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Obama Won't Release Osama bin Laden Death Photos

By Jeralyn, Section War on Terror
Posted on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:24:48 PM EST
Tags: Osama bin Laden (all tags)
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President Obama has decided against releasing the death photos of Osama bin Laden. More here.

Osama had 500 Euros and 2 telephone numbers in his clothing when killed. No word yet (if ever) on whose telephone numbers they were. [More...]

Here's CIA Director Leon Panetta last night on PBS's NewsHour. He says Obama and others in the Situation Room did not see Osama bin Laden get shot. They did not see the raid as it was taking place inside the compound, the video feed was only up to the point of entry. From that point on, they got "real time updates."

He also says there was a firefight as the commandos were making their way up the stairs, implying others in the house on the lower floors had guns and were shooting. If so, then a report yesterday by a certain news organizations that none of the people in the house were armed were incorrect. Has there been any mention of weapons being recovered?

The one minute portion stating Obama didn't see the shooting and reiterating the "firefight" going up the stairs is here.

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    Obama Won't Release Osama bin Laden Death Photos | 102 comments (102 topical)

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    Good. It's morbid. And most people who (5.00 / 7) (#1)
    by tigercourse on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:27:17 PM EST
    doubt he'd dead wouldn't be convinced by a blurry image of a possibly tall guy with a badly damaged, blood covered face.

    Yes, another good decision (5.00 / 4) (#2)
    by Towanda on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:29:10 PM EST
    by Obama.  And yes, no matter what is shown, there will be those who live on grassy knolls in their minds who will note the possibility of photoshopping photos, editing videos, etc.

    Parent
    I agree (none / 0) (#3)
    by shoephone on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:33:05 PM EST


    Parent
    Personally, I don't care either way (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by Dadler on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:41:24 PM EST
    I thought they'd release something.  I whiffed on that one.

    But I am offended at the notion that it's too gruesome to show.  Please, we are in a state, it seems, of perpetual war, we are killing loads of innocent people with remote control planes, we're now in the Libya mess, the list goes on.  We got gruesome in bulk.  

    For me... (5.00 / 2) (#97)
    by Thanin on Wed May 04, 2011 at 07:16:57 PM EST
    it's less about the gruesomeness of the photos and more about feeding the gruesomeness of human nature that wants to see them.

    Parent
    I think it would be (5.00 / 1) (#100)
    by BackFromOhio on Wed May 04, 2011 at 08:16:55 PM EST
    ghoulish to release the photos -- and would rub salt in a wound around the world, kinda like celebrating upon hearing the news.  Nothing to be accomplished here, accept pandering to those on the right who are looking to find fault, and would do so whether photos are released or not.

    Parent
    I'm kinda glad . . . (none / 0) (#7)
    by nycstray on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:45:08 PM EST
    wasn't looking forward to what some yahoos in the media and mass 'merica would do with it . . .   :)

    Parent
    totally agree (none / 0) (#30)
    by CST on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:20:46 PM EST
    I don't really care about the images personally.  I believe them already, some will, some won't, I don't know if pictures would change that.

    But honestly, the idea that we can't handle it is kind of insulting.  When I was 16 I watched the towers come down on TV, you could see people jumping from the top floors, hear screams, etc...

    This $hit is real.  Death is real.  It's gruesome.  Hiding it won't change that fact.

    Sure, they may be afraid that some 13 year old kid will see it and freak out.  But you know what, in 5 years, that kid will be eligible for the military and may be called on to serve in this perpetual war.  They should know what a dead body looks like before that.

    Parent

    I don't believe the concern (5.00 / 1) (#68)
    by gyrfalcon on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:55:59 PM EST
    is for the sensibilities of the American public, but the Middle Eastern public.

    Parent
    Not to mention... (none / 0) (#51)
    by kdog on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:13:28 PM EST
    your average 13 year old has seen far worse, in video games and action or horror flicks.

    Parent
    I'm not that married to my opinion here, (none / 0) (#60)
    by tigercourse on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:45:43 PM EST
    but I think that a) There's a difference between fake and the real thing (at least there damn well should be) and b)I'm not overly thrilled that our average 13 year old is inured to violence and suffering.

    Parent
    Yeah (none / 0) (#67)
    by lilburro on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:54:54 PM EST
    remember when they aired that video of the poor Georgian luger dying OVER AND OVER on primetime television?  That was horrifying.  I was surprised that the networks were okay with showing us someone dying in real time, although they eventually stopped showing it.  Watching someone die in real-time is creepy.

    Parent
    I hear ya... (none / 0) (#86)
    by kdog on Wed May 04, 2011 at 05:00:23 PM EST
    I'm just sayin' the reasons being given to keep the pics classified are lame...there may be good reasons but I've yet to hear them.

    If they are eventually released I ain't lookin' at 'em...I think myself and the nation at large have already wasted enough thought on this one bad dude...not to mention the blood and fortune chasing this one bad dude.

    Parent

    The ME and S. Asia... (none / 0) (#87)
    by kdog on Wed May 04, 2011 at 05:06:49 PM EST
    are in a constant state of inflamation...our occupations do that all by themselves just fine, and if not that then nonsense like Koran Burner Boy down in FLA....always something Don.

    We're supposed to be an open society...lets act like it.

    The only reasoning that makes some sense is releasing the photos would be in poor taste...but then again dumping the body in the ocean was in poor taste, and its not unreasonable to ask for some proof that they didn't dump Joe Pakistani in the ocean.  Kinda late to be classy.

    Parent

    Well, it's not so much how (none / 0) (#92)
    by brodie on Wed May 04, 2011 at 05:37:42 PM EST
    we react here as how they are going to react over there.  And so I can understand the Obama decision on not releasing, but can also foresee how the key pics will eventually be released with plausible deniability by the admin.

    And again, on disposing of the body so quickly, I'm just a little taken aback that our side seemed so hypersensitive about adhering to religious sensitivities -- which may or may not have a basis in actual fact -- after taking out a mass murderer rather brutally in what appears to have been a mission to kill.

    Probably a mistake to dump his body at sea so quickly.

    Parent

    Seriously... (5.00 / 1) (#95)
    by kdog on Wed May 04, 2011 at 06:39:13 PM EST
    what happened to seperation of church and state?   I can't say I'm keen on our leaders doing the superstition thing in such an instance...kinda fishy.  Kill the most wanted man in the world then ditch the body?  Are we serial killers or the righteous actors here?

    And I'm sure Osama fans are sooo relieved we adhered to their customs as we rushed to dispose of the body...why would they ever doubt us, the great satan?

    My brother said last night the body is on ice in Va somewhere by now, for dissecting in search of the terror gene by one of our Dr. Mengele's...thats the kinda sh*t the secrecy will fuel.

    In hindsight dumping the body looks like an err.

    Parent

    If someone doesn't believe he is dead (5.00 / 1) (#10)
    by Militarytracy on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:47:55 PM EST
    Seeing a photo will not change that at this time.  Conspiracy seekers will not be satisfied with any photo.

    I believe showing the photos will (none / 0) (#14)
    by observed on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:51:50 PM EST
    really lessen his mystique.

    Parent
    I think the fact of his death (5.00 / 1) (#22)
    by Militarytracy on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:09:39 PM EST
    does that adequately.

    Parent
    And I suspect that as the (none / 0) (#24)
    by Militarytracy on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:11:21 PM EST
    protections that were around him are exposed, and what remains of his organization and those he was supporting become even more compromised and more people held accountable, that will happen to an even larger extent.

    Parent
    No, I'm suggesting that Republicans (5.00 / 1) (#13)
    by observed on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:50:49 PM EST
    aren't being truthful.
    I think fears of retaliation over showing photos are ridiculously overblown.
    In general, I am completely unsympathetic to suggestions that legitimate or legal acts in the US should be avoided in order to "save the troops"---for example in the case of Pastor Jones. I was extremely offended at the number of people who argued in favor of prior restraint of Jones' speech.
    N. B.: I am not so offended that I will go out and kill someone.
    There lies the difference.
    People who kill because they are "offended" cannot be reasoned with, nor should they be accomodated.

    ok since your last comment (none / 0) (#15)
    by Jeralyn on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:56:34 PM EST
    didn't explain what you meant and would be taken the wrong way by anyone reading it, I deleted it.

    Parent
    I understand. I should have elaborated. (none / 0) (#16)
    by observed on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:57:12 PM EST


    Parent
    America (5.00 / 2) (#17)
    by star on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:57:19 PM EST
    Under Bush was regarded as a cowboy nation - cocky and gun happy - willing to do what ever it pleases and considers "its national interest", regardless of consequences to anyone else. He sent troops to sovereign nations with out due process and consensus and offered flawed reasonings and explanations.

    Producing the photo or providing clarity about this operation is something this administration can do to dispel unwanted conspiracy theories and as a responsible member of the world community. OBL has caused death in other parts of the world as well.

    The theory that it is 'too gruesome' simply does not cut. We needed to be treated as adults ..America can handle a couple of pictures.

    If the reasoning is that the fanatics are going to get all worked up over pictures, it is BS . Fanatics will get worked up over the KILLING of their leader , and dumping of the body in the sea..NOT a few pictures. These are hardened nuts.. they are NOT going to find them particularly or exceptionally gruesome than what they themselves have done (say to Daniel Pearl).

    How many of the (none / 0) (#79)
    by Wile ECoyote on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:30:42 PM EST
    conspiracy buffs are going to look at the photos and say "I was wrong, nevermind"?  Not one.  Why bother?    

    Parent
    There seemed to be a sharp decrease.... (none / 0) (#81)
    by magster on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:44:33 PM EST
    in the number of birthers after the birth certificate release.  There were the insane birthers, and the birthers who trusted what Fox News and their party leaders implied.  The latter group apparently still have some capacity to be influenced by credible, easy to understand proof.

    Parent
    I'm really of two minds on this. (5.00 / 2) (#29)
    by Anne on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:20:12 PM EST
    Or maybe more than two minds...

    (1)  There are people who aren't going to believe bin Laden's dead no matter what photographic evidence we have.  

    (2)  Just the news of our killing of bin Laden will be enough to inflame some people; pictures of Dead bin Laden aren't going to make much of a difference, in my opinion.

    (3)  But, speaking of pictures, how inflammatory are the scenes of Americans dancing in the streets?  Brian Williams was asking people to send in to NBC their videos of celebrations, so they could show more of them.  But, that's okay?  That's not shoving people's faces in Osama's death?

    (4)  War is gruesome.  Maybe if people could see just how gruesome they wouldn't be quite so laissez-faire about other people fighting these wars - maybe that would help end them.

    (5)  When is the transparency coming?  Anybody see any on the horizon?  

    (6)  I don't need to see the pictures.  I don't think they should be displayed on every internet site and news show.  But...I do think they should be available for people who do want to see them, for whatever reason they want or need to see them, perhaps via a secure website that would inhibit the copying or printing of the displayed material.

    Last thought: it just seems to me that had the Congress in 2007 made any effort to hold the Bush/Cheney administration accountable, and had Obama come into office determined to hold them accountable, and reverse the worst of the Bush policies, I think we'd be in a much different place, with less of the balance of power tilting in favor of those in power.  And those disseminating information would be going a lot farther to make sure it was accurate, lest they be held accountable for misleading the public.

    This total lack of accountability is one reason I think we're seeing such sloppy messaging: what does it matter?  It's not like there's going to be a consequence for it, so who cares?

    Good on Obama (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by sj on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:33:02 PM EST
    I'm glad that they aren't going to be released.  

    It's not so much that I think it's too gruesome.  It's that to me it's no different than holding up a scalp or a severed ear.  It diminishes us and glorifies the ugliness of war and conflict.

    Yes, I understand the argument wrt to proof and all that.  I could also make that argument.  But to me that's an intellectual argument, not a moral one.

    Agree sj...your imagery of what it calls to mind (none / 0) (#50)
    by christinep on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:06:24 PM EST
    is the key point to me. I do not believe that the repulsive reaction from "gruesome" would be as much an impediment to release as some claim...just look at all the images of all the wars in the age of TV; and, consider also the blood & guts approach weekly on such programs as Criminal Minds & CSI (the close-up of death would seem to be "all the rage.") Also: History is replete with imagery of those hanging in public squares or being impaled by Vlad along the roadway as a warning to all those plotting against the sovereign. (Heck, I even recall relatives telling me, as a child of 6 or so, about how Mussoling and his mistress were hung upside down with bullet-ridden bodies when the war was coming to an end. Interesting stories from the relatives about "what happened" during WWII.)

    Perhaps, the reference to gruesome by Press Sec. Carney et al is merely a gentler way of saying that we don't need to go to the square to see public hangings...and, this is the beginning turn away from that. It would be good, IMO, to start moving away from whatever the desire we humans have to "see for ourselves" that someone is really dead. But, the need to see with one's eyes that the enemy is gone may be even more compelling than the need to see those whom we regard much more highly at viewings/funerals one last time. As others above have indicated, I wouldn't be surprised that the decision not to release may be altered over time at a calmer time...even tho I would just as soon that we not look back at the face of bin Laden.


    Parent

    ABC reported that Gates and Hillary Clinton (none / 0) (#54)
    by magster on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:24:02 PM EST
    were opposed to release prior to Obama making his decision.

    I wonder if there was something that led to the hand over the mouth reaction of Clinton that was caught in that photo or if that is just her usual default "I'm stressed/concentrating" affectation.

    Parent

    I dunno (5.00 / 1) (#65)
    by lilburro on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:51:07 PM EST
    if they weren't able to see video in the compound then I don't know what she would have been viscerally horrified by.


    Parent
    Really (none / 0) (#75)
    by gyrfalcon on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:07:53 PM EST
    They were reacting to something Panetta was describing, not something they were seeing real-time because that didn't happen, according to the administration anyway.

    Also, half the people in that picture aren't looking at whatever Hillary and Obama are looking at.  If there was real time video on a screen, they'd all have been completely glued to it.


    Parent

    The look (none / 0) (#58)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:33:55 PM EST
    on her face said to me that she was looking at a horror happening. There could be more to this than we know right now.

    Parent
    Or maybe "hearing about" (none / 0) (#113)
    by Nemi on Thu May 05, 2011 at 05:58:35 AM EST
    instead of "looking at"? As someone suggested in a prior thread they could be listening to reports on how one of the helicopters is having trouble.

    Parent
    Report I heard said (none / 0) (#105)
    by BackFromOhio on Wed May 04, 2011 at 08:44:22 PM EST
    Hillary was very worried about inflaming reaction around the world.  

    Parent
    I agree with a Republican. (5.00 / 2) (#69)
    by lilburro on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:00:53 PM EST
    Pour me a drink.

    "Imagine how the American people would react if Al Qaida killed one of our troops or military leaders, and put photos of the body on the internet," he said. "Osama bin Laden is not a trophy - he is dead and let's now focus on continuing the fight until Al Qaida has been eliminated."

    (TPM)

    pretty sure they do this on the regular (none / 0) (#74)
    by CST on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:06:18 PM EST
    with all those videos of beheadings and stuff like that.

    Frankly, I'm never gonna look at these pictures if I can avoid it.  I am uncomfortable with secrecy though.  I said earlier I think the best thing to do would be to wait until this all died down and then release them quietly for any official record.  That way it's not a trophy or a secret.  It seems that may still be what ends up happening.

    But I don't like being condescended to either by my government.  Really they are in a lose-lose situation here with me so I guess I'll stop my griping :)

    Parent

    I don't think a photo of (none / 0) (#91)
    by KeysDan on Wed May 04, 2011 at 05:33:29 PM EST
    Osama's corpse makes a trophy. The elusive hunt did that. Rather, the photo would take him off the pedestal that his followers put him on and would help to bring world-wide closure to the embodiment of global terrorism as a strategy--a germane message at a time when bin Ladenism is giving way to the strategy embodied by the Arab and North African spring.   Just what Republicans may not recognize (.. ( continue to) .fight until al Qaeda is eliminated) or be willing to adapt).   Just as the Republicans were nostalgic for the Cold War, so too, are they fearful of tamping down the "war on terror".

    Parent
    Pedestral (none / 0) (#96)
    by star on Wed May 04, 2011 at 06:44:04 PM EST
    You are right. among the mujahids and the terrorist recruits one of the myths propogated is that the 'martyrs' body never decays, they look more beautiful in death and their face glows. I am sure such stories are doing the rounds in their twisted world and over time it will increase in scope and exaggeration.
    Most of the people in those regions are illiterates. They totally believe all this nonsense unless shown actual hard proof. no shadow of doubt.


    Parent
    Wrong decision. (none / 0) (#4)
    by observed on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:40:27 PM EST


    Sarah Palin tweeted that Obama (none / 0) (#44)
    by MKS on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:48:43 PM EST
    ...should stop "pussyfooting" around and release the photo.

    Parent
    Well... (5.00 / 1) (#85)
    by sj on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:58:45 PM EST
    ... it might kind of wither them...

    Parent
    Is anyone listening to her anymore? (none / 0) (#48)
    by nycstray on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:58:29 PM EST
    Has Trump commented on the photo yet?

    Parent
    She could stil run (none / 0) (#49)
    by MKS on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:06:02 PM EST
    but it is looking increasingly unlikely.  Her reaction to the Tucson shootings appears to have been the last straw.

    Parent
    I think it's time for (none / 0) (#102)
    by BackFromOhio on Wed May 04, 2011 at 08:26:47 PM EST
    the Admin to completely ignore the right-wing noise machine -- stop engaging in the conversation about photos, etc.  They just can't stand the fact that he's accomplished something they would have liked to have been able to lay claim to.  

    Parent
    'They' being (none / 0) (#106)
    by BackFromOhio on Wed May 04, 2011 at 08:45:30 PM EST
    right wingers.  Sorry

    Parent
    If they ignore the rightwing noise machine (none / 0) (#114)
    by sj on Thu May 05, 2011 at 10:33:08 AM EST
    How will they be able to cave to them?

    Parent
    Agreed on the photos (none / 0) (#8)
    by Jeralyn on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:46:22 PM EST
    But I would like to see the video of the raid inside the compound. It's not whether Osama is dead, we all know he is (even his daughter says she saw him get killed), it's what happened in the moments leading up to his being killed.

    Especially since there are conflicting statements (and a lack of description) as to his resistance the video should make it clear whether this was a strictly a kill mission or Osama had any opportunity to surrender. Panetta says he doubts Osama had time to say anything.

    I'm also wondering: Did Osama even have time to recognize or process these were U.S. military forces? Did they announce themselves as U.S. forces? With all the masks and goggles, how would he have known who they were? How could he weigh whether to surrender if he didn't know who he was surrendering to?

    Yup. (none / 0) (#80)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:32:49 PM EST


    Parent
    To: Donald...a very good explanation (none / 0) (#82)
    by christinep on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:47:18 PM EST
    Thank you for your discernment in differentiating a combat mission from a crime scene. And, most especially, thanks for your prayerful statement regarding circumspection before entering military conflict situations in future.

    Parent
    Agree with part, (none / 0) (#90)
    by brodie on Wed May 04, 2011 at 05:28:59 PM EST
    but I don't think this case fits quite so neatly into the wartime analogy.  We're talking about a stateless actor and group here, not war enemy Japan, where our Congress had formally declared war against that country.

    Sort of a hybrid military-police/homicide action here, and so I kind of wish our people had taken more care to treat it as a crime scene, to the extent possible (even under heavy time pressure) and to preserve certain things like the body, while being far less concerned about bending over backwards to appear religiously sensitive (if we were even reading Muslim law correctly in any event).

    Not having his body could create problems down the line, and it was the best evidence.  Though it's possible our people have good, and complete, body photos showing all entry/exit wounds, which could put many Qs to rest about how he was killed.  I hope that's the case.

    Parent

    Direct, non-blinking, accurate...thanks again! (none / 0) (#99)
    by christinep on Wed May 04, 2011 at 08:05:50 PM EST


    Parent
    Actually the SEALs did (none / 0) (#101)
    by brodie on Wed May 04, 2011 at 08:24:13 PM EST
    to some extent -- albeit under extreme time pressure -- treat the scene as if a crime occurred as opposed to what I perceive would be their actions in wartime.  I understand that they took DNA samples of all those found on the premises, including survivors.  That in addition to seizing and taking into custody relevant other evidence such as computers and other electronics for data.  Crime scene activity.

    As for Pakistan's reaction, I don't think we can say for sure at this point how much they knew.  Remember, both sides have an interest here in spinning/lying for political/public consumption purposes.  They may well have been let in -- or enough of their key people -- sufficient that our team was relatively safe provided the event didn't drag out for many hours.  Who knows.

    I just hope they took plenty of pics of the body for evidence purposes now that the body has been tossed.

    Parent

    I think they would call it intelligence gathering (none / 0) (#104)
    by ruffian on Wed May 04, 2011 at 08:44:12 PM EST
    rather than crime scene activity. Seals on a mission are well aware that they are not gathering data for prosecution of a crime - anyone's crime.

    Parent
    Fully disagreed with you, Jeralyn, until (none / 0) (#103)
    by BackFromOhio on Wed May 04, 2011 at 08:36:35 PM EST
    I read one of MT's comments yesterday explaining what goes down with a typical operation where the Seals are trained to assume that 'enemy' have arms under clothes that can be detonated in the seconds when waiting to see if they'll surrender.

    MT - apologies if I misstate in any way.  

    Parent

    Another one - sorry (none / 0) (#107)
    by BackFromOhio on Wed May 04, 2011 at 08:47:37 PM EST
    I meant to say, fully agreed with you until reading MT's comment yesterday

    Parent
    Report by one blogger (none / 0) (#111)
    by BackFromOhio on Wed May 04, 2011 at 09:41:39 PM EST
    is that wife resisted & was shot in the leg, and then OBL started to resist & then was shot - Juan C; but he does not cite a source for this.  

    Parent
    I'm wondering (none / 0) (#12)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:49:59 PM EST
    why he had Euros and two phone numbers sewn into his clothes. I'm guessing those phone numbers might be a boon to the intelligence community but why Euros and why sewn into his clothes? I guess this could be some sort of cultural thing.

    The "why" is easy (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by sj on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:23:55 PM EST
    Or least seems to be.  It's similar to the nobles sewing jewels into their clothing when fleeing Russia or Paris during their respective revolutions.

    It's to have resources handy without having to go get them.  In the event escape is possible, that is.  In this case it wasn't.

    Parent

    That (none / 0) (#36)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:29:12 PM EST
    makes sense. I guess he must have thought he was going to escape to Europe if the time came.

    Parent
    I think Euros (5.00 / 2) (#38)
    by CST on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:31:10 PM EST
    are the new Dollar.  They are essentially an international currency.  He could have been escaping to South America or Indonesia, and he would have had limited problems finding someone who would take Euros.

    Parent
    You nailed it... (none / 0) (#53)
    by kdog on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:22:44 PM EST
    American banksters are panicking that the Euro might be the new currency choice of the international drug trade, replacing the dollar...and how that would further weaken our currency, and banksters ability to make a killing laundering dollars.

    Parent
    Why the Euros is, to me, (none / 0) (#23)
    by KeysDan on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:10:42 PM EST
    less relevant that where did those Euros as well as all the financial support come from.  The infamous courier was bringing money, but from where, and from whom, through which banks?  Maybe, those are questions that we do not want answered.

    Parent
    Well (none / 0) (#34)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:27:43 PM EST
    sounds like he had money in European banks I would guess maybe Swiss banks. I would think that the computer drives etc. would probably answer a lot of these questions and I imagine that will come out in time.

    Obviously he wasn't using Euros to send people to buy stuff in Pakistan because I would think that would have set off alarms.

    Parent

    Pretty sure he still got support somehow from his (none / 0) (#43)
    by ruffian on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:45:11 PM EST
    friends in Saudi Arabia. We will know  at some point . The money trail is being followed based on records found at the house.

    Parent
    Oh and I agree about those phone (none / 0) (#41)
    by sj on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:35:29 PM EST
    numbers.  That could be a true bonanza.  Or "could have been".  Or "was".

    I expect that they're useless by now.

    Parent

    Yeah (none / 0) (#46)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:50:37 PM EST
    I'm sure once word got out that there were phone numbers they were worthless but I'm guessing they did something with them before they announced they had them or even before they announced that Bin Laden was dead.

    Parent
    yep, mostly likely (none / 0) (#47)
    by sj on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:52:05 PM EST


    Parent
    This decision will be (none / 0) (#18)
    by KeysDan on Wed May 04, 2011 at 01:59:24 PM EST
    changed, in my view.   It will take a decent interval, but they will be released sooner or later.   However, in my view they should be released sooner rather than later, and not in response to pressure.  House Intelligence Committee Chair, Republican Mike Rogers, is opposed to release of the photos--al Qaeda will want to harm our soldiers if we do.  Too gruesome say some, as they  call for Drone attacks to prevent a blood bath in Libya and prepare to take their children to see "127 Hours."

    i agree (5.00 / 1) (#33)
    by loveed on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:26:28 PM EST
    these photos will be released.
     Congress can demand to see them. the media will press this. And believe it or not, some american still find it hard to believe our goverment is into killing first.No chance to surrender.
     You know there is a video,they may have cut the feed before going upstairs,believe me the cameras kept rolling. Things like this, common sense things. that starts conspiracy talks.
     what kind of example is this for our childen.

    Parent
    Oh, you were there? (none / 0) (#70)
    by gyrfalcon on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:01:02 PM EST
    Please, tell us more!  What did Osama say?  What did the SEALs say?

    Eagerly awaiting the True Story from an actual eyewitness such as yourself!

    Parent

    I think so too. And better to do (5.00 / 1) (#37)
    by ruffian on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:30:01 PM EST
    a controlled release at some point rather than having them come out by surprise.

    Half the world is seeing fighting in their own streets. No one is shocked by gruesome.

    Parent

    I don't (none / 0) (#31)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:20:48 PM EST
    thing gruesome is really a valid excuse. I can see some of the other reasons.

    Parent
    From my perspective, I do not find (none / 0) (#45)
    by KeysDan on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:49:31 PM EST
    corpses to be gruesome--they are the decomposing bodies of the deceased.  No pain, no suffering going on.  Forensically, a corpse is evidence of death.  Spiritually, a corpse makes me think of the life of the deceased.   Now, a visit to the poor souls in a burn ward--that's pain and suffering and the living disfigurements may qualify as gruesome to some.

    Parent
    Some loons... (none / 0) (#19)
    by kdog on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:03:43 PM EST
    will never be satisfied, true...but, secrecy only fuels more conspiracy theory too.  Is there any evidence besides our word that we didn't murder Osama Bin Bodydouble?

    Dropping the body off at the House of Saud, in hindsight, might have been the way to go.  Stay classy and give the body to the family...the funeral rite superstitions regarding time frames are not our concern as a secular nation.  And any non-loons with doubts would have all the proof they need...a corpse.

    That would have been good (none / 0) (#21)
    by star on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:08:29 PM EST
    I like the idea of a much publicized drop in the front lawn of house of saud .LOL .

    What happened to the Body of Junior Bin Laden? According to media reports - both pak and european - that body was loaded onto the chopper too.. has that been buried in 24 hrs as well?

    Parent

    Can't imagine a single (none / 0) (#71)
    by gyrfalcon on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:03:00 PM EST
    reason why they would have taken the body of junior.  The European press, particularly if you mean British, would have gotten that idea from the nutso stuff the Pakistani press is making up.

    Parent
    Did we have photos of Hitler (none / 0) (#20)
    by observed on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:07:18 PM EST
    dead? Were they released?

    I think we relied on the Soviets. (none / 0) (#25)
    by KeysDan on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:13:08 PM EST
    But, it was trust but verify--we continued to check out supposed sightings in Argentina.  

    Parent
    Nope (none / 0) (#26)
    by star on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:15:56 PM EST
    No Hitler dead pictures and till date conspiracy theories are around.

    That is why it is important to establish once for all that he is DEAD. no room for any lunatic to doctor a tape down the road and claim the 'great Sheik' is invincible.

    Why is it so disgraceful to ask for proof? why is anyone asking for inconclusive proof immediately compared to a Birther? Is Obama WH above and beyond questioning of any form? that the story has taken so many different versions does not help.

    I am NOT sure I would have believed Bush , If he said OBL is dead but we refuse to provide any proof - just take our word for it....

    Parent

    Hitler and JW Booth (none / 0) (#59)
    by brodie on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:40:43 PM EST
    both.  No photos and either very dilatory and flexible stories or a story suspicious for its obvious flaws at the outset.  And a couple of recent docs about both surviving their ordeals and escaping made it to THC and were both surprisingly intriguing.  

    Usually it's better to release all info.

    And it could well be that eventually the O admin will quietly arrange to have this done -- perhaps by bureaucratic "accident".

    Parent

    The Russians released one (none / 0) (#27)
    by ruffian on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:16:17 PM EST
    Looks authentic to me.

    Parent
    Never thought I would google (5.00 / 4) (#28)
    by ruffian on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:17:43 PM EST
    'dead hitler photo'

    Parent
    And you made me read that whole page (none / 0) (#55)
    by republicratitarian on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:24:16 PM EST
    Thanks, :)
    Good thing my boss is traveling this week.

    Parent
    Might be political decision too (none / 0) (#35)
    by magster on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:28:26 PM EST
    He's trying to put Republican nominees in a position of having to pander to nutters in the primary right after the birth certificate thing.  If the eventual GOP nominee had to resort to vocalizing his base's conspiracy in order to get the nomination, Obama can release them during the election.

    Or, it might just be plain ol' handy to have something to get a bump and a news cycle or two sometime during the general election.

    Not saying it's right, but Obama is a politician.

    Maybe (5.00 / 1) (#40)
    by AngryBlackGuy on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:34:13 PM EST
    The images and video are just really horrible and although we have the capability of releasing them, there really is very little upside.

    Conspiracy theorists home and abroad are going to believe what they want to believe.

    All I care about is that the man is gone.  I don't particularly even care in this case about whether he was unarmed, etc.

    I have lots of issues with the construction of the war on terror, but in this case, when we have the guy responsible for bringing down the towers and killing thousands at our mercy, then all I care about is that he's gone.

    That is inconsistent with my other beliefs about due process and such, so OK, I am a hypocrite in that respect.

    But if there is someone to break your ideals for it is Osama.

    Parent

    yeah, kudos to the Jeralyn's of the world... (5.00 / 2) (#42)
    by magster on Wed May 04, 2011 at 02:39:02 PM EST
    because I also have a hard time devoting emotional and actual energy to protecting the rights of "monsters" even though I support that kind of work intellectually.

    Parent
    Really? (none / 0) (#73)
    by gyrfalcon on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:05:51 PM EST
    The "images and video are just really horrible"?

    When did you see them?

    Parent

    I'm not normally in the position of (5.00 / 1) (#94)
    by Anne on Wed May 04, 2011 at 06:36:42 PM EST
    defending ABG, but you should note that the word "Maybe" is in the subject header of his comment, after which follows "The images and video are just really horrible..." which puts what he said in the category of speculation, not the fact you seemed to think he was providing.

    Easy enough to miss.


    Parent

    "Maybe" (none / 0) (#109)
    by gyrfalcon on Wed May 04, 2011 at 09:37:32 PM EST
    actually seems to be his comment to the speculation in the comment above his.  His comment "The photos and video" starts a new sentence, as noted by the capital letter.

    I think my interpretation of what he said is correct, but if he tells me that's not what he meant, I will certainly acknowledge it.

    Not just ABG, but there are an awful lot of people here and elsewhere proclaiming "facts" that simply aren't in evidence, and I object to that.


    Parent

    see the newer threads (none / 0) (#93)
    by Jeralyn on Wed May 04, 2011 at 05:43:50 PM EST
    with links to the photos of three of the men killed, lying in blood inside the house.

    Parent
    Respectfully, those are not (none / 0) (#108)
    by gyrfalcon on Wed May 04, 2011 at 09:34:55 PM EST
    the photos in question here, and there's no video.

    Parent
    Well, Saxby Chambliss is reportedly (none / 0) (#61)
    by ruffian on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:46:49 PM EST
    showing the photos around. Just release them.

    Or arrest Chambliss. (5.00 / 2) (#62)
    by ruffian on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:47:13 PM EST
    I'm good with that.

    Parent
    Me too (none / 0) (#64)
    by star on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:50:23 PM EST


    Parent
    Update: Chambliss denies it was him (none / 0) (#63)
    by ruffian on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:49:33 PM EST


    Parent
    Saxby (5.00 / 1) (#66)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed May 04, 2011 at 03:53:50 PM EST
    is a sleazebag so I wouldn't doubt that he did show it to Ayotte and then deny he did it. It's his typical MO.

    Parent
    Yup - didn't he show pictures (none / 0) (#72)
    by ruffian on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:03:51 PM EST
    of bin laden in his ads against Max Cleland? He certainly has no qualms about it.

    Parent
    How on earth would (none / 0) (#76)
    by gyrfalcon on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:10:08 PM EST
    any of them even have a copy of the photo?  Surely the White House isn't passing them out as souvenirs.  If there actually somehow is a copy of the photo circulating in Congress, it'll be in the papers in a day or two.


    Parent
    Just a thought, that (none / 0) (#78)
    by brodie on Wed May 04, 2011 at 04:23:23 PM EST
    the photos might have come to the WH via our CIA or other alphabet soup agencies or Pentagon, who, for their own reasons, also might have provided photo(s), perhaps on the sly, to "trusted" cong'l people.

    Parent
    Seems extraordinarily unlikely to me (none / 0) (#110)
    by gyrfalcon on Wed May 04, 2011 at 09:39:18 PM EST
    Major firing offense, for one thing.

    In any case, turns out ol' Saxby was scammed, according to the latest info, and what he had was a fake.

    Parent

    The minute those photos are released (none / 0) (#112)
    by weltec2 on Thu May 05, 2011 at 04:28:49 AM EST
    they will become major recruiting tools. Let's hope they are never released.

    Obama Won't Release Osama bin Laden Death Photos | 102 comments (102 topical)

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