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The romance of the working class does not extend to nonwhites for Tweety and Biden

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Elections 2016
Posted on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 12:02:21 PM EST
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I know all you folks love Joe Biden. I don’t. One of the reasons why is his phony white working class schtick. Watch him on with Tweety last night.

The whitewashing of the racial element of why “white working class” voters disdain Democrats is, to coin a phrase, a bunch of malarkey. How do you think Tweety and Biden explain the split between white and nonwhite no college voters? From YouGov, among NonWhite No College voters, Clinton leads 75-18.

Among White No College Voters, Trump leads 58-32.

If you’re keeping score at home, the gap between the 2 groups is 83 points. 83!!

Spare me the “economic anxiety” and “cultural issues” BS.

Biden says “we’ve forgotten about the ordinary Americans” out there. To Biden and Tweety, nonwhites are not “ordinary Americans” who you can safely ignore.

Let’s focus on the people who matter they say, white people. Yes, it offends me.

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    The romance of the working class does not extend to nonwhites for Tweety and Biden | 70 comments (70 topical)

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    Yeah I came back (5.00 / 4) (#1)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 12:02:54 PM EST
    to balst Biden Lol.

    I share your Biden side eye (none / 0) (#18)
    by JanaM on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 09:58:34 PM EST
    When I was a lobbyist back in the day I would have to watch him in the Senate Foreign Relations Cmte. He would pontificate abd ramble on trying to show off his knowledge saying these ridiculous things almost akin to "when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor" and we in the audience would just look at each other and do our best not to laugh.

    We don't even have to get into his unforgivable deception about his wife's death trying to imply it was the trucker's fault or that he had been drinking - none of which was true.

    I will say this, he had the best staffers. I got everything I needed out of them and then some.

    Parent

    I totally agree with you on (none / 0) (#41)
    by Jeralyn on Fri Oct 28, 2016 at 10:03:08 PM EST
    Biden. Great to see you posting!

    Parent
    I do not like Joe Biden. Never have. (5.00 / 2) (#3)
    by caseyOR on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 01:37:11 PM EST
    And had I been inclined to like him when I was younger, his shameful performance as chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee during the Clarence Thomas hearings would have put an end to that.

    C'mon, Biden and Tweety are both old white guys, the heart of Trump's gang. Sure, Biden is supporting Hillary. I can believe he dislikes Trump. His political world view, though, is still seen through the lens of his boyhood in scrappy Scranton, PA. A boyhood lived during the 1940s and 1950s when white men reigned supreme.

    It is long past time to end the mythologizing of and yearning for the "white working class," the Reagan Democrats. These are not people who left the Democratic Party because of economics. They left the party because they hated the new world in which people of color and women and teh gays were demanding, and getting bit by bit, a share of the American pie.

    As long as the Democratic Party continues to be the party with the biggest tent, the party of coalitions, the party most in tune with the changing demographics of the United States, those Reagan Democrats will remain chained to what I can only hope is the sinking ship of today's GOP.

    Yup, when people show you who they are (5.00 / 1) (#12)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 08:43:04 PM EST
    We saw what you did to Anita Joe, we saw

    Parent
    And (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by FlJoe on Thu Oct 27, 2016 at 04:01:02 PM EST
    as if on cue
    An Alaska lawyer said Justice Clarence Thomas groped her at a dinner party in 1999, a claim that Thomas said is "preposterous," the National Law Journal reported Thursday.


    Parent
    Yes (none / 0) (#38)
    by TeresaInPa on Fri Oct 28, 2016 at 05:02:23 PM EST
    His failure to protect Anita Hill disgusted me.  

    Parent
    The Democratic Party (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by KeysDan on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 03:56:50 PM EST
    has not studiously ignored anyone. And, certainly not more so than Republicans or Trump and Trumpism.  It has been the Democrats who have championed school funding, support unions and higher wages, protect social security and medicare, extend health insurance coverage through the ACA, provide tax incentives for public good, and, support college tuition assistance.

    If the Democrats have lost some members of the white working class, it relates more to the fact that Democrats have not pandered to scapegoating, nor to exploitation, as is being done by Republicans with the churning out of fear of the other and race-baiting.

    With the passage of the Civil Rights and Voting Rights Acts, some whites felt that Democrats were abandoning them in favor of "those people."   And, subsequently proceeded to vote against their economic interests. They have been conned but it is hard to admit.

      Of course, loss of manufacturing jobs, the weakening of unions, are a part of the whole, but these factors came after perceptions of welfare queens getting free stuff with their tax dollars, immigrants taking away their good jobs, new skill requirements leaving them out in the cold (not a situation unique to while working class)--all exploited successfully by Republicans over the years, epitomized by the "tell it as it is" Trump. Guns, gays, and god are just icing for the cake.

      Chris Matthews yearns for a time he thinks he used to understand not realizing that things have past him by.  Joe Biden, I believe, knows better, but is attempting to give Matthews a tingle up his leg by masking the truth with the happy thoughts of nostalgia. Same outcome, different thought process.

    My husband asks (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 09:02:26 PM EST
    Can this election be over now? He's worried about his liver :)

    And once it's over...what has been exposed magically goes away?

    I guess I am antithetical (5.00 / 4) (#21)
    by Chuck0 on Thu Oct 27, 2016 at 07:46:08 AM EST
    to the demographic described. I am a middle age (57) white male with no college degree who believes that Donald Drumpf is one of the most repugnant individuals breathing air. I'm not sure if I qualify as "working class." I work. I am a fairly well paid technology worker in the defense industry. I have taken numerous college classes, but alas, no degree. I stated here some time ago that I was no fan of HRC, but have recently warmed to her. I did also state, however,  even then that I would vote for her if she was the Democratic nominee. No GOP candidate was acceptable for my vote. And Drumpf is just an abomination. An individal with no sense of human decency. My one hope is to be able to vote for Cory Booker for president one day.

    Who's white and wants to admit (4.00 / 4) (#8)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 04:59:17 PM EST
    That there is a white subculture that wants to be valued not for what they give back to society, but simply because they are white? And they don't need no education.

    You see it all the time here in the south. (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 06:00:25 PM EST
    They are loud and proud about that fact. I heard I don't need no education all the time growing up in SC and I guess if you're white you don't need an education back then. Not that way anymore though. And there's certainly resentment.

    The irony is that they are finally realizing that the GOP has been lying to them for a long, long time but have now latched onto the ultimate con man.

    Parent

    It's sad (none / 0) (#10)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 08:40:09 PM EST
    They are angry living in a world where the color of their skin doesn't grant them middle class status automatically.

    Parent
    Bahahaha obviously linea doesn't want to admit it (none / 0) (#11)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 08:41:43 PM EST


    Parent
    I don't know why not (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by Peter G on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 08:54:07 PM EST
    All you asked was whether there was such a subculture, and clearly there is. Even in Norway.

    Parent
    Yup, and I saw rebel flags in a backyard in (none / 0) (#16)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Oct 26, 2016 at 08:59:19 PM EST
    Berlin...because anything directly Nazi affiliated is illegal. I was shocked, but then my second thought...why? Why shocked?

    Parent
    i feel (5.00 / 1) (#19)
    by linea on Thu Oct 27, 2016 at 12:39:31 AM EST
    you're just a mean person who enjoys ridiculing poor people who have difficulty learning. i feel it makes you feel superior. i feel when people say they "dont need no education" it's because they are embarressed and they deserve empathy not scorn.

    Parent
    That's the nice thing about "feelings" (5.00 / 2) (#22)
    by Yman on Thu Oct 27, 2016 at 07:56:35 AM EST
    They don't need to be based on facts or reality.

    Parent
    There is no meanness in MT's posts (5.00 / 3) (#24)
    by Peter G on Thu Oct 27, 2016 at 09:29:16 AM EST
    There is an enormous difference between "difficulty learning" and "uneducated" -- particularly when the lack of education is treated as a point of pride and based on an implied or expressed contempt for the value of information, which was MT's focus. Nor did she make any reference, direct or indirect, to "poor people." (And to repeat the sincere advice I have offered again and again, Linea, every time you assert that your opinions are based on how you "feel," you undermine the chances that your views will be persuasive to those who value facts.)

    Parent
    Linea (5.00 / 2) (#26)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Oct 27, 2016 at 01:45:54 PM EST
    I grew up in SC. The anti education mindset has nothing to do with poverty and everything to do with fear. Fear that people will question what the bible says and become atheists. Fear that people will learn their parents weren't really all that smart. Fear that their kids will get an education and look down on their parents (the ones that did get an education never looked down on their parents though. They mostly thanked their parents for what they gave them). Fear that their kids will do better than they did financially and fear that their kids will not work at the dog food mill because they can get better jobs with an education. It's all about being afraid.

    Parent
    Fear that science is going to (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Oct 27, 2016 at 02:02:26 PM EST
    Teach us we're all mutated Africans :)

    Parent
    Ga (5.00 / 1) (#35)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Oct 28, 2016 at 02:53:43 PM EST
    I am a sharecropper's son and do not need anyone to tell me about the culture.

    I lived it.

    Every family I knew wanted their children to be better educated than they were and to have a better life. There were no federal programs so military enlistment was an acceptable way out. Other kids I knew applied for/took every available option to qualify for scholarships.

    In the years between the early 50's and late 70's manufacturing factories moved into the south and a middle class started to emerge.

    To fully understand that you have to lay aside the class issues and the race issues. Most of which were solved by the participants 20 years ago.

    It was the collapse of this economy caused by the loss of jobs which created the Tea Party and the slow but sure rising anger at the elites of both parties that has launched Trump.

    "In the Heat of The Night" and "Deliverance" are old  movies and not commentaries on the real world of 2016.


    Parent

    The race issues in Southern Alabama were solved (5.00 / 1) (#52)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 12:13:19 PM EST
    20 yrs ago? OMG what bull $hit!

    My son had a biology teacher here 2 yrs ago who told a class that had African American children in it that current statistics had whites living longer because white people have better immune systems than black people. She should have been fired, shot down in flames. She was allowed to retire with full benefits.

    Go sell crazy somewhere else Jimbo

    Parent

    Fear that their kids will do better financially? (none / 0) (#30)
    by Chuck0 on Thu Oct 27, 2016 at 04:04:30 PM EST
    I thought that was part of the "American Dream." I thought every parent wanted their children to have a better life than they did.

    Parent
    Yes, actually (none / 0) (#32)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Oct 28, 2016 at 05:31:31 AM EST
    that is true in these cases. They want their children even as adults to be near them and if they do better than their parents they are not going to be hanging around.

    Parent
    No, they don't. (none / 0) (#20)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Oct 27, 2016 at 04:34:24 AM EST
    linea: "i feel when people say they 'dont need no education' it's because they are embarressed and they deserve empathy not scorn."

    Conscientious ignorance is both pitiful and contemptible. Why should we respect and accommodate the expressed views of such willful fools? These people insult my intelligence every time they open their mouths. They're an obstacle to progress.

    And yeah, I get it, white guys without college degrees have been screwed by the system. In fact, they've been screwed over and again for decades now, because they're gullible and easily manipulated by naked and emotional appeals to their worst fears and instincts about "The Other."

    When you deliberately double down on stupid by continuing to support the very same people whose policies are screwing you over, how is that anybody else's fault? Why are you not responsible for your own choices in life?

    Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me repeatedly on multiple occasions over an extended period of time, and I'm the poster child with a "Kick me!" sign taped to his a$$, whose photo appears in "Bartlett's Book of Quotations" next to the entry which reads, "There's a sucker born every minute."

    Aloha.

    Parent

    Really? I agree. (none / 0) (#33)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Oct 28, 2016 at 02:29:56 PM EST
    When you deliberately double down on stupid by continuing to support the very same people whose policies are screwing you over, how is that anybody else's fault? Why are you not responsible for your own choices in life?

    Chicago, Detroit, Watts, LA, Memphis....and the beat goes on.

    Parent

    Ohhhhhhhhh (none / 0) (#34)
    by Yman on Fri Oct 28, 2016 at 02:42:12 PM EST
    You mean THOSE people - the "urban" people.

    Heh.

    Parent

    And the people (none / 0) (#36)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Oct 28, 2016 at 02:56:47 PM EST
    of East St Louis, Miami.....Ferguson...New Orleans...Houston..

    The existing governance has failed them.

    Parent

    Yep - as I said (none / 0) (#39)
    by Yman on Fri Oct 28, 2016 at 05:23:49 PM EST
    ... you're mocking people that live in cities (wink, wink) as being too stupid to know what's good for them when they vote.

    The irony is seriously funny.

    Parent

    You obviously have never been to Hillbilly Heaven (none / 0) (#42)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Oct 28, 2016 at 11:53:00 PM EST
    in Chicago.

    And there is no mocking. Just pointing out that the Democrats have been in charge forever....and the results speak.

    And isn't it said that insanity is doing the same thing over and over while expecting results.

    Parent

    No idea what irrelevant "Hillbilly" (none / 0) (#46)
    by Yman on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 08:49:09 AM EST
    ... thing you're talking about.  Don't really care, since I prefer to associate with intelligent people.

    What's funny is you don't recognize the irony in your comment and how it should be applied to those "hillbillies" that live outside those "urban" (wink, wink) areas.

    Parent

    I know that you don't know (none / 0) (#49)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 10:06:33 AM EST
    and that's what is so delicious.

    And it shows how the Democrats failed policies harmed people.

    It was never about race.

    It was and is about power, control and money.

    Parent

    Logic (none / 0) (#50)
    by Yman on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 10:24:36 AM EST
    Harder than it looks, huh, Jim?

    Heh, heh, heh ...

    Parent

    George W. Bush (none / 0) (#40)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Oct 28, 2016 at 07:39:17 PM EST
    lied us into a war and collapsed the entire economy yet you still vote for Republicans. So you voted for the worst president in recent memory and you have the audacity to hand out sanctimonious lectures to everybody else about who they vote for?

    Parent
    Carter started the fire (none / 0) (#43)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 12:03:16 AM EST
    Clinton fanned the flames and Bush wasn't good enough in fire fighting but the Democrats didn't help.

    The oil bubble, aided by Democrat's anti-oil position and Obama's anti-drilling policies expanded the disaster and extended it.

    Parent

    What bullsh*t.. (5.00 / 1) (#44)
    by jondee on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 03:14:16 AM EST
    there was literally a trillion dollar market on Wall St that relied on the betting on and bundling and selling of those toxic mortgages, Jim.

    On some level you must be aware of this, but there's just something about lying in the service of the cause that you find too deeply satisfying..

    The Fannie Mae red herring is a conservative twofer: it works to deflect attention from the real villains and to maintain the status quo and exploits the crisis in order to discredit social programs.

    Parent

    The links are to the NYTimes (none / 0) (#47)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 09:58:52 AM EST
    Are you claiming the NYTimes is a Right Wing paper?

    And yes there was a market in selling mortgage based instruments supposedly made up of a mixture of mortgages.... no risk, high risk, medium risk, low risk...

    The crash happened when the adjustable rate subprime mortgages saw their interest rates jump and the home buyers couldn't make the payments.

    There was a ton of corruption by the banks and the agencies and the oncoming collapse was seen by a few who bet against the market and got very rich. I recommend you read "The Big Short" by Michael Lewisand/or see the movie which is now on Netflic.

    Here's what happened to the home owner.

    The question is why the easy credit? Politics based on getting votes from the "poor" and the elites making money.

    The links in my comment #43 show that in 1999 Fannie Mae was sandwiched by the Clinton administration and the banks and other lending institutions and folded.

    The links also show that some people knew what was at risk and what would probably happen.

    In moving, even tentatively, into this new area of lending, Fannie Mae is taking on significantly more risk, which may not pose any difficulties during flush economic times. But the government-subsidized corporation may run into trouble in an economic downturn, prompting a government rescue similar to that of the savings and loan industry in the 1980's.

    ''From the perspective of many people, including me, this is another thrift industry growing up around us,'' said Peter Wallison a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute. ''If they fail, the government will have to step up and bail them out the way it stepped up and bailed out the thrift industry.''

    The links also show that in 2003 the Bush administration tried to get a handle on the situation but was opposed by the Democrats. McCain tried again in 2005 but he also didn't really push. So neither Bush or McCain get any kudos.

    So this is not about liberal or conservative. It is about how the elites on both sides played the system.

    And how the Trump campaign has educated people to understand that.

    Parent

    There's plenty of right-conservative influence (5.00 / 1) (#51)
    by jondee on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 11:55:06 AM EST
    at the WMD Times..

    I'm fully aware of the main thrust and emphasis of your narrative which you've already repeated ad nauseum here..

    Which is, in the final analysis, to provide cover for the deregulated and destructive pre-2007 anarchy on Wall St by putting most of the blame on Democrats and "Big Government programs" for the poor..

    Of course, of course, the noble and mostly innocent Bush and the Republicans "tried to fix things" but they were sabotaged at every turn..lol..too funny and pathetically and transparently lame..

    Like the good, talking point-parroting, right wing foot soldier that you are, you're nothing if not consistent..

    This particular bit of propaganda is particularly pernicious in that the result, if followed to it's conclusion, leaves most of the destructive economic time bombs in place, while continuing one of conservative's ongoing projects, which is to blame the victims and provide cover for the big boys..

    As far as Trump goes, the barely educated teaching the completely uneducated is not what this country needs right now.

     

    Parent

    So you really have no way of refuting the facts (none / 0) (#61)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 05:07:02 PM EST
    beyond saying that the NYT is right wing and that I blame the Demos.

    Hey, the facts are the facts. Including what the two administrations did....and did not do.

    And do you really think the "poor" having their credit destroyed by the banks and speculators taking advantage of subprime loans is a good thing??

    I never could figure out why if a person couldn't qualify a standard 5% mortgage how they could afford a 6% ARM

    Parent

    Yes, I'm claiming that the only "facts" (none / 0) (#62)
    by jondee on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 09:42:44 AM EST
    related to the financial crisis that you deem worthy of consideration are ones that SEEM to impugn the actions of Democrats.

    Is that in any way in question?

    You're obviously on a agenda-driven personal jihad and misguided quest for revenge against "Barney Franks", Clinton et al.. that filters out all contradictory information and muddies the waters with talk radio-level caterwauling.

    So, you've fixated on one article that SEEMS to reinforce your narrow right wing worldview, rather than giving fair-minded consideration to all sides the way someone genuinely interested in averting a crisis in the future would.

    Parent

    I see that you are engaged in shoot the (none / 0) (#63)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 11:33:38 AM EST
    messenger. The NYT's is WMD Times.

    Is this also untrue?

    ''Fannie Mae has expanded home ownership for millions of families in the 1990's by reducing down payment requirements,'' said Franklin D. Raines, Fannie Mae's chairman and chief executive officer. ''Yet there remain too many borrowers whose credit is just a notch below what our underwriting has required who have been relegated to paying significantly higher mortgage rates in the so-called subprime market.''....

     By expanding the type of loans that it will buy, Fannie Mae is hoping to spur banks to make more loans to people with less-than-stellar credit ratings.

    In July, the Department of Housing and Urban Development proposed that by the year 2001, 50 percent of Fannie Mae's and Freddie Mac's portfolio be made up of loans to low and moderate-income borrowers. Last year, 44 percent of the loans Fannie Mae purchased were from these groups.

    That was 9/99 and Clinton was Prez.

    As for Barney....

    The Bush administration today recommended the most significant regulatory overhaul in the housing finance industry since the savings and loan crisis a decade ago.....

    ''These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.''

    What contradictory information do you have??

    Can we agree that the intentions may have been good but the road to hell is often paved with good intentions??

    On the Left we have government control to put policies in place that force people to get what the Left think they need.

    On the Right we have Conservatives wanting less control and more freedom. Often this freedom leads to bad things happening to people due to their decisions.

    So often it is a disagreement over trust. Do you want/trust the government? Do you trust the people to do what's best for them?

    I favor a middle of the road position on many things.

    Parent

    it wasn't just poor people (5.00 / 1) (#64)
    by MKS on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 12:24:59 PM EST
    Jim who got in trouble.

    The whole debacle largely got started here in SoCal.  Saw the whole thing happen.  It was all kinds of mortgages--not just low income variety.  In fact, there are not too many low income mortgages here.   Lenders of all stripes just signed up as many warm bodies as possible, then sold the loans, which were then "securitized" and sold yet again.

    I actually knew personally the founder and head of the one of the more notorious lenders.  He got out in 2007, and was one step ahead of the Feds.  Just knew when to bail.  

    Conservatives love to blame poor people all the time.

    Parent

    I didn't blame (none / 0) (#69)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 11:14:56 AM EST
    poor people for anything.

    I wrote:

    "And do you really think the "poor" having their credit destroyed by the banks and speculators taking advantage of subprime loans is a good thing??"

    That puts the blame on the banks and speculators.

    Yet Wall Street took the bail out money gave it to the banks and gave themselves all kinds of bonuses.

    And the rich got rich and the poor got poorer.

    And Hillary and Bill took millions in "fees."

    And yes, many in the middle class got hit. That's why I used quotation markers around "poor."

    Don't let your incorrect believe that I am a conservative color your judgement. I have posted support for many liberal positions.

    Parent

    Nope, not gonna let that stand (5.00 / 1) (#71)
    by MKS on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 11:28:10 AM EST
    You say you support liberal positions.  I call bullsh*t.

    You do not vote for people who hold liberal positions.  When is the last time you voted for someone who was pro-choice?  Or that held any liberal positons?

    Parent

    The bullsh*t you call (none / 0) (#72)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 01:09:23 PM EST
    must be