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Why The Big Dog Has No Role To Play In The Health Care Debate

Rick Hertzberg wants Obama to put the Big Dog to work on health care reform:

Over at her Daily Beast, our former editor Tina Brown has a very good suggestion for President Obama: unleash Bill Clinton to sweet-talk and arm-wrestle the Blue Dogs into dropping their obstruction of health-care reform. Now that Tina mentions it, why hasn’t Obama done this already? . . . Given the horrific structural hurdles health care has to surmount . . ., this President needs all the help he can get. And it’s hard to think of anyone whose help would help more—especially since, as Tina notes, nobody has thought more about how to avoid the mistakes that were made last time than Mr. Clinton. Except maybe Mrs. Clinton.

I have the greatest respect for the former President but he can't help President Obama here. The Big Dog does not have political bite anymore. Former Presidents generally do not. Clinton has an extraordinary intellect, grasp of the issues and political acumen, but he does not have the political muscle. President Obama has to handle this one.

Speaking for me only

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    The person who could really help (5.00 / 1) (#2)
    by andgarden on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:02:41 PM EST
    is serving in another capacity.

    But I think the President has plenty of potency left to get this done.

    The current President? (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:04:47 PM EST
    I agree.

    Parent
    BTW, screwy capitalization in your title (5.00 / 1) (#8)
    by andgarden on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:08:14 PM EST
    Thanks (none / 0) (#19)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:15:04 PM EST
    Yes, the current President (none / 0) (#6)
    by andgarden on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:07:40 PM EST
    The other person I'm referring to is a different Clinton.

    Parent
    Really? (none / 0) (#11)
    by squeaky on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:09:02 PM EST
    What leverage does she have over anyone whose vote we need?

    Parent
    Public pressure (none / 0) (#13)
    by andgarden on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:10:15 PM EST
    can be leveraged into Congressional votes.

    Parent
    I Dunno (none / 0) (#17)
    by squeaky on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:12:53 PM EST
    For one she is quite busy, and two, not sure that she would be an asset here.

    Parent
    Read my original comment (none / 0) (#18)
    by andgarden on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:13:50 PM EST
    She is otherwise occupied.

    Parent
    Read It (none / 0) (#21)
    by squeaky on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:24:20 PM EST
    Also I do not think she would be an asset here, anyway. Unless your comment was more of a nostalgic reflection lamenting that if she were president..

    Parent
    Even if she were HHS Secretary (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by andgarden on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:28:49 PM EST
    But now she's in no position to influence the debate.

    Parent
    She was smart to get out while she could (5.00 / 0) (#65)
    by lambert on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:55:09 PM EST
    I think she saw the disaster coming and wanted no part of it.

    Parent
    Uh, she is IN THE ADMINISTRATION (5.00 / 1) (#74)
    by andgarden on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:03:52 PM EST
    Jeez, talk about bending the facts, Lambert.

    Parent
    She's out of the debate (none / 0) (#79)
    by nycstray on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:18:37 PM EST
    in the senate and the debate in this admin.

    Parent
    On healthcare, yes (none / 0) (#80)
    by andgarden on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:22:17 PM EST
    But that hardly means she ran away. Indeed, she was complementary toward the effort this week.

    Parent
    Of course she's complementary! (none / 0) (#82)
    by nycstray on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:28:24 PM EST
    Same as she was about issues in her husband's admin that she may or may not have agreed with. I have to wonder what we would hear if she were still in the Sen . . .  

    Parent
    I don't do mind reading (5.00 / 1) (#84)
    by andgarden on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:30:08 PM EST
    Was she complementary (none / 0) (#88)
    by Steve M on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:39:02 PM EST
    or merely complimentary?

    Parent
    GRRRRRRRR :D (5.00 / 1) (#93)
    by andgarden on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:42:18 PM EST
    Both In a Way (none / 0) (#94)
    by squeaky on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:43:51 PM EST
    Exactly (none / 0) (#102)
    by lambertstrether on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 10:05:20 PM EST
    And travelling a lot.

    Parent
    Exactly (none / 0) (#103)
    by lambertstrether on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 10:05:25 PM EST
    And travelling a lot.

    Parent
    The context is domestic policy (none / 0) (#123)
    by lambert on Sat Aug 01, 2009 at 07:16:57 PM EST
    She's "out" of that, as well as "out" of the country, and "out" of the sausage-making.

    Talk about going off about nothing!

    Parent

    Good one. (none / 0) (#24)
    by oculus on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:27:47 PM EST
    I was thinking (none / 0) (#12)
    by CST on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:10:12 PM EST
    Ted Kennedy.

    I really wish he was healthy right now and in D.C.

    Parent

    I think he could help behind the scenes (none / 0) (#16)
    by andgarden on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:11:06 PM EST
    I'm thinking Ted Kennedy being rolled (5.00 / 1) (#46)
    by oculus on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:24:59 PM EST
    into the Senate on a hospital bed throwing down the gaunlet for a good health care bill.

    Parent
    Kennedy? (none / 0) (#110)
    by suzieg on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 01:32:14 AM EST
    I hope not because he's pushing for Romneycare!

    Parent
    Please don't call it that (none / 0) (#114)
    by CST on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 08:43:11 AM EST
    Mitt Romney did all he could to water down and kill healthcare legislation in MA.  It was passed in spite of him not because of him.  And then he skipped town before he had to figure out how to actually run it.

    Parent
    The Sec of State is supposed to stay above fray (none / 0) (#120)
    by jawbone on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 12:12:36 PM EST
    on domestic politics. Condi did some things during the second BushBoy campaign which were considered beyond the pale in terms of getting involved in going after Kerry and Dems.

    Parent
    Don't you think (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by Steve M on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:02:57 PM EST
    Clinton could play an important role in selling the plan (whatever the heck the plan is) to the public?  There's still no one who can make wonky details as accessible as the Big Dog.

    In terms of dealing with Congress I completely agree with you.  Heck, he didn't have much clout with Congress when he was actually President.  Maybe he could sway some wavering moderate by promising to do a fundraiser or campaign appearance for him, but that's about it.

    No (5.00 / 2) (#4)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:04:23 PM EST
    I do not think he can help.

    President Obama has to do the selling.

    Parent

    Well (5.00 / 1) (#14)
    by Steve M on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:10:50 PM EST
    I wasn't suggesting that Obama could head off to Crawford for 5 weeks.  But I don't see why this couldn't be an all-hands-on-deck effort.

    Parent
    he may (5.00 / 2) (#15)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:10:55 PM EST
    know how to talk to blue dogs in ways that could be helpful.
    I agree with tina.

    Parent
    I read somewhere that some of the (5.00 / 2) (#36)
    by magster on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:49:17 PM EST
    current Blue Dogs were recruited by Clinton, so there may be a personal loyalty card to be played.  Even swaying one or two votes could make all the difference.  Wouldn't hurt to have Clinton make some calls, IMO.

    Parent
    So far, he's blown that (none / 0) (#106)
    by BrassTacks on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 10:47:54 PM EST
    Obama just has not been good at explaining this program in a way that sells it to people.  I don't have advice to give him, but what he's been doing hasn't worked.  I fear it may be too late for him to pull it out of the weeds.  

    Parent
    Why would Bill Clinton even want to get involved (none / 0) (#122)
    by MsExPat on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 11:07:34 PM EST
    in this battle at this point?

    Politically, there's nothing in it for him.

    And as far as Obama is concerned, this is a "you broke it you own it" situation.

    Parent

    That's assuming Big Dog even likes this plan (5.00 / 1) (#100)
    by ruffian on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 09:37:22 PM EST
    He has talked enough to the public about the need for health care reform - heck, he won that battle. The vast majority of the people agree with him on that. That is the reason having Obama go do town halls about the need for health care reform is redundant.

     I doubt a Big Dog plan would look much like the Baucus Plan. What is he supposed to sell?

    Parent

    Insurance (5.00 / 3) (#105)
    by MO Blue on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 10:46:57 PM EST
    Is arm-twisting Congress on the (5.00 / 2) (#9)
    by oculus on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:08:37 PM EST
    list of approved activities for former Pres. Clinton?  Doubt it.

    I hope Big Tent and andgarden are right (5.00 / 1) (#10)
    by kmblue on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:08:45 PM EST
    but I am losing hope.

    Bill Clinton has no political bite (5.00 / 5) (#20)
    by Cream City on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:22:29 PM EST
    anymore in part because Obama made him toothless.  A rush job on dentures isn't going to do it -- unless maybe Obama can get Gates and Sharpton and  Jim Clyburn and Jesse Jackson, Jr., and Eugene Robinson and good ol' Donna, too, to say that Bill Clinton was not and is not a racist?

    Not gonna happen.  

    Seems to me (5.00 / 9) (#25)
    by Steve M on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:28:17 PM EST
    there is not a lot of overlap between the set of people who believe Bill Clinton is a racist and the set of people who need to be persuaded on health care.

    Parent
    excellent point (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:31:14 PM EST
    like I said.  he speaks blue dog.

    Parent
    Fricken stinging commonality you noticed (none / 0) (#35)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:41:43 PM EST
    of those who choose to entertain themselves by dabbling in a bit of fantasy.

    Parent
    Please clarify. (none / 0) (#43)
    by oculus on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:18:19 PM EST
    You don't notice the overlap (none / 0) (#47)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:25:25 PM EST
    between the Democrat pundits and bloggers who swore that Bill was a racist and those who had be persuaded to fight for healthcare?  It seems starkly obvious to me.  Well, other than BTD but he never said we didn't need to fight for healthcare, he said he didn't believe himself well versed in the subject.

    Parent
    Got it now. I thought you were (5.00 / 1) (#52)
    by oculus on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:28:42 PM EST
    referring to people in Congress and/or Obama campaign.

    Parent
    Well some of them are part of those (none / 0) (#71)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:03:05 PM EST
    structures as well.  In the online grassroots of the party though and media punditry (like Matthews)....if you were obsessing on Bill Clinton's racism you weren't getting this healthcare problem at all until it was literally shoved down your throat.  And they are reluctant fighters if they have become convinced to fight at all.  How is TPM doing on the healthcare issue?  I don't go there anymore.

    Parent
    The phrase you're looking for ... (5.00 / 3) (#62)
    by lambert on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:50:52 PM EST
    ... is "creative class." Remember that one?

    Parent
    Perhaps, but I'm very creative (none / 0) (#67)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:59:36 PM EST
    and I remember reading about your home renovations and you're pretty creative too.  Perhaps their creativity differs because it can't be extrapolated into anything tangible in the physical world....  I'm not sure what you would call this schism in the party and pundits, but it's there.

    Parent
    I disagree (5.00 / 6) (#32)
    by The Last Whimzy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:36:31 PM EST
    people know why Bill was called a racist during the primary and they know they lied because the ends (getting Obama to be president) justified the means which means if Bill spoke out no one would say "don't listen to him, he's a racist."

    But they would say "why is Bill trying to upstage our hero, Obama?" and it would be a monumental distraction.


    Parent

    pathetic (5.00 / 1) (#33)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:38:28 PM EST
    isnt it

    Parent
    Until things get better for Americans (none / 0) (#38)
    by The Last Whimzy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:02:28 PM EST
    And that's going to take another 3 years minimum, people are going to have an inferiority complex when comparing Bill Clinton to Barack Obama.

    The only suggestion I can make is for such a comparison to be considered verboten until Obama be given a real chance to be every bit as successful.

    And he has not been given that chance yet.


    Parent

    Well (5.00 / 1) (#44)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:20:19 PM EST
    then if it's going to take at least three years then Obama is going to be relegated to Carter status and put in the basement never to be seen again because three years is too long. His entire term will have been a disaster with continuing poor economic conditions in the country.


    Parent
    I hope things get better sooner (none / 0) (#53)
    by The Last Whimzy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:31:29 PM EST
    But i'm pretty sure that when it comes to the economy a president has to work his butt off for a long time before ....  well.... hmmm.  how long was FDR president before lives started improving for Americans??   is there anything to be learned there?

    I'll say this.  People want it now. And they are that desparate.

    i just can't imagine the worst here.  it's too depressing.  Obama has to be, almost for the survival of the planet, considered a good president.  regardless of his performance, because the alternative is just that bad and we're on the brink, etc. etc.


    Parent

    I don't (none / 0) (#58)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:42:04 PM EST
    think Obama realizes that.

    Parent
    Lives better (5.00 / 2) (#116)
    by cal1942 on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 12:03:08 PM EST
    how long was FDR president before lives started improving for Americans??   is there anything to be learned there?

    RE FDR:  See first 90 days.  In that period the Roosevelt administration established a host of agencies and programs that brought immediate relief to the American people. The economy improved steadily for the next four years.  In his first months in office FDR overhauled the entire finance industry, in his second year in office got Social Security passed.  In his first months the NIRA was established but when the Supreme Court knocked it down Roosevelt responded with the WPA, the biggest public works program in world history.

    Roosevelt acted swiftly to do what was necessary and there was no time wasted talking about bi-partisanship.  In his first few months in office FDR passed legislation that gave relief and was to have a dramatic impact on the future of the nation.

    Obama utterly failed to do what should have been done regarding the finance industry and in fact fought to maintauin the status quo.  His timid approach to health care reform and maintenance of the status quo in the finance industry are monumental failures.  His is the first Democratic administration since Wilson without a full employment policy goal.  

    The differences at this stage (6 months) are stark.

    Parent

    Actually, you're agreeing (5.00 / 7) (#68)
    by Cream City on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:01:19 PM EST
    because you're saying that those who know why Bill Clinton was called a racist know it was a lie.  And that makes Obama the liar.  And that makes it just about useless to expect Obama to accomplish this on both counts.  You broke it, you bought it, Amurrica.

    Parent
    If someone is willing to fight a tough (5.00 / 1) (#75)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:05:40 PM EST
    fight by using such blatant lies in hopes of winning.....well, how clear is the conscience weilding that integrity and how visceral is that energy?

    Parent
    Yeah (none / 0) (#86)
    by The Last Whimzy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:35:41 PM EST
    i just think a person can lie and everyone can know why they lied and because agrees with those reasons, it doesn't impact the liar's credibility or ability to do things in the future.


    Parent
    It does with me (none / 0) (#115)
    by sj on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 10:40:56 AM EST
    Lies always impact the liar's credibility.  And I think it does to most people who know they have been lied to.

    Parent
    Though Hertzberg bought the Obama Koolaid... (5.00 / 3) (#49)
    by sallywally on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:26:51 PM EST
    don't know if he ever elegantly smeared Clintons (both) but he was head over heels for Obama ... dunno if he's doing an about face or not; just that I couldn't read his columns during the primary.

    Parent
    Oh, yes, he smeared both Clintons (5.00 / 6) (#72)
    by Cream City on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:03:07 PM EST
    and I've never looked at my beloved New Yorker magazine quite the same.  

    Parent
    I cancelled my longtime sunscription (5.00 / 3) (#81)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:23:15 PM EST
    to the New Yorker because of the writing of Hertzberg during the primary. Also, cancelled the Atlantic until such time as Andrew Sullivan is relegated to the archives.

    Parent
    Which Gates? (none / 0) (#23)
    by oculus on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:26:28 PM EST
    Unfortunately (5.00 / 5) (#29)
    by The Last Whimzy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:33:58 PM EST
    While in a sane world this would make sense, the simple fact is Bill Clinton involved would devolve into 20 news cycles of Bill trying to upstage Obama hysterical BS.

    Smart idea if the world wasn't populated by morons.


    I wrote it once before (5.00 / 2) (#30)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:35:13 PM EST
    but when the shoe fits......Obama is a cowardly lion.

    More telling - to me, anyway - (5.00 / 16) (#31)
    by Anne on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:35:38 PM EST
    is the casting about looking for someone, anyone, who can help push a reform effort through because it says there is declining confidence that Obama has what it takes to do it himself.  He's making the speeches, giving the pressers, doing the townhalls and it's falling flat.

    Part of that is because - again, in my opinion - he never really had a plan; he had talking points and bumper stickers, but no plan.  You can't educate people, and garner popular support for something, that isn't defined, and it gets worse when this group in the House is going in one direction, a group in the Senate is going in another, and from day to day no one knows whether there is a public option or isn't one, and if there is, who it will cover.

    Yes, we all get that the legislative process is one that hardly ever takes a straight path from point A to point B, but had Obama corralled the Dems from the beginning and had them all pushing for the same elements, I suspect the whole process would have been less fragmented.  And, more importantly, the product would have been much, much better than what we are seeing.

    I think Obama, to be an effective leader, has to be able to stand for something, to project not just where he wants to go, but that he knows how to get there, and I don't think people are seeing that in him.  If anything, people may be seeing him as being led this way and that by Congress, by the special interests, to the point where people just don't know if he's got it.

    For sure, if Obama was being effective, you would not be hearing people speculate about who can save this reform effort.  That being said, I don't want this particular effort to be saved, because I think it is spectacularly bad.

    How activists failed (5.00 / 5) (#41)
    by MO Blue on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:14:37 PM EST
    Activists must recognize the surest way to get a strong public option that could compete with the Cadillac of health plans. We needed to mobilize millions of Netroots people, almost every union and 150 members of Congress to endorse a maximum demand: National health insurance . . . enhanced Medicare for All. In other words, a cost-effective single-payer system of publicly-financed, privately-delivered healthcare that ends private health insurance (and its waste, bureaucracy, ads, sales commissions, lavish executive salaries, profiteering).

    Had liberal groups sent out millions of emails building a movement that posed an existential threat to the health insurance industry, Sen. Baucus and Blue Dog Democrats and their corporate healthcare patrons might well be on their knees begging for a comprehensive public option -- to avert the threat of full-blown Medicare for All.  Cohen - Huffington Post h/t Corrente

    I strongly agree with Cohen's approach.

    Parent

    But the net roots won't do this ... (5.00 / 4) (#56)
    by Robot Porter on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:39:14 PM EST
    the only line in the sand they will draw is on the term "public option."

    Oh, sometimes they'll use the phrase "strong public option" or "robust public option."

    But they won't define it.

    It seems any proposal that may, potentially, at some time in the future be open to more than one person is a "public option."

    Parent

    The net roots are pursuing a failed policy IMO (5.00 / 7) (#63)
    by MO Blue on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:51:01 PM EST
    They criticize the Dem leadership for not knowing how to negotiate or how to sell their ideas yet they employ the same timid tactics.

    If you say you will settle for crumbs, don't be surprised if you end up with an empty plate.

    Parent

    Amen (5.00 / 1) (#97)
    by BackFromOhio on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:57:30 PM EST
    Pelosi rips insurance companies (5.00 / 1) (#34)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:40:13 PM EST
    At her press conference today Nancy Pelosi tore into the health insurance companies and accused them of being "villians" in the fight for health care reform. No mincing words or PPUS from the Speaker today

    A little late for populist rhetoric, yes? (5.00 / 4) (#61)
    by lambert on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:49:12 PM EST
    And with a "health insurance reform" bill that guarantees the insurance companies a market, it's hard to see how the rhetoric is anything more than that.

    Parent
    I agree, lambert (none / 0) (#91)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:41:11 PM EST
    It is too little, too late, and smacks of posturing. If the Speaker really means what she says, let's see her put some leadership muscle into this fight.

    Parent
    She already put her leadership muscle (none / 0) (#96)
    by MO Blue on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:47:28 PM EST
    behind Waxman and the Blue Dogs. What else is new.

    Parent
    Yeh. And she's for apple pie (5.00 / 6) (#73)
    by Cream City on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:03:49 PM EST
    and motherhood, too.  When it's safe to be so.

    Parent
    The other shoe did drop (none / 0) (#124)
    by lambert on Sat Aug 01, 2009 at 07:18:28 PM EST
    On getting Medicare for All an up or down vote -- symbolic or not, it's an opportunity for action in the recess.

    Parent
    The blue dogs ... (5.00 / 11) (#37)
    by Robot Porter on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:53:23 PM EST
    are a false problem.

    If the bill was better it would have stronger public support, and the blue dogs would whimper and fall in line.

    Blaming the blue dogs is just a method of weakening the bill.  They are the scapegoat for creating a bill (or no bill) that the insurance industry likes.

    Absolutely (5.00 / 2) (#40)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:14:18 PM EST
    A lot of people simply do not understand the blue dogs. The blue dogs respond to leadership and when left to their own devices they will go 50 different ways.

    Parent
    +1000 (5.00 / 7) (#64)
    by lambert on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:52:51 PM EST
    "The Blue Dogs are a scapegoat for creating a bill that the insurance companies like."

    Parent
    "creating a bill (or no bill) that the insurance industry likes", which is what the POTUS ordered up.

    Obama was shrewd to out-source the dirty work to Congress...sooo when it becomes a hot mess, he won't have any of that gnarly meat by-product on his hands. Clearly, with few exceptions, they're all working toward the same end-product, on behalf of the same private interests.

    The so-called "debate" is partly about creating an illusion of diverse viewpoints (much like you'd see in one of those functioning democracies). And the fear-mongering is a domestic campaign of shock and awe, designed to quash the option that had 72% public support, as of June 20th, namely:

    a government-administered insurance plan -- something like Medicare for those under 65 -- that would compete for customers with private insurers.


    Parent
    Bingo. He will get to do hand-wringing (5.00 / 6) (#107)
    by Cream City on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 10:58:02 PM EST
    at whatever the public doesn't like about it, and he will get to take credit for whatever just might -- repeat, might -- ameliorate the awful mess that is health care coverage now.

    And that is what really grates for me about Obama not even making a head fake at having a plan.  It is political cynicism at its worst -- the opposite of "hope" and "change."  I am not surprised, but I did hope for better than this from him, if only because I hoped that he would listen to those wiser than him on health care coverage and on the economy, as they are so interlinked.  Instead, it looks like he is continuing to campaign rather than govern.

    So now I have to wonder if the poor steps taken on the economy are political cynicism as well.

    Parent

    They're also cover for Obama's true intentions -- (none / 0) (#117)
    by jawbone on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 12:04:02 PM EST
    which are to ensure the protection and profitability of the Big Insurance Parasites (BIP) and other Big Health Industry Players (BHIP).

    Obama can always say he was forced into accepting this plan; he wanted better but...oh...so hard to work with Congress...doncha know? Congressional Dems are being set up to bear the brunt of the public's anger and disappointment. (Wonder if he'll get away with that.)

    Obama never mentioned the public plan in the prepared (meaning thoroughly vetted) opening remarks for his 7/22 primetime press conference. He mentioned "health insurance reform" in the very first sentence, and then again 4 more times in brief opening sentences.

    He finally mentioned the public plan when he was asked directly about it -- by the second to  last questioner.

    He's got the plan essentially where he has always wanted it: a boon to business. I believe he's accepted universal mandates because the BIPs see the advantage to having people forced to buy their junk insurance.

    Health CARE? He's just not that into that for the little people, the unterbussen.

    Parent

    The phrase *unfunded mandates* will be a rallying (none / 0) (#118)
    by jawbone on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 12:05:46 PM EST
    cry against the Dems in the 2010 election, I predict.

    Unfunded Mandates -- not just for states any more!

    Parent

    Am I (5.00 / 10) (#39)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:07:15 PM EST
    the only one who's getting the impression that Obama is largely afraid of this issue? It seems that whatever comes out of congress via Pres. Baucus he will sign onto. He's not really showing any leadership on this issue nor does he really seem to want to.

    I agree that Obama has to handle this but will he? Not seeing it so far.

    I don't think he was ever that into getting health (5.00 / 1) (#119)
    by jawbone on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 12:10:21 PM EST
    CARE reform -- it was forced on him by Hillary and Edwards.  He needs to get it out of the way, way off the table. The better to get to the St. Ronnie unfinished agenda? Who knows?

    He seems far more comfortable talking about digital record keeping and insurance reform.

    Also, I don't think "leading" is his MO. He seems to prefer letting two opposing sides establish parameters, then he can "reconcile" things by finding what he perceives to be the exact middle.

    However, he did show some actual intensity about how his friend "Skip" Gates was treated. So there may be areas where he is willing to show some passion....

    Parent

    Well, he's a racist anyhow (5.00 / 4) (#60)
    by lambert on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:47:37 PM EST
    Who would want him?

    Only three paragraphs and the CDS kicks in! (5.00 / 1) (#70)
    by lambert on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:02:46 PM EST
    BTD quotes the lead, but Hertzberd just can't help himself. I thought the MoDo quote especially fine..

    Blue-collar working Dems (5.00 / 3) (#76)
    by Cream City on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:06:09 PM EST
    already have made it quite clear what they want, and Obama and Congressional Dems don't want to give it to them.  So the latter are hardly going to want Bill Clinton to go out and rile up the populace to make that point inescapably evident.  The hope is that, with media turnover and short memories, the blatherers will report in 2011 or so that Obama gave them the change they hoped for, and that something will have intervened to make the blue-collar working Dems want to believe it.

    Obama cannot allow Bill Clinton to (5.00 / 6) (#95)
    by Anne on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:46:55 PM EST
    take a leadership position on this, or even a behind-the-scenes role, because Clinton might succeed at doing something that was supposed to be Obama's strength - bringing people together.  And on an issue that was - and probably still is - his wife's passion?  Oh, there is all kinds of danger there.

    If Obama had an actual plan in mind, if he weren't still keeping himself open to a hodgepodge of ideas that form no cohesive shape, then he might be able to send out the troops to get this thing done - but it won't do any good to whip something that isn't anything yet.  "Health (Insurance) Reform" is the new "Hope and Change."

    This has been badly managed, and the patchwork of plans coming out of the Congress reflects that.

    I caught Obama (5.00 / 5) (#111)
    by NYShooter on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 02:22:34 AM EST
    doing a Town Hall the other day, and I was aghast. He was just simply awful. Without a teleprompter, he stumbled, fumbled, and gave the most convoluted, unintelligible answers to questions from the audience one could imagine. If the purpose was to explain his plan, and answer doubts, I can't imagine a more pitiful performance. His attempts to simplify the salient points came out as talking down to the audience, and the "clinging to ...," Inner Obama, came flashing back.

    So, to BTD's point that it's Obama who has to sell it, forget about it. He can't do it, his heart isn't in it, he doesn't understand it, and it all came shining through for all to see. So, if the choice is, Obama selling the plan, or a lousy, worse-than-before plan, we are doomed.
    I don't know if Bill Clinton, at this late stage, can pull it off, but I do know Obama can't.

    The Town Hall venue worked for Obama during the primaries because then he wasn't selling difficult issues requiring firmness, assertiveness, and command; He was Willy Wonka, taking a sunrise, mixing it with love, and making the world taste good. Bill Clinton was born in a Town Hall, with a microphone in his hand.

    Throughout it all, I called out Obama, in every forum I could, that he was pulling off the greatest con-job in the history of the world. Bill Clinton was nicer; he said that voting for Obama was a "roll of the dice." That was enough for Obama/Axlerod; they unleashed the dogs, and committed the unforgiveable, blood-libel that they'll go to He*L with.

    So we closed our eyes, plugged our ears, suspended our ability to think, and went off with "Willy, the Con Man," who exposed the evil "racists."

    We wanted him, we voted for him; now we'll live with him.

    Damn!


    Parent

    "His heart isn't in it." (5.00 / 1) (#112)
    by Fabian on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 04:32:23 AM EST
    I agree.  If we could make health care "all about Obama", then the Obama would be there, on fire, ready to do what it takes.

    Obama is who he ever was.  Does Obama mention health care in his books?

    Parent

    Wow. How quickly we forget. (5.00 / 3) (#104)
    by oldpro on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 10:39:50 PM EST
    I thought it was all a done deal with Daschle the healthcare czar and Teddy...

    ...oh....right...probably shouldn't have counted on those two this year either, even if they personally made Obama 'their guy,' what with passing torches and all.

    A former Southern senator or (none / 0) (#1)
    by Joelarama on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:02:19 PM EST
    Southern elder statesman like Sam Nunn would be better, if he were willing.

    (I shudder to call Nunn a "statesman" after his role in DADT.)

    Sam Nunn (none / 0) (#42)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:15:15 PM EST
    would be no help and I can't think of anyone from the south that would.

    Parent
    Some Major Arm Twisting is Necessary (none / 0) (#7)
    by squeaky on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 05:07:47 PM EST
    Obama has to threaten, no dessert, no teevee privileges, lights out early, etc. iow, he has to start holding a big stick over the blue dogs, and any GOPers that may need something from him.


    Can't even offer a beer at the WH (5.00 / 1) (#101)
    by ruffian on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 09:41:43 PM EST
    after making it look about as much fun as a trip to the dentist.

    Parent
    Would Pres. Clinton lend his (none / 0) (#50)
    by oculus on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:27:09 PM EST
    energy if he didn't think the legislation in question was the best possible?

    Probably. BC is a pragmatist. (5.00 / 1) (#54)
    by Steve M on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:32:10 PM EST
    Agree, but I could see a situation where (none / 0) (#55)
    by oculus on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:34:41 PM EST
    B. Clinton sees a means to get a better bill than Obama has already given approval to.

    Parent
    Well (none / 0) (#57)
    by Steve M on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:40:12 PM EST
    I hope he won't hide his cheeseburger under a bushel, because we need all the help we can get!

    Parent
    Certain bloggers could request his help. (none / 0) (#59)
    by oculus on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:42:14 PM EST
    Do you mean (5.00 / 3) (#90)
    by Steve M on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:40:50 PM EST
    bloggers who have had the privilege of meeting with him, but then hid their meeting notes under a bushel?

    Parent
    Making me ticked off all over again. (5.00 / 3) (#108)
    by oculus on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 11:14:35 PM EST
    Or perhaps he'll just continue (none / 0) (#77)
    by nycstray on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:15:33 PM EST
    making progress in people's lives on his own.

    Hillary very clearly stated she was "out of politics" when asked about health care. Wouldn't it be a bit dicey to have her husband out there politicing on health care?

    Parent

    Nah (none / 0) (#92)
    by Steve M on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 07:41:26 PM EST
    Two separate people, right?

    Parent
    He is on a short WH-held leash. (5.00 / 1) (#109)
    by oculus on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 11:15:17 PM EST
    And many others as well. n/t. (none / 0) (#51)
    by sallywally on Thu Jul 30, 2009 at 06:28:06 PM EST


    Why would Bill Clinton want to associate himself (none / 0) (#121)
    by jawbone on Fri Jul 31, 2009 at 12:15:18 PM EST
    with this HMO with mandates approach? Romney's MA plan, essentially? Seriously, why?

    He believes in, iirc, getting as close as possible to single payer.