Monday Morning Open Thread

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Blog Related
Posted on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 10:36:02 AM EST
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Monday Morning Open Thread | 100 comments (100 topical)

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New All Star game rules: (none / 0) (#1)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:10:38 AM EST

LAT

DH whether AL or NL ballpark. Will this push the NL to a win?

They should get rid of the DH rule altogether (none / 0) (#5)
by shoephone on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:38:30 AM EST

Having grown up in a NL town, I always thought it was chickensh*t.

Parent

I like the idea the AL All Star team (none / 0) (#7)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:40:58 AM EST

DH is selected by the fans and the NL manager picks his DH.

Parent

: I don't want the fans (none / 0) (#39)
by brodie on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:13:57 PM EST

involved in any major way for the AS Game. When millions of people around the world watch the Oscars®, they're seeing nominees and winners voted by members (in good standing) of the Academy. The People's Choice Awards® is that cheap-award show that doesn't really count in the record books.
Let the players vote for their peers for the starting squads, and let the managers select the rest. Like it used to be. I thought baseball was all about tradition?

Parent

Me too (none / 0) (#23)
by ruffian on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:14:43 PM EST

It has been around for years now and I still consider it a new disgraceful experiment. Enough already.

Parent

I disagree (none / 0) (#25)
by jbindc on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:16:25 PM EST

As someone who grew up in an American League town, I see letting the pitchers bat as a wasted bat. Yes, yes, I know there's a certain strategy, but I'd rather see runs score, then see a weak batter get an out 98% of the time. Show me power and save the pitcher's arm for pitching.

Parent

I suspect the majority of NL owners, GMs, (none / 0) (#28)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:23:12 PM EST

and managers agree w/you. Lots of money invested in pitchers. And lots of opportunity for injury.

Parent

Some pitchers can hit, if they have to (none / 0) (#38)
by shoephone on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:08:19 PM EST

Case in point: Fernando Valenzuela. And it didn't hurt his pitching arm any.

Parent

and Bob Gibson (none / 0) (#68)
by jimakaPPJ on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 07:39:02 PM EST

Parent

"Gibby!" (none / 0) (#79)
by shoephone on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 01:07:43 AM EST

Parent

: He owned the inside of the plate. (none / 0) (#87)
by jimakaPPJ on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 10:16:34 AM EST

I saw him pinch hit one day against the Cubs.

Parent

Yes (none / 0) (#81)
by jbindc on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 06:30:12 AM EST

Once in a while you get a a pitcher who is also a good batter.

But it's rare.

Give me power and scoring over a failed (and bad) bunt any day.

Parent

: And that might explain (none / 0) (#82)
by jbindc on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 06:34:27 AM EST

Why the American League has totally dominated the National League in inter-league play.

Parent

Get rid of the DH -- check. (none / 0) (#37)
by brodie on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:05:59 PM EST

A stupid rule put in during the reign of nitwit Comm'r Bowie Kuhn, if I'm not mistaken. Led to awful hyperspecialization in the sport, with one player -- the DH -- not even required to put on a glove and play the field.

Pitchers spend too much time as it is concentrating on their one narrow speciality. Let them return to the days of yore -- i.e. their youth -- and begin again spending more time in the batter's box. A few of them, back in the day, were actually fairly decent hitters; at least it was entertaining for the fans to see whether a pitcher could manage a hit off a star pitcher.

Parent

HATE the DL! (none / 0) (#66)
by otherlisa on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 07:35:37 PM EST

It removes a huge layer of strategy from the game. It's a dumbing down of baseball. Get rid of it!

Parent

Should teams with injuries be penalized? (none / 0) (#80)
by cymro on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 04:38:10 AM EST

I don't think the game would function well without the DL.

Parent

I think he meant DH (none / 0) (#88)
by jimakaPPJ on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 10:18:23 AM EST

Parent

: Really?! (none / 0) (#101)
by cymro on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 02:39:18 PM EST

Parent

In answer to your question... (none / 0) (#40)
by ruffian on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:20:01 PM EST

No ;-)

Parent

Gaffe or Test Balloon (none / 0) (#2)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:18:19 AM EST

I am starting to wonder whether Steele's "gaffe" was a test balloon floated to determine GOP strategy to clean up in Nov.

Polls indicate that the US is tiring of the Afghan war. Reframing the Afghanistan war as "Obama's War" and linking it to the successful propaganda pinning the deficit on the Democratic party seems just about as craven a political maneuver as the GOP has ever done.

I wish them well on "reframing" it (none / 0) (#3)
by Militarytracy on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:27:28 AM EST

I was there when they did the things they did and made the choices they made and rubber stamped everything in sight with no actual debate...just rhetoric. I was in fact hypervigilant due to pain, and suffering, and survival and I sure won't just sit there while they talk sh*t. People have died, children are without parents and homes, someone should tell them that in such situations rhetoric will castrate you if you didn't kill everyone who you hurt or damaged and who could remember EXACTLY what the hell you did.

Parent

Not sure on this. GOP talks and talks (none / 0) (#4)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:38:18 AM EST

and "people" seem to buy it.

Parent

On further reflection, talking also (5.00 / 1) (#6)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:39:32 AM EST

worked for candidate Obama.

Parent

Before 9/11 I really couldn't talk about war (none / 0) (#12)
by Militarytracy on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:59:48 AM EST

One of the reasons I'm a liberal is because I think very few functioning agreements come through acts of force. I had not studied war, I had no desire to, it disgusted me. Things changed though, I had to begin to visit and understand things that given a choice I would just as soon walk around or away from.

This is where liberals are weak as hell in the debate. They do not study war. Who could blame them? Not me, I understand where that desire originates from.

I have been shocked too that Michael Steele said the sh*t he said and his own party is actually the only people worried about it because he looks soft on defense :) If liberals could talk war he would have had been eviscerated.

None of this will mean though that I won't say what I have to say :) Sometimes it isn't a terrific thing to not need other people backing you up and be on your page before you open your big mouth! And sometimes it is a good thing. I have to deal with all the negative things my big mouth places in my life. Don't think for one minute I'm not going to get right in there and bathe in the positives of my big mouth. I intend to stay balanced :) Being an exhausted, beaten down, dragging through the mud to be burned at the stake martyr is the most overrated virtuous existence in the universe :)

Parent

Today's goal: finish reading (none / 0) (#15)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 12:06:40 PM EST

Hilary Mantel's "Wolf Hall." More than I ever wanted/needed to know re techniques for burning martyrs at the stake. In this case, Catholic hierarchy in England burning those who read Tyndale's English translation of the Bible or advocate Luther's teachings. The people being burned are often tradespersons. Not theologians.

Parent

I listened to the audiobook (none / 0) (#49)
by ruffian on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 03:10:13 PM EST

Listening to those descriptions in a biting British accent kind of destroys the pleasure of listening to a British accent.

I think there must be a fundamental lack of empathy in people that can devise or carry out such things. That is all I can come up with in trying to figure out how people can do that to other people. Maybe if you can't imagine how it might feel yourself, you can do it to someone else.

Let me know when you finish..want to ask you something!

Parent

wolf Hall (none / 0) (#50)
by suisser on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 03:40:21 PM EST

Loved it!
Read the library copy then bought my very own. ;-)

Parent

: I am enjoying this book. Due at (none / 0) (#53)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 04:20:22 PM EST

libs Wed. Pressure!

Parent

You Are Not Typical (none / 0) (#8)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:43:53 AM EST

Or average in any way, imo. Also it appears that the weakest sector in the nov elections, illuminated by recent polls, are many liberals who are disillusioned with Obama... many of those are not keen on war and could easily be lulled by GOP lies and propaganda.

Yeah, the GOP seems divided over Steele. The hard core neocons are calling for his head, but surprise, surprise, Steele does not seem to be going anywhere... I smell a Rovian rat..

Parent

Liberals at large will never be okay with war (5.00 / 1) (#14)
by Militarytracy on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 12:03:43 PM EST

Not after Vietnam and in my lifetime. I am reluctant to b*tch about it. As soon as people become okay with some war they can easily become okay with a little more war.

It would be nice if their memories of the wars they have lived through and are living through were a little more acute though. But they have no desire to live this, only get through it. It is hell for them, and when you are going through hell you keep on going.

Parent

L:ast poll I read (5.00 / 1) (#18)
by BackFromOhio on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 12:45:42 PM EST

-- Marist poll, 7/1 (I think) - showed that the greatest problem for Obama is among independents whom he has lost in great number after having won them over in 2008.

Parent

: Yup (none / 0) (#20)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 12:53:08 PM EST

That is the GOP target audience..

Parent
: And those are (none / 0) (#22)
by jbindc on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:12:53 PM EST

Mostly people in the middle - which are by far, most voters in America.

Parent

TL sidebar suggest Steele would be (none / 0) (#10)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:50:41 AM EST

gone by now if he were not African American. Is it possible the GOP leadership is actually worrying about effect on AA voters of firing him?

Parent

: Are You Kidding? (none / 0) (#13)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 12:02:16 PM EST

Why would they fire Steele when he is such a good whipping boy?
As I said, I think that his "gaffe" was a trial balloon...
I have already read from our "liberal media" that the Democrats are draining american treasure after doubling the deficit, in order to eliminate the last 50 al qaida remnants in Obama's unwinnable war.
Seems like americans will eat this one up... clever strategy imo.

Parent
: I don't believe that (none / 0) (#17)
by Militarytracy on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 12:13:25 PM EST

You don't have to be competent or even on message all the time to stay in power in the GOP. You don't have to to stay in power with the Dems either :) What matters more for him is being pretty and having a radio announcers voice. He's pretty. He has a nice voice. When he colors outside the lines you can always back him up and insert the programming he forgot to take with him into the port :)

Parent

I think it is much more likely that the (none / 0) (#11)
by Anne on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:57:13 AM EST

disillusionment of liberal Democrats will translate into staying home, or choosing to bypass voting for the national offices and just voting for the local ones.

And I say that as one of those liberal Dems who never, in a million years, ever thought the two major parties would be doing such a terrible job of representing the people that neither one offered a reasonable choice.

I'm not keen on war, either, but I would never look to Republicans to get us out; they are still just as much - if not more - in love with the whole military industrial complex and its revolving - and lucrative - door, as Dems have become.

As for Steele, the explanation for why he is still around can be explained by the same phenomenon that keeps drawing crowds to see Sarah Palin: I guess stupid is now a demographic - some people will believe anything; it's a commentary on how badly the the GOP needs these gullible voters, I think.

Parent

: I think they feel like staying home (none / 0) (#16)
by Militarytracy on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 12:07:21 PM EST

for different reasons and war is only icing. But....look at the economic situation of the country and two full blown funded wars going on. It just screams and screams and screams neoliberalism. They would never have made good Germans :) Feck the Motherland and the Fatherland too :) There is something comforting about that :)

Parent

About your conjecture, squeaky (none / 0) (#35)
by christinep on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:59:00 PM EST

The thought about the GOP positioning off of Steele has crossed my mind...more than once. I suspect the situation now will allow that party to play it however they want. One of the comments above is that they <GOP> "talk and talk" but nothing happens with Steele is interesting, because the GOP "strength" has been message control. So often, I've thought how stupid the GOP was with their various beyond-the-earth claims/charges. Yet, it seems, that if a person points to the sky and says that the sky is orange at mid-day--and says often enough and with conviction--individuals and then groups come to see a sliver of orange followed by a bright orange sky. Meanwhile, segments of the Democratic Party make a statement once or twice that the sky is dark at night, leave it at that, and begin to argue about the stars, the moon, whether to look at the sky at all, and how different the sky would look at that time in China. Ah yes, there is something to be said for just a bit of message agreement.

Parent

Yeah (none / 0) (#36)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:05:16 PM EST

Goebbels 101. Repeat, repeat, repeat and even the most outrageous lie becomes "truth".

Interesting too, that the anti-intellectual GOP took left wing French post-structuralist theory seriously and used it, while the pro-intellectual Democrats are stuck in traditional modernist thought, where truth and reality are immutable.

Go figure.

Parent

: Ha! Good one.... (none / 0) (#43)
by christinep on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:32:59 PM EST

Call it what you will. The Goebbels technique to which you refer has been called "The Big Lie."
As for whether we are looking at intellectualism or anti-intellectualism--or a reprise of the know-nothings--so much of this all comes down to the communication issue eventually. Maybe the head & heart can work together to get us Dems to the level of being able to communicate (aka: talk with the public.)

Parent

"You are not typical" (none / 0) (#54)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 04:20:55 PM EST

is quite the understaement.

Parent

Here is the VIdeo (none / 0) (#19)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 12:52:22 PM EST

The right wing is even showing US soldiers coffins...

Fareed Zakaria via HuffPo

He develops Steele's comment... even brings in WWII...

one US soldier death per remaining al qaida member per month

US spending 1 billion per remaining al qaida member annually.

Also thanks to BushCo's work, there are only 100 al qaida left...

Amazing, imo. I think this is the new war strategy on reckless Democrats by the GOP

Parent

: they are such hypocrites (5.00 / 1) (#32)
by The Addams Family on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:42:13 PM EST

The right wing is even showing US soldiers coffins...
i have not forgotten the Bush blackout

Parent
: And still no credible vision of (none / 0) (#31)
by ruffian on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:36:51 PM EST

what 'victory' or 'success' will look like.
To the extent that Steele is pointing out the sobering facts of the situation and calling for an end to our engagement, I agree with him. To the extent that he is pretending that Republicans had nothing to do with starting it or maintaining it today, of course he is full of it. Certainly being full of it has never stopped them in the past.

Parent

It is Obama's war. (none / 0) (#21)
by jimakaPPJ on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:08:05 PM EST

He is the Prez and indicated before that Afghanistan was the right war.

Parent

Got It (none / 0) (#24)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:15:43 PM EST

And it was the right war for you until Obama took over, increased troop strength and said he was committed to the war.

lol

The exit plan is to win (none / 0) (#44)
by jimakaPPJ on Sun Oct 04, 2009 at 05:42:15 PM EST
That we dishonored ourselves then (1.00 / 1) (#68)
by jimakaPPJ on Mon Oct 05, 2009 at 09:42:27 AM EST
by cutting and running while leaving millions to be killed by the communist North means only that the radical Muslims believe that we will do it again.
And by golly you are wanting to prove them right.
A stable Afghanistan that (none / 0) (#56)
by jimakaPPJ on Sun Oct 04, 2009 at 07:50:56 PM EST
is not exporting terrorists would be a start.
A country that is secular would be a win win.

Parent

And why do you think me saying it is (none / 0) (#55)
by jimakaPPJ on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 04:31:17 PM EST

Obama's war mean that I don't support it?

In fact, it is dithering and blathering that I detest.

Parent

BS (none / 0) (#56)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 05:05:20 PM EST

Nary a word about BushCO "dithering and blathering", evah.

Parent

Catch a clue (none / 0) (#67)
by jimakaPPJ on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 07:37:35 PM EST

Bush prosecuted the war in Iraq and he did so in Afghanistan to the extent that it suited his strategy.

That you disagree with him attacking Saddam Hussein is well known. But that is meaningless.

I repeat. It's Obama's war. I just wish he would get on with it.

Parent

Criticizing the CIC During Wartime? (none / 0) (#70)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 08:56:13 PM EST

I thought that was bad for the moral of the troops. But I guess that theory only was in effect for you when Bush was CIC.

Che baby, I hate to keep pounding on this, but basics are basics. When you constantly criticize the government's involvement in the war, you are giving the terrorists hope that a political upheaval in the US will cause us to withdraw. That causes them to continue to fight. That causes the war to go on. That causes soldiers to be killed. Now tell me again how you support the troops.

Hypocrisy much?

Parent

I see that you fail to understand the (none / 0) (#71)
by jimakaPPJ on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 09:23:09 PM EST

difference between protesting being in the war and protesting for not being more in the war.

Ever take a logic class?

lol

No? Let me help.

The first tells the enemy..."When you constantly criticize the government's involvement in the war, you are giving the terrorists hope that a political upheaval in the US will cause us to withdraw. That causes them to continue to fight. That causes the war to go on. That causes soldiers to be killed."

The second tells the enemy that the war is supported by the country and that they cannot when either a political or military victory.

No charge for the assistance.

Parent

BS (none / 0) (#72)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 09:34:41 PM EST

Making fun of the president, or not supporting him during wartime invites the enemy to think that Americans do not support the president and emboldens them, according to your logic, and endless spew of comments during Bush years.

By your logic, if a terrorist were to look at your website, for instance, they would be certain that they were winning.

Your double standard and blatant hypocrisy is more than obvious.

This about sums up your hypocrisy:

It is unpatriotic to criticize the GOP when they are in power, because it emboldens the enemy,

It is unpatriotic to support the Dems when they are in power because it emboldens the enemy.

Parent

: I see that I was correct (none / 0) (#83)
by jimakaPPJ on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 07:42:29 AM EST

You never had a logic class.

Parent

When Obama fired McKiernan and (none / 0) (#77)
by Militarytracy on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:42:20 PM EST

hired McChrystal, that was the point that he began to own Afghanistan. Up to that point he was just trying to stop up the leaks in the failing dam that Bush left him saddled with. It was his right as CIC to choose what he was going to do in Afghanistan. And it can never be meaningless in a Democracy Jim when a President lies to his people and gets his own soldiers killed for Imperialism IMO.

Exactly how do you wish he would "get on" with his war though?

Parent

I see that you revert easily to the (none / 0) (#84)
by jimakaPPJ on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 07:58:09 AM EST

old "Bush lied and men died" position.

Tracy, Bush attacked because he was convinced, along with the CIA, that Hussein had WMD's and was building more, including nuclear weapons.

A logical and proper decision. I mean, what would you have said had he not attacked and Saddam torched off a nuke in NYC?

BTW - No WMD's but plenty of evidence that Iraq was trying to get back in the business. They did find missiles with a range that violated the UN's guidelines. Did you ever wonder why he needed them?

Afghanistan became Obama's the second he was sworn in. At that instant he was CIC and responsible for the success or failure of the war.

His leadership has been poor at best. McC's and his command's comments re Obama and the civilian leadership in Afghanistan and in Obama's administration were correct and timely. However, they should not have been said and I supported Obama's firing him.

Now let's see if he will let the ROE's be changed to save military lives and if he will let Gen P convince the Taliban and al Qaeda that all they have to is last until we depart as per scheduled.

Dumbest statement ever made by a CIC was his telling the enemy when we would leave.

Parent

And the ROE are COIN (5.00 / 1) (#99)
by Militarytracy on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 01:44:23 PM EST

This is a war Jim, soldiers die in war. In a COIN strategy we lose them in gaining the trust of the people. In Jarhead Urban War we lose them by creating great hatred and giant on fire insurgencies by blowing the hell out of everyone and everything. They are at war though Jim, they will die....duh! At least they stand a chance of dying for something other than some Republican Failed President who left them stranded in Afghanistan while he was trying to save face.

Parent

bad writing... (none / 0) (#85)
by jimakaPPJ on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 08:00:14 AM EST

until we depart as per scheduled is no longer going to happen.

Parent

: I see you revert easily to baloney (none / 0) (#90)
by Militarytracy on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 11:13:07 AM EST

We all now know that nobody in the White House actually thought that Saddam had WMDs. We went to Iraq to help Iraq "secure" its oil. The 3rd ACR marched right past Tuwaitha Jim on its way to "protect" the oil fields. I know people who were part of that march and who pointed out to the command that Tuwaitha was unsecured. They were told to move on, it was not the mission.
Tuwaitha was broken into, barrels of yellow cake uranium were unsealed and broken into Jim. Finally the Marines did show up and secure the place about a month later, but WMDs were not why we went into Iraq and no matter how many times you repeat what you want to be true Jim....it won't make it any truer.

Parent

Yeah (none / 0) (#89)
by squeaky on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 11:09:24 AM EST

Dumbest statement ever made by a CIC was his telling the enemy when we would leave.

All 50 of them.... lol

Parent

Political jujitsu is their specialty (none / 0) (#26)
by ruffian on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:18:17 PM EST

Steele may just be ahead of some of the rest of them, like Bill Kristol, or just not artful enough about it.

Parent

Digby's blog is "dark" today (none / 0) (#9)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:48:15 AM EST

(so far). Amazing.

Wachovia banksters were heavily involved (none / 0) (#27)
by DFLer on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:18:52 PM EST

in Mexican drug money laundering.

link

I say to myself, why are Bobby (none / 0) (#29)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:26:59 PM EST

Fischer's remains being exhumed in Iceland? Answer: estate. Need to establish/rule out paternity of a nine year old.

Even (none / 0) (#51)
by CoralGables on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 03:55:14 PM EST

when the king falls, it's sometimes important to know if a pawn is left on the board.

Parent

Am I the only one who did NOT (none / 0) (#52)
by observed on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 04:13:29 PM EST

find this story bizarre? It was definitely the right thing to do.

Parent

No, you're not the only one (none / 0) (#57)
by Zorba on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 05:12:58 PM EST

They've got the kid's DNA. Now they've gotten Bobby's. It's certainly easy enough to find out if he's the father, and if he is, the Icelandic court should do the right thing and make sure the kid can inherit. (At least some, if not all of the estate, depending upon what other claims there are against it.)

Parent

I found out I have something (none / 0) (#59)
by observed on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 05:15:43 PM EST

in common with Fischer. And I"m not counting playing chess.. haha.
Apparently he didn't like to drive at all, and liked to walk for hours.
I think places where you can't get anywhere worthwhile by walking are totally devoid of civilization. Walking is among the best everyday activities, IMO.

Parent

I like to walk, too, (none / 0) (#61)
by Zorba on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 05:41:01 PM EST

but come on up to where I live, observed. (This would be a 60+ acre farm on a mountain in Western Maryland). Our views are great, walking around here is wonderful. Unfortunately, you cannot get to a grocery store, bank, restaurant, museum, theater, etc, etc, just by walking from here (unless you want to spend about 6 hours or so walking to the nearest city, and another 6 hours walking back). Now, we grow a lot of our own food, and I can and freeze a good deal, but we certainly don't produce everything we need to live on. (Not to mention the fact that, not only must we drive the car, there's the farm truck, the tractor, the lawn tractor- I guess we do a fair amount of driving of various sorts, in the normal course of things. But we do a lot of walking, too. And planting. And picking. And weeding, etc. All good exercise, too.) ;-)

Parent

"Civilization" being the key word there (5.00 / 3) (#75)
by gyrfalcon on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:37:50 PM EST

It's a never-ending source of amazement to me how most liberal-lefty types are completely oblivious to the fact that not everybody lives in the cities/suburbs and that take-out Chinese isn't the be-all and end-all of living well.

I actually ran into a comment thread once on some blog about how living in the country was out of the question because of the food. As I get ready to fix some pasta with peas picked this afternoon from my garden, splendiferous country bacon and Jersey cream from the farm I get my raw milk from, the mind simply reels...

Parent

I notice this too and chuckle (5.00 / 2) (#78)
by Militarytracy on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:46:47 PM EST

AS IF they own the labels and the meanings :) One of these days......one of these days my friend when they get good and hungry and the big stinky gas guzzling truck stops shipping in their fresh frozen we'll just see who the kings and queens of kindness and People First Liberalism are :)

Parent

to each his/her own (5.00 / 0) (#94)
by CST on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 12:04:04 PM EST

I prefer to pick my fights with the 'burbs than the country/small towns - I love me some wide open spaces - it's the overly groomed lawns I don't like (and neither does mother nature).

That being said, city living isn't all take-out Chinese. Very possible to eat well these

Recently got a farmshare and am getting all my veggies/dairy from a (fairly) local farm (or the garden) these days.

And on the flip side of that, I will also be going to see some local civilized "culture" in farm country VT this weekend at a barn that has been converted into a theater.

Parent

People in the boonies leach civilization (none / 0) (#86)
by observed on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 09:16:48 AM EST

off the cities. I"m sorry, but that's the way it's been for thousands of years.
And you can definitely live in a smaller town and have many things in walking distance.
What I just can't understand is how people actually prefer to get in cars instead of walking.

Parent

People in the boonies (5.00 / 2) (#91)
by Zorba on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 11:18:57 AM EST

Provide the food that people in the cities eat. I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "leaching civilization" off the cities. It's fine to live in cities and towns, it's great to be surrounded by museums, restaurants, concert halls, and so on. When we in the "boonies" do drive in to the city to partake of these things, are you suggesting that we are parasites on "your" civilization? Civilization breaks down rather rapidly if there is no food available. So maybe it's the people in the cities who are leaching off the work we do to provide you with food. I'll share my food with you, if you share your civilization with me.
;-)

Parent

Wow, Did YOu Skip Junior HS Social Studies? (5.00 / 0) (#92)
by squeaky on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 11:24:01 AM EST

The rise and development of Western Civilization was made possible by the development of Agriculture. Being able to grow and store food source allowed culture to flourish.

Parent

What? (5.00 / 2) (#95)
by waldenpond on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 12:40:52 PM EST

Huh? I guess city dwellers feed us in the boonies (just a small towner here) off your roof top gardens?

A convertible with the top down.... :)
Motorcycle on mountain trails.... :)

We seem to be getting this weird band of purists that think your only a 'true' liberal if you live in the city and take a bus.

My dream is living on a few acres off the grid with electric equipment. We'll see.

Parent

: I want an earthship (none / 0) (#98)
by Militarytracy on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 01:37:09 PM EST

I have the plans and everything :)

Parent
: Good Luck (none / 0) (#100)
by squeaky on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 01:48:42 PM EST

A friend of mine moved to southern spain, and lives in a two room house surrounded by 350 almond trees, aprox 9 acres.. she can sell the almonds for about 1000-1500 euros.
She has to come to NYC to make money, even though living there is quite inexpensive. Everyone has solar... there is no grid..
Imo, in order to live your dream, I think that you need to have some money stowed away in the bank...

Parent

My my my :) (none / 0) (#97)
by Militarytracy on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 01:35:50 PM EST

Parent

"The Secret in Their Eyes.," (none / 0) (#30)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:35:36 PM EST

Anyone seen this? Best foreign film.

saw it several weeks ago (5.00 / 1) (#33)
by The Addams Family on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:42:43 PM EST

it's good

Parent

Almost went to see that (none / 0) (#65)
by shoephone on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 07:20:52 PM EST

Went to see "Winter's Bone" instead. Wow. What a great piece of filmaking.

Plan to see "The Secret in Their Eyes" as soon as the weather is either too hot, or turns rainy and crummy again, as it was all of June.

Parent

Watch COUNTRY BOYS (none / 0) (#69)
by Dadler on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 07:59:29 PM EST

Frontline show on PBS a few years ago about the lives of two teenage boys in a small Kentucky town. You can watch it free online.

Something about Winter's Bone brought the doc to mind.

Parent

Fabulous, fabulous Frontline (none / 0) (#76)
by gyrfalcon on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:40:36 PM EST

series. Just knocked me out.

Dadler, somebody other than me regularly posts links to Frontline shows here from time to time. Is that you? I've long thought it was the best thing on television, period. I'm just so sad their funding has been cut back so dramatically by both government and now recession-hampered private funds that they're only doing about half the number of shows they used to back in the day.

Parent

: yeah, i link to them sometimes (none / 0) (#102)
by Dadler on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 03:42:26 PM EST

I think the last one I linked was the one about Brooksely Born and her unsuccessful fight to regulate derivatives under the Clinton Admin.

Parent

Thanks, Dadler (none / 0) (#96)
by shoephone on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 12:43:56 PM EST

That definitely interests me.

Parent

Hot (none / 0) (#34)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 01:55:26 PM EST

Just went outside... 100 degrees in NYC, but not so bad because the humidity is low... carried my friends dog because the sidewalk is too hot... lol

Unseasonably cool day here (none / 0) (#45)
by ruffian on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:38:07 PM EST

High of only 83. This morning it felt so nice. Need a day like this once in a while to keep spirits up. Back to the 90s by Wednesday.

Keep cool up there. I'm sure it feels a lot hotter in the city then it does out here in the burbs.

Parent

: Almost 1 pm here and the sun finally (none / 0) (#47)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:50:15 PM EST

appears.

Parent

BTD, (none / 0) (#41)
by cpinva on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:20:29 PM EST

two questions:

will you be predicting the winner of the all-star game?, and
will you be making predictions for NFL games this coming season?

i ask because, based on your performance during the world cup, i plan to bet the opposite of your predictions. i predict i'll make a killing! :)

I had a good football season (5.00 / 1) (#46)
by Big Tent Democrat on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:41:07 PM EST

So pick against me at your peril.

Parent

college, pro (none / 0) (#58)
by NYShooter on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 05:15:30 PM EST

or both?

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Very good in college (none / 0) (#63)
by Big Tent Democrat on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 06:31:22 PM EST

Just good with the pros.

Parent

: not a trick question, but (none / 0) (#64)
by NYShooter on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 06:44:18 PM EST

did you keep percentage records on your pics vs the points?

Parent

Well Be Careful (none / 0) (#42)
by squeaky on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:25:32 PM EST

Statistically speaking, BTD is bound to be right once.

Parent

: true enough. (none / 0) (#73)
by cpinva on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:28:58 PM EST

Statistically speaking, BTD is bound to be right once.
but then, a stopped clock is right twice a day. :)

Parent

Well, sad to say some (none / 0) (#44)
by brodie on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:34:54 PM EST

of my WC picks came up a little short, too. No more easy picks in favor of Brazil, and no more underestimating the Nederland.

Germany is about the only team I've had right so far.

But I'm afraid Paul the Psychic Octopus is still ahead of all of us, last I checked. 5 for 5 on his picks, assuming everything going on in that tank is on the up and up.

Parent

: never trust (none / 0) (#74)
by cpinva on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 11:29:51 PM EST

anything that has more arms than you do!

Parent

I think you are fairly safe to (none / 0) (#48)
by oculus on Mon Jul 05, 2010 at 02:51:54 PM EST

pick AL.

Parent

Wolf Hall (none / 0) (#93)
by DancingOpossum on Tue Jul 06, 2010 at 11:49:24 AM EST

...one of the best books I've read in the past few years, and I'm a voracious reader. You have to be "into" Mantel's highly distinctive style, which some people are not. I've liked her from the first book I read of hers and I went totally gaga for her book on the French Revolution, "A Place of Greater Safety" (a book you'll get vehement debate on, again it's that Mantel style at work). When "Wolf Hall" came out I happened to be reading some really good nonfiction about the same historical period, so it was a perfect coincidence of "hey, I'm into this subject right now, and I dig this writer, and I know she writes good historical fiction...buy buy buy!"

I don't think you'll be disappointed. It's a long book and I couldn't bear to finish it. Fortunately I understand that a sequel is in the works!

Monday Morning Open Thread | 100 comments (100 topical)

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