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50 Years Ago Tomorrow: The Cuban Missile Crisis

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Foreign Affairs
Posted on Sun Oct 21, 2012 at 08:12:01 PM EST
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Read Bob Stein's wonderful piece on the day President Kennedy announced to the American People the presence of nuclear weapons in Cuba.

Open Thread.

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    50 Years Ago Tomorrow: The Cuban Missile Crisis | 47 comments (47 topical)

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    Hmmmm. "No crowing." (5.00 / 1) (#1)
    by oculus on Sun Oct 21, 2012 at 08:21:28 PM EST


    Well, if Dubya'd been president then... (5.00 / 4) (#3)
    by Dadler on Sun Oct 21, 2012 at 08:36:47 PM EST
    ...he would've bombed Haiti, invaded Jamaica, and ordered Cuban Sandwiches to be renamed Freedom Subs.
    And crowed. (5.00 / 2) (#5)
    by oculus on Sun Oct 21, 2012 at 10:50:38 PM EST


    Parent
    If Obama had been president (2.00 / 1) (#12)
    by Slado on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 11:51:26 AM EST
    The missiles would still be there.

    Just sayin.

    Parent

    Hey, he "got" Osama. And is (5.00 / 1) (#14)
    by oculus on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 12:27:05 PM EST
    up for behind the scenes negotiation

    Parent
    That was funny (2.00 / 1) (#15)
    by Slado on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 12:33:41 PM EST
    I'd like a "Behind the Music" type episode on VH1.

    it could be called "Behind the Assassination".

    Parent

    Don't make me laugh (none / 0) (#17)
    by Dadler on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 12:53:14 PM EST
    Saddam had sh*t.  He was the EASIEST kind of dictator to figure out and deal with, a secular sociopath who really just wanted chicks and wealth.  But our "leaders" have all the imagination of a thumb-tack, no offense to thumb-tacks since they actually do something.

    Parent
    If Ronald Reagan had been president, ... (none / 0) (#31)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 07:35:23 PM EST
    ... he'd have ordered the invasion of Grenada to "liberate" expatriate American medical students from the imminent "menace" of several hundred Cuban construction workers (who were merely building a new runway at the island's only airport), in order to distract citizens' attention away from the fact that 250 U.S. Marines were blown up by a suicide bomber in Beirut on his watch.

    Oh, excuse me, but apparently Ronald Reagan actually WAS president, and he actually DID order the invasion of Grenada to "liberate" expatriate American medical students from the imminent "menace" of several hundred Cuban construction workers (who actually WERE merely building a new runway at the island's only airport), in order to distract citizens' attention away from the fact that 250 U.S. Marines actually WERE blown up by a suicide bomber in Beirut on his watch.

    My bad. Sorry.

    Parent

    The author of this NYT piece (none / 0) (#2)
    by oculus on Sun Oct 21, 2012 at 08:29:21 PM EST
    disputes the "eye-to-eye" facedown, which is the considered wisdom back in the day:  link

    Well, if it was a lie (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by NYShooter on Sun Oct 21, 2012 at 09:46:58 PM EST
    It sure as heck fooled me.

    I was in junior high when that fateful, last day occurred. That was the day the Soviet cargo ships, and the U.S. Navy were scheduled to cross paths. The loud speakers in all the classrooms were giving us minute by minute updates on what was happening. Our hearts were stopped as the announcer relayed the news that the lead Soviet ship had speeded up in an apparent maneuver meant to run through the blockade. Then, we all held our breaths as we were told that Russian ship had stopped. I'm sure there were some wet spots under some desks as we waited to see if the Russians would let the Americans board their vessels, or if the cannons would start blowing up Soviet ships.

    Finally, when we were told that the Russians had turned around and were steaming back to the direction from where they came, the whoops, and hollers were so loud I can still hear them today.

    I simply can't understand, living through those last minutes, as they occured, how the fleets could have been 750 miles apart.


    Parent

    Best factual account (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by BackFromOhio on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 09:33:03 AM EST
    See the movie 13 days -
    A friend edited the tapes of the EXCOM meetings -- word for word.  He said except for the recollections of Kenny O'Donnell, which she could neither confirm nor deny, the movie was exceedingly accurate.  He only saw it after insisting he didn't want to because he 'knew' it would be a Hollywood takes liberties with facts type film; he was gladly disappointed.

    During Bush years, I used to watch the movie over and over, wishing I had a president who was dedicated to the best interests of the country and smart enough to figure out which opportunities fit the bill.

    Parent

    i was in second grade, in a catholic school (none / 0) (#6)
    by cpinva on Sun Oct 21, 2012 at 11:00:38 PM EST
    located just outside the main gate of cherry point, MAS, in NC. this was the jump off point for the 1st Marine Division, all packed up and ready to head for cuba. the adults were going batshit crazy, fearful a nuclear warhead was heading our way shortly. to their credit, the nuns and priests kept their cool, in front of us, and assured us (mostly dependents of marine & navy personel) that everything would be ok, and that we should pray for pres. kennedy, to make wise decisions.

    strange day, really strange two weeks.

    We weren't living all that ... (none / 0) (#8)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 12:52:48 AM EST
    ... far apart from one another, since we were stationed at Camp LeJeune (see Comment No. 7).

    Parent
    I was an 19-mo.-old toddler in Oct. 1962. (none / 0) (#7)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 12:33:50 AM EST
    I do know that we were living in Jacksonville, NC at Camp LeJeune during this time, because my father was on short-term assignment there with the newly constituted 2nd U.S. Marine Reconaissance Battalion, part of Force Recon. We also had a male tabby cat named Samson, who my mother remembers as being extraordinarily patient and tolerant of me at my most rambunctious, which for some reason she found unusual.

    crisis in LA (none / 0) (#21)
    by the capstan on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 02:11:07 PM EST
    We lived just up Lake Ave. from Pasadena, and my 3 and one-half year old went to a cooperative nursery (no, not plants).  She learned to 'duck and cover,' and their shelter was a dirt cellar.  I was listening to the car radio when the mayor said it was time to go lay in food supplies--something I had gotten used to. living near Oak Ridge in the days of shelters and evacuation routes (late 50's)

    Parent
    So, not quite old enough to hang out on Court St? (none / 0) (#38)
    by unitron on Tue Oct 23, 2012 at 10:42:15 AM EST
    Neither was I at the time, as I was only in 6th grade, but back then we didn't hear anything about the tactical nukes also on the island or the missles of ours in Turkey.

    Parent
    Bad timing got us there. (none / 0) (#10)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 10:26:24 AM EST
    Kennedy and Khrushchev had met and Khrushchev had concluded that the new President was young, inexperienced and weak. So he decided to place missiles in Cuba. Bad mistake. Kennedy was not weak, he was just inexperienced and had made a mistake in even agreeing to meet.

    Thank goodness he decided to not double down and keep the missile sites we had in Turkey. So he traded those for the sites in Cuba. As we say in poker, "split pot."

    Some think that was Khrushchev's goal from the start.  

    Another consequence that is not mentioned a lot is that some believe that Kennedy then decided to project strength by increasing aid to South Vietnam because he wanted to show the world we were strong.

    We all know how that turned out.

    Of course if Kennedy had supported the invasion of Cuba and the overthrow of Castro then the missile crisis would never have happened...

    Shades of Bush and ain't Monday morning QBing fun??

    Oh, where was I? Doing what everyone does best in the military. Standing by to stand by while wondering if I would be the shooter or the shootee.

    Right on the front lines, huh? (5.00 / 1) (#13)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 12:09:29 PM EST
    Oh, where was I? Doing what everyone does best in the military. Standing by to stand by while wondering if I would be the shooter or the shootee.

    Heh.


    Parent

    And where were you stationed (none / 0) (#16)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 12:33:45 PM EST
    during your service?

    Parent
    I don't believe I said (none / 0) (#19)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 01:59:38 PM EST
    Nor did I suggest I would be the "shooter or the shootee".

    But nice try.

    Parent

    Ya. Your comment to PPH seems a little (none / 0) (#20)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 02:05:38 PM EST
    uncalled for to me.

    Parent
    He has a history (none / 0) (#22)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 02:49:11 PM EST
    ... including attacking the patriotism/service of actual combat veterans, as well as frequently supporting the use of military force.

    ... always much easier as a spectator.

    Parent

    Well, I really have no idea what he did or didn't (2.00 / 1) (#23)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 03:25:10 PM EST
    do while he was in the service, but it is clear that he did serve, and it would seem from your comment that you didn't, so, to me, your comment attacking his service is pretty unseemly.

    However, if you did serve, knock yourself out and attack his service as much as you like.

    Did you serve?

    Parent

    I have an idea (5.00 / 1) (#24)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 03:57:00 PM EST
    ... of what he didn't do while he was in the service, and I think his comments are "pretty unseemly".  As for your opinion of my comments, ...

    ... I don't care.

    Parent

    More allusions... (none / 0) (#25)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 04:21:21 PM EST
    I have an idea (none / 0) (#24)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 12:57:00 PM PST
    ... of what he didn't do while he was in the service


    Parent
    Go back and look up the threads ... (none / 0) (#26)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 04:36:03 PM EST
    ... where it's been discussed.

    Or not.

    Parent

    More allusions and evading answering (2.00 / 1) (#27)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 04:39:46 PM EST
    a simple question. Your lack of directness does not surprise me, despite all your protestations to the contrary.

    Parent
    I'm so sorry (5.00 / 2) (#28)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 05:07:45 PM EST
    Did someone give you the idea that your question deserved an answer?  Or that your opinion of my statements mattered in the least?  If so, ...

    ... they were mistaken.

    If you want to know the history/basis for my comments, Google is your friend.  If, OTOH, you're simply trying to suggest that I can only criticize Jim's statements if I served in the military (and you believe I didn't), well ...

    ... that's just funny.

    Parent

    Where, my strawman-building friend, (none / 0) (#33)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 08:15:20 PM EST
    did I say you couldn't criticize his statements? I said that your attacking his service is unseemly, as it appears you did not serve. See the difference?

    Parent
    What you said (5.00 / 2) (#36)
    by Yman on Tue Oct 23, 2012 at 08:36:50 AM EST
    ... but it is clear that he did serve, and it would seem from your comment that you didn't, so, to me, your comment attacking his service is pretty unseemly.

    However, if you did serve, knock yourself out and attack his service as much as you like.


    I'm going to spell it out in very clear terms to clear up your confusion.

    Jim's original comment was that

    "Oh, where was I (during the Cuban Missile Crisis)? Doing what everyone does best in the military. Standing by to stand by while wondering if I would be the shooter or the shootee.
     In the past, after bringing up his own service and cheerleading for others to be sent to war, Jim has been asked (by several people) whether he served in combat.  He's never answered the question, but has said he did not serve in Vietnam (the only war, if any, during his term) and that he was in "naval aviation".  Now he's suggesting that he was in a combat role (i.e. "...wondering if I would be the shooter or shootee"), which I thought was pretty amusing, given his non-combat position during peacetime and his willingness to send others into combat.

    Your response indicated my response was "uncalled for" and "unseemly", given your assumption that I did not serve.:

    ... but it is clear that he did serve, and it would seem from your comment that you didn't, so, to me, your comment attacking his service is pretty unseemly.

    However, if you did serve, knock yourself out and attack his service as much as you like.

    While you didn't say that I (literally) couldn't criticize his statement if I didn't serve, you stated that my criticism was "uncalled for" and "unseemly" given my (assumed) lack of service, but that I was free to criticize his statement if I did serve.  My response was (paraphrasing) I don't give a $hit what you think.  Moreover, I don't need your permission to do so.

    Hope that helps clear things up for you.

    Parent

    Wondering if he would be (none / 0) (#43)
    by MKS on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 12:08:55 AM EST
    shooter or shootee.

    Jim may be talking about U.S. forces preparing to invade Cuba during the Cuban Missile Crisis.

    My Dad who was a lifer, as was his dad, was waiting on a runway in Massachusetts to board a military transport plane.  His mission was to fly to the airport in Havana, deplane, and then "take" the airport.  In other words, in this last minute thrown-together plan, they were going to just fly in and land the plan without any covering fighters or paratroopers--who were going to land elsewhere on the Island.

    So, there was Pops waiting, waiting....

    I think that is what Jim was referring to.

    He was wrong though, trying to use JFK to prop up W.  Bush was a very terribly bad President.  He ignored the reports of Hans Blix which clearly showed pre-invasion that Iraq had no WMDs.  And Iraq had nothing to do with 911.

    So, Bush committed the biggest strategic blunder perhaps in all the history of U.S. military action.  We attacked a nation that did not attack us, and did not pose a threat to us.  And by doing so we took out Iran's enemy, strengthening Iran.  Great job, W!

    Parent

    Enough, already. (5.00 / 3) (#32)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 08:11:47 PM EST
    sarcastic u.o.: "Did you serve?"

    Speaking as the son of a Marine officer who DID serve in combat, and who DID actually lose his life in the course of that service, it has been my experience that those politically-oriented persons who are so free with the dispensing of tough-minded bluster about war and combat, tend more often than not to have never even SEEN war and combat, up close and personal.

    Actual combat veterans who've really been under enemy fire and stared at death in the face, tend more often than not to not wish that particular experience on their worst enemy.

    It's the practical difference between:

    • The late George McGovern, who as an Army Air Corps pilot in the Second World War received the Distinguished Flying Cross -- which is the nation's second-highest military award for valor, by the way -- for exhibiting courage under fire while piloting B-24s on missions over Nazi-occupied Europe; and

    • McGovern's many political critics on the right who regularly accused him of cowardice, even though very few (if any) of them ever served on the front lines or experienced combat first-hand.


    Parent
    Enough already. (1.00 / 2) (#35)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 08:21:59 PM EST
    Your opinion is noted.

    Parent
    Uh speaking as someone who has ACTUALLY (none / 0) (#42)
    by jimakaPPJ on Wed Oct 24, 2012 at 10:43:07 PM EST
    served.....

    I find that using other people's service laughable.

    No matter who "other people" was.


    Parent

    That's funny, since I find ... (none / 0) (#44)
    by Yman on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 06:21:45 AM EST
    ... 99.9% of what you post "laughable".

    Parent
    yes (none / 0) (#46)
    by jondee on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 02:25:03 PM EST
    Uh, laughable indeed.

    And about as original as a recipe for boiled hotdogs.

    Parent

    SUO (1.00 / 2) (#29)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 05:40:23 PM EST
    Thanks for asking Yman the questions. I quit responding to him 1/1/2012. His endless shadowing and making things up just got too much for me to put up with.

    And I have never attacked any combat veteran's patriotism. I even honored Kerry's service while condemning his actions after he returned.

    As for me, I have never said what I did beyond noting that I served 10 years in Naval Aviation and one time I noted I did not serve in Vietnam.

    Parent

    "Making things up" (5.00 / 2) (#30)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 07:21:16 PM EST
    Yeah, Jim ... being confronted with facts gets a little tiring after awhile, huh?

    Hey!  What's the latest over at your blog, Jim?  Uh, Oh ...

    "You Don't Have To Be a Muslim To Serve Them" (with a picture of President Obama)

    Classic.

    Parent

    Yup, he's a pisser. (none / 0) (#34)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 08:21:00 PM EST


    Parent
    You don't get bonus points ... (5.00 / 1) (#37)
    by Yman on Tue Oct 23, 2012 at 08:39:02 AM EST
    ... for stating the obvious.

    Parent
    Well, now we know... (none / 0) (#39)
    by unitron on Tue Oct 23, 2012 at 10:58:24 AM EST
    ...that one of those 10 years was 1962.

    Parent
    "honored Kerry's service" bullsh*t (none / 0) (#40)
    by jondee on Wed Oct 24, 2012 at 12:35:23 PM EST
    the way a person says "good morning" tp someone the moment before they knee them in the groin.

    Not only did you and your fellow chickenhawk, purple Bandaiders NOT "honor Kerry's service", you also, in the bargain, backhandedly cast doubt and aspirtions on the experience of other conflicted vets from that unfortunate era.

    Your "service" has been disgraced, Hannity.


    Parent

    Uh Jondee (none / 0) (#41)
    by jimakaPPJ on Wed Oct 24, 2012 at 10:39:41 PM EST
    If you think I would even speak to you then you are wrong.

    Parent
    Uh (5.00 / 1) (#45)
    by jondee on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 02:22:09 PM EST
    you just did General Lemay.

    I you repeat, you utterly disgraced yourself and your so-called service with that purple bandaid b.s.

    Why you're not embarassed can only be because you're incapable of the level of self awareness requied to be.

    Parent

    A great account of that time period (none / 0) (#11)
    by Slado on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 11:50:29 AM EST
    is contained in the documentary on McNamara...

    "The Fog of War".

    You can get it on Netflix

    Parent

    Overthrow a revolution (none / 0) (#47)
    by jondee on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 03:09:44 PM EST
    at least as popular in Cuba as the American revolution was here, butchering thousands and tyrannizing over the rest -- all so that "we" don't appear "weak" to those folks who, the John Birch Society said, were preparing to invade Italy France, Britain and the U.S..

    Yep, messhugga white people..

       

    Parent

    In 1962 I was in Aspen (none / 0) (#18)
    by fishcamp on Mon Oct 22, 2012 at 01:42:47 PM EST
    training for the forthcoming FIS ski championships in Zakopane, Poland.  It rained during the entire two weeks of attempting to ski race.  We ate a lot of strange food.  I was very bad in the races.

    50 Years Ago Tomorrow: The Cuban Missile Crisis | 47 comments (47 topical)

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