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Friday Open Thread

In the John Edwards saga, will Andrew Young go to jail today? What happened to the Enquirer's prediction of an imminent indictment of John Edwards? It's been a week since its announcement. Has the grand jury not met, was the tabloid wrong, or will there be news today? (Doesn't the grand jury meet on Thursdays once or twice a month?)

I'm off to work, here's an open thread, all topics welcome.

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    Early bird got his worm! (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:32:58 AM EST
    Glad I filed my state taxes the day I got my W2's...got my state check yesterday, while NY considers holding onto other people's money.  Link

    I find this pretty outrageous...people count on this money...and it is their money.

    Good timing for Mexico trip, eh? (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:34:18 AM EST
    You know it kid.... (none / 0) (#9)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:43:58 AM EST
    I was weating out the rumors hardcore.

    The only way I am able maintain a small knot of apocolypse money is by fooling myself into thinking I don't have said knot and never ever touching cashish once its placed in the knot.

    If this check didn't come I'd have to have touched the knot for the first time for the big trip...and knowing me and my total lack of respect for money, the knot would be gone soon after that.

    Parent

    I cadged the free wine and appetizers (5.00 / 1) (#35)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:17:34 PM EST
    at an event last night.  Invited.  But, the bottom line is minimum donation to this newly-formed arts org. is $25,000.  Who put my name on the invite list? The other attendees are legendary for their arts philantropy here.  God (small g) bless them all.

    Parent
    I can't say I ever heard... (none / 0) (#48)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:42:56 PM EST
    of a minimum donation before, I've heard of suggested minimum donation.

    Donation would imply you'll take what you can get...weird.

    Parent

    Arts presenting org is trying to (none / 0) (#49)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:45:51 PM EST
    set up a subsidiary focusing on presenting dance  Expensive.  I'm sure they will accept any amount, but that wasn't the purpose of this gathering apparently.  Not a hard sell--yet.

    Parent
    Really? (none / 0) (#66)
    by squeaky on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:19:04 PM EST
    $500 plate dinners? It is a typical fundraiser ploy, food drink, and hang with celebrities if you pay the admission price...

    For many it is a duty to attend (and pay up).

    The lower end would be a $25 benefit concert.

    Parent

    I heard of those... (none / 0) (#71)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:30:09 PM EST
    types of deals, but this was a free invitation-only event where they asked for a min. donation of 25k if I'm understanding oculus correctly...that's a new one for me.

    Parent
    NoT exactly. Invitation was to (none / 0) (#87)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:51:47 PM EST
    "Inaugural Dance Society Reception."  Accompanying letter sd. purpose was to discuss landscape of dance.  All this was w/o charge.  Glossy folder available on departure contained the details of belonging to this society.

    Parent
    Fine Print (none / 0) (#108)
    by squeaky on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:05:35 PM EST
    I get a lot of these "invitations" We request the presence of your company for a private reception honoring bla bla bla...

    It goes on and on, making me feel sooooo special, and then the fine print:

    $1,000 tax deductible donation if received before x/y/z or $1,500 at the door.  

    Parent

    No fine print on invite or cover letter. (none / 0) (#112)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:10:59 PM EST
    Fine Print (none / 0) (#121)
    by squeaky on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:35:09 PM EST
    "Fine Print" has been so ubiquitous for so long that Is a metaphor at this point. Not to say that many luxury events are free for a select crowd... after a few glasses or nice wine, whiskey or champagne, tasty appetizers and well placed flattery,  the checkbook grows wings for many. Otherwise these events would not exist.

    I have seen top art galleries throw an impromptu "lunch" for super rich collectors and their family and or entourage, dropping 20K and the collector will buy a piece for 80K that he would normally pass on, but out of guilt, deference, or wanting to keep in good graces, pulls out the checkbook.

    Of course for these fat cats 80K is pocket change.  

    Parent

    The head of this new dance thingee (none / 0) (#146)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:25:54 PM EST
    announced he his his wife, who was not present, would be "in."  Didn't say how much.  Nobody else mentioned making a commitment last night and there wasn't any pressure to do so--but glossy brochures were on table available on the way out.  I expect to hear more!

    Parent
    Patronage (5.00 / 1) (#162)
    by squeaky on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:45:24 PM EST
    Some arts need patronage more than others. Dance is certainly one of them. Usually the more contemporary the practice, the harder it is to survive especially in the performing arts.

    Tax deductions helps support a tithing mentality for the arts, among the rich.

    Parent

    Last night's point man sd. to bring in an (none / 0) (#164)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:51:14 PM EST
    out-of-town dance company costs of rent, stage hands, electricians, et al. starts at $25,000.  We all know the dancers make a pittance.

    Parent
    At Least 25K (none / 0) (#168)
    by squeaky on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:06:20 PM EST
    Minneapolis and Minnesota in general supports the performing arts big time because many are from Northern European stock where it is traditional to tithe for the arts, or live in a cultural desert.

    Different ideas about quality of life here and in europe. Art is a biggie over there, although it is becoming more like the US, while race cars, boats, and conspicuous spending are more cherished here for quality of life.

    Bottom line though, if you want performing arts in your community the money has to come from somewhere.

    Parent

    Europe has a tradition of public money (none / 0) (#176)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:47:40 PM EST
    in support of the arts.  We surely do not.

    Parent
    And (none / 0) (#182)
    by squeaky on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 06:10:51 PM EST
    CA has the lowest per capita State spending on the arts. Why see art when you can go and see the terminator et al..?

    No surprise that Minnesota has highest per capita spending on the arts. MN spends $5.79 per capita, compared to CA $.12 per capita..

    Parent

    Case In Point (none / 0) (#174)
    by squeaky on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:37:35 PM EST
    Morton Feldman, as American as apple pie, but 98% of concerts of his music take place in Europe. We do not have the thirst for art it in our blood here. In general the arts are enjoyed by a rarefied group in the US, often associated with the intellectual elite and upper class, while in Europe arts are enjoyed across class lines. It is partly due to the schooling and long tradition in Europe, I assume.

    Granted listening to a six hour string quartet requires a certain amount of faith and devotion even if it is free. I am going..

     

    Parent

    I went to San Francisco Opera's (5.00 / 1) (#179)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:56:04 PM EST
    performance of "Saint François d'Assise" by Olivier Messiaen.  Six hours with intermissions, as I recall.  Could not recruit a single soul to join me. A highlight.

     

    Parent

    Wow (5.00 / 1) (#183)
    by squeaky on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 06:18:22 PM EST
    That must have been great... I have heard live the Vingt regards sur l'enfant-Jésus, and Quatuor pour la fin du temps several times, most notably, and have heard several other pieces as well.

    One day I will tackle Vingt regards sur l'enfant-Jésus, maybe when I finally finish learning all the goldberg variations.

    Parent

    Messiaen was a very nice man (5.00 / 2) (#192)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:39:03 PM EST
    I sang several of his pieces where he was involved in rehearsals, and he was one of those composers who was just thrilled to bits to have his music performed and fascinated by an interpretation that wasn't quite what he'd had in mind.  Lovely man, but he was perfectly useless to have around for guidance because he loved everything you did.

    He was a tiny little live wire of a guy, accompanied by his enormous, charming, bolster pillow of a wife and her equally enormous sister, and we used to think, um, interesting thoughts about their apparent menage a trois.

    I love his music and hope to see/hear St. Francis some day.

    Parent

    Would have liked to (5.00 / 2) (#197)
    by oculus on Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 12:36:16 AM EST
    have studied with him or at least met
    him. Wonderful, highly inventive compositions for organ

    Parent
    Nice (none / 0) (#198)
    by squeaky on Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 01:02:17 AM EST
    Looking at promo again re new (none / 0) (#200)
    by oculus on Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 01:07:58 PM EST
    cance thingee.  Lowest buy in is $2500 per yr. with a three yr. commitment.

    Parent
    They are all just busted broke (5.00 / 3) (#5)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:37:36 AM EST
    Alabama had to refund a bunch of people last year because they were over taxing and they got caught, and they decided to use to education funds for classroom supplies to get that done.  This year, parents are buying the classroom supplies and the fundraiser where Joshua decided to run laps even though mom said no :)  That was what they were raising funds for.  And that little stinker ran 20 laps, on feet that some doctors think he shouldn't have to put up with.  He is an amazing kid.  I'll never be as good a person as he already is.  I can be tenacious though, so can his father, but he took that and wedded it to his heart and turned it into a virtue.

    Parent
    That's our little hero... (5.00 / 3) (#10)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:46:12 AM EST
    20 laps...that's awesome.

    And awesome of you to let him try...I'd imagine it was hard for you not to overrule.  

    Parent

    I'm gonna use... (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:54:26 AM EST
    that Joshua nugget as motivation in me and the fellas big championship game Sunday.  If he can do 20 laps, I can blanket cover the opposition's best receiver all day long!

    Parent
    Are you going to be playing (none / 0) (#20)
    by nycstray on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:59:13 AM EST
    in the Mud Bowl? One of the things that got me hooked on football back in the day were the mud games :)

    Parent
    This season... (none / 0) (#24)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:08:05 PM EST
    was our first on artificial turf...our league lost the permits for the grass (or more accurate, dirt and rock:) fields because we tear them up pretty good and they would freeze with footprint craters aka ankle-traps...and the city has no money to properly maintain them.

    I like the turf alot, more than I thought I would...probably took half a sec off my 40 yard dash...but its very slippery when wet.  And rough on the knees....but overall an improvement.  Though nothing beats a well-maintained natural grass field in my book.

    So it will be the Slip-N-Slide Bowl...no more Mud Bowls.  For awhile there it was Slogging in Ankle Deep Snow Bowls...talk about sore!

    Parent

    I can't imagine playing a full game (none / 0) (#30)
    by nycstray on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:13:32 PM EST
    in the snow. I get worn out trying to keep up with my snow crazy dog!

    Parent
    Of course... (none / 0) (#56)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:53:14 PM EST
    those few weeks we were short-handed with the less committed than I coming down with suspect nagging injuries...we were playing ironman.

    Me...I need to be in traction to miss a game...I need help:)

    Parent

    I went to the event to console (5.00 / 2) (#23)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:04:56 PM EST
    him because he was going to have to sit on the side lines and shake a shaker can.....NOT!  I couldn't find him.  There were two tracks and his school teaches over 600 kids.  The gun went off, by the time I found out where he was he in the middle of a running pack.  He was letting me know what he thought of my NO :)  So I watched, after 10 he was getting pretty tired so I went in and ran next him.  After his classmates hit the 35 limit, they started running next to him too, I had to not think about what we were all doing or I started to break down crying.  He had not been collecting pledges, but they didn't have to turn money in for a week...he collected pledges after the fact and raised $250.

    Parent
    That's freakin' great... (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:10:15 PM EST
    I predict that son of yours is going places...adversity builds character.

    Parent
    Good mothering, MT. Poignant. (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:12:45 PM EST
    He brings out the best in me :) (none / 0) (#50)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:47:03 PM EST
    Unbelievable. (5.00 / 2) (#37)
    by Dr Molly on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:21:25 PM EST
    You must be incredibly proud.

    Parent
    I was and am (5.00 / 2) (#55)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:52:32 PM EST
    But I try to keep it in check.  He is a child of the universe. He was gifted to me to to do my best as a parent, but in the end we are all really products of the universe.  And we have our own say so over what we take in, what leave on the side of the road, and how we use all of that.  Even my husband says that Joshua is an instructor of life to him.  We try not to voice that around him, it isn't a good thing when you are so little to discover that your parents don't know most everything.

    Parent
    Okay, totally tearing up, MT (5.00 / 2) (#138)
    by caseyOR on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:02:06 PM EST
    Joshua is an amazing little guy. And I'm guessing you and Mr. MT are right up there in the amazing parent department. After all Josh has gone through, and will go through, you all still plough through life with style and flair.

    By the by, how are those sweet little grandbabies of yours? Any current pics available to share?

    Parent

    I'm so lucky to have the SO that I have (5.00 / 2) (#188)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 09:27:47 PM EST
    Nobody ever decides to have your child go through the things that some of them do.  When he was first born I was doing the research, and the stats on marriages that end up failing because of the stress is huge.  But my husband and I are so well suited in the stress department.  We literally take turns having the falling apart moments when certain things are happening and we are needing to be there for Joshua in a huge way.  I have gotten to where I can even feel the shifting of gears as I'm shifting down or shifting up and we do it without conscious thought.  Jesus we are lucky to connect like that.  I did cry for about three months when he was first born though, my heart was broken that my tiny son was going to endure so much just to grow up.  I was getting out of the shower one day trying to become a human again, and my husband is in the living room and he has a golf ball and the baby and the baby is kicking at the ball with his clubfeet hanging in the air by his dad.  I asked him what the hell he was doing and he said the kid has clubfeet....duh!  You just can't cry forever.

    Parent
    I'm sure that I can come up with (none / 0) (#191)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 10:02:14 PM EST
    photos for tomorrow too.  They are in Charleston now.  

    Parent
    Chip off the old block, I'm sure. (5.00 / 2) (#42)
    by desertswine on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:30:02 PM EST
    Both my husband and I (5.00 / 1) (#57)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:55:29 PM EST
    notice that he has inherited our tenacity, but he does much better things with it so far than either one of us ever thought about doing with it at his age, or our teenage years, or our twenties. I think in my 30s I began to ponder using my tenacity for something greater than self service.  Now I get it, but it seems like Josh already gets a lot of what took me a very long time to learn.

    Parent
    I think that with all (5.00 / 2) (#60)
    by Zorba on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:04:35 PM EST
    his problems, all the doctor and hospital visits, etc, he has had to grow up very fast, and has risen to the occasion.  He also obviously has had a good upbringing with caring parents, and good genes, too- don't forget the genes!

    Parent
    What a great kid! (5.00 / 2) (#54)
    by Zorba on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:50:22 PM EST
    And he has a great mom!  Bless you all.

    Parent
    Thanks! (none / 0) (#58)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:55:48 PM EST
    Darn it MT... (5.00 / 2) (#65)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:18:15 PM EST
    ...you're making get all teary at work!  People might start thinking I'm a softy and not the hard nosed regulator that my reputation suggests...

    Parent
    I heard... (5.00 / 2) (#73)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:32:06 PM EST
    the Chariots of Fire music in my head picturing the little guy willing himself to run.

    If it don't pull your heartstrings, you're dead.

    Parent

    For me... (5.00 / 2) (#80)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:39:59 PM EST
    ...it triggers old (and partially repressed)memories of my younger days.  

    Parent
    I hear that... (5.00 / 1) (#84)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:44:40 PM EST
    you can relate in ways most of us can't possibly imagine.

    Now I'm a little misty thinking of all the ways I'm blessed.

    Yet I still find sh*t to complain about...shame on me, shame on me.

    Parent

    And of course it does (5.00 / 1) (#102)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:44:17 PM EST
    You haven't allowed much to hold you back.  You aren't afraid to voice your opinions in a very open forum too.  I see and experience a lot of my son often in your comments and interaction.

    Parent
    Getting all teary here too (5.00 / 3) (#79)
    by ruffian on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:38:22 PM EST
    Such an inspiring kid and mom.

    I promise to stop whining about my paltry aches and pains for at least an hour.

    Parent

    Blessed are the long distance runners (5.00 / 2) (#189)
    by Salo on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 09:36:33 PM EST
    Salo 1:1 for they shall endure.

    Parent
    Amen (5.00 / 1) (#190)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 09:57:24 PM EST
    When we first got the Wii fit he got on there doing that running program where you run through a sort of cartoon land.  He was going at this own pace, doing his own thing keeping up with nobody but himself...eventually he poops out and he calls me in to look at his "stats".  It said he had covered over three miles :)  And he was grinning from ear to ear.  He ran at that fundraiser until the time for the event ran out.

    Parent
    Of course it's their money, Kdog (none / 0) (#68)
    by Zorba on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:23:54 PM EST
    And it could lead to a huge mess.  Any lawyers want to comment on whether the states can issue IOU's and require in-state merchants, banks, etc to accept them same as money?  If so, that might help the people some, but then, even if the states could do this, the IOU's wouldn't be accepted anywhere else.  If you have out-of-state debt, I guess tough luck.  Even if you have an in-state landlord or loan or mortgage and can pay them with IOU's, and even if your grocer accepts it, what about the out-of-state debts of the banks, grocers, stores, etc?  They're then stuck with the IOU's and can't pay what they owe.  It could have a rippling effect.

    Parent
    Your IOU plan... (5.00 / 0) (#81)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:41:10 PM EST
    sounds good, but it adds another layer of paper and bueracracy and costs.

    If the feds have untold fortunes for Goldman Sachs and AIG, they can bail-out the states...NY, Hawaii, and the other states gotta be too big to fail if Goldman and AIG are...right?

    If the states really can't pay out returns they should go to Uncle Sam with their hand out...everybody else is.  Or stop payment on paychecks up in Albany for the gov and legislators.

    Parent

    New York Hawaii, and other states (none / 0) (#90)
    by Zorba on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:57:07 PM EST
    don't give huge amounts of money to the campaigns of US senators and representatives and the President, kdog.  Goldman, AIG, and the Wall Street big banksters do.  They're all in bed together.  Of course the federal government could bail out the states, but I'm not sure it will.  Follow where the donations come from- that seems to be what counts.  Unfortunately.  I do, however, really like the idea of not paying the state governors and legislators if you can't pay your own residents the money you owe them.  Let them feel the pain, instead of the little guy.

    Parent
    Good point... (5.00 / 1) (#92)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:03:11 PM EST
    hadn't thought of that, the states ain't funding campaigns.

    And the feds are part of the reason the states are in such a mess...getting them used to levels of federal funding and then reducing it, leaving gaps.  And federal mandates with funding left to the states.

    State incompetence and corruption more than anything though, especially in NY.

    Parent

    CA used to issue IOUs to state employees (none / 0) (#89)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:54:03 PM EST
    until a judge ruled this was illegal.  The state still issues IOUs to vendors:  court reporters, nursing homes, etc.  Very difficult.

    Parent
    Ah, yes, I do remember this (none / 0) (#91)
    by Zorba on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:59:56 PM EST
    That, of course, scr*ws the state vendors, but if it happened in other states, that doesn't help the taxpayers who need their refund money to buy groceries or pay their rent.

    Parent
    Must be good news day (none / 0) (#123)
    by mmc9431 on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:36:14 PM EST
    I got a check from the state because they overcharged me on my property tax. I almost had to call 911.

    Parent
    My dog got Customer of the Month (none / 0) (#134)
    by ruffian on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:51:48 PM EST
    at his day care. No prize was forthcoming, except a very cute picture in the newsletter.

    Parent
    Glad you got yours (none / 0) (#133)
    by ruffian on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:50:51 PM EST
    We don't want you all cranky around her because John Law (or is it Joe Tax?) has your vacation money!

    I saw that article on the USA Today when I bought my coffee this morning. FL has no state income tax, or I'm sure they would be doing the same thing, as strapped as they are.

    Parent

    As if... (none / 0) (#135)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:54:04 PM EST
    I need an excuse to be a crank:)

    Parent
    You aren't old enough (none / 0) (#153)
    by jbindc on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:30:43 PM EST
    to be a crank ;)

    (And I thought, the um, recreations you pursue were supposed to make you mellow?)

    Parent

    My vice is... (none / 0) (#163)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:51:06 PM EST
    excellent as a crank-reliever, but you guys usually catch me stone-cold sober at work.

    Parent
    NYPD does it again... (5.00 / 0) (#51)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:47:50 PM EST
    now they're disrespecting the dead.  Link

    I just knew you would find this! (5.00 / 1) (#53)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:50:07 PM EST
    All credit due... (none / 0) (#59)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:59:10 PM EST
    the NY Daily News...I must say they do a pretty good job of watching the watchers...this was front page today.

    Unlike that rag the NY Post, where all you hear is how wonderful John Law is and how we should bend over backwards in gratitude.  I think the Post front page was some gal in a bikini...again:)  That Rupert is a piece of work.

    Parent

    Only in (none / 0) (#61)
    by Zorba on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:05:56 PM EST
    New York!  At least he got the body back in time to ship it to the relatives.

    Parent
    Prediction: lawsuit for negligence, (none / 0) (#62)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:09:21 PM EST
    negligent/intentional infliction of emotional distress, and punitive damages.

    Parent
    Take 'em to the cleaners! (none / 0) (#64)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:14:55 PM EST
    I'm becoming convinced there is but one way to beat city hall...bankrupt city hall.  If and when paychecks start bouncing, maybe then bueracrats will start thinkin' straight.

    Parent
    Who would sue whom? (none / 0) (#69)
    by Zorba on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:27:22 PM EST
    The relatives receiving the body got it in time.  Would they have any case against either the funeral director or the city?  Would the funeral director be able to sue the city?  After all, he was parked illegally, and he admitted his funeral director sign was worn.  Seems bizarre all the way around, but I'm not sure anyone would have much of a legal case.

    Parent
    Don't forget you can sue anybody for (5.00 / 1) (#93)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:03:56 PM EST
    anything.  Doesn't mean lawsuit is viable.  My hypo envisions relatives of deceased suing city, officer, funeral home, driver who illegally parked the hearse, etc.

    Parent
    Yes, of course they can sue (none / 0) (#95)
    by Zorba on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:07:28 PM EST
    But can the family prove that they suffered damages, since they got the body on time?

    Parent
    innovation (5.00 / 1) (#98)
    by Jlvngstn on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:32:51 PM EST
    It does seem (5.00 / 2) (#101)
    by jbindc on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:42:57 PM EST
    a bit out of sorts when people are wondering across the country how they are going to pay their mortgage or rent next month.  Now, no one expects the First Family to exist on Ramen noodles (which I love, by the way), and only shop when they can get pasta on sale 10 for $10, but the fact that this administration has had more parties in its first year than any other, really doesn't send a good message.  And I agree with Axelrod's statements - it's not good to brand the president as a brand (even though we really know he is and that's how his campaign was run).

    Parent
    Pasta 10 for $1?? Around here pasta at $1 a pound (none / 0) (#113)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:12:22 PM EST
    IS on sale! (Northern NJ)

    Parent
    10 for 10 bucks.... (none / 0) (#116)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:20:43 PM EST
    was what jb said...we get the same sale on Long Island too, and thats when I stock up on Angel Hair for my specialty, kdog's Bacon Basil Pasta...the roomies go crazy for it.

    Parent
    That sounds good -- recipe, please? (none / 0) (#122)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:35:53 PM EST
    Excdept---bacon???

    Parent
    It's the main ingedient:)... (none / 0) (#132)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:50:44 PM EST
    Fry up a pound of bacon till not quite done, put aside.  Mix a tablespoon or so of the bacon grease with some Olive Oil...saute fresh garlic, fresh green peppers (any fresh veggie you like really), fresh basil, fresh tomatos, salt, pepper, pinch of oregano.  When done break the bacon into bite-size bits and add to mixture.  Pour it over some angel hair and dig in....simple and delicous.

    Parent
    That does sound tasty, kdog (none / 0) (#144)
    by caseyOR on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:23:57 PM EST
    I think I see a little bacon in my future.

    Parent
    Oh, and which store on LI? Are they also in NJ? (none / 0) (#148)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:27:06 PM EST
    Pathmark... (none / 0) (#165)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:54:26 PM EST
    is my usual spot, they run the 10 for 10 fairly often.  I think they're in NJ.

    Parent
    Just bought (none / 0) (#118)
    by jbindc on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:25:25 PM EST
    Some boxes at Giant, here in NoVA.  10 for $10 - got 5 boxes for $5 - 2 boxes of spaghetti, 1 box of shells, 1 box of rotini, and 1 box of penne.

    Parent
    Jameson's Irish Whiskey on sale at (5.00 / 1) (#151)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:28:34 PM EST
    Rite Aid for $16/bottle.  Not a necessity of life, but, still.

    Parent
    Not in Oregon, sadly. (none / 0) (#159)
    by caseyOR on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:36:27 PM EST
    The state owns the liquor stores here. We never get prices that low. And, of course, no buying hard liquor at the Rite-Aid, only at the state stores. Beer and wine, however, can be purchased at regular retail establishments.

    Parent
    Not here in NY either... (none / 0) (#166)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:57:16 PM EST
    not state-run, but you gotta go to a liquor store for booze and wine.  There's been talk of let the supermarkets in on wine, but the liquor store lobbies are fighting it hard.  

    So foreign to me to think you can buy whiskey at Rite-Aid...liberty-friendly alcohol policy, I like it.

    Parent

    My personal favorite (none / 0) (#167)
    by jondee on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:02:52 PM EST
    the original word did mean something like "water of life", didnt it?

    Btw, isnt there supposed be some loyalist - republican thing with Bushmill's and Jameson's?

    Parent

    There is a political dimension to the whiskey (5.00 / 2) (#178)
    by caseyOR on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:55:58 PM EST
    Jameson's is Republican and Catholic and, in my family, the good whiskey.

    Bushmill's is Protestant and loyalist and, in my family, the bad whiskey.

    This is the same family that drinks bourbon, made in the USA by American workers, but never Scotch which is, of course, made in Scotland by not-American workers and the drink of elitist  corporate overlords to boot.

    The personal is political, as we used to say.

    Parent

    Tastewise, I prefer Jameson's. Didn't (5.00 / 1) (#180)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:59:26 PM EST
    realize I was making a political statement though.

    Parent
    Yes, indeed (5.00 / 1) (#196)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:59:37 PM EST
    When I came of age, I started out drinking Scotch.  But I was pretty deeply involved in politics already, and I learned that Scotch, being imported, was not a Democratic drink, that bourbon, being made here, was, so I switched and have stayed with it ever since.

    Parent
    This makes me mad (5.00 / 2) (#128)
    by ruffian on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:45:26 PM EST
    Johnny Weir 'Not Family Friendly Enough' for Stars on Ice? I know it is their show, and this is America and they can do what they want, but this is ridiculous.

    Weir fans can sign the petition that is linked in the article.

    wow that's terrible (5.00 / 1) (#139)
    by CST on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:09:50 PM EST
    it's ICE SKATING fer chrissakes.

    You know, after all the media hype about Weir I was expecting to not like him much at the olympics, but man was I wrong.  His long program blew me away.  Say whatever else about him, but the man skates beautifully.

    Shame on them.

    Parent

    "Not family friendly" (5.00 / 1) (#141)
    by jondee on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:14:53 PM EST
    the sound overstuffed, conservative, closets make.

    If they want to evoke Leviticus or Deuteronomy thats one thing, but when they're so insecure about the "threat" posed to "the family" of just being around gays, you have to wonder just how many Craigs, Sandfords and Miss Piggys there are out there.

    Parent

    was talking about this on another site (5.00 / 1) (#142)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:20:16 PM EST
    someone said something like "who knew it was possible for a figure skater to be TO gay"

    I said I dont think thats it.  its not that he is to gay, and I agree with you, its that he is sort of rowdy and unpredictable.
    I have found over and over in my life that lots of people dont have a problem with gay people as long as they are non threatening.  they dont even mind if they are flamboyant as long as it is a non threatening kind of flamboyance.  what they cant deal with is a loud unapologetic rowdy gay man.

    I know this from experience.  Im one, hes one.
    its a beautiful thing.

    Parent

    Yep, I know loud, obnoxious, unapologetic (none / 0) (#170)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:23:53 PM EST
    straight people who are also often avoided by others...

    Parent
    Unless they're in talk radio (none / 0) (#172)
    by jondee on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:27:43 PM EST
    I think its rather Freudian (none / 0) (#173)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:35:20 PM EST
    that you added the word obnoxious.

    since many straight people think unapologetic gays are obnoxious.

    Parent

    Missing the point. Purposely? (none / 0) (#184)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 06:34:55 PM EST
    Many straight and gay people think loud, unapologetic straight and gay people are obnoxious.

    Heck, seems like often it's the loud, unapologetic straight and gay people themselves who find other unapologetic straight and gay people obnoxious.

    When people don't dig me it serves my psyche to pretend it's them, not me - pretend  they don't dig me because of what I am, rather than who I am.

    But deep down I really know it's because I can be an insensitive ass at times. (Shocking, I know.)

    You, of course, are free to live in whatever world suits you...

    Parent

    did I mention (none / 0) (#185)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 06:36:40 PM EST
    I live to tweak those people?

    and I live pretty well

    Parent

    Bien Vivre! (none / 0) (#187)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 06:47:17 PM EST
    Also (none / 0) (#140)
    by CST on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:12:09 PM EST
    did you hear about the prom they cancelled in Missisippi?  Apparently instead of letting a girl wear a tux and bring her girlfriend, they cancelled the whole thing.  So now her entire class hates her.  This cr@p needs to end.

    Parent
    did you see this (none / 0) (#175)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:41:36 PM EST
    I thought that meant his personality lacked (none / 0) (#156)
    by Inspector Gadget on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:31:12 PM EST
    warmth.

    Those people who want to limit their life experiences because of a prejudice are the ones who lose.


    Parent

    we are gonna need more popcorn (none / 0) (#1)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:29:01 AM EST
    Tea parties stir evangelicals' fears

    "There's a libertarian streak in the tea party movement that concerns me as a cultural conservative," said Bryan Fischer, director of Issue Analysis for Government and Public Policy at the American Family Association. "The tea party movement needs to insist that candidates believe in the sanctity of life and the sanctity of marriage."

    "As far as I can tell [the tea party movement] has a politics that's irreligious. I can't see how some of my fellow conservatives identify with it," said Richard Cizik, who broke with a major evangelical group over his support for government action on climate change, but who remains largely in line with the Christian right on social issues. "The younger Evangelicals who I interact with are largely turned off by the tea party movement -- by the incivility, the name-calling, the pathos of politics."




    Meanwhile, on BBC last night, (none / 0) (#6)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:40:23 AM EST
    atheist convention is coming up soon and organizers are trying to stave off evangelizing on behalf of atheism.

    Parent
    It was our friend Sarcastic Unnamed One... (5.00 / 1) (#12)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:47:45 AM EST
    who taught me that I am a freedom evangelical:)

    Parent
    Truer words . . . . (none / 0) (#13)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:49:25 AM EST
    Saw a great bumper sticker the other day... (5.00 / 3) (#15)
    by Dr Molly on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:52:43 AM EST
    "Militant Agnostic - I Don't Know and Neither Do You".

    LOL.

    Parent

    That is a good one... (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:55:59 AM EST
    and so true!

    The more somebody tells you they know what its all about, the further you should run from said person:)

    Parent

    Except for the Rosicrucians (none / 0) (#67)
    by jondee on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:20:54 PM EST
    Damn you jondee... (none / 0) (#103)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:54:36 PM EST
    nobody sends me scurrying to wiki at the frequency you do...now I'll be reading up on medieval German secret society mystics this weekend.

    I thought I was a regular Cliff Clavin, but you've got me in spades:)

    Parent

    If nothing else (none / 0) (#154)
    by jondee on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:30:45 PM EST
    it's definitive proof that cannabis smoking was not unheard of in medieval Germany.

    They also advertise in Popular Mechanics.

    Parent

    I love it! (none / 0) (#18)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:56:33 AM EST
    I know - it was awesome. (5.00 / 3) (#22)
    by Dr Molly on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:03:21 PM EST
    It was a great week for bumper stickers. The same week, I saw a car with a sticker that said "Dog is My Co-Pilot" AND they actually had a dog in the passenger seat.

    Parent
    That used to be me! (5.00 / 2) (#43)
    by ruffian on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:34:27 PM EST
    Loved that bumper sticker, and my old dog ruffian too of curse. Good times. My current dog is too clumsy for the front seat - his big ole paw slaps the control panel and opens and closes windows. and shifts gears. Now 'dog is my limo passenger'.

    Parent
    My favorite bumper sticker (5.00 / 1) (#52)
    by Zorba on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:48:17 PM EST
    that I saw in this area quite some time ago was pasted on the back of a bumper-pull two-horse stock trailer.  It said "Don't be what you're looking at."

    Parent
    Don't start... (5.00 / 1) (#85)
    by kdog on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:46:08 PM EST
    that one again Don!...:)

    Parent
    My old buddy Ajax (none / 0) (#149)
    by MKS on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:27:10 PM EST
    a 98lb Golden used to ride in the car in the passenger seat.  He would sit in the seat just like a person.  When we came to a stop at a light, he would turn his head from side to side to look around at various people....People in the other cars would crack up....

    Parent
    re "We are going to need more popcorn": (none / 0) (#7)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:41:45 AM EST
    thought maybe you were referring to Edwards/Hunter video.

    Parent
    I've got the good drugs today (none / 0) (#2)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:32:24 AM EST
    Killing microbes and taking names.

    Just got an e mail about a study (none / 0) (#8)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:42:44 AM EST
    ranking foods for purported ability to stave off cancer:  red wine, chocolate (soy, broccoli, etc.).

    Parent
    I live on the first two as often (5.00 / 1) (#19)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:58:33 AM EST
    as possible.  I should be cancer free :)  My Uncle used to call beer and chocolate the Marine Corp breakfast to make everyone feel less guilty when he was trying to get a Mimosa down you on Christmas Morning.  I still miss him :)

    Parent
    Dark Chocolate (5.00 / 1) (#126)
    by mmc9431 on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:41:10 PM EST
    Can I double up on the choclate and skip the broccoli?

    Parent
    How About (5.00 / 1) (#130)
    by squeaky on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:48:37 PM EST
    Tempura broccoli drizzled with dark chocolate, and a ginger soy dipping sauce with a dash of cayenne.

    Parent
    See Glenn Greenwald on public option (none / 0) (#11)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:46:14 AM EST
    and up or down vote.  Interesting read.

    What Durbin and Reid are doing (5.00 / 2) (#27)
    by Anne on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:10:31 PM EST
    just proves what we long suspected about the Democratic caucus: there are many whose support for something is conditioned on them never having to actually vote on it.

    There was support for this mostly-undefined public option when there just weren't the 60 votes; now that they are looking at reconciliation, and would only need a simple majority, they need to whip the count down so there is no danger they will meet that threshold, either.

    That being said, the only public option that currently exists is the anemic one in the House Bill that isn't worth the paper it's printed on, and notwithstanding Alan Grayson's Medicare Buy-In bill (which isn't going anywhere, I'm sure), its just too damn bad that the energy that has been expended on this subject could not have gone into legislation that would put us miles and miles closer to getting out from under the private insurance companies.

    The fix was in from the day Obama announced his first health care summit, over a year ago, and everything that followed has been nothing but kabuki.

     

    Parent

    Yup. As Glenn (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by dk on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:14:05 PM EST
    notes, the sham is absurdly transparent.  Healthcare reform (and we can add to that equal rights for women and GLBT) are great rallying causes for the Democratic party as long as they are impossible to achieve.  But as soon as they become achievable, they sing a different tune.

    Parent
    The 60 vote requirement (none / 0) (#28)
    by observed on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:11:26 PM EST
    is a shame, as GG notes. Republican opposition to HCR has only been a convenient excuse for Democrats to do what the insurance industry wants, rather than what voters request.

    Parent
    *sham* (none / 0) (#31)
    by observed on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:13:44 PM EST
    Balloon Juice (none / 0) (#63)
    by waldenpond on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:11:21 PM EST
    Was just reading comments at BJ and how Greenwald's piece is 'bizarre and absurd' ....only FDL and Kos thought there were ever 50 votes.

    [So the Progressive "strategery" thrown about by people like Armando all summer and fall is shown to have been seriously wrong... and yet it's all Obama's fault.

    Classic.]

    Another agrees... [but yeah for the most part the Greenwald thing is first rate concern trolling.]

    I remember BTD saying that people don't criticize GG.  I guess he meant bloggers not comments.

    Parent

    What's the BJ site? Thnx. (none / 0) (#76)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:35:09 PM EST
    Ooops --now I see what's referred to. (none / 0) (#77)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:35:35 PM EST
    A (ex?) Republican schooling (none / 0) (#106)
    by MO Blue on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:58:56 PM EST
    Democrats on how they should act. Thanks but no thanks.

    Parent
    A little more background on the Durbin/Reid (none / 0) (#75)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:33:32 PM EST
    whipping against PO (whatever that may mean), plus post on Greenwald's piece.

    I was way behind of what Senate leadership was doing -- and is willing to do.

    Parent

    Greenwald left out this statement (none / 0) (#88)
    by Farmboy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:52:15 PM EST
    from Durbin's office on Thursday: "Sen. Durbin and the rest of the Senate Leadership will be aggressively whipping FOR the public option if it is included in the reconciliation bill the House sends over."

    Wonder why he left that out?

    Parent

    quite a bit was left out. (none / 0) (#94)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:06:00 PM EST
    also on salon
    Five reasons not to get excited about the public option

    1) Durbin didn't actually change his position. Aides say Durbin, who has been a vocal supporter of the public option all along, never meant to indicate it was dead Thursday, and the pressure he got since then didn't bring him around. "There is no change in his position; it's exactly what he meant yesterday," spokesman Joe Shoemaker told Salon. "In the simplest terms, Durbin will whip against any attempt to alter or amend the reconciliation bill sent over by the House -- if it includes a public option, Leadership will whip for it and against all amendments to strip it out; if not, they will whip against any amendments to alter the House bill." Which means Friday's "news" doesn't actually change where things stand -- the House still needs to put a public option in the reconciliation bill.


    Parent
    And more: (none / 0) (#100)
    by Anne on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:40:45 PM EST
    From FDL/d-day:

    After Dick Durbin (D-IL) got attacked for saying that he would whip against the public option, he sent out his spokesman to lie about reconciliation in a pathetic attempt to justify Durbin's role in trying to kill the public option. (Which is curious because we were told we could not have a public option because there were not the votes to pass it in the Senate-if there aren't the votes, why would Durbin need to whip the no votes.) Durbin spokesman Joe Shoemaker's illegitimate excuse for Durbin's plan to whip against the public option is that it would change the reconciliation measure, causing it to go back to the House for a final vote after passing the Senate:

    I want to be crystal clear: Sen. Durbin and the rest of the Senate Leadership will be aggressively whipping FOR the public option if it is included in the reconciliation bill the House sends over. Conversely, the Leaders will whip against any attempt to alter or amend the bill if the public option is not in it (or as your email says - whip against adding the public option as an amendment in the Senate.)

    The reason is simple. There can be no amendments - good or bad - to the reconciliation bill once the House passes it and sends it to the Senate. The House will not do step one (passing the Senate healthcare bill in the first place) if they do not have assurances that the fixes they want (i.e., the fixes in their reconciliation bill) will be passed unchanged by the Senate.


    This excuse is pure nonsense because the House simply can never get assurances that the reconciliation bill that they pass will pass the Senate unchanged. It is almost guaranteed that it will need to go back to the House for one final vote.

    It is basically impossible to create a Byrd-rule-proof reconciliation bill. No matter how hard you work on it, there will almost always be one small provision on which Republicans could call a legitimate Byrd rule point of order. That would cause the provision to be removed unless it gets 60 votes to waive the Byrd rule. Since all 41 Republicans said they will never vote to waive a Byrd rule, that means any small offending provision could be removed. That would slightly change the bill, and force it to return to the House to be voted on again so that both chambers pass the exact same bill.

    The only way you could assure the House that the reconciliation bill would pass the Senate unchanged is if Vice President Joe Biden declares that he is prepared to play real hardball, using his power as President of the Senate to ignore the parliamentarian's decision and reject all Byrd rule points of order, legitimate or not.

    Of course, if Joe Biden is prepared to do that, effectively nullify the Byrd rule, there is zero reason the House Democrats need to vote for the politically toxic Senate bill as is. They could pass a "new," merged comprehensive health care reform bill that deals with all the House's problems using reconciliation, with Biden nullifying the Byrd rule, so it can pass the Senate unchanged with only a simple majority.

    Until I hear Biden declare he is prepared to play real hardball with the reconciliation rules, the excuse from Durbin's office stinks to high heaven.

    Bold was added by Dayen in his post.

    Just more kabuki, as usual; I've lost count of how many excuses we are up to with why we cannot have a health care bill that actually reforms the system and is not just a giveaway in disguise.


    Parent

    gosh (none / 0) (#104)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:55:35 PM EST
    I guess we will just have to wait and see who is right.

    thanks for the reminder why I stopped visiting that site.


    Parent

    personally (5.00 / 1) (#105)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:56:53 PM EST
    I will take salon

    Parent
    why (none / 0) (#107)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:59:16 PM EST
    Why is it all up to the House? For a combination of reasons. One, the House doesn't trust the Senate much farther than House Speaker Nancy Pelosi could throw Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid right now. (Which is not that far, even if Reid isn't the biggest guy in Congress.) In order to finish the healthcare bill, the House will have to pass the Senate-passed version, which House members hate, and only then take up a reconciliation measure designed to "fix" the bill. The Senate has to promise the House that whatever comes over won't be changed; otherwise, the House might not have faith that the Senate will actually finish the job. Two, the reconciliation measure, because it would raise some taxes, must begin in the House anyway. And three, the Senate parliamentarian told Republicans there Thursday that the Senate can't take up the reconciliation measure until after the House has passed -- and Obama has signed -- the underlying healthcare bill. Otherwise, it's not reconciling an existing law.

    All of that means Durbin had plenty of room Friday to pass the public option buck over to the House, and look justified in doing it. Conveniently, of course, that also means the Senate is slightly off the hook if the public option doesn't actually make it into the reconciliation plan.



    Parent
    Sure, the procedural rules (none / 0) (#109)
    by ruffian on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:06:17 PM EST
    mean the PO would have to start in the House at this point. But in the big picture to blame the House alone for the lack of a PO is crazy talk. I can't tell if anyone here is actually doing that. To me The entirety of the Salon article makes it clear it is all Kabuki.

    It should be abundantly clear to anyone that has followed the whole process that the Senate will not pass a PO, even by a majority. I can't blame Pelosi for not wanting to waste her own time trying to get the House to do something on the PO now when it was hard enough to pass it the first time.

    Parent

    Also (5.00 / 2) (#129)
    by christinep on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:48:08 PM EST
    Speaker Pelosi had to get the 216. She has Progressives and Blue Dogs as well as other interest areas represented in the House. While I agree with your sentiment about the convenience now for the Senate, the Speaker's determination not to include a public option at this time must clearly reflect what yields the 216. It seems that it has to be about the math.

    Parent
    reason # 5 (none / 0) (#110)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:08:09 PM EST
    5) Why get excited about the public option, when the whole bill might still collapse? What is or isn't in the reconciliation measure is, for now, a theoretical question. The more pressing matter is figuring out whether Pelosi can wrangle the 216 votes she needs to get the House to pass the Senate's healthcare bill.


    Parent
    Exactly (5.00 / 2) (#124)
    by ruffian on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:38:29 PM EST
    I am not a huge Pelosi fan, but of all the leadership she is least culpable for the debacle that has been this HCR project. Not that that is saying much.

    Parent
    I agree (5.00 / 2) (#127)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:43:35 PM EST
    I actually think she has been pretty remarkable.
    she is whipping the sh!t out of people.

    Parent
    Stupak fail (none / 0) (#131)
    by waldenpond on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:49:57 PM EST
    Here ya go...

    Stupak:  "At this point, there is no doubt that they've been able to peel off one or two of my twelve," he said. "The others are having both of their arms twisted, and we're all getting pounded by our traditional Democratic supporters, like unions."

    Parent

    translation (5.00 / 3) (#136)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:54:33 PM EST
    "one or two of my four"

    Parent
    More Stupak fail (none / 0) (#177)
    by waldenpond on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:50:14 PM EST
    Via Political Wire...
    "They're ignoring me. That's their strategy now. The House Democratic leaders think they have the votes to pass the Senate's health-care bill without us."

    -- Rep. Bart Stupak (D-MI), in an interview with the National Review, explaining that the House will not be adding revised language on abortion to the reconciliation bill.

    Parent

    General sense among (none / 0) (#193)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:50:14 PM EST
    congressional reporters I've been hearing, FWIW, is that Stupak never had anything close to the 12 to 15 he was claiming he had, and Nancy's found that out.  He tried to bluff and didn't get away with it, IOW.  

    Parent
    No one thought to make him name names (none / 0) (#199)
    by ruffian on Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 06:18:13 AM EST
    until now?

    Parent
    It's not going to happen (none / 0) (#114)
    by jbindc on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:13:14 PM EST
    Pelosi says no public option will be in the bill.

    Parent
    which (none / 0) (#117)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:23:48 PM EST
    even if true doesnt mean its over
    from the same article:

    Rep. Raúl Grijalva, D-Ariz., the co-chairman of the Congressional Progressive Caucus, said last week after a meeting at the White House. "However, he personally committed to pursue a public option after passage of the current bill."


    Parent
    Oh, come on... (5.00 / 1) (#158)
    by Anne on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:33:33 PM EST
    if the will was there for it, we'd have it - and it would be a damn sight better than the pitiful thing that ended up in the House bill.

    But, I'm guessing you don't even know what the House public option included, when it would go into effect and who would be eligible.

    Parent

    I'll bet (none / 0) (#161)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:43:07 PM EST
    they know at FDL

    Parent
    I wouldn't hold your breath (none / 0) (#120)
    by jbindc on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:29:07 PM EST
    Is John Edwards Protected by the 1st Amendment? (none / 0) (#14)
    by Dan the Man on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:50:13 AM EST
    Gawker made the insightful joke "Using campaign funds to pay a lady to not talk about the baby you put in her is decidedly not allowed, at least until the Supreme Court overturns those restrictions."  I believe a fair reading of Citizens United implies John Edwards alleged conduct is protected by the Freedom of Speech in the 1st Amendment.

    Edwards is alleged to have used campaign funds to pay somebody to deny or not talk about her relationship with him.  Now certainly denying or not talking about having a relationship is an exercise of 1st Amendment rights.  Citizens United implies that paying someone to exercise those rights is also protected by the 1st Amendment.  This is because The Edwards Campaign paid the money.  Now, according to Citizens United, The Edwards Campaign is a Speaker who has the free will to exercise its 1st Amendment rights to pay other speakers to exercise their freedom of speech.  Since this is exactly what The Edwards Campaign allegedly did -- ie it paid a woman to exercise her 1st Amendment rights - the alleged actions of The Edwards Campaign and John Edwards is protected by the 1st Amendment.

    To you really think, if asked, SCOTUS (none / 0) (#21)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:02:59 PM EST
    would extend "Citizens United" to a Dem. presidential primary candidate's allegedly paying his sign. other not to talk?

    Parent
    It's not obvious to me (none / 0) (#25)
    by andgarden on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:08:12 PM EST
    that speech would even be the only issue.

    Parent
    Me neither. Thinking of Letterman's (none / 0) (#33)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:14:35 PM EST
    extorter.

    Parent
    Did you think that verdict was (none / 0) (#34)
    by observed on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:16:22 PM EST
    correct?


    Parent
    Guilty plea, not a verdict. (none / 0) (#36)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:20:19 PM EST
    oh right, sorry (none / 0) (#38)
    by observed on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:21:48 PM EST
    Here's a scenario: What if Halderman had at least one other legitimate buyer for his script, and invited Letterman to bid on it as well.
    Would that have been a crime?

    Parent
    I am not qualified to opine on NY state law! (none / 0) (#40)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:24:00 PM EST
    Not that lack of qualification deters me in other areas.

    Parent
    well, imagine it happened in CA then. (none / 0) (#41)
    by observed on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:24:51 PM EST
    Totally out of my depth here (none / 0) (#44)
    by andgarden on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:36:33 PM EST
    but I would expect that to cut against mens rea.

    Parent
    I am imagining a listing on e bay (none / 0) (#45)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:39:25 PM EST
    open to all bidders with a minimum bid established.

    Parent
    Suppose the listing contains (none / 0) (#47)
    by andgarden on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:41:10 PM EST
    so much disclosure that there is no longer any secret to protect?

    Then it really is just a "treatment."

    Parent

    He could have sold the script to (none / 0) (#46)
    by observed on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:39:45 PM EST
    anyone else, right?


    Parent
    Me too (none / 0) (#39)
    by andgarden on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 12:22:55 PM EST
    What's the law on accessory to extortion?

    Parent
    Vote for single payer&Corporations NOT Persons (none / 0) (#70)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:29:15 PM EST
    issues at Vote for Change. Top Ten vote getters will be presented to Obama.

    LINK to comment from yesterday. Yves Smith supports the single payer and mentioned Lambert in so doing, plus asks for vote against Corporate Personhood.

    Also there's a link for Rep. Grayson's proposed bill establishing Medicare Buy-In.

    PLEASE, vote - didn't mean to be peremptory, just (none / 0) (#72)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:30:13 PM EST
    saving space on the title line.

    Parent
    Anyone know what is going on (none / 0) (#82)
    by ruffian on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 01:43:14 PM EST
    on "The Ellen Degeneres Show" today?  Got a cryptic msg from an old friend who now lives in California, telling me she will be coming to Orlando soon and to watch 'Ellen' today. If you see a tall slim blonde lady from CA on there, she has been my friend since we were 6!

    Go to the website and look (none / 0) (#99)
    by Inspector Gadget on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:38:09 PM EST
    at the video from today. Not sure how much of the show ends up in video, but scroll down and see if the segment with Drew Carey is your blonde friend. Susan Johnson, but they didn't say where she's from.


    Parent
    That would be her! (none / 0) (#111)
    by ruffian on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:08:12 PM EST
    Thanks, I will check the site.

    Parent
    So funny (none / 0) (#115)
    by ruffian on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:17:29 PM EST
    seeing someone I know that well on a show like that. They couldn't have picked a better person - mother of 5 including triplet girls as adorable as she is.

    Really happy for her getting a free trip to Orlando. she does not get many vacations.

    Parent

    yea it's awesome (none / 0) (#119)
    by CST on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:25:33 PM EST
    I had a college friend go on who wants to be a millionaire.  He won $100,000.  But first he had to name all the twilight books or something like that - in order.  So he got a lot of flack for the answers he got right :)

    Parent
    A spot of bother . . . . (none / 0) (#96)
    by nycstray on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:23:02 PM EST
    Lucky dog  There's a reason they're (affectionately!) called Damnatians  ;)

    Bravo to (none / 0) (#195)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:55:21 PM EST
    the firemen!

    Parent
    Pelosi says "no public option" (none / 0) (#97)
    by jbindc on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 02:31:32 PM EST
    There will be no public option in the health bill, despite some last minute wrangling.

    "We had it, we wanted it ... it's not in the reconciliation," Pelosi said at her weekly press briefing. "It isn't in there because [the Senate doesn't] have the votes to have it in there."

    Momentum had been building to reintroduce the government-run plan. Over 40 senators have endorsed a letter sponsored by the Progressive Change Campaign Committee (PCCC) that called for senators to pass the public option using the budget reconciliation process.

    But the number of senators who backed the plan falls short of the 50 needed to pass the package, assuming Vice President Joe Biden votes to break a tie.



    Jane Hamsher's take over at FDL-- (none / 0) (#143)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:21:54 PM EST
    Jane Hamsher says this should be an action item. Call, call, call. Hhhmmm...

    I see a nice dance going on:
    Report comes out that Durbin is whipping against PO votes in Senate;

    Durbin spokesman says that's wrong, that would whip for PO if House puts it in bill;

    Durbin says he would whip for PO if in House reconciliations bill, but won't whip for amendment in Senate;

    Durbin says not enough votes in Senate for PO;

    Pelosi says won't put PO in reconciliation bill since not enough votes in Senate....

    Oh, OK then.

    Quick step!

    So, no PO. Way to go. But, still, who knows which version of PO would be in reconciliation??

    Parent

    It has all gotten beyond ridiculous (none / 0) (#157)
    by ruffian on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:32:10 PM EST
    I understand FDL wanting to take a 'never say die' stance and not just give up and go home. So let's get the stupid votes overwith already so we can move on. Hey, I should start an org.

    There's not going to be a public option (not even a watered down, vaguely defined, nearly useless one). Who did not realize that by September? I'm just sick of watching this particular dance. The politicians just string the activists along, and the activists understandable have to at least pretend to believe them.

    Parent

    They string everyone along with the intent to (none / 0) (#160)
    by Inspector Gadget on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:36:57 PM EST
    break them down. I'm pretty glad FDL, and others, are holding their feet to the fire and making sure that the negatives are in bold print if they actually do pass something that is void of what the people NEED.

    Parent
    JBinDC, sorry I missed that you'd posted this, (none / 0) (#147)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:26:15 PM EST
    then I posted an addition to my post under yours. Ooops.

    Parent
    No biggie (none / 0) (#152)
    by jbindc on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:29:12 PM EST
    Make sure people REALLY get the message.

    :)

    Parent

    Pelosi says no PO in rec bill--not enuf Sen votes (none / 0) (#125)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:40:45 PM EST
    Obama wins on PO --no go.

    "We [meaning the House] had it, we wanted it (but) it's not in the reconciliation," Pelosi said during her weekly news conference. "It isn't in there because (the Senate doesn't) have the votes to have it in there."

    Momentum had been building recently to reintroduce the government-run healthcare plan, The Hill reported Friday. More than 40 senators endorsed a letter sponsored by the Progressive Change Campaign Committee that called on senators to pass the public option through budget reconciliation process, which requires a simple majority instead of a 60-vote supermajority.

    Assuming Vice President Joe Biden votes to break a tie, the number of senators who backed the public plan still is shy of the 50 votes needed for passage, the Washington publication said.



    About Skechers Shape-ups, MT, ruffian (none / 0) (#137)
    by caseyOR on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 03:57:13 PM EST
    IIRC, MT and ruffian, you both have a pair of shape-ups. What is your verdict on them? Have they helped or hurt?

    I just bought a pair because my research indicated they were good at relieving low back and knee pain, both of which I have in abundance due to the rugby playing of my reckless youth. So far I've just been walking back and forth in my little apartment.

    Before I venture out in the world and dirty up the soles of the shoes I wanted to get your impressions. What say you?

    How do they feel to you, casey? (none / 0) (#145)
    by jawbone on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:24:28 PM EST
    So far, so good (none / 0) (#155)
    by caseyOR on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:31:05 PM EST
    but I am pacing back and forth in a small studio. So, I only go approx. 10 feet in one direction before turning and retracing that same 10 feet.

    They are not nearly as high as I thought they would be. I don't feel like I am teetering on them or about to lose my balance.

    The shoe box includes an instructional booklet and DVD. Very interesting.

    And, Joe Montana, possibly my favorite NFL QB ever, endorses them. What's not to like?

    Parent

    Let us know (none / 0) (#150)
    by jbindc on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 04:28:28 PM EST
    I'm interested in a pair - my mom has them, and while she hasn't worn them a lot, she said it's tricky because you have to learn to re-balance yourself.  I'm a klutz, so I'm a little leery of something that will improve my chances of falling even more!  :)

    Parent
    George Will (none / 0) (#169)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:10:13 PM EST
    abandons his last shred of credibility at Town Hall.com:

    We could take one small step toward restoring institutional equilibrium by thinking as Jefferson did about State of the Union addresses. Justice Antonin Scalia has stopped going to them because justices "sit there like bumps on a log" in the midst of the partisan posturing -- the political pep rally that Roberts described. Sis boom bah humbug.

    Next year, Roberts and the rest of the justices should stay away from the president's address. So should the uniformed military, who are out of place in a setting of competitive political grandstanding. For that matter, the 535 legislators should boycott these undignified events. They would, if there were that many congressional grown-ups averse to being props in the childishness of popping up from their seats to cheer, or remaining sullenly seated in semi-pouts, as the politics of the moment dictates.

    In the unlikely event that Obama or any other loquacious modern president has any thoughts about the State of the Union that he does not pour forth in the torrential course of his relentless rhetoric, he can mail those thoughts to Congress. The Postal Service needs the business.  



    Grandstanding and partisan posturing (none / 0) (#171)
    by jondee on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 05:24:36 PM EST
    second thought, lets stop paying any attention to American politicians altogether.

    Funny, that those kind of sentiments never seemed to occur to George during that idyll when he spent eight years with his nose up the Gipper.

    Parent

    Pres. Carter mailed it in. (none / 0) (#181)
    by oculus on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 06:02:11 PM EST
    he mailed (none / 0) (#186)
    by Capt Howdy on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 06:37:51 PM EST
    in his whole presidency

    Parent
    Great story (none / 0) (#194)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 11:53:11 PM EST
    about the senator.  Love the mental image!