home

Monday Open Thread

Here's a new open thread, all topics welcome.

< Ohio State Stabbings | Trump Picks More Washington Insiders For Cabinet Posts >
  • The Online Magazine with Liberal coverage of crime-related political and injustice news

  • Contribute To TalkLeft


  • Display: Sort:
    More than just a fantasy-ridden sociopath, I fear (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by sallywally on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 11:23:09 AM EST
    But having real breaks with reality?

    Happy birthday, Emma Morano, ... (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 05:34:54 PM EST
    ... who, at 117 years young, is the last living person on earth who's verified as having been born in the 1800s.

    As far as the people I've known personally during my lifetime, my maternal great-grandmother (on my grandfather's side) was born in Malvern, PA in 1872, and represents my farthest personal link into the past.

    "Granny P" once recounted to me how, when she was five years old, she had accompanied her father and mother to attend the 100th anniversary commemoration of the Battle of Paoli, aka "the Paoli Massacre." which took place during the American Revolution in and around present-day Malvern on Sept. 20, 1777.

    The commemorative ceremony itself was held at a site less than 100 yards from her childhood home, and she remembered being uncomfortably overdressed on what was a cloudy but otherwise almost unseasonably warm day. She further recalled that the mayor of Philadelphia was also in attendance, and that he spoke to the crowd for what seemed like forever to her. The stone obelisk monument and marble plaque which were dedicated on that day nearly 140 years ago still stand there.

    Granny P was a sweet woman who adored her grandchildren and great-grandchildren, and even well into her late 90s, she'd still fly out to L.A. by herself at least once a year to visit my grandparents and the rest of us.

    She lived to be 105, and is buried in the Malvern Baptist Church cemetery next to her husband, who had died in 1902 of "consumption" (more commonly known today as tuberculosis) and thus predeceased her by 75 years. I remember her every time I enter her birth date in an ATM as a credit card password.

    Aloha.

    We have passed that plaque and marker (none / 0) (#49)
    by Peter G on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:24:47 PM EST
    many times. A little over ten miles west of here.

    Parent
    I don't know if we have any relatives ... (none / 0) (#60)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 09:00:56 PM EST
    ... living in that area any more. My great-grandmother had three sons with her first husband, who was her one true love, and my grandfather was only one year old when his father died in 1902. She got remarried in 1910 to a man nearly 30 years her senior, and had another son by him in 1912, when she was 40.

    By all accounts, Granny P's second husband was an old curmudgeon who didn't care at all for his three stepsons, and according to my grandfather the feeling was clearly mutual. It's not surprising, then, that after serving in the Army during the First World War, the eldest chose to follow an Army buddy to Los Angeles in 1918 and live there, rather than return home to Pennsylvania.

    The following year, after my grandfather graduated from high school, he and his other brother left Malvern for good. With very little money in their pockets, they literally worked their way cross-country over the course of six months to join their older brother.

    I always found that to be rather daring thing to do on my grandfather's part, because as a teenager he was a rather bookwormish guy with a slight (if solid) build who wore glasses, and long-distance travel in those days was much more arduous and daunting than it is today. (When I showed my daughters his high school graduation photo, the eldest said, "Oh, look -- Harry Potter!")

    Once they were settled in with their older brother in Southern Cal, my then-19-year-old grandfather borrowed Elder Brother's suit, strolled into the headquarters of First Western Bank in downtown L.A., requested to see the manager and then brazenly asked him for a job, thinking nothing ventured, nothing gained. Much to his surprise, the man hired him that very same day.

    He worked at First Western for 35 years, not counting a four-year break for military service in the Army Air Corps during the Second World War, eventually becoming a senior vice president. In 1922, he was promoted from head teller to assistant manager and transferred to the bank's Pasadena branch, where he met my grandmother. They married in 1924.

    As for Granny P, her second husband died in 1923 and left her and her youngest son financially secure for the rest of their lives. She outlived that son, who was somewhat of a mama's boy according to my mother, although she really liked him. After his death in 1963, his wife and children eventually relocated to Chicago, where she was from originally.

    I've often wondered if Granny P didn't likely marry the old guy for his money, since as a widow with three young children in the early years of the 20th century, she admittedly struggled financially, whereas he was a fairly wealthy and prosperous businessman. That's what my grandfather said anyway, but he nursed such a huge and longstanding grudge against his stepfather that I'm not quite sure what the real story was.

    By the time I was old enough to knew her, she was already an elderly woman in her eighties who had outlived all her siblings. She lived alone in Malvern with her longtime housekeeper who became a loyal friend and companion, and she also had lots of friends in Malvern and adjacent communities.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    Story on how (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:04:29 PM EST
    to deal with NPD here

    Going to be a rocky four years with constant firings and recriminations and I guess Trump is going to fight a lot with the GOP. Absolutely explains why he wants Romney to grovel.

    Good news (5.00 / 1) (#53)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:43:55 PM EST
    Seems a little negotiating does work, and the companies just might get some consumer good will as well

    http://tinyurl.com/gvvth47

    http://tinyurl.com/gt5uhjj

    On Thursday, Mr. Trump and Mike Pence, Indiana's governor and the vice-president elect, plan to appear at Carrier's Indianapolis plant to announce they've struck a deal with the company to keep roughly half of the jobs in the state, according to officials with the transition team as well as Carrier.

    Apparently (5.00 / 1) (#70)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 10:39:33 AM EST
    they are still moving their operations to Mexico. They are just going to leave 700 jobs behind in Indiana for right now.

    Parent
    Does that 700 jobs include the 400 (5.00 / 1) (#71)
    by caseyOR on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 10:44:53 AM EST
    jobs Carrier had already decided to leave in Indiana? If so, this new deal, the greatest deal ever thanks to Trump, will net just 300 jobs.

    Do we know yet how big a bite out of taxpayers this deal will take?

    Parent

    I don't know (5.00 / 1) (#73)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 10:55:16 AM EST
    and the irony is it can't even be a deal because the Indiana legislature is going to have to approve it. It's not worth the money it would seem if the majority of jobs are still going to Mexico. And if they are moving operations there soon the rest of them will go too. I would imagine within two years the rest of them will be gone.

    Parent
    We Don't Really Know Yet How Good it Was (none / 0) (#59)
    by RickyJim on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 08:46:06 PM EST
    Half of the original 2000 jobs won't be moved to Mexico.  But what promises did Pence and Trump make to Carrier?  Link.

    Parent
    They shouldn't have had to make many (none / 0) (#80)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 03:33:35 PM EST
    Considering DOD is Carrier's biggest client. But what do I know?

    Parent
    Is that what it "seems" was the trick? (none / 0) (#67)
    by Yman on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 09:16:15 AM EST
    It "seems" they are not willing to release any details of what it took to get the company to keep  of the jobs Trump previously claimed with 100% certainty they would keep.

    Parent
    Yeah, Trump claimed on the trail (none / 0) (#81)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 03:35:36 PM EST
    It was already a done deal didn't he?

    Parent
    Not sure if he said it was "done", ... (none / 0) (#86)
    by Yman on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 09:26:15 PM EST
    ... but he did say:

    "Here's what's going to happen," Trump said on stage in Indianapolis Wednesday with legendary Indiana Hoosiers basketball coach Bobby Knight. "They're going to call me and they are going to say `Mr. President, Carrier has decided to stay in Indiana.'"

    "One hundred percent -- that's what is going to happen," Trump insisted. "It's not like we have an 80 percent chance of keeping them or a 95 percent. 100 percent."



    Parent
    Didn't exactly work out (5.00 / 1) (#87)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Dec 01, 2016 at 06:15:14 AM EST
    that way though since they are moving operations to Mexico.

    Parent
    "To get the company ..." (none / 0) (#85)
    by Yman on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 08:26:28 PM EST
    ... to keep less than half of the jobs Trump previously claimed with 100% certainty they would keep."

    Parent
    Join the fun (5.00 / 1) (#72)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 10:51:02 AM EST
    Border Patrol sued over warrantless searches (5.00 / 1) (#78)
    by Mr Natural on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 11:52:44 AM EST
    in Michigan

    Under decades' old federal law, CBP can stop and search any vehicle or vessel -- including boats, cars or aircraft -- without a judge's order while searching for undocumented immigrants as long as they are "within a reasonable distance" from an international border. That "reasonable distance" has been interpreted to mean 100 miles from most international borders but includes the entirety of several states, including Michigan.

    The ACLU's lawsuit noted that the U.S. Border Patrol already has undergone a huge growth, nearly doubling in size in recent decades, with the Detroit sector growing faster than any in the nation, from 38 agents in 2001 to 411 agents in 2015. In the lawsuit, the group said that complaints of Border Patrol abuses have increased as well.



    San Antonio Four finally exonerated (none / 0) (#1)
    by McBain on Mon Nov 28, 2016 at 05:01:28 PM EST
    This was another satanic, sexual abuse, nonsense case that somehow convinced a jury to convict the four women 15 years ago. Their sexual orientation was also used against them...
    They had recently come out as lesbians and prosecutors used their sexuality as a motive. The women refused plea deals and took the rare step of testifying in their defense to say they had done no wrong.
    After years of fighting to clear their names, the state's highest court exonerated them on Wednesday, saying they had achieved the "Herculean" task of proving their innocence.

    This case shows, once again, young children will say anything when pressured. Hopefully, each of the wrongfully convicted women will be compensated for their horrible ordeal. There's a good documentary on this saga called "Southwest of Salem".  

    Thank you for this -- I will look into the (none / 0) (#15)
    by Cashmere on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 12:03:30 PM EST
    documentary.  How awful for them.  

    Parent
    Dylann Roof to 'defend himself' (none / 0) (#2)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Nov 28, 2016 at 05:19:17 PM EST
    CHARLESTON, S.C. -- Against the advice of a federal judge, accused church shooter Dylann Storm Roof will represent himself in a death penalty trial that began Monday.

    [Judge Richard] Gergel [of U.S. District Court] ordered that Roof's existing defense team act as standby counsel and then asked the defendant whether he would like those lawyers to sit at the defense tables or in seats behind him.

    Roof paused for a moment, raising his left hand to his temple in a gesture of thought, then said, "Umm, at the table."

    With that, Gergel asked lawyer David Bruck, the former lead counsel for Roof who has vast experience in defending death-penalty cases, to shift one seat over, ceding that top spot to Roof.

    - USA Today, 11/28/2016

    Several parts tragedy (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by Peter G on Mon Nov 28, 2016 at 08:34:44 PM EST
    and part farce.

    Parent
    Roof Asks Judge for Return of Representation (none / 0) (#89)
    by Mr Natural on Sun Dec 04, 2016 at 04:03:11 PM EST
    In a handwritten request, Dylann Roof asked U.S. District Judge Richard Gergel to bring his defense team back on board for the guilt phase of his federal death penalty trial, which begins this week in Charleston.

    "I would like to ask if my lawyers can represent me for the guilt phase of the trial only," Roof wrote. "Can you let me have them back for the guilt phase, and then let me represent myself for the sentencing phase of the trial? If you would allow that, then that is what I would like to do."



    Parent
    Wow, Trump just melted down again on Twitter (none / 0) (#4)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Nov 28, 2016 at 11:07:36 PM EST
    I can't make out exactly what he's upset about. Just lashing out wildly, 5 hrs after meeting with David Petraeus.

    I know most here aren't impressed with David Petraues, I remain grateful to the man who pulled our doctrine together and through the force of his soldier personality held the military together on the same page until he got us out of Iraq as an occupier.

    He isn't perfect, but he's accomplished. He took on a heaping pile much like Obama did, and he stabilized us and got us moving in the right direction.

    So, it was 5 hours. 5 hours after having a sit down with a very accomplished human being he lost it. Did he lose it after meeting with Obama. I'm gonna go look at the Twitter right now.

    My issue is not with (5.00 / 2) (#16)
    by KeysDan on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 12:42:52 PM EST
    Petraeus as much as it is with Trump--and the hypocritical consideration of him for a major post in a Trump Administration.

      Petraeus plead down felony charges (lying to the FBI, violating the Espionage Act--gathering, transmitting or losing classified info) to a plea of guilty to misdemeanor charges of mishandling classified information. The plea arrangement called for a statement regarding giving false information to the FBI, a $100,000 fine (up'd by the judge from $40,000) and probation for two years (Still on probation runs into 2017).  

    The Petraeus case involved  a combination of obstruction of justice, intentional misconduct (his mistress recorded a phone conversation with Petraeus in which he told her the eight notebooks he gave her contained classified material, such as code words, covert officers and info on strategy).

    Given the miscreants that are peopling the Trump Administration, Petraeus may be a bright spot for the country.  However, anyone who is good is not likely to last long. Petraeus wants the job too much to refurbish his reputation--noted in his after-Trump interview, when he said Trump tutored him about the world:  "walked him around the globe, and showed a grasp of the challenges and opportunities."  Oh, my goodness!

     

    Parent

    I understand (5.00 / 2) (#18)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 12:54:16 PM EST
    I guess because I never expected Trump to observe any principle, and I have no expectation that his supporters will hold him to any principle, I am mostly concerned with who is my best possibilty preventing a nuclear event.

    Parent
    Yup, that's what I thought (none / 0) (#5)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Nov 28, 2016 at 11:12:58 PM EST
    Right after meeting with Obama he made his first "this guy must be joking" tweet about the unfair protesters.

    He is never going to be able to sit across from an accomplished principled human being with a core, in touch with their soul. He emotionally  loses it afterwards.

    Parent

    From an opinion piece by Dana Milbank at Wapo (none / 0) (#6)
    by vml68 on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 12:25:28 AM EST
    Trump's `news' source: Alien lizards, fluoride mind control and voter fraud

    Rest assured, fellow Americans: President Trump will deliver us from fluoride, juice boxes, outer-space reptiles and the 7 million dead people and foreigners who vote in our elections. Less clear is whether he'll protect us from the real threats his intelligence briefers would tell him about -- if he'd let them in.


    And this morning, this Tweet from the President El (none / 0) (#7)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:46:32 AM EST
    Nobody should be allowed to burn the American flag - if they do, there must be consequences - perhaps loss of citizenship or year in jail!

    How can a person take the required oath (5.00 / 3) (#8)
    by Peter G on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 09:14:40 AM EST
    of office (to "preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States," Art. II, sec. 1, cl. 8) if he is totally unfamiliar with what it says or what it means?

    Parent
    Hasn't (1.00 / 1) (#51)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:37:27 PM EST
    President Obama enacted executive orders that have been declared unconstitutional?

    I am pretty sure other Presidents have gotten parts of the Constitution wrong, or its meaning, but they didn't have Twitter, or the willingness to advertise their lack of knowledge.

    Parent

    We're not talking (5.00 / 1) (#54)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:48:47 PM EST
    about an executive order. Trump apparently does not know that there was a court decision on this back in 1989.

    Parent
    Please give an example (5.00 / 1) (#55)
    by Peter G on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:49:08 PM EST
    of an Obama action or proposal that was as blatantly invalid on its face as "people who burn the Flag should lose their citizenship and/or go to prison." If you can, I will condemn it just as loudly.

    Parent
    Key word (1.00 / 1) (#56)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:54:15 PM EST
    Blatantly

    Parent
    You can omit "blatantly" if that helps (5.00 / 1) (#58)
    by Peter G on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 08:01:09 PM EST
    you to back up your suggestion, which I am suggesting is a false equivalency. Taking bold executive action that might later be held unconstitutional by some right-wing district judge in Texas is not like suggesting that something be done that the Supreme Court, in decisions joined by Justices Brennan and Scalia alike, has repeatedly held to violate the First Amendment. What's your best example?

    Parent
    Don't remember offhand (none / 0) (#61)
    by TrevorBolder on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 05:39:23 AM EST
    But do recall that there were a number of 9-0 Supreme Court decisions against this d administration.

    More to the point of my reply was that I gather more than 1 president has been unaware of some parts of the Constitution, and have been told by their advisers that what they want to do is unconstitutional.
    The Donald just bypasses the asking his advisers part and Tweets.

    And The Donald is just one of the crowd in America that feel burning the flag should be a crime.
    Washington Post      


    Trump's decision to stand against flag-burning is likely to pit defenders of the practice "against the patriotism of people who find flag-burning unacceptable."

    But the size of that latter group might be bigger than the coverage of this topic suggests. And Trump's position probably won't strike most Americans as being all that controversial.

    Occupy Oakland protesters, in 2012, burn an American flag. (Beck Diefenbach/AP)
    In fact, making flag-burning illegal appears to have had overwhelming public support as recently as a decade ago. It's controversial to attach such harsh penalties to it, and the fact it would require a constitutional amendment makes it a steeper climb, yes. But Trump's basic position is one that appears to have base-level appeal to a huge cross-section of Americans -- no matter what the Supreme Court ruled about flag-burning in 1989.



    Parent
    Thankfully - and thanks to James Madison, (5.00 / 2) (#63)
    by Peter G on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 08:18:09 AM EST
    George Mason, and many other visionaries -- what the majority (even a great majority) of Americans say they favor is not controlling, since protection for freedom of expression and for minority rights is absolutely essential to a functioning democracy.

    Parent
    That's nice (5.00 / 1) (#65)
    by Yman on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 09:05:17 AM EST
    Unfortunately for you,  we don't decide the constitutionality of government actions by public poll.

    But keep trying to excuse/defend Trump's ignorance.  You might succeed occasionally.

    Parent

    I wish I knew (none / 0) (#9)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 09:43:14 AM EST
    Every day I think I have gotten closer now to being able deal with what we must all survive, and then nah Tracy! You haven't really embraced how bad it is. Tracy has no clue how bad this is all going to get.

    Parent
    what do we do (none / 0) (#11)
    by CST on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 11:12:34 AM EST
    Seriously - I'm at a bit of a loss.

    Maybe I should move back to Pittsburgh.  My friends there seem to be fighting the good fight and losing.  Here in Massachusetts we're all just collectively depressed with nothing to do but wait for the hammer.  Just feels useless.

    Parent

    I was thinking about you yesterday, CST. (none / 0) (#13)
    by vml68 on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 11:37:25 AM EST
    Actually, I was thinking about your sister and her family :-). Are they still considering leaving the US?
    Husband and I are thinking of bailing. The US has been good to us but maybe the time has come to move on.

    Parent
    They are waiting for now (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by CST on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 12:45:32 PM EST
    My brother in law can't go back to his country.  They are waiting to see what happens with Erdogan.  If Trump decides to play nice and start sending people back to Turkey they will probably leave.  They're looking into options for where - Canada just changed the rules and made it a lot harder.

    My brother in law has done this before and doesn't really want to do it again.  My sister is making plans just in case.

    Parent

    I'm very sorry CST :( (none / 0) (#19)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 12:55:10 PM EST
    We will see (5.00 / 2) (#22)
    by CST on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 01:25:14 PM EST
    We might all have a role to play in the days to come.  I'm just trying to figure out how I can best prepare for whatever may be needed.  If we need more Democrats in purple states that's one thing.  If we need secret rooms in blue states that's another.  If we're all gonna die in a nuclear war that's a third thing entirely.

    And I think the hardest part of all will be determining which one it will be.  

    It's not lost on me that I'm only here because my grandmother left Germany in the 30s - years before WW2 broke out.  Or that we have term limits in the United States and most of the worst that Hitler (or Erdogan, or Putin) accomplished came after they'd already held power for many years, in countries without long established democratic controls - although less than 8 years...

    Parent

    I was just reading at Slate how weak Trump (none / 0) (#25)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 02:10:50 PM EST
    Really is. Emotionally he's very weak and needy. He must be loved. I hope his childish need to be loved can somehow lead him to not, in the end, destroy our nation.

    Parent
    Can't blame your BIL. My family has done this (none / 0) (#24)
    by vml68 on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 01:47:09 PM EST
    before too and would rather not do it again. If it were just my husband and me, we would hang around.

    We convinced my parents to become US residents so that we could keep an eye on them and not have to fly half way across the globe everytime they need help (they are now in their early 70s). Right now they can get health insurance through Obamacare and would be eligible for Medicare if they decided to become citizens. But, if we lose those options, I don't want to stick around.

    Parent

    He has deleted it now CST (none / 0) (#14)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 11:45:56 AM EST
    The NYTimes tweeted that using one tweet Donald Trump managed to make two proposals that the Supreme Court long ago determined were Unconstitutional.

    (Orange fist shaking in the air) DAMN YOU TIMES! You wanna love me, stop denying it!

    You know who I blame? David Petraeus! He started this, walking in there a Veteran all puffy with been there and really done that. He didn't explain to Donald Trump that when your ego feels inadequate and threatened, you don't just reach for shooting looters to make yourself immediately feel better ;)

    Parent

    And I read a security analysis of Trump staying (none / 0) (#10)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 09:54:23 AM EST
    At Trump Tower. Manhattan cannot be protected effectively. If a Kansas City size truck bomb goes off trying to destroy Trump Tower, probably not much security can do. What are ya going to do? Prevent delivery trucks from servicing Manhattan? She said Trump is placing all of his Manhattan neighbors at risk and if she was one of them, time to move, because anyone looking to take him out is going to do something in your vicinity. As his neighbor, you are in great danger on 5th avenue.

    He has reportedly only taken 2 of his daily security briefings. He just doesn't need them.

    Parent

    Losing citizenship? (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by KeysDan on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 02:36:19 PM EST
    Aside from renouncing citizenship in various ways, natural born citizens, according to the Immigration and Naturalization Act (Sect 349) citizenship can only be revoked upon conviction of treason or attempting to overthrow the government.  

    Naturalized citizens are more vulnerable in that any fraud in the naturalization process could result in revocation.  But, then, American flag burning equating with conviction of treason or conspiracy to overthrow is not a stretch for a fascist government.

    In any event, protests must become updated to the Trump twitter age. Burning of the American flag is one of the passe means of protest.  Better, and more maddening to the Trump Administration would be the protest of burning the Confederate Battle Flag.

    Parent

    Even more maddening... (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by kdog on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 02:58:45 PM EST
    would be burning US currency in protest.

    Place a flag and a stack of Benjamins in close proximity to a fire and see which one Trump, and half the scoundrels who take refuge in patriotism, will risk burning their grubby little fingers to save from the flames.

    Parent

    Reminds me of one of Abbie Hoffman's (none / 0) (#38)
    by Peter G on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 05:09:24 PM EST
    "Steal this Book" (none / 0) (#64)
    by Mr Natural on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 08:43:14 AM EST
    Seen through the eyes of a child those were interesting times.

    Parent
    "Steal This Book" is... (none / 0) (#68)
    by kdog on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 09:32:27 AM EST
    a personal fave...and yes, I stole it.  Abbie speaks, I listen;)

    Parent
    Dancing bear, they don't need our few (none / 0) (#44)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 06:05:25 PM EST
    Benjamins. We are worth much more jailed, processed, made an example of new found treasons, yet beautifully out of the way. They own the entire system that generates and passes out the Benjamins now.

    Parent
    I don't think thee who owns... (none / 0) (#46)
    by kdog on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 06:25:14 PM EST
    the sh:tstem is really left up to things like elections...though they are certainly not without consequence.

    Parent
    Anyone who proposes to criminalize ... (none / 0) (#20)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 01:02:05 PM EST
    ... the act of burning of a U.S. flag in public protest, is effectively wiping his a$$ with the U.S. Constitution.

    But in all honesty, the media is irresponsibly wasting everyone's time by focusing so relentlessly on Trump's silly and outrageous tweets, which at this point in time are a K-Mart "Blue Light Special" at a dime a dozen. These are really not news anymore. Rather, they're starting to look more and more like a series of calculated and very deliberate distractions.

    That's because while our media people are in meltdown mode over a flag-burning proposal that really doesn't even come close to passing constitutional muster, they're ignoring Trump's latest controversial nomination of Congressman Tom Price (R-GA) as Secretary of Health & Human Services. Price is an ardent Obamacare foe who'd further try to undo Hillary Clinton's State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP), given the opportunity. And he's just been given that opportunity.

    But, hey. Must. Chase. Shiny. Objects.

    Parent

    Why do you say the proposal (5.00 / 3) (#21)
    by Peter G on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 01:17:46 PM EST
    "doesn't even come close" to being constitutional, Donald? You and I might like to think so, but both of the Supreme Court decisions he contradicted or showed his ignorance of yesterday were decided by 5-4 votes.

    Parent
    Peter, this is so scary (none / 0) (#26)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 02:18:01 PM EST
    Please tell me Nixon was this scary. I never thought my grandparents were scared. Please tell me they put one over on me because I was a kid. Please tell me we've pulled through something like this before.

    Parent
    Nixon was absolutely as scary (5.00 / 3) (#57)
    by Peter G on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:54:49 PM EST
    But nowhere near as public and unashamed about it.  Nixon was a Duke Law School grad. He had argued a First Amendment case before the U.S. Supreme Court.  He knew very well that what he was doing was illegal (but for the fact that he believed he was above the law). (The White House tapes revealed him also to be a racist and an anti-semite.) Tr*mp speaks (and tweets) from the gut, and doesn't care to know or learn, as far as I can tell. Whether he will act as he speaks and tweets remains to be seen.

    Parent
    While there's obviously cause for concern, I can't peer into the future and predict with any real degree of accuracy what will actually happen and further, I'm not even going to try. Respectfully, neither should you. We won't serve ourselves well in these challenging times by going into Chicken Little mode.

    Yes, we may well be headed toward a full-blown dystopian nightmare that's worthy of Stanley Kubrick's "A Clockwork Orange" -- but then again, we may not be. Let's just take this one day at a time, see what unfolds, and cross those bridges if and when we ever get there.

    Keep the faith, Peter. We will survive, 'cause old bleedin' heart libtard basterds like you and me never go down easily without one helluva fight. When push comes to shove, we're the toughest guys alive.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    My Trump epiphany (none / 0) (#23)
    by MKS on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 01:39:58 PM EST
    I finally got Trump.  It was when he gave his victory speech.  He entered to this loud, grandiose music.  At first, I thought it was a Caesar imitation.  

    But no, the music was more like what you hear at Frontierland in Disneyland. Big, bold, brash, ambitious, fresh.  American.  That is when it hit me.

    Trump is from the early 19th Century.  He is resurrecting Manifest Destiny. America winning and taking the Continent.  Native Americans, get out of the way.  People of Color, stay in your place.  America is for Americans.  For winners. He is trying to be Andrew Jackson.

    Or, like Bill "the butcher" Cutting, the Gangs of New York character played by Daniel Day Lewis.  A true American.  

    Yes, and "The Butcher," (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by KeysDan on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 02:41:32 PM EST
    worked under the helm of Boss Tweed (Jim Broadbent).  And, now we have "Boss Tweet."

    Parent
    More like (none / 0) (#50)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:37:03 PM EST
    Andrew Jackson

    Parent
    Not what most people would expect (none / 0) (#30)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 03:27:51 PM EST
    but Malibu, CA, is mostly rural and has a mountain lion population.

    Yesterday, after a known and monitored lion, P-45, killed almost a dozen alpacas and a goat over the weekend at a couple Malibu ranches, one of the ranchers was given a 10-day permit to hunt and kill P-45.

    There are a bunch of alpaca ranches in Malibu, the one I am friends with built a well-protected area and bring their animals into it every night.

    Seems like a reasonable thing to do.

    Isn't the Alpaca thing.. (none / 0) (#31)
    by kdog on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 03:42:47 PM EST
    just a tax deduction scheme though Sarc?

    I agree it's reasonable when people are at risk, or even legitimate livestock that provides dairy and meat for people to eat...but if it is true that people only really raise Alpacas for a tax deduction, I think I feel sorry for P-45.  Mountain Lions gotta eat too, a glorified tax scam is what I'd call fair game...pun intended.

    Parent

    This is an animal... (5.00 / 2) (#35)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 04:26:00 PM EST
    that is basically killing for sport instead of subsistance. That makes it dangerous (even to humans).  

    Pumas normally make a kill and drag it off and bury it to feed for an extended time.  They don't usually make any other kills during that time unless directly threatened.  To kill 10 alpacas in a night is very out of the ordinary.

    Parent

    Ya, I agree. (none / 0) (#36)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 04:44:24 PM EST
    Just realized I didn't link to the story, here it is.

    Parent
    Sounds like P-45... (none / 0) (#39)
    by kdog on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 05:10:10 PM EST
    is exhibiting some human qualities.

    Perhaps it is prudent to shoot the motherf#cker down.

    Parent

    Not new, but a very dominant cat (none / 0) (#45)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 06:19:24 PM EST
    There was one killing cattle for sport around Dayton WY 3 decades ago. They issued a special permit to the highest bidder. I don't know what the final bid was but the hunter wanted to use a bow. I guess it was his call to make. He was using special arrows for predators. The tech has probably improved since.

    They tracked him to a tree where he was lounging in the branches. The winning hunter did not miss a shot, but four arrows in and the cat jumped out of the tree and was coming for the hunter when the fifth arrow finally brought him down. I knew one of the game wardens there. The measured skull span of that entitled kitty was a record.

    Will the gene pool be better off without them?

    Parent

    Our kitty stays indoors and is well-fed. (none / 0) (#52)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:40:54 PM EST
    He's snoozing in his basket by the window next to my desk, even as I type. Cats are much more compatible when they're lounge acts.

    ;-D

    Seriously though, a large cat like a mountain lion that kills for its own thrill, rather than sustenance, poses a potential menace to humans, particularly small children.

    Surrounded as it is by several large mountain ranges, the L.A. metro area is blessed to have an abundance of wilderness and wildlife right at its very doorstep. Residents in the foothill regions are generally very aware and tolerant of the presence of mountain lions, bobcats, black bears and other furry creatures in their midst, and are even protective of them to a point.

    (Here's some recent video of local wildlife in the San Gabriel Mountains National Monument, which was recorded near the Johnston Peak area just to the north of Glendora, where my brother lives. You can see the city lights in some of the nighttime footage. The diversity of wildlife in such close proximity to urban communities is pretty amazing.)

    But if there's an incident where someone gets attacked or even killed by a mountain lion or bear, public attitudes can change in a big hurry. Such attacks in Southern California have admittedly been quite rare, but they have occurred. I hate to see a mountain lion put down, but P-45 sounds overly aggressive, and a lot of people live in communities in the Santa Monica Mountains behind Malibu. It's better to be safe than sorry.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    My grandmother had one stalk her (none / 0) (#69)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 09:40:57 AM EST
    She was house sitting a home on Cheyenne mountain. The owners put corn out for the deer. She was doing this and said she felt watched. The second time she did it she saw the cat observing her. She very slowly made her way back to the house. The cat walked around to the front of the house, and laid across the front sidewalk. She had to call law enforcement to help her leave :) Kitty was tranquilized and relocated

    Parent
    Well, here is the National Park Service (none / 0) (#76)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 11:47:10 AM EST
    statement:

    National Park Service Statement on Mountain Lion P-45:

    "We extend our condolences to those who have lost a pet or animal as a result of being preyed upon by native wildlife. This is extremely unfortunate for everyone.

    Our partners at the California Department of Fish & Wildlife (CDFW) have issued a permit, as they are required under state law, for the mountain lion known as P-45 to be killed within 10 days.

    Although we conduct research on the local mountain lion population, CDFW is responsible for managing the state's wildlife.

    We respect the legal process that is currently underway, but also suggest that we all need to work together in the future to ensure that pets and livestock are safe and that mountain lions can continue to roam in the Santa Monica Mountains, as they have done for millennia.

    To that end, we are co-hosting a workshop tomorrow night with CDFW (http://bit.ly/2faU2sF) that will offer simple and affordable solutions to protect animals in safe enclosures. We have worked with a number of landowners in the past to develop solutions that have successfully protected goats and alpacas.

    The only long-term solution to keeping mountain lions in these mountains is mountain-lion proof enclosures for otherwise defenseless animals.

    Eliminating P-45 does not solve the problem, especially given there are at least four mountain lions in the Santa Monica Mountains that have killed livestock over the past year.

    Nor is P-45's behavior abnormal or aberrant in any way, even if the number of animals killed is large. In a typical natural setting, animals flee from a mountain lion attack, but if animals are stuck in an unsecured pen, a mountain lion's natural response can be to prey upon all available animals.

    We look forward to working with local residents and our partners to keep pets and livestock safe and also to keep these mountains wild."



    Parent
    Good question, not sure. (none / 0) (#32)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 04:01:48 PM EST
    My friends told me they "made" over 90K last year from their alpacas, though I would bet that was sales and not profits. They breed them and sell the babies to other ranches. There is a good market for their fur, they shear them like sheep. My friends also have a vineyard.

    Both seem like legit businesses to me. The animals are not cheap to buy and then there is pasturing, feeding, vet bills, etc. Sounds legit to me.

    fwiw, there are tons of mountain lions' natural food around - deer. And it's rutting season right now so the deer are basically stoopid fearless.

    I think it's reasonable to build a protected area and put the alpacas in it at night like my friends did.

    Doing that has got to be less expensive than having 10 of your alpacas killed in one night.

    Parent

    Looks like I'm well behind the Alpaca curve... (5.00 / 1) (#40)
    by kdog on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 05:28:37 PM EST
    the bubble burst bigtime. Linkage


    Parent
    kdog, here's a bet you might want to toss (none / 0) (#41)
    by BTAL on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 05:32:43 PM EST
    a couple sheckles at and get in early (related because of it being in CA)

    Moo! Cows Targeted in Global Warming Battle

    Whoda thunk that cow flatulence could be a bubble opportunity.  ;-)


    Parent

    California is hardcore... (5.00 / 1) (#43)
    by kdog on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 05:40:43 PM EST
    Whoever figures out cheap and efficient methane energy is gonna rule Bartertown and keep me in steak.

    Parent
    Great article. fwiw, the tax deduction (none / 0) (#47)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 07:00:04 PM EST
    "scheme" as you put it, at least as outlined in the article, is not what I think you think it is.

    Here is the quote from the article:

    Due to a clause in the Jobs and Growth Tax Relief Reconciliation Act, passed in 2003, the tax benefits to an aspiring serious breeder were even greater. From an article on an alpaca breeder's website:

    "The fact is that Uncle Sam will pay for a portion of the cost of acquiring your herd, assuming you are currently paying income tax and plan to continue paying income tax over the next six years. You can write 100% of your original purchase price off, up to a maximum of $250,000, in the year of purchase.""

    First of all, the quote may very well not at all be true, since it was written by some jamoke trying to convince you to buy his stuff.

    However...

    Any business can, and does, subtract its business expenses from its sales to arrive at profit, and then it gets taxed on that profit.

    Those business expenses are regulated by the gvt in how and when they can be deducted.

    Some business expenses, like the telephone bill, are deducted in the year the expenses are incurred.

    Other expenses, like, say, a real estate purchase, are regulated such that they are defined as assets and are only deductible (depreciated) over a number of years, like 20 years. So the business deducts 1/20 of the cost of the real estate asset every year for 20 years from its sales.

    Clearly, if the business could deduct the entire real estate purchase in year one, that would reduce the profit in year one by a lot, by the whole purchase amount, but not reduce the profit at all in the following years.

    If the guy was accurate in what he wrote, it looks like the Act allows alpaca businesses to deduct the cost of the animals they buy in the first year that they purchase them - up to a 250K limit.

    I'm no accountant, but if the alpacas were purchased for resale, and thus are inventory, they should be deductible in the year they were purchased.

    If they are used for producing fur, or milk, or something, over a number of years, then they should probably be classified as assets, and their cost would be deducted (depreciated) over a number of years.

    So, maybe the tax "benefit" is the ability to deduct 250K of livestock purchases in year one vs spreading the deduction out over a number of years.

    Either way, the alpaca businesses still deduct the same amount of business expenses, they simply deducted some of them sooner.

    Parent

    I see your point... (none / 0) (#62)
    by kdog on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 06:36:11 AM EST
    Donnie is way out of his element with this tangled web of tax code...I'm a 1040ez tell me what I owe guy, in part because it's a game I have little stomach for. I don't know how you business owners can stand it!

    I didn't mean to imply the Alpaca business was somehow unique in this regard...though I think it's fair to say the explosion in domestic Alpaca breeding could be most attributed to the tax benefits, not demand for Alpaca products.

    It's interesting how tax code can lead to all kinds of behavior...like my arse driving 30 miles for cigarettes when theres a 7-11 around the corner;)

     

    Parent

    Ha! Ya, just had a discussion with my kids (none / 0) (#75)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 11:29:33 AM EST
    the other night about taxes and tax-avoidance behaviors. NY'rs driving to NJ or CT to buy their cigs was the example I used.

    Our tax codes in some ways make sense, but like just about any law our gvt passes, there are always some seemingly completely illogical "sweeteners" thrown in for particular businesses or industries that made an appeal to the lawmakers and were able to find a empathetic ear.

    But, back to alpacas, from reading a few more articles, my guess is that most alpaca ranchers in Malibu are losing money on their animals. Glad I never got caught up in the craze!

    Parent

    I was going to say... (5.00 / 1) (#77)
    by kdog on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 11:50:06 AM EST
    any Alpaca tax benefits have surely been consumed by losses by now...unless you got out and sold your flock before the bubble burst.  

    In addition to illogical sweeteners, I'd add the unintended consequences of using the tax code to  induce/regulate behaviors as a strike against a our complicated convoluted tax code.  In general, I'm opposed to using tax code to influence behavior...that's what the criminal code is for, and of course persuasion via reasoning the best method of all to promote good citizenship.

    Parent

    Until (none / 0) (#34)
    by CST on Tue Nov 29, 2016 at 04:19:13 PM EST
    Way more recently than I'd like to admit I didn't know Alpacas were a real animal, I thought they were made up but historically referenced in mythology or something.

    This is especially ironic considering there are a number of Alpaca farms around, it's not like they're particularly rare.

    I wonder what mountain lion tastes like. A part of me is rooting for the lion, but I can't blame them for trying.

    Parent

    Joke

    Not sure I would eat mountain lion from this area, many reports over the years of the local lions having very high doses of rat poison in their systems.

    Parent

    Alpacas are a distant relative of camels. (none / 0) (#66)
    by fishcamp on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 09:10:59 AM EST
    They are also related to Llamas, but are much smaller.  They are not used as beasts of burden like llamas, and are raised for their soft wool used in many types of clothing.  They are also much gentler than llamas.  They can spit like camels and llamas but usually don't.

      Many fancy ranchers around Aspen have collections of exotic animals such as, Scottish longhair cattle, llamas, alpacas, vicuña, emus, and one rancher I used to know had a miniature Brahma bull, who was very mean, and didn't know he was miniature.  Another rancher imported 100 Reindeer, and sold pairs to other exotic collectors.  I filmed a short Christmas video with Santas, sleighs, and reindeer.  They are difficult to work with, and can die if stressed.

    Several outfitters use llamas along with other pack animals during camping and hunting trips in the mountains.  They don't eat as much as horses and mules, and are very tidy when corralled. They always poop in the same place, far from where they graze.

     Alpacas, llamas, and reindeer are very smelly critters.  When I dated a veterinarian, years ago, I often helped her vaccinate them.  We had dedicated clothing we wore, and discarded, since I didn't want to stink up my washer and dryer.  She graduated from Colorado State vet school, and said they had about 1,000 berserker llamas that people brought to the school to get rid of them.  If they grow up with people, the males think they are people when they get older, and become impossible to control.

    Yes that mountain lion who killed for pleasure was quite the exception, and needed to be culled.  I filmed a mountain lion segment, where one Puma was slaughtering cattle daily.  We captured three with BLM dogs that treed them, and they were tranquilized, and taken away.  I prefer my cats as pets.

    Parent

    For those who were interested... (none / 0) (#88)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Dec 02, 2016 at 12:08:56 PM EST
    ...after not a little public outcry against the couple who received the depredation (kill) permit, and some public shaming, the couple have pledged not to kill the animal and will rely on the kindness of strangers - a group of those people heavily involved in the public outcry - to build a safe pen for the remaining alpacas.

    Seems like a great resolution to me.

    Parent

    Hunter S. Thompson's Personal Stash (none / 0) (#74)
    by Mr Natural on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 11:27:50 AM EST
    (Marijuana Stash) Will Be Cloned and Sold

    Though marijuana was the least of his vices, his widow, Anita Thompson, recently announced via Facebook that she has found a way to clone and sell her late husband's supply. She has held onto six strains from his personal reserve for the past 12-15 years, and plans to sell Gonzo-brand cannabis in states where the drug has been legalized.
    - Michael Addady, Fortune, November 30, 2016

    ("As your attorney, I advise you to...")

    I'll buy... (5.00 / 1) (#79)
    by kdog on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 12:00:25 PM EST
    Raoul Duke never struck me as the type to f8ck with no schwag.

    Anita should add some of the dearly departed's favorite hash strains to the line...even as prohibition fades into the oblivion it deserves, it still ain't easy finding the good hash.  

    Parent

    I dunno (none / 0) (#82)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 03:44:46 PM EST
    Jeff Sessions has indicated he don't like this weed business. You think they will try to roll back state legalization?

    Parent
    Not sure... (none / 0) (#83)
    by kdog on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 03:59:42 PM EST
    if they'll wanna make adversaries of the state's bringing in mad tax bank. Colorado, Washington, and now California will resist...and it's clear where the American people at large stand on the issue.  

    I think the momentum is bigger than anyone admin...they could jam some people up, maybe steal some money & crops and cage some poor souls, but they can't stop the train.  

    Parent

    Raoul Duke? (none / 0) (#84)
    by TrevorBolder on Wed Nov 30, 2016 at 07:23:59 PM EST
    Has to be from Doonesbury fame?  Lol

    Did love that comic strip, Duke and BD

    Parent