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Wednesday Afternoon Open Thread

By Jeralyn, Section Blog Related
Posted on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:34:18 PM EST
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There's not much catching my eye this afternoon other than the new iPhone. I'm going to switch from the Treo when it comes out. How about you?

Update: Maybe not.

This is an open thread.

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    Here is an interesting story re. Obama and women (5.00 / 1) (#1)
    by tben on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:40:31 PM EST
    LINK

    Interesting? Expected I would say (none / 0) (#24)
    by nycstray on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:57:56 PM EST
    since many will vote the "D" on the ticket. Will it hold? Time will tell. Is it enough? Time will tell.

    Parent
    Jim Johnson just stepped down (5.00 / 1) (#2)
    by bjorn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:40:50 PM EST
    from the VP selection comm

    Oh Golly, why? (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by shoephone on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:43:15 PM EST
    According to Obama, he wasn't actually "working" for him.

    /snark.

    Parent

    This is going to get interesting (5.00 / 0) (#22)
    by JavaCityPal on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:56:46 PM EST
    Obama may actually have to start hiring vetters to vet the vetters to vet the vetters.

    Considering the team he chose, we could see a repeat of the Eagleton choice.

    What's that famous quote, "He!!uva Job, Brownie".

    Was Johnson the one who ran the Kerry vetting process for his VP?

    Parent

    The Eagleton choice issue won't happen (none / 0) (#29)
    by scribe on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:01:10 PM EST
    again, if only b/c McGovern picked Eagleton in a real hurry.

    Those old enough to remember, will remember that the VP issue was wide open during the convention.  Shooot- Chairman Mao even got a vote from a delegate.  Someone had to be picked and quickly - and that vitiated any attempt at vetting.

    Parent

    Depends on what the meaning (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by madamab on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:08:18 PM EST
    of "work" is. ;-)

    Parent
    Somebody should ask Obama that, lol!~ (none / 0) (#40)
    by nycstray on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:10:10 PM EST


    Parent
    hee hee hee (none / 0) (#45)
    by madamab on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:13:32 PM EST
    I wonder what he'd say?

    Parent
    "uuh . . . uuuummmmm . . . . uuhhh"? (none / 0) (#64)
    by nycstray on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:38:54 PM EST


    Parent
    And the "E" Word Has Been Floated, (none / 0) (#114)
    by PssttCmere08 on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 06:31:26 PM EST
    as in "ETHICS".

    link

    Parent

    I'm asking this here (none / 0) (#115)
    by illissius on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 06:34:11 PM EST
    because it seems the other thread is closed: You mentioned there that Sebelius belongs to the DLC. What's your source? I tried looking into whether she is when she was first floated as VP (many months ago), but didn't find very much of relevance. She (or the DGA? can't remember) did some project or press release or something in cooperation with the DLC, but as far as I could tell she didn't seem to be a member.

    Parent
    Poll numbers (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:43:24 PM EST
    must have dropped. Yesterday there was nothing wrong with him and today he's under the bus. I guess the next thing he needs to do is cough up that birth certificate that the right wingers are yammering about.

    Parent
    Seriously (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by LoisInCo on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:50:51 PM EST
    it looks like a bad pattern. I didn't care one way or the other because I thought the vetting was just for show. The real VP slot has been paid for by someone already. But it just looks bad to defend people and toss them out (or resign) repeatedly. As if the revolving door during Shrub's wasn't bad enough.

    Parent
    It bothers me that (none / 0) (#116)
    by Grace on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 06:48:54 PM EST
    he doesn't appear to have the cajones to really defend anyone.  The closest he has come to mounting a strong defense was his defense of Wright.

       

    Parent

    i am not happy. i just ordered drapes (5.00 / 0) (#47)
    by hellothere on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:13:54 PM EST
    for my spot under the bus. the obama campaign has to understand that there is only such room here. "hey, move over, that my spot!" (snark)

    Parent
    No cell phone (5.00 / 3) (#3)
    by Step Beyond on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:41:39 PM EST
    I don't have a cell phone so no upgrade/switch for me. I used to have one years ago and then I realized I don't like to be that reachable.

    The most precious thing today (5.00 / 5) (#7)
    by scribe on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:43:51 PM EST
    is, when questioned:

    "Where can you be reached?"

    To be able to answer:

    "I can't."


    Parent

    I 'dumped' mine to be unreachable except by ... (5.00 / 1) (#72)
    by Ellie on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:48:30 PM EST
    ... three people (spouse, sister, assistant) and I only use it once or twice a day.

    Otherwise it's tag-you're-it on returning voicemail all day long.

    Parent

    grandcentral (5.00 / 1) (#77)
    by jerry on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:53:24 PM EST
    Checkout google's new toy, grandcentral.com.

    In beta, as usual, it's free (for now?), and it gives you a new phone number to handout to people.

    Then you can split people up into various groups, family, work, other, and when you get an incoming call, depending on the group, it will ring you, or send the call direct to voicemail.

    If it does send it to voicemail, you can have it call you at the same time, and you can actually listen in on the call and pick it up as the person is leaving their message.

    It also gives you a visual voicemail and lets you pick and choose the messages to answer or just delete or return or whatever.

    Parent

    Hmm, I limit personal info online but will check (none / 0) (#82)
    by Ellie on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:04:09 PM EST
    I won't even transmit client info via the currents in the Great Electronic Fishbowl but it sounds pretty handy for ancillary contacts.

    I used to think I was being a stick in the mud about being old-school on this point but people actually like me -- really really like me -- for staying that way on privacy.

    Parent

    Ah, client info.... (none / 0) (#86)
    by jerry on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:13:55 PM EST
    Well, first, it is in beta, so while it works great for me, I don't have clients I want to talk to, just people I would prefer NOT to talk to, so you may wish to wait until it is out of beta.

    There are competitors to grandcentral that you can pay for similar services....  Onebox I think can do similar things.

    But if you're worried about client voicemails left on google's servers, as you probably should be, what do you do about voicemails left at sprint, tmobile, verizon, att, right now?

    apart from their actual voicemail, I don't think you have to put any identifiable information in, you can leave "other" to default to the phone you are using.

    Sigh, right now, there is a message I don't want to listen to....

    Parent

    grandcentral and sms (5.00 / 1) (#96)
    by jerry on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:34:33 PM EST
    So, while I kill sometime, some nice features of grandcentral:

    a) they'll ring your phone while someone is leaving a message and make it so that you can pick up in the middle
    b) they'll send you an sms message each time someone leaves a message
    c) they support visual voicemail from your brower or phone's browser
    d) they support SIP phones so you can get them to call a computer SIP phone when you are logged in (see the gizmo project for a free computer SIP Phone, or iCall for a semi-free computer SIP phone)

    They are not yet hooked in with gmail though :(

    Parent

    LOL and thanks for the info (5.00 / 1) (#97)
    by Ellie on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:40:07 PM EST
    Normally we limit the number of voicemails and their content to "Get back to me", and exchange works in progress (with notes, etc.) on hard media.

    Since storage has become smaller and cheaper, I've urged people to use vox commanding to talk their notes directly into the drive and overnight express it via the boring old snail mail.

    This kind of exchange is cheaper, more secure, easier to work with and back up and no one has President Gladys Kravitz and Friends listening in due to his War on Whatever.

    Parent

    Have to rate you up for mentioning Gladys Kravitz (5.00 / 1) (#98)
    by jerry on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:42:20 PM EST


    Parent
    No cell phone here either (none / 0) (#120)
    by splashy on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 11:25:04 PM EST
    When I realize it won't work when I'm at home, and since I work at home I'm there most all the time, it seemed like a very unnecessary expense to me. My land line works just fine, thank you.

    We got a pay as you go phone that we buy minutes for on the rare times that we travel, perhaps once every three years or so. We are real homebodies!

    Parent

    RealisED, not realize (none / 0) (#121)
    by splashy on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 11:25:45 PM EST
    Need to proofread better...

    Parent
    First comment deleted (5.00 / 4) (#4)
    by Jeralyn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:43:12 PM EST
    it was a pitch to go to a site promoting voting Republican. Commenters cannot use TL as an organizing ground for movements we oppose, nor shill for third party party or Republican candidates. Expressing one's opinion about why one is voting a certain way is one thing -- that's allowed -- shilling and organizing is another.

    Yeeeee-hawwww! (5.00 / 1) (#8)
    by scribe on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:44:32 PM EST
    Way to be quick on the delete key!

    Parent
    I didn't get to post on VP discussion earlier (5.00 / 2) (#9)
    by bjorn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:45:45 PM EST
    but I think a lot of independents want Obama to pick a Hagel or Lugar.  I am begging him not to because it is really a deal breaker for me.

    Well (5.00 / 1) (#14)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:49:15 PM EST
    there goes the Roe v. Wade sledgehammer of unity.

    Parent
    Hackuva Job Flores (5.00 / 3) (#11)
    by squeaky on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:46:59 PM EST
    A senior Justice Department official says a $500,000 federal grant to the World Golf Foundation is an appropriate use of money designed to deal with juvenile crime in America.

    "We need something really attractive to engage the gangs and the street kids, golf is the hook," said J. Robert Flores, the administrator of the Justice Department's Office of Juvenile Justice and Delinquency Prevention.

    [snip]

    The director of the golf program, Joe Louis BarrowJr., said the program would help teach inner city children because "golf is a game where values such as honesty, integrity and sportsmanship are essential."

    [snip]

    In a telephone interview with ABC News, Flores defended his decisions as in the best overall interest of dealing with teen crime.

    He said he was never bound by his staff's recommendations and that he made decisions based "on the overall" need in the country.

    Murray Waas

    Actually, this scheme sounds a lot like (5.00 / 1) (#23)
    by scribe on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:57:19 PM EST
    what Georgia Thompson was prosecuted for.  Except that, in her case, the lowest responsible bidder/best qualified bidder actually got the contract and she didn't monkey around with making sure anyone's political connections got them moved up or down the list.  You'll remember - she was the Wisconsin Democratic government employee who was prosecuted by Steven Biskupic's USAtty office, and whose prosecution made a whole series of nice articles/media for the Republicans and against the Democrats in the run-up to an election.

    Biskupic, one might remember, seemed to have made one of the earlier drafts of the firing list in Gonzo's DoJ but then mysteriously was removed from the list as it evolved.  There seems to have been some correspondence between his presence on and removal from the list and Georgia Thompson's prosecution and some voting fraud prosecutions, but no one ever looked too closely....

    And Georgia Thompson - who was denied bail pending appeal?  You'll remember she was the one the Seventh Circuit (no friend of criminal defendants) ordered released on the same day as it heard oral argument of her appeal because not only had she not committed a crime, but there was no evidence to suggest she'd done anything other than follow the competitive bidding law.

    Parent

    now that is priceless (1.00 / 1) (#46)
    by Jlvngstn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:13:51 PM EST
    Gangbangers with golf clubs, kinda like giving mini bats to bleacher bums at Yankee stadium....

    Parent
    JL - I was at (5.00 / 1) (#54)
    by scribe on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:24:24 PM EST
    Yankee Stadium among the bleacher bums for bat day this past weekend.  (Had to go see Joba start.)

    No one got hurt.

    No one even swung the bats.

    Best part - during the seventh inning stretch, the kids were all asked to "Carefully, without hitting anyone" hold their bats upright above their heads to thank the sponsor for the bats and bat day.

    Everyone held their bats up, got and gave a big cheer, and went back to watching a fun game.  And getting a wicked sunburn.

    It's a lot safer at The Stadium than it used to be, though not necessarily as entertaining.

    Parent

    no way (none / 0) (#61)
    by Jlvngstn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:31:24 PM EST
    lol.  I remember going to games in the 80's and it was a zoo.  I have not been to a yankees game since (since i had kids my trips are considerably shorter there and with less free time).  Nice to know that it has improved to where they can have a bat day (i thought they gave that up).  Now if we could only have some civility in the bleachers at home here in chicago.......See you in October, unless of course the white sox want some of us.

    Parent
    Way - you can't even bring (none / 0) (#71)
    by scribe on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:46:37 PM EST
    one of those soft-sided coolers in.  Though you can bring in a diaper bag.  Security silliness.

    The bowling alley across the street (under the tracks for the 4 train) has made a mint off putting in a locker/bag-check-type service for all the folks that get turned away at the gate b/c of their over-sized bags.

    A while back a friend related being at a Red Sox/Yankees game in the late 70s, during an earlier iteration of the rivalry-at-fever-pitch business.  He saw some guy in the upper deck launch a live chicken into the air such that it landed in the Red Sox dugout.  Much to everyone's amusement.

    Today, you couldn't even get a couple of D cells in.

    Oh - and they don't serve any beer in the bleachers anymore.  Even if you wanted to pay $8.50 for a crappy American light beer  (really), with that $12 bleachers ticket you can't get one.  People actually take their kids to the bleachers now.

    FWIW, the bleachers fans are some of the more knowledgeable fans going - it's like going to the movies for them (same price range), so they get to see a lot of games.

    Parent

    Ah, the bowling alley! Good to know they're (none / 0) (#102)
    by nycstray on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:53:08 PM EST
    doing bag check now. We usually travel very light these days, but ya never know when ya may need it :)

    Parent
    Yup. Gratuitous plugs coming up - (none / 0) (#109)
    by scribe on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 05:05:52 PM EST
    they've even gone so far as to paint over the beer ad on the wall of the bowling alley, the one that used to say "[Beer name] - official beer of bowling".

    Neighborhood's goin' upscale.

    For those interested, Stubhub (a ticket brokerage, basically) has worked out some sort of deal with the Yankees where, if you get tickets through their brokerage, you can pick them up at a couple of little trailers just outside the Stadium, rather than hope fedex delivers them to your house prior to your having to leave for the Stadium.  A nice touch, I think.

    Parent

    Didn't the bleachers become (none / 0) (#67)
    by nycstray on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:42:44 PM EST
    a "family" section?

    Parent
    I'm still waiting for my patent to clear on ... (none / 0) (#74)
    by Ellie on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:51:25 PM EST
    ... The Beer Bra (TM)

    Parent
    Yup - see mine at 71 on this thread (none / 0) (#76)
    by scribe on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:52:27 PM EST
    Oh, and if you want to see a game at Yankee Stadium, do it soon.  It'll be knocked down after this season and the new one's well on its way to completion.

    Parent
    we're planning several games (none / 0) (#100)
    by nycstray on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:50:10 PM EST
    this may also be my last summer/year in NY, so aside from the fact they're tearing it down, I need to make sure I get in all my "lasts". Westminster Dog Show will be another along with Shea, lol!~

    Parent
    Hmmm... (none / 0) (#83)
    by kredwyn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:05:49 PM EST
    Big Brothers/Big Sisters would be what to you?

    Look...it sounds like an odd program. But there are a couple different programs that are very similar when it comes to helping inner city kids get a nudge away from falling through the cracks.

    Golf, baseball, basket ball, chess, music...

    Parent

    I should walk across the street (none / 0) (#19)
    by nycstray on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:54:57 PM EST
    to the high school and see how this one scores with them, lol!~

    Parent
    Thanks for that link (none / 0) (#21)
    by Step Beyond on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:56:07 PM EST
    From that article.

    Current and former Justice Department employees allege that Flores ignored the staff rankings in favor of programs that had political, social or religious connections to the Bush White House.

    The honorary chairman of the First Tee program is former President George Bush. On a videotape presentation, the former President Bush praised the program for "serving others and building character and building values."

    Gee why am I not surprised? Golf for teen gang members is such a splendid idea that there can't be any other reason for giving money to that winning program. :D

    Parent

    Oh And (none / 0) (#60)
    by squeaky on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:31:02 PM EST
    Hat tip to Laura Rozen for the link.


    Parent
    I wrote a post on it yesterday (none / 0) (#49)
    by Jeralyn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:16:41 PM EST
    here.

    Parent
    Missed It (none / 0) (#65)
    by squeaky on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:40:08 PM EST
    Thought it would be something you would have written about. So much for me thinking that I don't miss a beat here at TL...

    Parent
    Jim Johnson just got thrown under the bus! (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by janarchy on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:51:33 PM EST
    Obama's VP vetter steps aside

    To Cream City (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by creeper on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:52:32 PM EST
    Are you okay?  Is the water receding?

    yaay, open thread. (5.00 / 4) (#18)
    by Marco21 on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:53:03 PM EST
    I have been waiting to comment regarding the Clinton "enemy list" BS pushed by the New York Times and MSNBC.

    The Clintons aren't the Heathers in some sort of political high school. I am so tired of hearing about how this mad, power-hungry couple will do anything to take down those who oppose them since I've never seen any evidence to support said gossip.

    On Morning Joe, they were actually speculating on who could be on the list, acting as if it truly exists.

    It's pathetic what passes for a worthy story these days.

    End of rant. Regarding Jim Johnson, so much for not vetting the vetters, huh Barack?

    I saw a brief snippet of a conversation (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by bjorn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:00:30 PM EST
    about this....seems like crap to me.  You don't need to make a list.  Most people help people that help them.  Most people don't do political favors or any kind of favors for people who smear them. The Clintons are really not any more powerful than other politicians.

    Parent
    bjorn...must be Santa Claus Syndrome... (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by PssttCmere08 on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:01:58 PM EST
    one side for naughty (Hillary), the other side for nice...

    Parent
    Ahhh (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by LoisInCo on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:02:56 PM EST
    I knew there was a reason I was on her side!

    Parent
    All I ever see is the back of obama's (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by PssttCmere08 on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:00:47 PM EST
    head, caused by so much backpedaling.  It is way past the point of ridiculous.  obama's penchant for flip-flopping far surpasses Kerry's, even in Kerry's wildest dreams.  Maybe the ultimate backpedal will be when obama decides he doesn't actually want to be president... :)

    Parent
    You aren't (5.00 / 0) (#119)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 07:35:43 PM EST
    kidding. Kerry was the model of consistency compared to Obama.

    Parent
    Makes you wonder when enough will be (5.00 / 1) (#34)
    by JavaCityPal on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:05:37 PM EST
    enough. They got rid of the Clintons, but their addiction to hate just goes on.

    There is no such list. FOX reported on it, too, but they insisted no list exists.

    Parent

    What a ridiculous article (5.00 / 1) (#36)
    by stillife on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:06:31 PM EST
    Just pathetic.  

    I wonder if the media are sorry at some level to see Clinton go (despite the fact that they helped give her a shove).  The race is going to be boring without her.  

    Parent

    Jim Johnson.... Another one bites the dust (none / 0) (#38)
    by kelsweet on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:07:59 PM EST

     I love that song by the way. If I knew how to put a link here I would.

      Ouch, O's camp being called out on MSNBC for taking twisting words. I am beginning to wonder how long they can use that tired ol' game.
    Does not bode well i tellya.

    Parent

    MSNBC calling camp Obama out? (none / 0) (#43)
    by Marco21 on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:12:14 PM EST
    Huh. I thought they'd wait a little longer for abandoning him for their true sweetheart, McCain.

    He's a maverick, you know?

    Parent

    I think most are waiting, (5.00 / 0) (#48)
    by madamab on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:15:39 PM EST
    but jeez! It's been so difficult trying to fake the Obamalove when they really, REALLY heart McCain...some of them just can't hold out any more!

    Parent
    I have not seen signs of McCain love (5.00 / 1) (#50)
    by bjorn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:17:26 PM EST
    yet...I am predicting the Obama crush will be sustained for many more months.

    Parent
    Not sure about that (5.00 / 1) (#94)
    by mmc9431 on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:31:39 PM EST
    I have heard Chris Matthews state that he believes no one in the country deserves the presidency more than John McCain. He's made that statement several times and I'm sure he believes it. The media has invest years in promoting the McCain mystique. I just don't see them backing away from their own creation. They're the ones who gave him this fake "maverick" reputation. His voting record doesn't support the name. He gives them sound bites like he did with the torture bill but then he goes along with the party vote anyway. Both McCain and Arlen Spector are great for that.

    Parent
    I think (none / 0) (#53)
    by LoisInCo on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:20:53 PM EST
    they would have to give an adjustment period if they were going to change. Anyone was a commenter at Taylor Marsh can tell you, suddenly falling in love with someone you called the devil days ago is jarring.

    Parent
    It'll be a slow process... (5.00 / 1) (#51)
    by kredwyn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:18:38 PM EST
    lest there be some sort of August double-cross at the convention.

    Parent
    kelsweet....LOOK!! (none / 0) (#88)
    by PssttCmere08 on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:17:49 PM EST
    Queen
    » Another One Bites The Dust

    Steve walks warily down the street,
    with the brim pulled way down low
    Ain't no sound but the sound of his feet,
    machine guns ready to go
    Are you ready, Are you ready for this
    Are you hanging on the edge of your seat
    Out of the doorway the bullets rip
    To the sound of the beat
    Another one bites the dust
    Another one bites the dust
    And another one gone, and another one gone
    Another one bites the dust
    Hey, I'm gonna get you too
    Another one bites the dust
    How do you think I'm going to get along,
    without you, when you're gone
    You took me for everything that I had,
    and kicked me out on my own
    Are you happy, are you satisfied
    How long can you stand the heat
    Out of the doorway the bullets rip
    To the sound of the beat
    Chorus
    Another one bites the dust
    Another one bites the dust
    Another one bites the dust
    Another one bites the dust
    There are plenty of ways you can hurt a man
    And bring him to the ground
    You can beat him
    You can cheat him
    You can treat him bad and leave him
    When he's down
    But I'm ready, yes I'm ready for you
    I'm standing on my own two feet
    Out of the doorway the bullets rip
    repeating the sound of the beat
     

    Parent

    Here's the link you wanted (none / 0) (#117)
    by JavaCityPal on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 06:52:11 PM EST
    Queen: Another one bites the dust

    Parent
    An Ulterior Motive (none / 0) (#112)
    by JimWash08 on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 05:42:01 PM EST
    I think there's a more sinister reason for this report, but that could just be old cynical me.

    As we all know, despite the editorial endorsement, most of the political writers at the New York Times (Jeff Zeleny, Katherine Seelye, Adam Nagourney, and the worst of all, Patrick Healy) are in the tank for Obama. I've always had a huge problem with the NYT, since a lot of their Hillary-Hate articles involved anonymous sources who were in her campaign. But I digress...

    So, back to this tripe in today's paper: I think it's an effort to build a case against a possible Clinton-VP move by the Obama campaign. I should be a little more clear -- they are helping the campaign develop ammo should they have to shield themselves when they choose someone else.

    I mean, seriously, it wouldn't be any secret that Bill and Hillary would remember who were with them, and who pushed them in front of Obama's bus. But seriously, they are both very intelligent and mature (pfft! duh) people ... and sure there are hard feelings and short-lived grudges.

    Now even CNN has an entire segment on this article. There has to come a point when the average American questions what role the media is playing in this election (a question most of us have long ago asked, debated and pretty much answered.)

    Parent

    I wonder how fast the new iPhone can (5.00 / 3) (#32)
    by Rhouse on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:04:55 PM EST
    pop popcorn?

    Krugman (5.00 / 4) (#55)
    by andgarden on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:24:27 PM EST
    makes a funny:

    Maybe I'm wrong, but my sense is that Jason Furman has become a proxy target for some Obama supporters who, now that the Great Satanness has been defeated, are suddenly starting to have the queasy feeling that their hero might be a bit of a .... centrist. I'm tempted to say I told you so; in fact, I guess I just did. But that's all in the past now.
    me likes it! (5.00 / 1) (#57)
    by bjorn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:26:41 PM EST


    Parent
    p.s. did Goolsby get thrown under the bus? (none / 0) (#58)
    by bjorn on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:29:10 PM EST


    Parent
    Well, all mobile devices have limits (5.00 / 1) (#56)
    by andgarden on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:24:54 PM EST
    Not a very good argument against the iPhone.

    Ewwwww...has anyone seen... (5.00 / 0) (#63)
    by Berkshireblue on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:35:41 PM EST
    the Matthew 25 ad/poster, whatever. It's in a diary over on the rec list at mydd promoting the Matthew 25 web site. I was really floored. Is anything Obama does just hunky dorey with his followers? Why are we using Obama's belief in the "redemptive death and resurrection of Jesus Chirst" in an election? Why don't we just admit we have no fresh ideas and are just co-opting the Republican playbook?

    P.S. I think I tried to embed the photo/poster but doubt I succeeded and if I screwed anything up I apologize-web skills are not my forte.

    Matthew 25 (5.00 / 2) (#75)
    by indy in sc on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:51:40 PM EST
    is a third party PAC.  It is not connected to the campaign.  Joshua Generation is (connected to Obama's campaign).  

    Parent
    So, it's obviously to benefit Obama.. (none / 0) (#108)
    by Berkshireblue on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 05:00:23 PM EST
    I'm sure they wouldn't be doing it if he didn't approve. It's HIS own quote being used.

    Sorry-I find any insertion of belief in Jesus into a political campaign as tainting the candidacy of the person.

    Parent

    Blog Code of Ethics? (5.00 / 1) (#66)
    by santarita on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:41:57 PM EST
    I've been wondering if there is a Blog Code of Ethics or Code of Best Practices?  I did a little google research and came up with niente.

    After looking at the comments in the diary here today that cited Matt Yglesias' comments on politicians the question resurfaced.  I wouldn't accuse most of the bloggers or diarists of outright lying but I did see plenty of distortions, omissions of facts that might run counter to their theses, misquotes, quotes out of contexts, etc.  And even if they didn't do those things all of the time, they allowed the commenters to get away with the same sorts of behavior.  

    I stopped frequenting those blogs because the signal to noise. wheat to chaff ratio got to be annoying and a waste of time.  More often than not I want to write "Beam me up, Scottie - there's no sign of intelligent life."

    So I ask the question.  Is there a Code of Ethics or Best Practices?

    You too? (5.00 / 1) (#81)
    by Sunshine on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:02:57 PM EST
    I don't know about the rest of you but I am getting e-mails from web sites that claim they are Clinton supporters and now are voting McCain...  I don't know how they knew I was a Clinton supporter, I don't give out my ID to often and I don't go to Republican blogs...  I'm not voting for McCain and I might not vote for Obama but every other Democrat has my vote... I don't want to be a part of putting Obama in office and I don't want to be a part of keeping him out of office...

    Before the Party is remade (5.00 / 0) (#85)
    by mmc9431 on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:08:49 PM EST
    Into the Obama image, wouldn't it be wise to see if he's elected. A lot of people could have egg all over their face if they revamp the Party and throw out all that dead weight they think they have, and we lose! I could respect a senior party spokesperson talking about new directions possible, more than an unproven candidate that has never even had to compete in a federal election. (He was given Illinois not elected)

    Here's Your Chance to Denounce Sexism (5.00 / 2) (#99)
    by kaleidescope on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:47:45 PM EST
    The L.A. Times is reporting that Alex Kosinski, presiding judge of the Ninth Circuit,

    acknowledged in an interview with The Times that he had posted the materials, which included a photo of naked women on all fours painted to look like cows and a video of a half-dressed man cavorting with a sexually aroused farm animal. Some of the material was inappropriate, he conceded, although he defended other sexually explicit content as "funny."

    For those of you TalkLefter's here west of the Rockies, here's your chance to "not be shut up about" sexism.  Time to write both Kosinski and the Chief Justice Roberts about this.  

    And if you're appearing before him, that would be an even better time to "call him out" on his sexism.

    gosh, Apple doesn't play MS proprietary stuff (5.00 / 1) (#106)
    by DandyTIger on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 04:23:37 PM EST
    what a surprise. Not much of an argument against. That's kind of like saying I'm not going to buy a Ford because it won't accept a GM engine.

    Is this the same as the first iPhone? (none / 0) (#111)
    by nycstray on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 05:19:24 PM EST
    my friend who's gadgety, hasn't said anything about it. She's Mac at home, PC at work and does work between the 2 systems/locations and her iPhone is in the mix. All my other iPhone folks are strictly Mac, but use it for business as well and I haven't heard any complaining.

    Parent
    Apple and AT&T aren't playing straight (none / 0) (#10)
    by andgarden on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:46:29 PM EST
    with the new iPhone. If you check the price over two years (the length of the contract), the new one is actually more expensive. I'm disappointed because I wanted one.

    I may still get one. . .

    Isn't that pretty standard for a subsidized phone? (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by davnee on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:58:59 PM EST
    I've been patient waiting for the 2nd gen iphone.  I don't think I can be patient any longer.

    As a random aside, I have to admit that my Apple fandom has taken a bit of a hit in light of this primary.  I get a bit nauseous now anytime I realize that I'm buying into aggressive branding and marketing, or that I am in any way showing my "creative class" colors.  I still love my macs, and think they're the best things since sliced bread, but I feel much less cool about it.  Thankfully, I can at least remind myself that I didn't fall for the Obama brand.  I don't know how I could look at myself in the mirror if I had.  And by the way, I do not mean to condemn all Obama supporters as consumerist lemmings.  I'm sure some of his supporters believe he has virtues beyond his brand.  But I just see him as a product - overhyped and underwhelming when you actually take him out of the box.

    Parent

    heh (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by andgarden on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:00:58 PM EST
    Yes, It's pretty standard, but Apple is pitching the new phone as being less expensive, and given the contract, that's just false. Anyway, Apple still rocks, creative class or not.

    I was using my Mac when it was UNCOOL.

    Parent

    Yeah, I've always had macs (5.00 / 1) (#37)
    by davnee on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:07:03 PM EST
    So I guess I only became cool by default.  Actually, I've always been irritated by the need to have expensive and hip toys in order to demonstrate coolness.  I want an iphone because it rocks, not because it demonstrates that I rock.

    Parent
    I still remember (5.00 / 2) (#44)
    by madamab on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:12:52 PM EST
    when that first little Mac came out. It was about 1981 or so, and it had that cute little trash can and smiley face. My high school boyfriend had one.

    He also played D&D.

    He was NOT cool, but he was cool anyway. :-)

    Parent

    I dumped a suitor in favor of my mac (5.00 / 2) (#52)
    by davnee on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:19:13 PM EST
    He could never get over that I liked my apples just fine.  He always picked fights about the inferiority of my computer preferences.  If he needed to go alpha on me so badly that he'd waste time impugning my mac fandom (and I'm not even a proselytizer), I knew he was not worth my time.  Next.

    Parent
    1984 when it came out, remember the commercial (none / 0) (#68)
    by DandyTIger on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:43:02 PM EST
    There were Lisa's before the original Mac, but even those were not out in 1981. Back then it was the little apple II. Also cute.

    Parent
    Can you explain that? (none / 0) (#73)
    by jerry on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:49:13 PM EST
    Did the price of the contract increase?  The phone sure seems cheaper, but I haven't looked at the contract details.

    Parent
    Data is $10 more per month (none / 0) (#87)
    by andgarden on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:17:15 PM EST
    so multiply that by 2 years. . .

    Parent
    Arguably you are sucking down more data (none / 0) (#90)
    by jerry on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:22:23 PM EST
    on a faster network....

    I like my Treo.  I like my unlimited data for $25 per month too.  I'm not convinced EVDO is as fast as people were making it out to be.

    Regarding the iPhone, I don't know how much data is.  Five years or so ago, Sprint wanted $15 per month for unlimited data, AT&T wanted $70 per month for metered data.  Sprint is now $25, I don't know what AT&T is.

    Parent

    It was $20/month, now $30 (none / 0) (#91)
    by andgarden on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:25:00 PM EST
    Plus the required voice plan is pricy (though the same).

    Parent
    It's not pricey, you have an iPhone! We have to (none / 0) (#93)
    by jerry on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:30:14 PM EST
    keep out the riff raff!

    If you can't afford the iPhone, well, perhaps, the iPhone really isn't for you.  Maybe you would be happier with a SideKick or a Motorola DynaTac

    Actually, compared to how it used to be, Apple has done great things to bring AT&T's data pricing into line.  Right now it seems $5 higher than Sprint's but I think AT&T's 3g is also supposed to be faster than Sprints 3G.

    I'm still keeping my Treo until I see an android based phone.

    Parent

    Remember, the data is 10X faster (none / 0) (#113)
    by JayBat on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 06:22:57 PM EST
    ...as long as you're in a 3G area.  You have to check the coverage map (push the "Coverage Type: data" button, or see the city list).

    So the phone is cheaper (and adds GPS, woot!), and surprise of surprises, the marketeers don't volunteer that data service is much-faster but more-expensive.

    You'll never get a great bargain from Apple or AT&T, that's how they work. But it's a fair deal, and my sweetie is gonna be getting one for her birthday.
    -Jay-

    Parent

    No, it is not cheaper (none / 0) (#118)
    by andgarden on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 07:08:26 PM EST
    It is more expensive, for more features.

    Parent
    My cell phone (none / 0) (#12)
    by Stellaaa on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:47:09 PM EST
    My cell phone fell in the pool, so I am using a pre-historic one till the new iPhone comes out.  I am an old Apple user, so I just swoon with all their products.  I stuck with them from the early 80's.  

    Looking forward to the GPS application that will come out in the future.  

    Old Apple user here also. (none / 0) (#35)
    by nycstray on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:05:59 PM EST
    I am getting better at resisting the drool factor of new products. I'll prob wait for one more round of i-Phones before I jump in. Unless something happens to my current phone (which also doubles as my non-existent i-pod).

    Parent
    TL - When you get your new (none / 0) (#13)
    by scribe on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:48:33 PM EST
    I-Phone II, you're going to have to make a youtube spoof of the IPHone commercials, in the vein of what Tom Goldstein of SCOTUSBlog did last Christmastime.

    So, where does your video start?

    Voting Democrat? (none / 0) (#20)
    by Artoo on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 01:55:10 PM EST
    Or Voting Republican?

    Jeralyn, there's no emoticons here so no way for me to indicate the snark without actually saying so. Check out the site. It's actually quite funny and if they're promoting voting Republican, they have a weird way of showing it - and one folks here I would think would find a little amusing.

    fake (none / 0) (#84)
    by boredmpa on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:07:46 PM EST
    site...

    Parent
    Has anyone seen (none / 0) (#33)
    by indy in sc on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:05:37 PM EST
    the new MoveOn ad featuring John Cusak on McCain?  Not sure of TL's link policy, so I won't add the link, but you can see it on youtube (for those who want no part of going onto MoveOn's site).  I think it's pretty good, but they are airing it nationally on Bravo.  I think most of Bravo's viewers already lean Dem, so I'm not sure that's the best use of their money or that it will make a big impact.

    I almost love John Cusack (5.00 / 3) (#42)
    by madamab on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:11:21 PM EST
    enough to let him tell me who to vote for.

    Almost. :-)

    Parent

    Edward Norton is my honey! (none / 0) (#89)
    by Fabian on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:22:20 PM EST
    Well, okay one of my honeys.  I just adore actors who can, y'know, really ACT.  

    So it's me, Ed Norton and The Hulk 10:30 AM matinee this Saturday.  Gonna be green(heh!) and ride my bike there.  (Dang!  Need to make sure I know where the KEY to my bike lock is.)

    Parent

    LOVE (none / 0) (#95)
    by indy in sc on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:31:56 PM EST
    Ed Norton!  Not sure that I can sit through Hulk though.  Let me know if it is any good.

    Parent
    Your fantasy dates are safe from me ... (none / 0) (#101)
    by Ellie on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:52:36 PM EST
    ... but surely I can't be the only person who's got Hugh Jackman on my Fantasy Guy Rotisserie -- but only in complete Wolverine from X-Men mode.

    The sideburns, the adamantine claws, the bitter wit -- plus, any guy that can use tools built into his own body to zest citrus and peel ginger is someone I want in my life.

    Also Johnny Depp if anyone in Fantasy Guy Rotisserie is trading ...

    Parent

    Apple blew it this time (none / 0) (#59)
    by dianem on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:29:16 PM EST
    Terrific product, but they fell into the Microsoft trap of setting artificial limits that customer's simply won't tolerate. The iPhone is turning into Apple's "Vista". People who want "the latest" get it, and it's a very cool product, but those who really think about it generally steer away because they have less sexy options that are easier to use. Personally, I won't even consider an iPhone until they unlock it from ATT. I like Verizon and I get the kind of coverage I need from their network. Why would I want to risk losing cell phone service at my house (I live in a remote area)? I have faith that Apple will resolve this, just like they resolved the iPod battery issue and the "Macs won't run MS Office software" issue. But it alwayw takes them some time to figure out that they can't bully everybody in to accepting things the way Microsoft can.

    Uh, you do realize (none / 0) (#62)
    by andgarden on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:34:25 PM EST
    that there is a hardware limitation that would make it impossible to use the current iPhone on Verizon, even if you could unlock it, right?

    Parent
    Some people found a way (none / 0) (#78)
    by dianem on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:59:56 PM EST
    I don't know how, but some people unlocked their iPhones. Unfortuntely, the hacks resulted in the phones not being upgradable.

    Parent
    Incorrect (5.00 / 1) (#80)
    by andgarden on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:02:22 PM EST
    unlocked iPhones work on T-Mobile and other GSM networks, not Verizon. Verizon uses a different standard.

    Parent
    But not tmobile (none / 0) (#107)
    by Valhalla on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 04:56:26 PM EST
    if I understand the network limits correctly.

    Parent
    gPhone.... (none / 0) (#69)
    by jerry on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:45:09 PM EST
    I think the iPhone is pretty neat, but I like my Treo 755p enough that I'm going to wait for Android and the gPhone....

    I'd keep the Treo for a while longer. (none / 0) (#70)
    by Iphie on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 02:45:31 PM EST
    I'm a Mac person all the way, and the iPhone is sooo pretty, but there is so much 3rd party software that is available for the Treo that Apple is just not willing to open up the iPhone for. Though I suppose it depends on what your primary use for it is -- I use my Treo for my phone, calendar, contacts, general reference, etc., but I don't spend much time online with it. Maybe if that were more important to me, I'd be more inclined to take the leap.

    I don't know if I could give up the Merriam-Webster dictionary I have on my Treo -- they don't make it for the iPhone, and it was the best $45 I ever spent.

    um, they opened up for third party software (none / 0) (#104)
    by DandyTIger on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 04:19:07 PM EST
    at the beginning of the year. So there will be thousands upon thousands of applications you'll be able to get for the iPhone. Many free.

    Parent
    Get your iPhone Jeralyn (none / 0) (#79)
    by ruffian on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:01:41 PM EST
    I love mine.  All those defects are fixable.  The Flash fix has been in work for a while now - I don't remember the details of that particular issue, but it will be a non-issue soon.  There will be a lot of new applications after the AppStore opens next month.

    Sure, it is not perfect for every use, but for web browsing on the go it is wonderful already, and the 3G will be much better.  I don't know if you are a Mac user, but it syncs seemlessly with all my other Mac utilities.

    And I made a TalkLeft icon for my home page!

    I'll upgrade to the new one at some point - I may wait to see if they put out new colors at Christmas.

    Iphone (none / 0) (#92)
    by Jgarza on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 03:27:11 PM EST
    If it works with my jobs enterprise server I'm switching.  Do you like the Treo, I know a couple of people with it, who have had to get like 4 new ones.

    yep, works with enterprise n/t (none / 0) (#105)
    by DandyTIger on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 04:19:39 PM EST


    Parent
    Supreme Court (none / 0) (#103)
    by CST on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 04:03:09 PM EST
    Jeralyn, any opinion on the recent supreme court case Engquist vs. Oregon Department of Agriculture?

    Seems to me like another decision curtailling the rights of employees who face descrimination.

    I didn't really understand the logic behind the ruling, it seemed to me to be something like "public employees have fewer rights than the rest of us" but I don't really get legal jargon so I may be way off.  This plus the Ledbetter vs. Goodyear ruling seems very anti-female.

    Maybe Bigger News (none / 0) (#110)
    by CoralGables on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 05:08:02 PM EST
    Possibly the biggest news today and somewhat of a surprise to me is the latest GE poll out of Michigan (Rasmussen) has Obama overtaking McCain 45-42. That's a 4 point swing since the last Rasmussen poll in Michigan.

    The latest from Washington (Rasmussen), which shouldn't be any problem for the DEM's at all, has Obama extending his lead from 11 pts to 18 pts 53-35

    Wednesday Afternoon Open Thread | 120 comments (120 topical)

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