moynihan (5.00 / 3) (#6)
    by Molly Bloom on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 10:30:02 AM EST
    Daniel Patrick Moynihan, who aggressively opposed Clinton's health-care plan in 1994. Moynihan went as far as to appear on Meet the Press to accuse Clinton of using "fantasy numbers" and declare that "there is no health-care crisis."

    Not to say Baucus will not need watching.

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    Moynihan was horrible (none / 0) (#7)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 10:32:05 AM EST
    As bad as Baucus.

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    I uprated you because you said (none / 0) (#16)
    by hairspray on Sat Nov 08, 2008 at 12:01:18 PM EST
    my favorite words, binary.  Our culture is steeped in binary thinking and I, cough, cough, think it may be attributable to our legal system based on its structure of adversarial positions. You may have a different take on its origins.

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    Max Baucus | 34 comments (34 topical)

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