iPhones and Face Recognition

By Jeralyn, Section Civil Liberties
Posted on Thu Sep 14, 2017 at 02:13:56 PM EST
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The iPhone X (ten) does away with the home button and fingerprint ID and uses Face ID instead.

What's wrong with it?

From Slate: In the event you get arrested, a cop can just put your phone in front of your face and get all the stuff on it.

Even more likely, in my opinion, since most of us won't get arrested, muggers and robbers will know they can put your phone in front of your face and get all your banking info -- and after emptying your bank account at an ATM or charging up a storm for a few hours, sell the phone to a hacker.

Here's what Edward Snowden thinks.

I need a new phone now. The iPhone 8 and 8plus, which are revamped versions of the iPhone 7, are taking pre orders starting tomorrow. [More...]

Why not get a Samsung Galaxy 8 Note 8? Because the fingerprint reader to get into your phone is on the back and hard to reach with one hand.

I stopped in At&T last week to make sure that my grandfathered plan with unlimited data could be transferred to a new iPhone. It can, but they have even better and cheaper unlimited data plans now, and one that adds Direct TV streaming for $10 even if you don't have Direct TV with a satellite at home.

So many phones and carriers to choose from. I'm going to pre order one of them today, I have a feeling it will be the iPhone 8 (not plus) or the Samsung Note 8. If you can opt out of face recognition and use a four digit passcode for the iPhone X, then I'll probably get that for the size.

Is anyone here considering one these phones?

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iPhones and Face Recognition | 33 comments (33 topical)

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I was thinking about getting the 8. (5.00 / 1) (#5)
by caseyOR on Thu Sep 14, 2017 at 10:00:43 PM EST

I am concerned about the phone being, essentially made of glass. It seems that people have a hard enough time with the glass front breaking. If the phone is glass front and back with a thin layer of aluminum wrapped around the edge does that not make cracking/breaking so much more likely?

For someone like me who usually carries their phone in a front pocket the all glass phone is worrisome.

Wireless charging is not worth the risk of greater breakage to me. I don't have a problem keeping track of my cables and chargers.

isn't the 8? (none / 0) (#6)
by linea on Thu Sep 14, 2017 at 10:20:40 PM EST

just an upgrade to the 7? i have the 7 Plus and it is very sturdy. it gets tossed about and abused in my handbag daily.


: yes there is an 8 and 8 plus (none / 0) (#7)
by Jeralyn on Thu Sep 14, 2017 at 10:27:16 PM EST

which are just upgrades to the 7/7 plus essentially, and a X. The links I provided explain. That's why I included them.

: The 8 and the 8 plus are very jacked (none / 0) (#8)
by caseyOR on Thu Sep 14, 2017 at 10:49:57 PM EST

up improvements on the 7. The 8s are both made totally of glass, front and back. This is to facilitate wireless charging.
The 7 is not all glass and cannot be charged wirelessly. My concern has to do with the sturdiness of an all glass phone.

Casey, the glass has gotten so much (none / 0) (#27)
by ruffian on Sat Sep 16, 2017 at 03:28:17 PM EST

stronger int he last couple of models. And watching the presentation now, this new glass is even stronger, and steel reinforced. I have no idea how they do that.

Did you have an iPhone 4? IIRC it also had glass on both sides and I thought it was fine. Actually it was my favorite old iPhone as far as feel goes.

If you are one that likes to use a case anyway, it might not matter. I don't use a case unless I'm traveling and am throwing it in and out of my purse all the time, and I wouldn't let the all glass design stop me. But that's me - living on the edge - lol.


Thanks, ruffian. (none / 0) (#28)
by caseyOR on Sat Sep 16, 2017 at 05:12:36 PM EST

My current phone is a 5s. I like the 5s, but the battery is not what it used to be, and other glitchy problems are popping up.

I do keep a case on my phone all the time. Sounds like my fears about the glass are unfounded. I will wait awhile and see what people say after having the 8s for a few month. Unless my current phone becomes too annoying. If that happens I will be forced to buy a new one.


: Yes, that is always a good plan! (none / 0) (#29)
by ruffian on Sat Sep 16, 2017 at 05:27:05 PM EST

Let the early adopters report back! Hope the i5 hangs in there a while. You will definitely notice a big speed and battery improvement even if you get a 7.

Hmmmm, I have titanium crystal instead of lead (none / 0) (#30)
by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 17, 2017 at 11:06:25 AM EST

Because I get mad about easily chipping edges. It is much stronger, the edges don't chip. But dropped one accidently on slate and it was like a gun shot, it exploded. I found tiny pieces for months.


Watching the Apple presentation now (5.00 / 2) (#26)
by ruffian on Sat Sep 16, 2017 at 03:22:15 PM EST

Apparently the glass is steel reinforced...somehow. Actually the iPhone 4 was also glass on both sides and I never had a problem with it. I see most people using cases anyway, even on the metal phones. I use a case as little as possible just for size reasons. I have the smaller size iPhone7.

I don't have a practical need to upgrade, but as ever, the new stuff stimulates my gottahaveit nerve.

Would I ever switch from iPhone? I don't think so. I drank all the koolaid a long time ago and have not regretted it.

You can disable the face recognition if you want, just as now you don't have to use the fingerprint recognition, which has the same security concerns. The burglar can grab your hand just as easily. So that doesn't bother me. Also there is an emergency disable if you hit one of the keys 5 times real fast. That does not seem practical to me though.

Ah, so nice to be sitting in my air-conditioned, back to normal house on a Saturday afternoon with a sleeping dog beside me, and contemplating buying something I don't need!!!!

My company provided (none / 0) (#1)
by Chuck0 on Thu Sep 14, 2017 at 02:37:27 PM EST

Samsung 6 has fingerprint ID. I originally set it up but it was a pain. Sometimes it worked, sometimes not. Then I would get locked out for periods of time. I went back to a good ol' password that only I know. That keeps crooks and cops out of my phone. Plus, I lost the about two thirds of my right index finger last year in an accident. Now, I'm left handed and had set the fingerprint ID up for my left index finger. But it got me to thinking. What if I had lost my left index finger? Then how the heck would I get into the phone?

I have a $70 prepaid LG phone with (none / 0) (#2)
by McBain on Thu Sep 14, 2017 at 02:48:42 PM EST

a cracked face. I use it every day but I'm not really a smartphone person. I don't like surfing the web on it. I still use a actual calendar to keep appointments.

I briefly owned a $700 iphone but took it back because I don't need that much phone. I've heard about studies that suggest the more you use a smartphone the less happy you are. But they probably said that about books, TV and computers when they first came out.

I used to be on the cutting edge of technology but I've really slipped behind the past 15 years. Not sure if that's good or bad?

I don't know about "happy," but, (none / 0) (#12)
by NYShooter on Fri Sep 15, 2017 at 01:12:40 PM EST

I'm pretty sure they make you dumber, and, anti-social.

Interesting article regarding something I've thought about for quite some time.

"Have Smartphones Destroyed a Generation?"

The Atlantic


Just had a convo about this last night. (5.00 / 2) (#23)
by sarcastic unnamed one on Sat Sep 16, 2017 at 11:22:17 AM EST

My son just got his driver's license and he's probably the worst driver I've ever seen.

He has spent most of his life staring at his hands and literally does not know how to be aware of what's going on around him.

Autonomous cars can't get here soon enough.


yikes. (5.00 / 1) (#24)
by leap on Sat Sep 16, 2017 at 12:49:01 PM EST

I had not thought about that angle, the driving and not even while texting or talking on the phone. The unaware-of-surroundings part, because he is not used to looking about and paying attention. That's really frightening.


It's not that I don't believe you (none / 0) (#31)
by CST on Tue Sep 19, 2017 at 09:01:13 AM EST

It's that I feel like every parent feels this way about their kid learning to drive.

I'll never forget the first day I got my license, my parents sent me out to pick up food. I had to call them to pick me up because I'd locked the keys in the car.

Now I'm afraid to drive with my parents, because they moved to the country and forgot how to drive in the city of crazies where you need to be prepared for the fact that literally everyone is trying to cut you off.


: Ha! No, it's for reelz. (none / 0) (#32)
by sarcastic unnamed one on Tue Sep 19, 2017 at 11:52:24 AM EST

Ha! My oldest niece turned 16 today and (none / 0) (#33)
by vml68 on Tue Sep 19, 2017 at 01:23:24 PM EST

will be taking her driving test any day now. I think my brother's hair just got a little grayer thinking about it. He is not very impressed with her driving skills.

No cell phones or tablets when I was growing up but my nose was constantly buried in a book. My parents always made the same claim...

One of the few times in my life that I did not argue with them, because I knew they were right :-)!


at this point (none / 0) (#3)
by CaptHowdy on Thu Sep 14, 2017 at 04:51:38 PM EST

your face might be the only thing not in the possession of hackers.

our society is becoming stratified by those who live on their phone - including people like Jeralyn who use it for work and a new generation who will soon have them surgically attached to a limb - and those who dont.

im definitely a dont. i hate talking on the phone and use it as little as possible. also i hate the new trend of expecting me to have endless back and forths by texting when a 30 second call would do it.

feel sort of luditeish. i just recently got my first smart phone. an older simpler version that runs on andriod. which i actually like.

I'm with ya Capt. (5.00 / 1) (#10)
by Chuck0 on Fri Sep 15, 2017 at 08:52:18 AM EST

My personal phone is a flip phone. I don't text. The company smartphone is primarily for the encrypted email app (I work for a defense co) so I can get emails after hours.


I'm not a good texted but the problem with (none / 0) (#4)
by McBain on Thu Sep 14, 2017 at 08:06:28 PM EST

phone calls these days is the mediocre reception. Remember the good old days of landline to landline conversations? You could understand every word and even know when someone was about to start talking because you could hear breathing and other noises. Far to often, with cell phones, I end up talking at the same time as the other person.


Yes! (none / 0) (#11)
by kdog on Fri Sep 15, 2017 at 09:32:23 AM EST

I don't if it's my cheapest outdated Motorola smartphone on the market or Verizon or what...but everybody I talk to on it sounds like they have marbles in their mouth. So I text more, and use the landline at home when I need to talk to somebody and can't see them in the flesh.

I certainly don't need a fingerprint or face recognition access...my phone doesn't even have a password.


oh definitely yes! (5.00 / 1) (#13)
by leap on Fri Sep 15, 2017 at 01:51:34 PM EST

Landlines have so much better sound quality, AND they don't "drop" connections mid-sentence. That part of cell phones is so damned irritating. That, and the tinny, crackly sound. Feh. My main phone is a landline; I have a TracFone<sup>TM</sup>©® for emergencies or quick calls when I'm out and about. It won't work at my escape place, where there also is no internet connection. (Yay!) I do not need or want all the non-phone stuff on a "smart" phone. That's what computers are for. I have one of those at home.


Some of us (none / 0) (#14)
by Zorba on Fri Sep 15, 2017 at 02:36:40 PM EST

Have to have a landline because we live way out in the country on top of a mountain, where our cell phones do not get any reception.


Also, too, (5.00 / 1) (#16)
by leap on Fri Sep 15, 2017 at 05:47:55 PM EST

landlines work when the power is out, as long as your phone is connected with a wire and is not a wireless walk-about-the-house land-based phone. Don't have to worry about charging it, either.


: And for that very reason, (none / 0) (#18)
by Zorba on Fri Sep 15, 2017 at 07:46:50 PM EST

We have one old-fashioned phone with a cord. The rest of our phones are cordless, but we keep that one corded phone.

: Weather is why we still have a landline (none / 0) (#25)
by Towanda on Sat Sep 16, 2017 at 01:31:09 PM EST

We're not in the countryside. We're in a very urban area.
We get hurricanes, but we get blizzards.
And even heavy snow can take down cell towers and/ or electricity to keep cell phones charged.
Spouse Towanda has given up trying to talk me out of our landline. In return, I refrain from pointing out the monthly bill for sll of his cable channels. This what makes marriages work.

The reason I have a new cell (none / 0) (#15)
by CaptHowdy on Fri Sep 15, 2017 at 05:41:19 PM EST

Is be cause my old cell did not work IN my new house. On the deck. Not in the house.

So I got one of those cable based "land line" phones and planned to downgrade my cell service and use the new phone when at home.

In this process I switched providers for the cell and ended up getting a new (smart) phone because it was really cheap and my phone was old.

But

Once I got the new cell, guess what, IT WORKS IN THE HOUSE. So I did not need the other cable based thing and gave it back.

It was very cheap tho. 15 bucks a month for unlimited local and long distance and every extra you can have on a land line.

I just decided I did not want to deal with two phone numbers.


We have had people (none / 0) (#17)
by Zorba on Fri Sep 15, 2017 at 07:44:06 PM EST

visiting up here who had a variety of cell phone providers and newer and even fancier cell phones.
And yeh, none of them work worth sh!t.
I don't think you realize how far up on top of a mountain we are. We can quite literally wave at people walking the Appalachian Trail.


: sounds lovely (none / 0) (#19)
by CaptHowdy on Fri Sep 15, 2017 at 09:16:12 PM EST

Google Voice (none / 0) (#20)
by jmacWA on Sat Sep 16, 2017 at 05:53:23 AM EST

Have you ever considered it? It's the only number I give out now when asked for my phone number, and I simply forward it to the home phone, or if I am out for an extended period to the cell.

Has worked real well for me... but it is Google.


: thanks (none / 0) (#21)
by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 16, 2017 at 07:52:54 AM EST

After all my research and hours (none / 0) (#9)
by Jeralyn on Fri Sep 15, 2017 at 12:39:32 AM EST

today in person at the Apple Store and the ATT store, where I could handle the iPhone 7/7plus (which are the same size as the 8/8plus, and the Android phones, it wasn't even a close call. Goodbye iPhone, hello Samsung Galaxy 8 -- the Samsung 8 Note is clearly the most advanced phone anywhere, and it comes out Friday (today), but it's just too big for me to use as a phone. iPhones are all so behind the curve and the iPhone X, which won't be out until November, which is between the size of an iPhone 7/8 and iPhone 7/8 plus just doesn't have enough bells and whistles and also has the dreaded face recognition.

Contrary to what some reviews say, the Galaxy 8 does indeed have a home screen button on the front, it has an earphone hole, it has a 4k screen, and the on screen keyboard layout is so much better -- letters and numbers on one screen and a ".com" button.

Financially, with ATT, it's a no brainer. They gave me $300.00 off the cost of the phone for trading in my iphone 5S, I get to upgrade to any phone (IPhone or Android) in a year. They gave me Direct TV streaming and HBO for $10 a month forever. I'm grandfathered to a new unlimited plan with unlimited phone, data and texts for roughly the same as my old unlimited plan (which had unlimited data and texts but only 400 minutes of phone use). They gave me $100. in free accessories (a phone case, the screen guard, a wireless charging stand to hold the phone upright, and a six foot charging cord. They waived the upgrade fees and on and on. They set up the phone in the store, put the screen guard on the front with no bubbles, backed up my iPhone and transferred everything to the Samsung. Great service (thank you Devyn at ATT, Cherry Creek Mall, Denver, he's just awesome.)

As I said, if you don't mind a huge phone, the new Galaxy Note that comes out today is the one to get -- it has a stylus to take notes in your handwriting.

Now I have to finish setting up the phone and I hope I like using it as much as I like its features. Since I still have my iPad Pro and my iMac, I don't think I'll miss the iPhone, but we shall see. I have 14 days to change my mind, and if I do, there's only a $45 restocking fee.

Who Uses a Stylus With Their Phone? (none / 0) (#22)
by RickyJim on Sat Sep 16, 2017 at 08:04:32 AM EST

I know students who use it with a tablet when taking notes or sketches in class. But when considering whether to buy a Note 8, how big a value add is it?