home

Ed Kilgore For The Unity Ticket

Ed Kilgore on why a Unity Ticket is a good idea:

I know this is a deeply unpopular, even infuriating, suggestion to many Obama supporters who've watched the Clinton campaign savage their champion for many months. Indeed, some of them think the vanquishing of the Clintons from power in the Democratic Party is the whole point of the Obama "movement." Why, many ask, should Obama take on Hillary's "baggage" after finally defeating her at the cost of so much blood, sweat, tears, money, and approval-ratings points?

More...

The answer is simple, and for me at least, overwhelmingly compelling. Right now the Democratic Party is deeply divided, as evidenced by the steadily rising number of Democratic primary voters threatening to take a dive in November. Those divisions are, in fact, John McCain's most important political asset. Yet they are not about ideology, or about policy issues, really; they are about these two Democratic politicians, and all the symbolic freight each has assumed. The easiest way, the fastest way, and the only sure way, to heal these divisions is to unite their sources on a single ticket.

What he said. See also Tom Watson.

By Big Tent Democrat, speaking for me only

Comments closed.

< How To Solve The Problem | The Electoral Map vs. the Primary Map >
  • The Online Magazine with Liberal coverage of crime-related political and injustice news

  • Contribute To TalkLeft


  • Display: Sort:
    I'm siorry... (5.00 / 5) (#2)
    by Rainsong on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:16:20 PM EST
    but smashing Clinton, with a tone of grudgingly accepting with great reluctance that she has too much support, may not be effective.

    Don't know whether to laugh or cry, we hate you Hillary, but we need you -- welll.. not you, but your voters.

    Clinton will rally her voters to Obama. No need to insult her further.

    I might... (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by dianem on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:18:07 PM EST
    MIGHT... vote for Obama if Clinton was his VP. I'm not sure, but I'd consider it. That and counting Florida and Michigan might sway me. Not that he needs my vote, but I suspect that there are a lot of people like me in the Democratic Party - people who are looking for a reason to vote in favor of Obama who simply can't find one.

    Might, might. (5.00 / 0) (#61)
    by rnibs on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:36:33 PM EST
    People are fools who think anyone other than HRC in the VP spot could sway some of us to consider voting for him.  It would be very, very hard to vote for him, but that would be the only thing that might cause me to actually vote for him.  

    I'd do it because I'd assume she'd be a very strong VP and knock some of his silly policy notions out of his head.  I think with HRC on the ticket, we'd at least have a chance at getting some of her policies through.  BO paired with any one else means BO's policies, which I will never support.

    Parent

    Richardson would not be it (none / 0) (#7)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:18:57 PM EST
    at least for me

    Parent
    I think (5.00 / 19) (#6)
    by hlr on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:18:51 PM EST
    all the men writing these Obama/Clinton unity ticket arguments fundamentally don't understand Hillary's base.

    I'm with you.... (5.00 / 5) (#25)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:26:53 PM EST
    Clearly the media doesn't share the admiration a good share of the democratic party voters have.

    They are continuing on this afternoon claiming Hillary is saying the whites won't vote for him. They are ignoring that it is a segment of the white demographic, not simply "whites" who won't vote for him. Not one word out there about how Obama believes the Clinton's cannot capture the AA vote back. If they can't, it's because they were painted as the enemy.


    Parent

    Yes (5.00 / 9) (#32)
    by Emma on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:28:01 PM EST
    I think you're right.  Asking the more qualified woman to take second fiddle while the less qualified man is promoted over her -- it sticks in the craw.

    The question asked to every woman who's ever complained about the younger, less experienced, less qualified man promoted over her:  "Do you think you're entitled to a promotion?"

    Don't underestimate how many women "of a certain age" have lived through this more than once.

    Parent

    If Hillary were to accept the VP (5.00 / 5) (#93)
    by Boston Boomer on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:41:13 PM EST
    under Obama, I would lose a lot of respect for her.  I would not vote for Obama even if Hillary is on the ticket as VP.  If Hillary were on the top of the ticket with Obama as VP, I'd vote for them, but with a heavy heart.  I'm afraid the ticket would not win with Obama weighing it down.


    Parent
    how do you think (none / 0) (#129)
    by leftygogo on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:48:49 PM EST
    Hillary would win over Obama's supporters?

    Parent
    if she ironed his shirts (5.00 / 3) (#134)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:50:11 PM EST
    I think Stella was making a joke (5.00 / 1) (#204)
    by leftygogo on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:08:29 PM EST
    Everyone knows Hillary would curb stomp any man dumb enough to drop a load of wrinkled shirts on her desk.

    Parent
    Why are you so confrontationaL (none / 0) (#150)
    by independent voter on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:53:53 PM EST
    today? I am immune to you being a Clinton partisan, but the comments are truly coming across as spiteful this evening. You are better than this.

    Parent
    Maybe an astro-troll wore on her last nerve ... (4.20 / 5) (#210)
    by Ellie on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:11:36 PM EST
    ... or the sheer time-wasting factor of Team Obama's other transparently idiotic super genius strategies made her [grouchy, problematic, angry, bitter, clingy and say "I I I" instead of "we we we"].

    Could be a bad period or a hot flash though.

    Parent

    so just so I am (none / 0) (#158)
    by TruthMatters on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:56:04 PM EST
    aware how was this NOT a sexist comment?

    in fact you made a sexist comment while trying to attack Obama supporters as being sexist.

    just wow.

    Parent

    I am confident (5.00 / 2) (#224)
    by echinopsia on Thu May 08, 2008 at 07:48:38 PM EST
    she will get his votes if she's the nominee. It's not clear he would get the votes she got if he were the nominee.

    Parent
    {raises hand} along with being told . . . (5.00 / 4) (#99)
    by nycstray on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:42:25 PM EST
    I make a fine salary for a woman . . .

    heh, we've come a long way baby . . . .

    Parent

    Wasn't LBJ more (5.00 / 1) (#102)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:43:54 PM EST
    experienced than JFK?  Obama is getting "promoted" over her.  He has won the nomination  - or will.  At that time, asking her to be VP is not an insult.  It is a sign of respect for an strong campaigner.

    Parent
    LBJ (5.00 / 2) (#178)
    by Emma on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:59:46 PM EST
    also got 409 delegates on the first and only ballot at the Democratic Convention in 1960.  He wasn't competitive against Kennedy like Clinton is against Obama.  And he wasn't offered the VP until after he lost the race fair and square. Let me emphasize the fair and square part.

    Parent
    BTD opened the discussion (none / 0) (#193)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:04:40 PM EST
    about the unity ticket.  Are you suggesting he is also against the "fair and square" argument?  

    But let's just say it is an entirely hypothetical argument.  In that case if Obama gets the nomination, I think it would be wise to offer the nomination to HRC.  

    Parent

    Actually, yes, but (none / 0) (#160)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:56:21 PM EST
    as I remember it, LBJ resented JFK tremendously.

    Parent
    Yep, but he stepped up to the (5.00 / 2) (#176)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:59:27 PM EST
    plate like an adult and did what the party needed. JFK wasn't a big fan of LBJs either, but he did what was necessary.  It's time for both sides to do the same now.

    Parent
    yeah, problem is that BO is no JFK. (5.00 / 4) (#191)
    by kangeroo on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:03:57 PM EST
    not in a million years, not by a longshot.  wishful thinking won't make him so.  that's why the analogy doesn't fit.

    Parent
    Um. (none / 0) (#172)
    by ChiTownDenny on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:58:57 PM EST
    Didn't JFK have significantly more national experience that BHO, sexism aside?

    Parent
    My point is NOT to compare (5.00 / 1) (#186)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:01:53 PM EST
    Obama with JFK, but was to give one example of cases where the traditionallly experienced candidate was the VP.  And couldn't you make an argument that Al Gore was more experienced in Washington wasys then was Bill Clinton?  

    Parent
    OK. (5.00 / 2) (#206)
    by ChiTownDenny on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:09:03 PM EST
    If the traditionally experienced candidate may have been the VP, what about the "no experience" candidate?  He should be the Pres?

    Parent
    There is a contest and (none / 0) (#207)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:09:17 PM EST
    one candidate wins.  The 2nd place candidate is a damn good candidate with strong supporters.  Winning candidate should offer position to 2nd place candidate.  That could/should  happen no matter what gender the candidates were.

    So if HRC was a man it would be OK for Obama to offer him the vp slot?  

    TO me it is sexist to NOT OFFER her the slot.

    Parent

    This reminds me so much of Texas (5.00 / 3) (#192)
    by DJ on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:03:59 PM EST
    when Ann Richards who had done so much for us was kicked out for the good ole boy who did nothing for us.  Unqualified man over fantastically qualified woman.  Makes me mad, makes me sad.

    Parent
    This isn't a gender issue. (1.50 / 2) (#138)
    by 1jpb on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:51:01 PM EST
    Just as Wright needs to know that not everything is a race issue, many HRC supporters need to know that not everything is a gender issue.

    For one thing, BO is a more successful legislator in DC on big issues that affect the entire country or world such as being the lead D on online gov spending accountability and expanding international arms control, or being one of the two lead Ds on the biggest ethics reform in 25 years.  And, BO has proven to be better at managing a campaign, which is the biggest management challenge that BO or HRC (or McCain) have ever taken on and lead.  And, BO is self made, HRC had a huge head start because she inherited the political apparatus of the most recent D president.

    Secondly, even if you (unlike me) think that HRC is somehow more accomplished as a leader: it is undeniable that Dick was much more accomplished than George, and Dick wasn't made the VP because he's a woman.

    Parent

    No he's not (5.00 / 5) (#154)
    by cmugirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:54:43 PM EST
    But you've said this, like 100 times today.

    It's been shown over and over that your statement is not true, both on this blog and other places out there.

    Please let it go,

    Parent

    Are you reading everything? (5.00 / 3) (#175)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:59:23 PM EST
    Very little of the posts in favor of Hillary address gender either explicitly or implicitly. She is simply the better candidate on all levels.

    Parent
    see Parent to my comment. n/t (none / 0) (#181)
    by 1jpb on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:00:58 PM EST
    half is your opinion.  They have similar voting records so how can he have a more solid record on things that matter?

    Parent
    Nope, they don't... (5.00 / 7) (#92)
    by Rainsong on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:41:03 PM EST
    many Obama supporters who've watched the Clinton campaign savage their champion for many months.

    Nope, they dont understand Hillary's base. Some think Obama has been doing all the 'savaging'.

    Indeed, some of them think the vanquishing of the Clintons from power in the Democratic Party is the whole point of the Obama "movement."

    Yes, that sounds close to it...

    The answer is simple, ....The easiest way, ....to heal these divisions is to unite their sources on a single ticket.

    I've read this whole piece 4 times now, and I still read this cranky tone of how dare she?

    Its been her fault all along, and now its cast as it will be her fault if it doesn't happen.

    She has not wavered once at supporting Obama if he is the nominee, but he almost chokes at the idea in reverse, and if this piece is a strong example of how they might 'woo' back the voting base, then he has even more problems.

    Parent

    Sure (none / 0) (#35)
    by squeaky on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:28:22 PM EST
    And Pelosi gets it because she is a woman?

    Parent
    squeaky, (5.00 / 1) (#132)
    by hlr on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:49:52 PM EST
    I probably should have said white 'creative class' men with their nice technocrat solution of dangling the Hillary cheese off of the Obama mousetrap. The mice will come!

    Nancy Pelosi just dislikes Hillary, that's all.

    Parent

    I Agree (5.00 / 1) (#165)
    by squeaky on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:57:37 PM EST
    That Pelosi has bad blood with the Clintons, and that was the source of her remark.  But I am all for a unity ticket and it makes no difference to me who is on top. It just seems like the math makes the ticket unbeatable against McCain.

    Were Hillary perceived as the presumptive nominee how would you characterize those who supported a unity ticket? The same?

    Parent

    for many of her supporters (5.00 / 1) (#216)
    by hlr on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:23:34 PM EST
    Were Hillary perceived as the presumptive nominee how would you characterize those who supported a unity ticket? The same?

    You know, there are issues w/ the Black male subservient to the White woman as well -- it's called plantation politics, Miss Anne, etc.

    So, if such a unity ticket were suggested, and if some of his supporters were uncomfortable, then I'd have an issue w/ White surrogates pushing it as a picture-perfect solution to Democratic political woes.

     

    Parent

    Um...no. Class warfare. (none / 0) (#63)
    by oldpro on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:36:50 PM EST
    And envy.

    Ugly.

    Parent

    Based on statements she has made, (none / 0) (#108)
    by Boston Boomer on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:44:57 PM EST
    I think Pelosi opposes a "unity" ticket because she believes that running a woman and a black man at the same time is a losing strategy.  


    Parent
    Mighty Generous Of You (5.00 / 2) (#147)
    by squeaky on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:53:30 PM EST
    To think that she is thinking about the party. I read her as an Obama supporter that did not want to see a Clinton sully his ticket.

    But I will take your interpretation under consideration, even though I disagree with the math.

    Parent

    Yikes...I thought we were nuts (5.00 / 3) (#8)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:19:03 PM EST
    I read the comments, they are off the deep end.  This is starting to remind me of the Kathleen Turner and Douglas movie "War of the Roses".  

    Humpty Dumpty (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:20:59 PM EST
    The comments are astonishing. (5.00 / 6) (#38)
    by liminal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:29:40 PM EST
    I was trying to figure out the stupidest point made by Kilgore's braindead commenters, and I think it's this:

    Bill Clinton is an electoral liability.

    Wow.  How seriously dumb can they get?  Bill was and remains popular with a broad swath of the Democratic base.  Obama obviously doesn't need to draw on Bill Clinton's (former) popularity among African-Americans, but Bill is still seriously popular with rural and working class voters.  On top of that, the Democrats biggest and best argument going into November 2008 is a simple compare contrast:

    1. Where was the country when Bill Clinton left office?

    • balanced budget;
    • a successful foreign policy;
    • relative economic prosperity;
    • low inflation;
    • gas $1.20 gallon;

    2. Where will the country be when George Bush leaves office?

    • huge budget deficits;
    • losing two foreign wars;
    • in the midst of the biggest economic challenge since the great depression;
    • spiraling prices for essentials - food, gas, utilities, possible stagflation;
    • gas $3.89 gallon;

    Democrats: have successful presidencies.

    Republicans: do not.

    These folks are insane.  Heh.  And I remember how excited they were when the Big Dog got out of his hospital bed to campaign for Kerry.  Oy.

    Parent

    what obama supporters don't get is (5.00 / 1) (#214)
    by kangeroo on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:17:30 PM EST
    that any benefits obama brings to the table are outweighed by his liabilities in other categories.  clinton's benefits far outweigh her liabilities, and especially so at the top of the ticket.

    the only state i can imagine obama bringing to the table in the GE is CO, if that.  but he's a liability, and conversely hillary is stronger, in delegate-rich swing/pink states like FL, OH, TN and blue states with checkered (red/blue) histories like CA, PA, MI, NJ.  not only do i think obama's ceiling is lower than hillary's ceiling, i think obama's floor is far, FAR lower than hillary's floor.  therein lies the problem.

    Parent

    One problem is (none / 0) (#96)
    by TomP on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:41:42 PM EST
    squaring her criticism of Obama with being VP.  Clinton essentially has questioned his experience/ability to be C-in-C and a few other things.

    I also think she might prefer the Senate, but who knows?  It would be historical for her to be VP.

    I wish there would be at least one progressive on the ticket.  Two centrists.  

    A "unity" ticket has some logic.  
     

    Parent

    Hello, Tom P. As I recall, (5.00 / 1) (#195)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:04:44 PM EST
    you were a strong advocate for John Edwards at DK.  How now?  

    Parent
    Two Centrists....?? (1.25 / 4) (#142)
    by Mrwirez on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:52:59 PM EST
    He is the MOST Liberal Senator in the Senate for God sakes. Who does not question his ability to be C in C also, HE Has NO record of anything.

    Parent
    I see an amazing manager and delegator (no pun intended) that has run a superb campaign, brushed off seemingly fatal problems, and kept cool and PRESIDENTIAL throughout the process. I do not want a President that can down a shot and a chaser...I want a President that is Presidential.

    Parent
    You think he is Presidential? (5.00 / 3) (#197)
    by madamab on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:05:08 PM EST
    I have never seen him handle any situation with one-tenth the grace and class of Hillary Clinton. He is rude, peevish, spoiled and entitled.

    Wait - he is Presidential!

    Just like GWB.

    Parent

    Presidential, you mean (5.00 / 3) (#211)
    by 1horseNag on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:12:09 PM EST
    like flipping the bird to Hillary JayZ style?

    Parent
    Nice Talking Point (3.00 / 2) (#167)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:58:17 PM EST
    Did you get that from Rush or Sean?

    Parent
    Unity Ticket? (5.00 / 2) (#13)
    by uncledad on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:22:43 PM EST
    I wonder: the HRC supporters that say they would vote for McSame over Obama, would they vote for Obama if HRC was #2 on the ticket? If they would then I don't see a good reason why they would think about choosing McSame over Obama in the first place? Just doesn't make sense to me. I'll support whomever is on the D. ticket. Four more years of the neoconsuperfratboy's is not an option for me!

    Not if the Creative Class has any say in it. (5.00 / 2) (#14)
    by jes on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:23:12 PM EST
    It is now out with the Bubba's and in with the Creative Class. The creatives have taken over the party from the Clintons and they will not give it back.

    They will go down in utter defeat.

    Oh, PLEASE! What cr*p (5.00 / 9) (#15)
    by suisser on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:23:23 PM EST
    "she should accept" and "assign (her) a minor role in the fall" ??  The most politically powerful woman in the land should accept these terms?  
    This is HRC we are talking about, former First Lady, 2 term Senator, strong advocate for families, incredibly hard working brilliant woman not some trophy wife who can be tacked on to a man to make him look better.

    Enough of this condescending cr*p! Enough of the diminishing her by turning her into a piece of "the Clintons"

    Stick a fork in me I'm done.

    Absolutely (5.00 / 6) (#18)
    by Emma on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:25:10 PM EST
    Condescending.

    Parent
    I think "they" believe (5.00 / 7) (#34)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:28:13 PM EST
    she should be honored to be asked.
    sad

    Parent
    She should be honored (5.00 / 1) (#60)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:35:59 PM EST
    She has not won the nomination. He has (or will).  

    Parent
    see (5.00 / 1) (#75)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:38:53 PM EST
    Why is this considered an insult? (none / 0) (#126)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:48:05 PM EST
    IT is the truth.  She's a great candidate and a very smart women.  But she didn't finish first.  That's why we have elections.  Assuming he does indeed reach the "magic number" it isn't an insult to her to be VP, or at least to be asked if she would consider the position.  

    Parent
    Finishing first and getting the required 2209 (5.00 / 1) (#200)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:06:42 PM EST
    delegates are two really different scenarios. The big change in the Democratic party is interpretation of the long-standing expectations for calling the winner of the race.

    There is every possibility the convention will take 2 votes to get the nominee. Delegates can vote however they want second round.


    Parent

    I'm not saying it's insulting. (none / 0) (#189)
    by ChiTownDenny on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:03:11 PM EST
    But it makes no sense for her to take the "internship" when she is ready and for him to take the position when he should have the "internship".  I can't support all the risk associated with an Obama presidency.

    Parent
    Will he win the GE (5.00 / 2) (#89)
    by ChiTownDenny on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:40:56 PM EST
    without Hillary's voters?

    Parent
    Most likely not, and (5.00 / 1) (#203)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:08:27 PM EST
    if he performs as badly against McCain as he did against Hillary in the GE debates (should he get the nomination), he'll continue to lose clusters of the support he now has, as well.

    Parent
    Well, no...he hasn't. (5.00 / 1) (#113)
    by oldpro on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:45:33 PM EST
    Obama folks used to warn Hillary about counting chickens before they're hatched...maybe they don't want to talk chickens any more but still...Obama's will come home to roost and sooner than he thinks.

    As for being 'honored,' Hillary like Obama should be honored by the votes they get from free citizens who support them.

    Parent

    Yes, they both should be honored (none / 0) (#130)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:49:20 PM EST
    I'm not slamming Hillary at all.  I just don't see how offering such a formidable candidate the VP position after they have come up short is insulting.  

    Parent
    Winning the nomination isn't so wonderful (5.00 / 3) (#135)
    by Boston Boomer on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:50:41 PM EST
    if you don't win the presidency afterwards.  Obama is a sure loser in November.  He'll just be another also ran.  It's unlikely he'll get another shot.  It's too bad he didn't get a little experience first and then run 8 years from now.  Perhaps he can write another book about his experiences as a presidential candidate.


    Parent
    Oh come on (none / 0) (#85)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:40:47 PM EST
    She didn't win the nomination so it isn't an "insult" to ask her to be the Vice-President.  

    Parent
    Nor did he. (5.00 / 1) (#107)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:44:52 PM EST
    I'm assuming that the position (5.00 / 1) (#153)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:54:17 PM EST
    is offered after Obama has won the nomination. And, even if I give you the point that he hasn't won the nomination a discussion of Clinton as VP is a valid one - as BTD, I assume, would agree.

    Parent
    Theoretically...yeah. (5.00 / 7) (#19)
    by oldpro on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:25:45 PM EST
    Practially, Hillary is in a bad spot with Obama as the frontrunner.

    If she's vp on his ticket and they lose, it's the Clintons' fault.  If she says no thanks and it's Obama/somebody else and they lose, it will be the Clintons' fault...somehow, some way.

    Really, though...how in Gawd's name do you see anybody in the Obama camp allowing a Clinton on their ticket when the whole point of the campaign was to get RID of the Clintons?

    'Splain that to me, please.

    Absolutely Not! (5.00 / 2) (#26)
    by ChiTownDenny on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:26:58 PM EST
    The only unity ticket I can support has Hillary on the top, with Barack as VP, begrudginly,  I'd rather see Hillary 2012.

    I endorse this whole-heartedly (5.00 / 2) (#27)
    by andgarden on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:27:10 PM EST
    HIllary has proven herself an adept campaigner. She can keep him from Losing Pennsylvania and probably Ohio.

    Me too! (5.00 / 1) (#152)
    by bjorn on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:54:17 PM EST
    But I don't think he will ask her.

    Parent
    Then that would be a mistake (5.00 / 2) (#164)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:57:34 PM EST
    on his part.

    Parent
    Ed Kilgore: former DLC person, (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:27:53 PM EST
    present political columnist.  Has he publicly come out for Obama?  Is he on his team?  He needs instruction in how to talk to and about "older" women.  

    Indeed (5.00 / 8) (#33)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:28:10 PM EST
    watched the Clinton campaign savage their champion for many months

    Yeah, the guy who framed the Clintons as "racists" has been savaged.  F-word you, Mr. Kilgore.  If this is the way to introduce a "unity ticket" then count many of us Clinton supporters out.

    Ed's idea (5.00 / 4) (#36)
    by zyx on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:28:42 PM EST
    certainly isn't popular in the comments section after his piece.

    "WE DON'T WANT THAT WOMAN--OR HER SUPPORTERS."

    Hmm.

    Is that any worse (5.00 / 1) (#161)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:56:40 PM EST
    than some of the comments on this site?  Nope it isn't.  The only difference is that you don't agree with those comments, but do agree with the ones on this site.

    I think the fact that the unity ticket idea pisses off the rabid supporters of Obama and the rabid supporters of Hillary makes it an even better idea.

    It's time for both sides to grow up.

    Parent

    They'll change their tune if Barack (none / 0) (#43)
    by andgarden on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:31:56 PM EST
    and the Commissars tell them to.

    Parent
    Sounds Exactly (none / 0) (#45)
    by squeaky on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:32:45 PM EST
    Like the rants that went on here when BTD suggested a unity ticket. I have noticed some, not many yet,  here warming to the idea.

    Parent
    I don't like his "tone" (5.00 / 8) (#40)
    by stillife on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:30:38 PM EST
    especially his claim that the Clinton campaign "savaged" the Obama campaign.  Puh-leeze.  Obama's damage has been self-inflicted (questionable associations and unfortunate comments).  

    IMO, a unity ticket is a pipedream of Obama supporters who see it as an easy fix for the disharmony in the party and Obama's little "problem" connecting with white working class voters and ethnic non-AA voters.  It's not gonna work because (a) Obama is too arrogant to ask her, (b) her skills and experience are better put to use in the Senate, (c) it's an insulting proposition to many Hillary supporters, and (d) he'd be better off with a white male running mate with military cred.  Even so, with his baggage, I see him losing to McCain in November.

    If Kilgore thinks the suggestion is infuriating to Obama supporters, how does he think we feel?  Personally, the proposition of a unity ticket makes me feel patronized and used.  Hillary is Teh Evil and her supporters are low-information bigots - yet he wants our votes in November.  Feh!

    "savage" (5.00 / 10) (#50)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:33:25 PM EST
    See, political amateurs.  They don't know how to bring people together.  The joke of historic proportions, the uniters divided the country more that before, now they made three factions.  You gotta love it.  You cannot make this stuff up.  

    Parent
    Took the words (5.00 / 2) (#173)
    by oldpro on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:59:09 PM EST
    right outta my mouth...

    "STELLAAA!"

    Gawd, I love Williams...

    Parent

    Inexperience Male needs Experienced Female (5.00 / 9) (#57)
    by nycstray on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:35:55 PM EST
    to get elected. Yeah, that'll work . . . not.

    Parent
    Heh (5.00 / 2) (#97)
    by stillife on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:42:02 PM EST
    Maybe he should put an ad on Craigslist.

    Parent
    lol!~ I hope he doesn't ask her (5.00 / 2) (#119)
    by nycstray on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:46:44 PM EST
    I want to see who his choice is after what he said in SF about not needing a VP with FP creds etc . . . I wish some names would leak from his campaign and not all this phony speculation. Especially speculation that involves gender . . .

    Parent
    Wasn't he hinting around about Bob Casey? (5.00 / 4) (#156)
    by Boston Boomer on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:55:20 PM EST
    That'd excite the Democratic base--an anti-choice Democrat running with a prez candidate who supports faith based initiatives and wants to "reach out" to the anti-abortion crowd.

    Parent
    God, I hope not (5.00 / 2) (#171)
    by joanneleon on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:58:51 PM EST
    That will drive women away in droves.

    Parent
    Including Catholic women. (5.00 / 5) (#183)
    by oldpro on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:01:12 PM EST
    Sometimes politics is an IQ test and not everybody is passing.

    Parent
    LOL! (5.00 / 1) (#111)
    by Cate on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:45:28 PM EST
    Hillary, would you mind freshening up (5.00 / 1) (#128)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:48:41 PM EST
    the coffee?

    Parent
    Hillary would end up doing all the work (5.00 / 3) (#159)
    by Boston Boomer on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:56:20 PM EST
    and cleaning up after his gaffes and mishaps.


    Parent
    Kilgore (5.00 / 3) (#58)
    by nell on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:35:58 PM EST
    writes his suggestion in such condsecending terms, it is just unbelievable. No, no, Clinton needs to stay away from Obama's ticket IF he is the nominee, and I continue to hold out hope that supers will wake up and smell the coffee (i.e. Obama is UNELECTABLE). He will lose, whether or not Clinton is on the ticket, and she should just stay away.

    Jeez, especially since we know how Obama supporters like Kilgore really feel.

    No R-E-S-P-E-C-T coming from the Obama supporters at all.

    Once again they miss the point (5.00 / 2) (#76)
    by Florida Resident on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:38:57 PM EST
    I know this is a deeply unpopular, even infuriating, suggestion to many Obama supporters who've watched the Clinton campaign savage their champion for many months. Indeed, some of them think the vanquishing of the Clintons from power in the Democratic Party is the whole point of the Obama "movement."

    Is exactly the reason why the unity schtick might not work no matter how hard  both Clinton and Obama work on it.  From the beginning the movement has been a destroy and vanquish the Clintons movement that is not going to change just read some of the comments we still endure here and I have to admit these are some of the better Obamabots.  As I have said before I will probably vote for Obama if he is the nominee but I wonder if I will be the norm or the exception.

    Hillary as VP is very unlikely (5.00 / 6) (#84)
    by aquarian on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:40:26 PM EST
    I just don't see Hillary taking VP.  I was thinking about Hillary's trajectory during this  very nasty primary and realized that notwithstanding the horrible hits she has taken from MSM and blogger lunatics, that she looks even stronger now than when she first began.

    I was a weak Clinton supporter until the MSM had to pile on the mysogyny and she came back swinging.  She emerges from this campaign -- whether or not the nominee -- as a powerful and articulate democratic woman.  Taking VP looks paltry to what she could accomplish in the Senate -- I would dearly like to see her take over from Harry Reid.  Not to mention the earlier comment that an older, wiser, and more competent woman should not take a back seat to Senator Obama.

    can someone get this knife out of my back (5.00 / 1) (#90)
    by DandyTIger on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:40:57 PM EST
    I can't seem to reach it back there.... snark. Well, after the knife is removed, maybe I'll think about unity.

    Obama's Political eGFR...Calling Dr. Dean... (5.00 / 1) (#91)
    by SunnyLC on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:41:02 PM EST
    http://insightanalytical.wordpress.com/

    Did you know that "Exit polls taken in 30 contests so far showed Obama carrying the white vote in only seven, including his home state of Illinois."  ????

    More in my blog post...

    As for a unity ticket...Hillary shouldn't be his VP...none of this "get passed over for a promotion after training a younger man" crap.  And, if she is the nominee, she shouldn't be her VP, since he will drag her down. His relationships are a lightning rod the GOP will focus on...

    Hell NO !! Hillary don't do it!! (5.00 / 3) (#101)
    by Mrwirez on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:43:11 PM EST
    Let him sink, he WILL NOT win. I had to laugh, the DKers are saying Obama is as electable as John Kerry. Ahem... Did he not lose to GWB? Hillary can run again in 2012. He will be a blurb in the history books. I actually hate this guy now, I really do, he is just another slimy Chicago politician as far as I'm concerned. Also, I do not know of ONE Democrat locally that will vote for Obama. I am willing to take a four year dive for Hillary AND BILL Clinton on this one. The OBAMA campaign did play the race card on the last TWO TERM DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENT, William Jefferson Clinton.. Fu*k Barack Obama. I am gonna go Green, Libertarian or "BLANK" for President and straight Democrat down ticket.

    Write her in please (5.00 / 1) (#177)
    by nycstray on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:59:38 PM EST
    if enough of us do, we will be heard and they will also understand where the down ticket votes are coming from. Obama needs to teach that one to his new voters still . . .

    Parent
    While I want Senator Clinton in the White House... (5.00 / 4) (#112)
    by stevenb on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:45:30 PM EST
    ...I don't see her doing any good as the VP to Obama.  Obama is obviously too arrogant to even consider this, nor would he allow Senator Clinton to exercise any power as VP, essentially relegating her to a "do nothing" position.  Why do I say this?  Right now Obama is "looking beyond" Clinton, acting as if she is nothing but a buzzing fly easily ignored; he is even suggesting not campaigning in the next few states.  He is ready to IGNORE her working class base because he feels confident his black and educated base will be "enough" to beat the Republicans.  A totally false premise.

    Unfortunately, he is more interested in his own position as Democratic Party King than as the unifier of the Democratic party = making inroads with Clinton's coalition.

    Senator Clinton would be better off letting him lose in the general election while she paves a great career in the Senate.  I would rather have her become a great senate leader than Obama's VP.

    My 2 cents.

    Let Obama win (5.00 / 2) (#122)
    by mikeyleigh on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:47:29 PM EST
    or lose on his own merits.  His wing of the party, his "movement" has made it quite clear that they don't need the Clinton wing.  So be it.  If Obama loses, then Hillary has another shot in 2012.  If he wins, Hillary can keep her Senate seat for as long as she wants it and join an exclusive club of politicians and statesmen who never made it to the White House:  Alexander Hamilton; Henry Clay; Daniel Webster; Sam Houston; William Seward; Al Smith; Adlai Stevenson just to name a few.

    Add me to the Hell no list. (5.00 / 3) (#123)
    by Katherine Graham Cracker on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:47:29 PM EST
    I think this is a mistake all the way around.
    There is nothing but being the scapegoat in this for Clinton.  If godforbid the ticket lost, she would get the blame.  I think she should spend the summer in up state NYC and be a good Senator for her state.  

    I don't see any benefit to Obama either.  How can you suddenly feel comfortable with someone you have painted as a hack and a racist.  He is not JFK and she is not LBJ

    They got my body now they want my soul but I'll .. (5.00 / 4) (#139)
    by Ellie on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:51:07 PM EST
    ... have none of that. Let the players play and give Sen. Clinton her due before peeling more of her support into Obama's column.

    Regardless of my current support for HRC, I'd have supported one, the other or both. He lost it before she earned it and when someone has my well considered and hard earned support, I'm there for the long haul.

    Obama hasn't earned this nomination, proven he's fit for office, won voters he dismissed as unimportant or made his case to the majority of voters he's baldly insulted.

    I used to think he was just green but now I believe he's unfit to serve. He'll be a disaster that not even teh awesome combination of Kos and Donna Brazile can save.

    And I'm sorry, after months of being demeaned by the Dems and Obama and typified as a racist and worse -- as thanks for all I've contributed -- it'll take more than an FREAKING Ed Kilgore PR appearance to repair things.

    Hearing the punditocracy and other patronizing party jackwads typify this as bruised feelings or other trivial bits of psycho-caca only underscores my belief that this changes nothing in the present or future.

    Obama's best apology speech ever would be a start. Sen. Clinton's in it to win it and Obama would be a drag on a more qualified, harder working, more experienced candidate's legitimate chance to be a historical first woman President of the US. I'm with HRC all the way.

    Maybe BTD isn't really advocating (5.00 / 1) (#141)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:51:36 PM EST
    an Obama/Clinton slate afterall.  If he was, why post such an inflammatory link?

    I Guess Kilgore Thinks Hillary's Supporters (5.00 / 5) (#149)
    by MO Blue on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:53:48 PM EST
    are so so uneducated that they can't even read.

    I know this is a deeply unpopular, even infuriating, suggestion to many Obama supporters who've watched the Clinton campaign savage their champion for many months. Indeed, some of them think the vanquishing of the Clintons from power in the Democratic Party is the whole point of the Obama "movement." Why, many ask, should Obama take on Hillary's "baggage" after finally defeating her at the cost of so much blood, sweat, tears, money, and approval-ratings points?

    If he thinks that this type of rhetoric will make Clinton's supporters jump on Obama's bandwagon, he might just want to get a reality check. The message is "Hey guys, we need her supporters but first let me trash her for your first." Hint to Obama's supporters: Insults do not promote unity.

    Well, Kilgore is a real charmer (5.00 / 1) (#179)
    by joanneleon on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:00:38 PM EST
    huh?

    LOL, I think I will just have to laugh (so I won't cry).  This thing keeps getting worse and worse.

    The entire first paragraph of that piece (5.00 / 2) (#184)
    by madamab on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:01:14 PM EST
    is nothing but crap.

    I cannot take the rest of it seriously.

    Ed Kilgore does not have a clue.

    Seeing Red (5.00 / 2) (#208)
    by chrisvee on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:09:18 PM EST
    Wow, did this make me angry.  So after the Obama campaign took a page out of the Republican playbook and tried to destroy her character, she should close her eyes, think of England, and be grateful that he is willing to 'take on her baggage'?  My hands are actually shaking (and I'm not normally this emotional; I tend to think a unity ticket is the only way to unite the party and avoid disaster in November).

    If we want or need a unity ticket, the Obama campaign better start making up for what they did to the Clintons during this primary or else they will not get a significant portion of Hillary's voters.  If we 'menopausals' (was that Wolcott's term?) don't feel she's getting proper respect, we're not going to be able to stomach watching her campaign for him.  She's a powerful Senator; why should she take the VP slot?

    And that 'rehabilitation' meme that is starting to work its way through the MSM needs to be shut down right now by the Obama campaign.

    This is the way strong women get destroyed in our society.

    I think an Obama/Clinton ticket is necessary (5.00 / 1) (#213)
    by lilburro on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:15:19 PM EST
    unless Obama somehow doesn't become the Dem nominee.  I agree he probably will, but there is still a chance he won't.  And he needs her...because people need to realize, OBAMA IS WEAK.  He may be exciting, but he is also weak.  If Clinton steps out of the race, the primary match up statistics will fade...and here is what we will see:

    McCain-Obama 46 to 43.
    McCain-Obama 46 to 43.
    McCain-Obama 46 to 43.
    McCain-Obama 46 to 43.

    That's TERRIBLE.  We should not be seeing these kinds of polls.  I don't care that it is early in the year.  Soon it's going to be pandering season and people will see what they want to see as both candidates jump from left to right to center.  If these numbers persist and the media reports them, the GE narrative for Obama will not be off to a good start, for sure.

    Also, I don't think Obama's passive aggressive approach to campaigning will work against John McCain.  The Republicans are masters of casual smearing.  Unless John McCain runs a campaign as inept as Hillary's, Obama will have an uphill battle fighting and defining McCain.  I am not optimistic.  

    do you think she (none / 0) (#1)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:15:02 PM EST
    should keep her senate seat?


    I would think, yes (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:30:55 PM EST
    Isn't that pretty much the norm?

    Should Obama?

    Parent

    yes (none / 0) (#68)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:37:37 PM EST
    I mean yes he should keep his seat (none / 0) (#70)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:37:54 PM EST
    The problem, though, isn't Clinton voters (none / 0) (#3)
    by Exeter on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:16:24 PM EST
    By and large, this is a relatively small slice of the general electorate and most will end up voting for Obama. The problem is what Clinton voters REPRESENT. Their voting reflects a deep disaproval of Obama among among Latinos, Catholics, Seniors, and working class whites. That disaproval isn't going to change with Hillary on the ticket.

    If I were Obama, I would pick Richardson. That would make the Western state strategy at least in the realm of possability.

    That would sure get the Clinton people on board. (5.00 / 4) (#16)
    by honora on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:23:52 PM EST
    I think that Richardson's only redeeming quality, as a VP, is that he is hispanic.  He is not very smart and he can not debate.  He would be a disaster as a running mate.

    Parent
    He is creepy... (5.00 / 1) (#24)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:26:47 PM EST
    the betrayal thing...is disgusting.  He is Judas from now on.  No one likes someone in politics who sells out.  Even Obama will not trust him now, he is used goods.  

    Parent
    But, so many have sold out. Who is (none / 0) (#37)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:29:38 PM EST
    left to trust.  Even McGovern leaves what he perceives to be a sinking ship to jump on board w/the winner.  

    Parent
    yeah...that is true (5.00 / 1) (#71)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:38:08 PM EST
    but Carville branded him.  I will forgive him being married to that woman, for this brilliant branding of Richadson.  

    Parent
    llike he would know one (none / 0) (#46)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:32:47 PM EST
    if it bit him on the butt.
    I think Hillary will take it if only to be able to say she did everything she could to set it up for 2012.
    cynically speaking.

    Parent
    I think she will take it to try to help (5.00 / 2) (#65)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:36:53 PM EST
    the party win the GE, if she thinks she will help by doing so.  Not so sure she is thinking of running for Dem. Pres. nomination again.  Talk about gruelling.

    Parent
    dont kid yourself (none / 0) (#212)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:14:04 PM EST
    Would have been good had he (none / 0) (#56)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:34:22 PM EST
    not declared his endorsement. He cut himself off at the knees with how that was portrayed.

    Parent
    Conjecture is not a prudent (5.00 / 1) (#20)
    by 1jpb on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:25:51 PM EST
    strategy for decision making, imo.

    How it became acceptable to make unfounded extrapolations from primary exit polling to the GE in November will forever remain a mystery to me.  Even my comment linked above doesn't come close to expressing how little sense this makes.

    P.S. I favor Strickland, Rendell, maybe Clark to work the unity angle since they're HRC folks.

    Parent

    A lot of people are pushing that idea... (5.00 / 2) (#28)
    by Demi Moaned on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:27:28 PM EST
    on the left blogs (especially DailyKos). Personally, I found Richardson's Presidential candidacy to be kind of a joke. And I know BTD wrote something here to similar effect.

    Aside from the fact that I don't think I'd ever like to see him at the top of the ticket, I imagine him playing like a comic sidekick next to the nominee. It's not an impression likely to reassure voters concerned about Obama's lack of experience.

    Parent

    His appeal in those quarters (5.00 / 2) (#53)
    by tree on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:33:30 PM EST
    makes sense. The same kind of people who support Obama because they think it makes THEM look progressive are the kind to think that supporting Richardson makes them double so. Forget about policy or substance, lets vote on appearance and identity and what strokes our own pretentiously "progressive" egos.

    Parent
    1on1 interview with CNN with BO now (none / 0) (#4)
    by feet on earth on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:17:11 PM EST
    Next Question will be: Unity ticket

    He's answered it differently twice today (none / 0) (#11)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:21:55 PM EST
    Brian Williams asked him, and he said that he would talk to her about the right way to get the party unified, and he alluded to that including her on the ticket. When he answered the citizen on Wolf's show, he danced around it and just said she deserved to be on any candidate's short list.

    An element of this scenario that is worthy of considering is: what role would Bill Clinton play as the husband of the VP? And, could Obama have a chance at his own administration and legacy with both Clinton's "living" with him?

    Just saying....

    Parent

    Hillary said Bill would have no role (none / 0) (#29)
    by Rainsong on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:27:44 PM EST
    or that Bill would have no major role in the White House in a recent interview. She hinted at his health problems, and that he would prefer to continue with the work he has been doing the last 8 years, the Foundation, work with AIDS strategies in Africa, the Library, and in academia.  She also hinted that, she could see him going abroad as a Goodwill Ambassador, relationship building, trade delegations with China etc.

    Parent
    That's as First Gentleman (none / 0) (#66)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:37:03 PM EST
    He could prove to be a haunting force to Obama, though.

    Parent
    Bill and Michelle. Problem: (none / 0) (#166)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:58:07 PM EST
    how to keep them quiet.

    Parent
    Sounds Like (none / 0) (#10)
    by squeaky on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:21:13 PM EST
    The start of a movement to me. I can not imagine a better ticket. The GOP, on the other hand, would certainly have dozens of better suggestions for us, no doubt.

    Start of a movement? I don't get it. (5.00 / 2) (#73)
    by zyx on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:38:15 PM EST
    The Brazile comment the other night.  The Stoller piece that says Obama's campaign has "they have destroyed their opponents within the party".  The internet sites that have driven out the Hillary supporters with venomous hatred.  

    I think that the Unity Obama people somehow see a New-New Democratic Party that doesn't have any seats at the table--not real seats at the real table--for the older Democrats that make up the non-Obama base--and clearly, the non-Obama supporters are a large group.  WTF?  And they think Hillary Clinton has problems with basic math?  They don't just have math problems, they have some major, major sociology problems!

    And besides, their organization--the Obama people--they don't strike me as post-partisan.  They strike me as post-Mormon.  Very organized, very team-spirited, very dedicated.  Lots of young people knocking on doors.  It's a new religion.  Donate $25 now!

    Parent

    The website after NC/IN asked for $5 (none / 0) (#100)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:43:02 PM EST
    donations.

    Parent
    Exactly (none / 0) (#104)
    by squeaky on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:44:13 PM EST
    a New-New Democratic Party that doesn't have any seats at the table--not real seats at the real table--

    That's why it is the start of a new movement.  Were there lots of seats at the table the movement would not be at its start.

    Parent

    The latest email (none / 0) (#148)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:53:40 PM EST
    had THREE "Donate $25 now" instructions. One in between every paragraph.

    Parent
    Im fine with it as long as she does (none / 0) (#12)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:22:16 PM EST
    not give up her senate seat.
    that would be a mistake.

    Don't be silly (5.00 / 1) (#77)
    by Demi Moaned on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:39:20 PM EST
    If she wins the Vice Presidency, of course she would have to give up her Senate seat.

    But she doesn't have to resign the seat in order to run (cf. John Kerry in '04). She was just re-elected in 06 and won't have to stand again for that seat until '12.

    Parent

    Does she have to? (none / 0) (#17)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:24:57 PM EST
    Can go till November and then see.  Then she gets the best of all worlds:  she did her best, but the kid lost it.  If they win, she gets to do all the work that needs to get done.  The kid gets the blame for the economy, Iraq mess, etc.  then she can be president later.  

    Parent
    It is so unbelievably (3.00 / 2) (#49)
    by independent voter on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:33:04 PM EST
    condescending to call a 46 year old man "the kid". You will scream like crazy about this, but it is just a whisker away from calling him "boy".
    It is interesting to me how you see sexism in so many things, but racism in so few (unless you are accusing Obama of it)

    Parent
    Yes (5.00 / 1) (#78)
    by squeaky on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:39:26 PM EST
    I agree. It is a way of putting him down. He is old enough to have several of his children fighting in a war and old enough to be a grandparent. But somehow he needs to get 'his ears clipped' as one commenter here recently said.

    It is exactly the sexist way men infantilize women by calling them girls and of course there is the equivalent racist 'boy' thing.

    Parent

    Also (5.00 / 1) (#155)
    by joanneleon on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:54:51 PM EST
    there's only about a 13 year difference between Obama and Clinton, so the "kid" reference is inappropriate, no matter what way you look at it.

    Parent
    Get over yourself (3.00 / 2) (#62)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:36:35 PM EST
    Every cowboy hero was called kid.   Kid was never and never is offensive.  It's a brilliant American word that attributes guts and heroism.  

    Parent
    Calling him a kid is an insult and you know it. (5.00 / 1) (#87)
    by leftygogo on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:40:49 PM EST
    You sound silly suggesting otherwise.

    Parent
    Like I said (5.00 / 2) (#114)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:45:43 PM EST
    get over your selves.  I have insulted him much better than using the word kid.  I called him a corporatist, a sell out, a person without values, an opportunist, a shallow vessel, the list is actually quite long.  

    Parent
    Those are not insults those are truths. (5.00 / 2) (#125)
    by Florida Resident on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:47:57 PM EST
    The Comeback Kid? (none / 0) (#146)
    by Robot Porter on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:53:29 PM EST
    Anyone remember that?

    Parent
    Stella remember they have this very (5.00 / 1) (#118)
    by Florida Resident on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:46:37 PM EST
    sensitive streak.  

    Parent
    I keep forgetting (none / 0) (#127)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:48:36 PM EST
    they don't have the old Westerns references.  

    Parent
    Yeah, most people ... (none / 0) (#187)
    by Robot Porter on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:01:56 PM EST
    under a certain age haven't seen more than a handful of Westerns ... if that many.

    I work in the film industry, and most of my friends have seen tons of movies, and many of them haven't seen many Westerns.

    But I've seen tons of them.  And not just the classics, but lots of the lesser known kiddie Westerns of the thirties.  A lot of those feature a titular "kid" hero.

    So I found your point valid.

    Parent

    Sigh....kidz.... (none / 0) (#217)
    by oldpro on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:25:56 PM EST
    "Why can't they be like we were...
    ...perfect in every way?"

    Love that song...

    Parent

    Again, sexism is (none / 0) (#83)
    by independent voter on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:40:19 PM EST
    everywhere, racism nowhere (unless you are accusing Obama of it)

    Parent
    take your racism accusation and stick it (5.00 / 2) (#121)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:46:58 PM EST
    Lieberman didnt give up his (none / 0) (#22)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:26:26 PM EST
    Kerry didn't, either (none / 0) (#72)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:38:09 PM EST
    Depends on state law (none / 0) (#42)
    by cmugirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:31:25 PM EST
    Lieberman didn't - Edwards had to

    Parent
    Nonsense (none / 0) (#48)
    by andgarden on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:32:52 PM EST
    It's a federal office. State law says bupkis.

    Parent
    Well (none / 0) (#117)
    by cmugirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:46:31 PM EST
    Many states have laws that dictate whether you can RUN for both a Senate (or House) seat at the same time you are running for POTUS/VPOTUS.  But I guess Kerry went back to the Senate and Lieberman did (although Lieberman was allowed under state law to run for both simultaneously)

    Parent
    I think such laws would also (none / 0) (#145)
    by andgarden on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:53:14 PM EST
    be constitutionally questionable. But anyway, Hillary's seat isn't up for a while, so there's no problem.

    Parent
    interesting (none / 0) (#54)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:33:40 PM EST
    this is what I was trying to find out.
    if the had to.
    if she does, I say no unity pony.

    Parent
    Hillary still has 4 years to run on her (none / 0) (#103)
    by tree on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:44:04 PM EST
    Senate term, so IF she ran as P or VP and lost she could just return to the Senate. Lieberman hedged his bets in 2000 because his senate term was up. He ran for Senate and VP, lost VP and won his Senate seat. Edwards decided not to run for his expiring Senate seat, so he had nowhere to go, electorally, when he lost in 2004.

    Parent
    She won't (none / 0) (#30)
    by andgarden on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:27:52 PM EST
    and no one will care.

    Parent
    Maybe, maybe not (none / 0) (#21)
    by Tom Hilton on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:25:55 PM EST
    Despite all of the boneheaded things Clinton has done in recent months, I wouldn't have a problem with her in the VP slot.  I don't think it'll happen, though, for the simple reason that she doesn't really get anything out of it.  She's much better off as a Senator--better still as Senate Majority Leader (I would love to see her in that position)--where she can actually accomplish something.  

    I'm sorry (5.00 / 1) (#51)
    by cmugirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:33:25 PM EST
    But Obama supporters keep throwing Senate Majority Leader around like a bone.  Do I think she'd be fantastic there?  Yes - she'd keep Obama in line, for one thing.  But I don't think Harry Reid is going anywhere just yet.  Plus the fact that there are many people ahead of her in seniority that may have an objection to that.

    Parent
    And what's wrong with that? (none / 0) (#64)
    by Tom Hilton on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:36:52 PM EST
    But Obama supporters keep throwing Senate Majority Leader around like a bone.

    Well...so?  Now that Clinton has lost the nomination race, is there something wrong with Obama supporters suggesting another way in which her tremendous talents could benefit the country?

    Parent
    Not to be rude (5.00 / 2) (#95)
    by nell on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:41:34 PM EST
    but shut up. Until Obama has 2,209 delegates, he has NOT won this race.

    Such arrogance coming from Obama supporters these days makes it less and less likely that Clinton supporters will back him in November SHOULD he be the nominee.

    Parent

    Um, right (none / 0) (#162)
    by Tom Hilton on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:56:55 PM EST
    Not to be rude, but shut up.

    The way not to be rude is not to be rude.  If your intention is to be rude (as it clearly was), then don't throw in some wienie qualifier like "not to be rude".  

    Parent
    She hasn't lost yet (5.00 / 1) (#168)
    by IzikLA on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:58:18 PM EST
    Typical. This is the whole "say it enough and it will actually be true" mantra that has been so pervasive in his campaign.  Like, well, she can't possibly win. Or, Clinton said those votes wouldn't count so that must be so.  Or, Bill said Jesse Jackson won SC and that Obama's story being against the war from the start is a fairy tale so they must be a racist.  She wants to count all 50 states so she will do anything to win!!!  All of these statements rely on leaving out the reality of their statements or the context they were in, and I am sick of it.

    But, on your statement that He Has Won?  I mean, even Obama is waiting until May 20th to declare that.  And really, shouldn't we ask ourselves why he is doing that?  Isn't it typical for the loser to bow out first and to be allowed the time for a gracious exit?  I am pretty sure that is generally how this thing works.  The loser makes the first speech.  The loser calls the winner to congratulate them.  I mean the arrogance and the very human decency is missing and that worries me plenty.  It must be nice to look at losing the next 2 of 3 contests resoundingly and still not be dismayed that he does not yet have the coalition to win in the GE.  

    Look, my candidate is not likely to get the nomination, I get that.  So if Obama is it, then I will do what I can to make him win despite everything he has done to make me lose respect for him.  I'm fully with BTD on this one -- it is Obama's job to heal the party now.

    Parent

    I would love to put Hillary Clinton (none / 0) (#110)
    by leftygogo on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:45:07 PM EST
    on the Supreme Court, doling out justice for the next 20 years.

    Parent
    Actually, all my point was (none / 0) (#143)
    by cmugirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:53:04 PM EST
    You make it sound like Obama would speak it and it would become true.  There's a lot more involved than kicking out a Majority Leader and replacing him with one who doesn't have the seniority that many members have. The Senate is very old-fashioned and runs with lots of deference to seniority. Assuming they would want the job, you think it would be ok with Kennedy, Kerry, Dodd, Biden, Reid, Byrd, Levin, Mikulski, et al to get Clinton to be Majority Leader (a decision the President doesn't have anyway - that's strictly under the control of the Senate).

    Parent
    Okay, I see what you mean... (none / 0) (#185)
    by Tom Hilton on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:01:27 PM EST
    That's certainly a reasonable point, and I didn't mean to suggest that it's something Obama would just give her (which, as you say, he couldn't if he wanted to); I see her earning it on her own.  

    Apart from Reid (who does, in fact, have the job), I can't see any of the other folks you named having the breadth of support necessary to win the job.  But I don't know; we're speculating about speculation here, so none of this really means much anyway.  

    Parent

    That's assuming the democrats (none / 0) (#98)
    by JavaCityPal on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:42:20 PM EST
    maintain the minimal majority they have after the elections.

    Remember, many disinfranchised Clinton supporters will focus on the congressional elections if Obama is the candidate. Especially if he continues to be so vague about those changes he plans to make.

    Parent

    all polls suggest (none / 0) (#116)
    by leftygogo on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:45:58 PM EST
    we will expand our recent gains. Even the repubs are sweating it right now.

    Parent
    Oh, and your other objections... (none / 0) (#120)
    by Tom Hilton on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:46:53 PM EST
    ...are actually more to the point.  I don't know how much longer Reid is going to be in the job, so yes, that's an imponderable.  As for seniority, it's not (wholly) about seniority (it's a factor as far as perception goes, but not a determinative factor); it's about the votes.  I think Clinton could get the votes.  

    And speaking for myself only: based on a very favorable profile of Clinton in the Atlantic last year, I honestly believe SML would be the ideal position for her.  If a meteor hits Obama and Clinton becomes the nominee, I'll support her...but I think her skills are more legislative than presidential.  

    Parent

    Hi Tom! (none / 0) (#52)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:33:29 PM EST
    Good to see a reasonable voice around here.  

    I too think she would make a great Senate Majority Leader.  Reid has got to go , IMHO.

    I've been hearing a lot about putting her on the Supreme Court, but I think SML would be the best fit.  

    Parent

    Yup (5.00 / 1) (#81)
    by kmblue on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:39:47 PM EST
    here's your consolation prize, Madam!

    Parent
    No (5.00 / 2) (#82)
    by nell on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:40:18 PM EST
    She would make a great President. That is what she would be really good at.

    No one needs to make her anything, Senate Majority Leader or Supreme Court Justice, she has made herself and she will continue to make herself.

    I am so sick of those off the wall handout suggestions, as if you could somehow pacify her by giving her the lesser position. I am not sure what your intention was, but after hearing idiots on the media like Wolf and Fineman throwing these suggestions out day after day, I am sick of it.

    She is running for president, not Senate Majority Leader, not Supreme Court Justice, and not Governor of New York. And don't you forget it.

    Parent

    Hey, MileHi! (none / 0) (#80)
    by Tom Hilton on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:39:44 PM EST
    Properly chastened by Aimai, I'm doing my damnedest to reach out to Clinton supporters (it isn't always easy, but...).  I think I'll try posting a kiss-and-make-up thread later today.  

    Parent
    Try really hard (none / 0) (#140)
    by kmblue on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:51:27 PM EST
    You have already called Clinton boneheaded in this thread.

    Parent
    "Boneheaded." Kind of undercuts (none / 0) (#115)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:45:45 PM EST
    the force of your argument.

    Parent
    Well... (none / 0) (#136)
    by Tom Hilton on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:50:42 PM EST
    ...I think she has done some extremely self-defeating things--adopting Republican memes that would be used against her as well as Obama in the general, for example.  I'm sure you disagree with my characterization of these particular instances; so be it.  

    Smart people do boneheaded things.  It happens.  Unless this is a Clinton-criticism-free zone, I'm not sure why you would have a problem with my saying that.    

    Parent

    Remember "boneheaded" (5.00 / 1) (#144)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:53:11 PM EST
    like getting into real estate deal with Rezko.   self described by Obama.  

    Parent
    Ahhhh. (none / 0) (#209)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:10:18 PM EST
    Only because saying someone (5.00 / 1) (#151)
    by oculus on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:54:09 PM EST
    has made boneheaded mistakes isn't the best way to persuade others of your point.  

    Parent
    Look don't insult our intelligence (5.00 / 1) (#174)
    by Florida Resident on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:59:13 PM EST
    I think she has done some extremely self-defeating things--adopting Republican memes that would be used against her as well as Obama in the general, for example.  

    Harriet and Louise ads
    The Clinton Years were bad for the economy
    etc. those were the Republican memes you mixed up your campaigns.

    Parent

    Sorry to undercut your argument (5.00 / 3) (#196)
    by IzikLA on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:04:49 PM EST
    But Obama's whole entire playbook relied on turning Hillary Clinton into the portrait of her that was painted by the Republicans.  They feared her, as did Obama, so they bought into and sold the same story to the public.  Amazingly, being in the public eye so absolutely for the last couple of months, people actually started to see what she is made of.  Despite the media, despite the right, and yes, despite what the Obama campaign would have you believe.

    Parent
    Just a way to blame her for his loss in the GE (none / 0) (#23)
    by honora on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:26:33 PM EST


    Unity? (none / 0) (#39)
    by uncledad on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:29:43 PM EST
    Will someone please explain why some HRC supporters won't vote for Obama. I don't get it, they seem pretty darn close on most relevent issues. What am I missing?

    Obama said it's not about issues (5.00 / 1) (#44)
    by Stellaaa on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:32:02 PM EST
    well, looking at the people, there is one we prefer over the other.

    Parent
    In the primary, sure... (none / 0) (#55)
    by Tom Hilton on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:33:42 PM EST
    ...but uncledad was talking about the general election.  It's a damn good question.  

    Parent
    Obama's not qualified. (5.00 / 3) (#59)
    by ChiTownDenny on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:35:59 PM EST
    He has no resume.  His campaign effectively called the Clintons racists, thereby alienating AA voters from them and bringing them into his core demographic.  How does that happen?

    Parent
    The AA voters (5.00 / 1) (#74)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:38:29 PM EST
    were alienated by Bill Clinton's comments.  

    Parent
    actually (5.00 / 4) (#106)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:44:23 PM EST
    they were alienated by the Obama campaigns misrepresentation of his comments.

    Parent
    Exactly. (none / 0) (#199)
    by IzikLA on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:05:56 PM EST
    which were? (none / 0) (#86)
    by Florida Resident on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:40:49 PM EST
    You confuse (none / 0) (#124)
    by ChiTownDenny on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:47:32 PM EST
    talking about demographics and racism.  But that is a political ploy, to call demographics racism, which I have no doubt, a South Side Polictal Campaign was aware of.

    Parent
    ugh (5.00 / 1) (#133)
    by ChiTownDenny on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:49:52 PM EST
    that's "South Side CHICAGO Politcal Campaign".  Haven't had dinner yet, but have had the martini.

    Parent
    Yeah well (none / 0) (#157)
    by stillife on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:55:32 PM EST
    I'm pretty sure that Bill's remarks were twisted by the Obama campaign for political advantage, to neutralize Hillary with the black vote.  When the Obamites cast the Clintons as racists, they lost my vote forever.  Fine - if the Clintons are racists, then I guess so am I, and you won't be getting my vote in the GE.

    And what about the misogyny coming from the Obama camp, the MSM and the Blogger Boyz?  Funny how women always fly under the radar.  When will Obama decry the rampant misogyny in this election?  I'm not holding my breath.
     

    Parent

    And calling people (none / 0) (#202)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:08:00 PM EST
    "Blogger Boyz" makes you any better?  

    It does not.  In fact, it can be taken as being both sexist and racist depending on the target.

    And by all means, don't vote or vote for McSame.  That'll teach 'em, right?

     

    Parent

    Speaking for me (5.00 / 5) (#79)
    by stillife on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:39:32 PM EST
    I don't trust or like him.  I don't have to "like" a candidate, but trust is essential.  I see him as an opportunist who does not believe in Democratic core values.  His dissing of the Clinton years sealed the deal for me (along with the praise for Reagan), and his equivocating on issues like abortion (when he said pro-choicers needed to consider the beliefs of right-to-lifers), Social Security and taking 100% health care off the table right from the get-go makes me distrust him.  Add to that the fact that he has a paper-thin resume.

    Hillary's not perfect, but she's a solid
    Dem and I admire her grit.  We need a fighter in the White House, not an equivocator.  I've been around long enough to have a pretty good BS detector and he sets mine off big-time.  I don't know what Obama stands for except Obama.  

    Parent

    But does that mean... (none / 0) (#94)
    by Tom Hilton on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:41:17 PM EST
    ...you won't vote for Obama against McCain?  Because that's what I understood uncledad to be asking.  

    Parent
    November is a long way away (5.00 / 2) (#182)
    by stillife on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:01:11 PM EST
    but as it stands now, I won't vote for him.  I live in a Big Blue State, so I don't feel compelled to hold my nose and vote for a candidate who has insulted me and my preferred nominee.

    I'm not ready to make nice.

    Parent

    Okay, this is what I don't get (none / 0) (#201)
    by Tom Hilton on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:07:03 PM EST
    I don't feel compelled to hold my nose and vote for a candidate who has insulted me and my preferred nominee.

    Setting aside that I disagree with your characterization of Obama 'insulting' you, what does that have to do with anything anyway?  Why would something like that influence your vote?  

    Parent
    For many working class people of all shades or (none / 0) (#215)
    by feet on earth on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:21:33 PM EST
    skin color is a matter of respect.  It is not his respect of us, it is the other way around: We do not respect him for too many things reported here already, many times.  

    Its beyond trust, there is no respect for him, some are really committed democrats who will go for him, but those who are also committed to the Catholic church, or to a certain way of life, or to our adopted land, McCain call out respect out of them.

    Now, don't give me the uneducated people sh*t, they ain't buying it from the classist class

    Parent

    Oh, this is going to be good! (none / 0) (#47)
    by MarkL on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:32:48 PM EST
    I'm off to exercise, eat dinner.
    I wish you enlightenment.

    Parent
    I'll join you (none / 0) (#105)
    by kmblue on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:44:16 PM EST
    MarkL.
    Time to pump some iron!

    Parent
    Glad to see some in the Dem (none / 0) (#69)
    by IndiDemGirl on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:37:43 PM EST
    Party still value a victory in November.  A unity ticket might not happen, but it should be given serious consideration.  

    No Obama on a ticket (none / 0) (#169)
    by scorbs on Thu May 08, 2008 at 05:58:42 PM EST
    Sorry, no Clinton as Vice President.  She gets the nod as the nominee and selects him as VP, okay, but not the other way around.  The guy has no credentials and has no idea what he's doing.  Bottomline.

    This Idea Is Ridiculous (none / 0) (#188)
    by dugan49 on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:02:38 PM EST
    I don't think Hillary Clinton has any interest in being Barack Obama's VicePresident for 8 years. If she runs on the ticket and they don't win, it isn't good for her, and if they win it isn't good for her, or really , for the country. She would be of more use in another position in the government.

    In 8 years Hillary Clinton will be 68 years old. She is not going to run in 2016.

    The whol;e thing makes no sense other than to get Obama elected. Can she help him do that as the VP candidate and then immediately resign?

    A third Party candidacy is more appealing than this 'unity ticket'.

    I just (none / 0) (#194)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:04:42 PM EST
    don't get how clueless these Obama partisans are. People vote the top of the ticket. If people aren't going to vote for Obama then they aren't going to vote for Obama even with Clinton on the ticket. She can't solve Obama's problems. Grrrr
    Get out of the fog people.

    Obama on the top ticket, Clinton ... senator. (none / 0) (#218)
    by SAINTIXE56 on Thu May 08, 2008 at 06:27:59 PM EST
    I voted Obama, I donated to his campaign and will donate again. So, no denial, I am happy he is to become the nominee... So who for Veep, Pb is that Mrs Clinton is married to a man who cat be trusted, and I dont speak about his philandering. He has been less than an asset to her campaign. He may carry on blundering. For Veep, is she the Veep WE HAVE IN MIND. We went for BHO because of the change theme. Clinton as a veep is no change for us. we are open to a woman, or a man a young an old, but not a Clinton. WP Will said it in his op-ed , this year, we want new faces, people we feel we can bond, McCain is a comeback kid a war hero who was unfairly cheated by Rove and his likes, we want people who deserve a second chance because they give us Hope, pb is that HRC gives us Bill... so I really dont see her, now she certainly can play in the decision committee but she and her bunch of advisers made a mull of it. Clinton voters started agonizing Obama voters by accusing us of being loonies. Brack kept mute, well, we bit back. Probably we have to apologize.. just like the other side has to apologize for irate comments. We are awre some Clinton voters will not vote Obama, we accept it. What is less acceptable, is the money loss Mrs Clinton is suffering due to Penn, it is a shame thios woman is losing all her honestly gained monenies for a soilly and prejudiced man. If she lost the nomination, we all know he is the first to be blamed. His micro management lost the big picture , the devil is in the details. Well it is true this year. 2012 if McCAIN WINS ? if Obama wins, she cant run until 2016...too old possibly. But she can stay a key player as the senate majority leader and be a serious pain in th Ass of the WH? OR qshe may become the health tzar etc.
    To go down in US history as the woman who gave a decent health care system to the US. thERE ARE MORE THAN ONE ROAD TO ROME. look at Gore. He is not the actual POTUS BUT HE IS THE Oracle of the dems and he is respected by the rest of teh world, so life is not over

    Unity ticket? Let's see ... (none / 0) (#219)
    by bridget on Thu May 08, 2008 at 07:04:53 PM EST
    Will Hillary Clinton accept Obama as her VP?

    I certainly wouldn't ask him myself BUT

    if Hillary as Prez can live with it and thinks it's the best solution (and can find something for him to do ;-) so can I.

    Go Hillary!

    All i know i$ (none / 0) (#220)
    by just victory on Thu May 08, 2008 at 07:20:52 PM EST
    I donated to her campaign again today. I'll vote for Obama only if he is the VP on her ticket.

    the is no humane option but to vote democrat (none / 0) (#221)
    by pluege on Thu May 08, 2008 at 07:26:23 PM EST
    a lot of people are going to have to "just get over it". Anyone not voting for the democratic nominee no matter who that is, is signing on to the death warrant of hundreds of thousands of innocent people who will be needlessly slaughtered under continued republican rule. No one's ego or pride should have prominence over the power each has to prevent wanton mass murder.

    So which is worse (if Obama is the nominee)... (none / 0) (#222)
    by Adept Havelock on Thu May 08, 2008 at 07:32:55 PM EST
    A Unity ticket with Obama at the top, or two McCain chosen SC justices who will in all likelihood tip the court and end worker protections, endorse more executive powergrabs, and possibly overturn Roe V. Wade?

    Remember, Clarence Thomas got in when the legislature was a Democratic majority.

    It only works with Hillary on top (none / 0) (#223)
    by goldberry on Thu May 08, 2008 at 07:46:21 PM EST
    The other way is going to encounter the same electability problems.  Plus, it makes no sense from  a readiness standpoint and she's be a fool to accept second place.  

    Unity Ticket??? (none / 0) (#225)
    by SoCalDem on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:10:25 AM EST
    This is crazy, why would she want to be V.P.??
    She can go back to her Senate seat and keep a check on President Macain. Then she can run again in 4 years.