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CNN Faith Forum, Live Blog II

By Jeralyn, Section Elections 2008
Posted on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:33:15 PM EST
Tags: Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, 2008 (all tags)
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The second section of our live blog on CNN's Faith Forum is below the fold. Use the regular comments section below if you want others to see your comments. More...

This thread is closed, post-forum thread is here.

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    CNN Faith Forum, Live Blog II | 218 comments (218 topical)
    Hehee. (5.00 / 5) (#3)
    by lilburro on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:41:13 PM EST
    Clinton has somehow turned this forum into an opportunity to be a policy wonk (global warming).  So great.

    I was just thinking that (5.00 / 2) (#6)
    by andgarden on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:43:33 PM EST
    and thank, ahem, god. An hour of wedge issues would be really tedious.

    Parent
    I want... (5.00 / 3) (#9)
    by Alec82 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:44:45 PM EST
    ...to hear a question like this:

     A large and growing population of the United States is nonreligious.  Do you believe that you can represent their values as president?

    She's even managed to make this (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by RalphB on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:47:37 PM EST
    a positive thing and kind of interesting.  I'm not one to care for religion but it wasn't bad.

    So they make her sit there (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:48:49 PM EST
    while he makes a big entrance?  That is just rude.

    Agreed. Then they go to a commercial (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by Cream City on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:56:09 PM EST
    when they could have given her a sendoff, gone to a commercial, and then brought him out.  Who the heck is producing this, and so badly?  (Or in this case, perhaps purposefully?)

    Parent
    what? does she have to be there while it's (none / 0) (#25)
    by Andy08 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:52:58 PM EST
    Obama's turn? That's absurd...

    Parent
    Why is Campbell Brown qualified for this? (5.00 / 2) (#18)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:49:44 PM EST


    GREAT question (5.00 / 2) (#24)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:51:32 PM EST


    Parent
    She aced CNN's WORM entrance exam? (none / 0) (#45)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:57:07 PM EST


    Parent
    Man (5.00 / 4) (#23)
    by Kathy on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:51:30 PM EST
    this is like kindergarten.  I mean, I'm glad Clinton got to speak and all, but I'm just not crazy about this whole topic.  Of course, I realize that I am about as religious as a box of hair, religion annoys me on my best day and I am just waiting for my Sunday Soft Porn show to start (The Tudors) but I just don't have the patience to listen to Obama's answers on these Very Important Softball Questions.

    I will say that I think she handled the End of Life question in a  sane way.  I am completely for the right to die, but I don't want it misused and I agree there should be steps, whether they are medical steps or legal steps, before you can pull the plug (but maybe that's because some folks in my family aren't that crazy about me).  I think the process has to be seen as legitimate before people will sign onto the legality of it.  I'm not the only one with greedy, crazy relatives out there.

    Obama can't help but to preach (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:53:26 PM EST


    Didn't offend anyone (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:54:08 PM EST
    so I guess she did fine.  Politicians have to step on so many eggshells on these topics that is all just seems like feel-good blather to me.  But I understand it is important to others.

    His explanation (5.00 / 2) (#33)
    by lilburro on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:54:44 PM EST
    of his gaffe is completly ignoring his anti-immigrant and anti-trade and gun comments.  

    thank you! (none / 0) (#70)
    by angie on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:01:25 PM EST
    The bible says to cling to good things --  how is clinging to bigotry a "good thing."  And I notice that the hosts didn't call him on it. pfft.

    Parent
    clinging to guns and religion (5.00 / 1) (#35)
    by kredwyn on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:54:52 PM EST
    invokes scripture? Which one?

    ooh we are trying to misconstrue his words... (5.00 / 1) (#38)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:55:01 PM EST
    ...thank goodness for WORM...nobody has done more to reach out to the church...will anyone ever get sick of this?

    Ego, thy name is Obama. yuck :-) (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by RalphB on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:56:08 PM EST


    Did he really go "No one has done more (5.00 / 2) (#44)
    by MarkL on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:56:53 PM EST
    .. " again???
    OMG!

    Yes, again. He has got to stop that (5.00 / 3) (#58)
    by Cream City on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:59:18 PM EST
    as it has become silly, with some of the "no one elses" in recent days.  Even some Obamans mocked it.

    Parent
    Well, no one has mocked Obama (5.00 / 1) (#82)
    by MarkL on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:04:20 PM EST
    as much as I have.. but this is getting ridiculous!!

    Parent
    Let's see (5.00 / 2) (#149)
    by nell on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:20:46 PM EST
    No one has ever done more to speak out against anti-semimitism

    No one has ever done more to speak out for LGBT issues

    No one has ever done more YET AGAIN???

    Damn. THIS is called being a serial exaggerator.

    Parent

    My friends...no on has done more... (none / 0) (#139)
    by Fabian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:17:44 PM EST
    What's the Hillary part...?

    Parent
    And that includes Gov Keane? (none / 0) (#48)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:57:36 PM EST


    Parent
    A phrase I could wait a long time (5.00 / 5) (#49)
    by Anne on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:57:40 PM EST
    before ever hearing again..."the notion that."

    I hope you all realize the sacrifice I am making watching this on CNN online...

    I wish someone would ask him what, exactly, he did in his chirch to help lift people up.

    Obama just kept the story going all week (5.00 / 1) (#52)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:58:25 PM EST
    Triple flip-flop maneuver and the Russian judge doesn't look happy.

    Now he wants to talk about (5.00 / 3) (#54)
    by andgarden on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:58:37 PM EST
    the "moral dimension" to abortion.

    UGH. He is not giving me any reason to like him tonight.

    Once again (5.00 / 3) (#55)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:58:50 PM EST
    it's the fault of the pro-choicers for not acknowledging the moral dimension of abortion.

    That's cause we are mistaken and (5.00 / 1) (#120)
    by kredwyn on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:11:25 PM EST
    don't respect the opinions of the opposition...except that respecting their opinions as their's and acquiescing to their demands are two entirely different things.

    Parent
    Moral component to abortion (5.00 / 3) (#56)
    by Anne on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:59:15 PM EST
    please don't tell me that pro-choice people don't "get that."

    Oh Jesus! (5.00 / 1) (#57)
    by angie on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:59:17 PM EST
    he actually said again that pro-choicers ignore the moral consequences of abortion. D'oh.

    Oh, no he didn't! (5.00 / 7) (#59)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:59:38 PM EST
    Focus on abstinence?!

    YES HE DID ABSTINENCE WTF (5.00 / 5) (#88)
    by Marvin42 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:05:34 PM EST
    What is this George Bush Part 3? Sorry about yelling, but I AM YELLING HERE....

    Parent
    yell away.... (5.00 / 3) (#141)
    by Fabian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:18:40 PM EST
    I'll second that.

    Parent
    teaching sacredness of sexuality?? (5.00 / 1) (#61)
    by LoisInCo on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:59:47 PM EST


    SACREDNESS OF SEXUALITY??? (5.00 / 1) (#94)
    by Kathy on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:06:48 PM EST
    Okay, he's officially picked up right wing talking points.  That's rhetoric from those frightening chastity ceremonies.  I swear on all that is sacred to me, I read that same phrase in one of their fliers that a friend sent me as a joke (it was left on her car).  It was ALL about the sacredness of sexuality.

    And speaking of sexuality, does he mean gay sexuality, too?  Or just women's sexuality, and the fact that they should cherish their virginity because it is the only thing of value that they have?

    Good Christ, can you imagine what the formerly progressive blogs would do with this comment if they had their heads outta their creative classes?  This is absolutely outrageous and disgusting and amoral.

    And now I really must go watch naked people.

    Parent

    By, I'd hate to be that woman (5.00 / 1) (#62)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:59:56 PM EST
    the camera stopped on when he was talking about preventing unwanted pregnancies.

    The sacredness of sexuality? (5.00 / 1) (#64)
    by lilburro on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:00:11 PM EST
    Interesting.  

    I hate his answers on abortion. (5.00 / 3) (#65)
    by Anne on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:00:25 PM EST
    And nothing he is saying is making me feel better about what he will do on this issue.

    an instrument of G*d's will? (5.00 / 1) (#66)
    by kredwyn on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:00:37 PM EST
    ummmmmmmm....

    Last time I heard that, Pat Robertson was talking about the president during the 2004 elections.

    Can't make himself say (5.00 / 6) (#67)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:01:04 PM EST
    'woman's right to choose' can he?

    What is the point of saying (5.00 / 4) (#69)
    by andgarden on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:01:24 PM EST
    that anti-choicers should have the right to try and change the law?

    He's giving a similarly terrible answer to the "life begins" question.

    Okay (5.00 / 7) (#71)
    by Kathy on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:01:32 PM EST
    he's worried about children being exposed to sexual situations.  I suppose he doesn't mean seeing  their preacher hump the podium on Sunday.  Oh, wait, he wasn't there.

    And I have been insulted again as not seeing abortion as a wrenching emotional issue, so it's time for the Tudos.  Boy, that was the heart wrenching decision: watch people f*cking or watch the guy who's f*cking us over.

    Heh, (5.00 / 1) (#87)
    by RalphB on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:05:30 PM EST
    there's no hard choice there.  I've also exited the forum.

    Parent
    lol (none / 0) (#83)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:04:31 PM EST
    good point

    Parent
    Yes, he was there!!! (none / 0) (#220)
    by FlaDemFem on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:41:33 PM EST
    Check out the video of it and there is Obama, in the last two or so frames. He was there, he is on video being there.

    Parent
    Mandate living wills, but not healthcare (5.00 / 2) (#74)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:02:42 PM EST


    Ha! Campbell does a WORM (5.00 / 1) (#81)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:04:20 PM EST
    way to help him out there!!

    I am having an aneurysm (5.00 / 4) (#86)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:04:56 PM EST
    about the idea that he is focusing on abstinence education. please tell me he is not endorsing abstinence education. please.

    Is he saying that he's in favor (5.00 / 3) (#89)
    by andgarden on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:05:53 PM EST
    of abstinence education?

    That's what I heard (5.00 / 2) (#92)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:06:27 PM EST
    Unbelievable!

    Parent
    worse is that... (5.00 / 2) (#124)
    by Dawn Davenport on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:12:40 PM EST
    ...he sounds like he supports federal funding for religion-based abstinence programs.

    Parent
    I like him more (none / 0) (#98)
    by Marvin42 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:07:38 PM EST
    The less I know, honestly. Also doesn't know when life begins? Great, so you can make good decisions then.

    Parent
    I thought he was going to say re HIV in Africa... (5.00 / 1) (#93)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:06:39 PM EST
    ...an area in which he thought Bill Clinton did a good job. LOL.

    End of life answers (5.00 / 4) (#95)
    by Anne on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:06:55 PM EST
    were really bad - nothing but mush.  I am so glad he thinks the dying should get pain relief - is there any doubt they would?

    It's like he's afraid to really say what he thinks - but maybe he doesn't know until he checks with Hillary.

    Obama's new motto: (5.00 / 6) (#107)
    by Anne on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:09:43 PM EST
    "Don't Parse Me, Bro!"

    Awesome (none / 0) (#111)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:10:40 PM EST


    Parent
    Ha Ha, but wormng is okay. (none / 0) (#115)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:11:10 PM EST


    Parent
    He is not being effective (5.00 / 2) (#113)
    by MichaelGale on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:10:43 PM EST
    he can't get his mind working to give any thought out answers.  Nothing is direct or even a cognitive flow. grrrrrr

    Tired? Poor baby.

    on abortion (5.00 / 5) (#117)
    by marirebel on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:11:18 PM EST
    I am offended by Obama's understanding that a woman may choose abortion after consulting "with her pastor," who is most often a man.  Again, we are asked to give  control of our bodies to the man.  And, what if the woman is not religious?  I am not convinced that women's right to choose will be well protected with Obama . . .in fact, I am now convinced otherwise!

    Where is Monty Python when you need them (5.00 / 1) (#129)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:13:44 PM EST
    This reminds me of the skits about the Spanish Inquisition.  Are we a first world country?  WTF if going on.  This makes my stomach turn.  

    How can you have a religion forum with the (5.00 / 2) (#132)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:14:30 PM EST
    most famous man/religion event in years and not ask about it?

    good pt (5.00 / 1) (#144)
    by TheRefugee on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:19:33 PM EST
    I hadn't even thought about that but that would have been an interesting question...so faith has shaped your life so did your pastor help shape your belief in the bitterness of small town dwellers?  Did he teach you to be pro-choice only if you also understood the "moral dilemma"?  Is the reason Bush did a good job on AIDS in Africa because your preacher taught you that Bill Clinton couldn't have done a good job because he got a blow job?

    Parent
    Who would that be? (5.00 / 1) (#146)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:19:44 PM EST
    I remember when we couldn't mention Mr. Wright on this forum.  But he's old news now right?  The media tells me this and it will never come up again.  I mean look, the media dropped it!  He's safe for the general election now.  They will never just put it on the backburner until they can really hit him with it when it counts or anything... nope sireeee.

    Parent
    Sorry.... (5.00 / 3) (#135)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:16:06 PM EST
    He is not in Hillary's league.  

    I disagree (none / 0) (#155)
    by TheRefugee on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:21:38 PM EST
    with that whole statement except the part where you say that "he isn't in Hillary's league"

    But he does have a league of his own---it is just a lesser league of backslapping sycophants telling each other how much smarter they are than the rest of the world.

    Parent

    I wish someone would tell Obama (5.00 / 1) (#137)
    by Anne on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:16:58 PM EST
    that the word is pronounced "to" and not "tuh;" for some reason, that just grates on my ears.

    I know...picky, picky.

    OMIDGOD Anne, yes, yes, yes.... (5.00 / 1) (#150)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:20:49 PM EST
    ..This drives me crazier than anything. I'm glad someone else feels this way.

    Parent
    I hear you (none / 0) (#148)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:20:23 PM EST
    Bush does it too, and it drives me nuts.

    Parent
    His discomfort should be a clue (5.00 / 1) (#143)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:19:24 PM EST
    Unity is not easy.  Duh.  

    I think... (5.00 / 3) (#152)
    by Alec82 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:20:55 PM EST
    ...asking a question like "who seems most sincere in their faith" is unseemly.  That is precisely the reason this entire event seems inappropriate.

    But that's entirely THE reason for the forum (none / 0) (#175)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:25:48 PM EST
    This show on CNN has no purpose if not to allow voters the opportunity to judge these candidates precisely on their answers to faith issues.

    So I don't think it's out of bounds for TL to put up this poll since that's the whole point of watching the CNN event.

    It is sickening that politicians are put to yet another religious test, but oh well...  our Democratic "leaders" have shown very little backbone when it comes to pushing back against these media frames and being boxed in as "godless" liberals by right wing and/or MSM media.

    Parent

    This whole process is kinda dumb (5.00 / 1) (#153)
    by Lil on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:21:35 PM EST
    Let's get to the 16th and debate.

    He makes his religion sound like... (5.00 / 2) (#159)
    by Dawn Davenport on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:22:19 PM EST
    ...a career opportunity rather than a leap of faith.

    Well...Wright demoted to just his pastor (5.00 / 1) (#160)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:22:20 PM EST


    He's not a spiritual advisor (none / 0) (#167)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:23:44 PM EST
    or mentor - just the pastor.  Just a guy whose church Obama attended for 20 years.  It's not like Obama bought into his ideas or anything.

    Parent
    Oh man (5.00 / 2) (#163)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:22:47 PM EST
    totally in the tank for Obama.  Who are these people?

    what do you think ? (5.00 / 1) (#164)
    by delacarpa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:22:54 PM EST
    It seems that CNN was going for a break for Clinton to get off the stage and Obama rushed out while Hillary was on stage. Very telling to me and so what do you think?

    No (none / 0) (#168)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:24:12 PM EST
    They specifically asked Clinton to stay on the stage while Obama came out.

    Parent
    Catholic school for urchins (5.00 / 1) (#169)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:24:30 PM EST


    Did they get to plant the guest questioners? (5.00 / 1) (#186)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:29:44 PM EST
    Seems like Wallis teed this one up for him.

    Where is the eloquence? Am I that tone deaf? (5.00 / 2) (#199)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:34:56 PM EST


    he's the great communicator (5.00 / 2) (#210)
    by DandyTIger on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:38:57 PM EST
    what do you mean you can't tell that. Are you saying the emperor has no clothes. Next thing you'll be saying he's just like Reagan and is an empty suit. Snark.

    Parent
    So much clapping. (5.00 / 2) (#201)
    by lilburro on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:35:23 PM EST
    Ridiculous.  And also, supporting faith-based initiatives is a big no no in my book.  It was one of the first things I disliked about GW Bush.

    And now he throws Democrats under (5.00 / 3) (#205)
    by Anne on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:36:34 PM EST
    the bus - man it's getting crowded under there...

    we're riding a pony (none / 0) (#213)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:39:23 PM EST
    the unity pony can hop over the little people who get in the way, unlike a bus.

    Parent
    Attacking Democrats (5.00 / 3) (#208)
    by lilburro on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:37:25 PM EST
    for saying separation of church and state is somehow wrong.  Why does he have to take us down a peg everytime he wants to make a point?

    Boooriiiiiiing (5.00 / 1) (#214)
    by GOPmurderedconscience on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:39:54 PM EST
    That's my final word.

    I did not watch, but it sounded (5.00 / 1) (#218)
    by MarkL on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:41:08 PM EST
    incredibly silly to me.

    Wow... (4.66 / 3) (#126)
    by Alec82 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:12:44 PM EST
    ...are we watching the same forum? because his answers seem fine to me.  

     

    It's striking that there's a "trolling is not (3.00 / 2) (#226)
    by jibal on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:49:52 PM EST
    tolerated here" message here, and yet the great majority of comments here are inflammatory one-line snipes at a man who has at least (and of course more) than 50% chance of being the Democratic nominee. It's tragic that identity politics has produced this sort of result, and will be even more tragic if it leads to John McCain winning in November. I myself have been committed to voting for the Democratic candidate, whoever it is, since ... well, since 2000, and for decades before that when I voted for Bill Clinton twice, and for decades before that when I recognized the disastrous consequences resulting from a Republican occupying the WH, and yet never foresaw during the Nixon years that we could get so much worse with Reagan, or during the Reagan years that we could get so much worse with GWB. And John McCain would be a continuation of that disaster, which becomes worse and worse as time goes on.

    Parent
    Its alright (4.33 / 6) (#100)
    by TheRefugee on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:08:12 PM EST
    I can see that Obama is a moron even his supporters can't.  They can have him cuz I don't want him. Uh...because I want a president...uh...who can take a stand...uh.uh..on an issue...uh..any issue.

    haha (5.00 / 1) (#119)
    by TheRefugee on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:11:24 PM EST
    he sucks when asked questions...jehesus k-ristomas I didn't understand a single thing about the aids question..good lord he juked left, juked right, faked a spin, then did the spin and as he dove for the goal line I thought?  How the hell did he get to the goal line again?

    Parent
    You'd get a straight answer (none / 0) (#161)
    by RalphB on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:22:36 PM EST
    from him with a taser I'll bet.  :-)   Otherwise, forget it.

    Parent
    I don't think (3.66 / 3) (#80)
    by rooge04 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:04:14 PM EST
    I've ever seen such clear arrogance from a politician even.  Unbelievable. I think Obama is taking large gulps from his own Kool Aid.

    He compliments Bush, Reagan.... (3.66 / 3) (#97)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:07:31 PM EST
    anyone ever hear Obama compliment Bill Clinton for anything?

    I am truly digusted at this continuing pattern from him.

    ah he finally did it (none / 0) (#105)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:08:59 PM EST


    Parent
    I don't think I can take this his voice is (3.66 / 3) (#99)
    by gish720 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:07:54 PM EST
    droning on and on--I would rather go watch a movie or something...this is as dull as ditch water to me.

    OMG (3.66 / 3) (#127)
    by andgarden on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:13:39 PM EST
    did he just joke that God plans for him to be in the WH???

    He did indeed (5.00 / 2) (#133)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:14:50 PM EST
    and he looks forward to their collaboration.


    Parent
    OMG, the arrogance! (3.66 / 3) (#131)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:14:03 PM EST
    Should it be God's plan to have me in the White House, I look forward to our collaboration.

    He's Bush III.

    The collaboration he was referring to (1.00 / 1) (#184)
    by jibal on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:28:48 PM EST
    was with the man in the audience he was talking with, not with God. And "should it be God's plan" was just a jokey way to say "if I'm elected" (since presumably that result would be consistent with God's plan, just as Clinton implied the same about herself). Thus, no arrogance and no Bush III, except in the eyes of those committed to finding it.

    Parent
    He's so boring (3.66 / 3) (#200)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:34:58 PM EST
    for a charismatic candidate.  

    They both were a little (none / 0) (#202)
    by Lil on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:36:14 PM EST
    I think it is the topic.

    Parent
    yeah but he apparently (none / 0) (#222)
    by TheRefugee on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:43:05 PM EST
    got Casey to turn out Casey voters to fill the audience.

    Parent
    Ok, now he says he was "misconstrued" (3.00 / 2) (#31)
    by andgarden on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:54:39 PM EST
    and then goes into his own biography.

    I HATE this answer, especially because I know what his "reaching out to the church" has looked like.

    His followers will love it though. (none / 0) (#53)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:58:31 PM EST
    He should have just apologized.

    Parent
    Obviously the crowd is not from Messiah college... (3.00 / 2) (#130)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:14:01 PM EST
    ...he must have ringers in there cause evangelicals no way would have applauded that answer. Oh god, he just said he would collaborate with creationists? Scientists are going to have a hissy fit about that.

    here's your scientist hissy fit, right on cue (5.00 / 2) (#194)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:33:07 PM EST
    HE SAID WHAT????????????

    CREATIONISTS???

    I'M GOING TO HAVE ANOTHER ANEURYSM.

    Parent

    Ugh (none / 0) (#219)
    by nell on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:41:08 PM EST
    Creationism = bad. McClurkin = bad. Not everyone belongs at the table.

    And I just text messaged my once neutral partner who is now drinking the kool-aid (he believes only in science, no god) how he feels about Obama bringing creationists to the table. This should be good, I am excited to see my partner WORM Obama out of this one...

    Parent

    Nonstop media manipulation for Obama (3.00 / 2) (#191)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:31:09 PM EST
    this is reminding me of the lead up to the Iraq War on FOX News.  Every opportunity to advance an agenda was taken advantage of... not a broadcast or pundit panel or interview or caption went to waste to seek their goals.

    I can't imagine (none / 0) (#211)
    by Lil on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:39:02 PM EST
    very many people are still watching this. Taking a nap, while it is on maybe. Not sure it is to Obama's advantage tp be putting people to sleep, but you are so right about the questions advancing an agenda.

    Parent
    Hmm (3.00 / 2) (#215)
    by lilburro on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:40:00 PM EST
    didn't ask Obama about evil or whether God wanted him to be President..instead he got softballs about torture.  
    When time is limited for this kind of thing such disparities are important.  And it's happened over and over.
    Ugh.

    If he says aaaannnddd one more time... (1.00 / 1) (#180)
    by gish720 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:26:45 PM EST


    Nice, save the poverty question for Obama. (1.00 / 1) (#183)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:27:43 PM EST


    Yes because they want to send a message to.... (5.00 / 2) (#187)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:29:45 PM EST
    ...John Edwards.

    Parent
    I think (none / 0) (#185)
    by LoisInCo on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:29:38 PM EST
    Hillary gave longer answers and got fewer questions actually.

    Parent
    I expect Obama to be much more (none / 0) (#1)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:40:01 PM EST
    interesting if the moderators participate as they should.

    because he's so adept at putting his foot in it (5.00 / 2) (#7)
    by Kathy on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:44:33 PM EST
    when he's not in a scripted format.

    Parent
    why? (none / 0) (#4)
    by bjorn on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:41:23 PM EST


    Parent
    Because there are many questions on faith (5.00 / 3) (#8)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:44:41 PM EST
    that they could ask him. Rev. Wright for one and clinging to religion from bitterness for two. If CNN ignores these issues in this forum, they are selling out.

    Parent
    got it, thanks (5.00 / 2) (#11)
    by bjorn on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:45:21 PM EST


    Parent
    But but.. (5.00 / 1) (#20)
    by Andy08 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:51:17 PM EST
    haven't they already sold out?

    Parent
    She is being very careful (none / 0) (#2)
    by bjorn on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:40:36 PM EST
    to compliment all religions, Jewish, Catholic, in very specific ways.

    I don't think it's difficult (5.00 / 2) (#5)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:42:07 PM EST
    for her to do that.  I fully believe that she has plenty of Jewish friends, for instance.  She's a Big Tent Christian!

    Parent
    Obama just said he said it was "a faith" (none / 0) (#32)
    by Cream City on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:54:41 PM EST
    that he was talking about in his infamous comments, that "a faith" was important in people's lives, etc.  Anyone else catch that?  Uh, only one faith?

    Parent
    These questions are crazy (none / 0) (#10)
    by lilburro on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:45:03 PM EST
    completely crazy.

    Actually audience (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by lilburro on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:45:39 PM EST
    questions are okay.  But Campbell and Meacham are nuts.

    Parent
    Who is sponsoring this and why? (none / 0) (#14)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:47:30 PM EST


    Easy stomach...he gets to come out like... (none / 0) (#16)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:48:48 PM EST
    a rock star? Did Hillary walk out through the crowd?

    Weird that in Clinton County, Obama gets a (none / 0) (#19)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:50:29 PM EST
    bigger welcome.

    It's a college.... (5.00 / 3) (#22)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:51:29 PM EST
    ..albeit a Catholic one.

    Parent
    Did CNN pick the crowd? (5.00 / 1) (#34)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:54:46 PM EST
    just saying, we know this question is on the minds of not just me.

    Parent
    Clinton CountRy, I mean. (none / 0) (#21)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:51:26 PM EST


    Parent
    Did CNN pick the crowd? (none / 0) (#36)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:54:54 PM EST
    just saying... we know this question is on the minds of not just me.

    Parent
    I may have to bag this.... (none / 0) (#26)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:52:59 PM EST
    ...I can no longer stand this man. And this crowd is going to eat up everything he says.

    Thank you Bible google (none / 0) (#28)
    by Kathy on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:53:27 PM EST
    "clinging" is a word from the scripture.

    So is "liar."

    Way to rephrase Obama. It's all good now. (none / 0) (#29)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:53:47 PM EST


    Yeah, BTD, what happened to the apology. (none / 0) (#37)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:54:57 PM EST
    Sounds like revised justification to me.

    Terrible and damaging answer (5.00 / 1) (#43)
    by andgarden on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:56:26 PM EST


    Parent
    His apologies, at least some of the four (none / 0) (#51)
    by Cream City on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:58:20 PM EST
    count 'em four yesterday, have made it worse.  I haven't seen any media move on to those yet, so they'll probably move right past them . . . but the Repubs won't.  I could just see some of those self-justifications aka so-called apologies in ads.  Ugh.

    Parent
    No one else (none / 0) (#40)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:55:29 PM EST
    but him has spoken about religion...."ahhhhh"

    No one else but him (5.00 / 1) (#47)
    by Kathy on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:57:33 PM EST
    has done a lot of things.

    Except maybe McGovern.

    I'm going to force myself to listen to him through his abortion response (ooooh...let's see where he stands tonight!) and then I am so going to watch the Tudors.

    Parent

    No one has spoken out (5.00 / 2) (#50)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:57:53 PM EST
    more powerfully for religion, against anti-Semitism and for gay rights!

    Parent
    ha ha ha, same old crock (none / 0) (#60)
    by RalphB on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:59:44 PM EST


    Parent
    BTD says he looks tired (none / 0) (#46)
    by andgarden on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 07:57:16 PM EST
    I was going to make the superficial observation that it looks like he's growing a mustache.

    Part of his disguise (5.00 / 1) (#96)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:07:13 PM EST
    for sneaking back into the Pennsylvania countryside.

    Parent
    Bill Richardson Eye for the straight guy? (none / 0) (#63)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:00:07 PM EST
    as long as he stays away from the beard... (see Republican blogs and photoshop of OBL/Obama already) yikes

    Parent
    My gawd his boring (none / 0) (#68)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:01:11 PM EST
    What is he saying, why don't I follow him, am I moron?  (don't answer)  

    No you're not. (5.00 / 2) (#118)
    by felizarte on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:11:21 PM EST
    I asked another friend watching with me, "Do you understand what he is saying?" and he answered "no." I asked because I think that he is rambling, going off topic.  I am sure many who are watching are scratching their heads too at some of his answers.

    Parent
    His answer on when life begins is.... (none / 0) (#72)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:01:58 PM EST
    ..even worse than Hillary's although he is using the word potential but upped the ante by giving it a "moral weight."

    I like his answer (none / 0) (#73)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:02:05 PM EST
    better on 'when does life start' though.  At least he admits he can't know.

    Get Campbell out! (none / 0) (#75)
    by GOPmurderedconscience on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:02:47 PM EST
    She's horrible.

    She's just like the SNL satire.... (5.00 / 1) (#79)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:03:45 PM EST
    ...her husband should be jealous.

    Parent
    I'm waiting for her to start slapping (5.00 / 3) (#104)
    by Anne on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:08:46 PM EST
    the table and screaming "yes! yes! yes!" a la Meg Ryan in When Harry Met Sally.

    Parent
    Heh. (none / 0) (#116)
    by LoisInCo on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:11:13 PM EST
    At least she would saying something worth hearing in that case.

    Parent
    Living wills (none / 0) (#76)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:02:47 PM EST
    don't work in all states.  Depends on state law.

    Gee, doesn't know about when life begins (none / 0) (#77)
    by angie on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:03:11 PM EST
    I guess he's of two minds about that too.

    Life begins (5.00 / 2) (#84)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:04:32 PM EST
    when you accept Obama as your personal savior.

    Parent
    Obama says babies are punishment (none / 0) (#78)
    by MarkL on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:03:24 PM EST

    Look, I got two daughters, 9 years old and 6 years old," he said. "I am going to teach them first about values and morals, but if they make a mistake, I don't want them punished with a baby.

    from Obama Election Central.

    I do not see how he can square that with his what he is saying tonight.

    Don't parse him too carefully. (5.00 / 1) (#106)
    by lilburro on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:09:34 PM EST
    It's wrong and it's just sadly typical of elections.

    Parent
    Oh noes! (none / 0) (#90)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:06:02 PM EST
    He's complimenting George Bush.  Niiice.

    Tell me again why I should vote for this guy?

    Why Compliment Bush? (none / 0) (#108)
    by noonan on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:09:53 PM EST
    He's recognized within the US and internationally by agencies dealing with AIDS in Africa as being the most attentive president. Granted, most of us disagree with how he advocated abstinence first, but we are sending more aid to deal with this problem under Bush than during any other administration.

    Parent
    First name Peggy? (5.00 / 2) (#121)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:11:38 PM EST
    Just wondering, really.

    Parent
    Haven't you heard? Clinton News Network. (none / 0) (#91)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:06:26 PM EST
    haha

    oh yeah, lol--thanks for reminding, too funny n/t (none / 0) (#128)
    by TheRefugee on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:13:40 PM EST


    Parent
    WORM, WORM, WORM (none / 0) (#101)
    by andgarden on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:08:33 PM EST
    He is really not good at this.

    I'm glad Hillary went first (none / 0) (#102)
    by angie on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:08:33 PM EST
    Now I can switch over to John Adams on HBO.  Thank god I can keep up with what's going on here.  

    Just words (none / 0) (#103)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:08:39 PM EST
    Don't parse them too carefully!

    you spin me right round (none / 0) (#123)
    by lilburro on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:12:12 PM EST
    baby right round like a record baby...

    Parent
    That's a terrible answer for you Obama... (none / 0) (#109)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:10:14 PM EST
    ...because none of those situations you mentioned apply to your daughters. You will not be honest enough to say that having a child could mess up even an upper middle class young teen. I liked when he said this better the first time than I do now when he added this crap.

    OMG do we have to (none / 0) (#110)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:10:17 PM EST
    think about his adorable daughters having sex at 12 or 13?  I applaud his bluntness, but I didn't need to hear that.

    Ahem (none / 0) (#114)
    by andgarden on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:10:59 PM EST
    "the Christian community, of which I'm a part"

    HUH?

    andgarden, where in PA is this college? (none / 0) (#138)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:17:35 PM EST


    Parent
    Grantham, PA (n/t) (5.00 / 1) (#142)
    by Alec82 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:19:10 PM EST


    Parent
    rural or city? (none / 0) (#157)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:21:46 PM EST


    Parent
    Dunno (5.00 / 1) (#158)
    by andgarden on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:22:04 PM EST
    Never heard of it.

    Parent
    ruralish (none / 0) (#182)
    by kredwyn on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:27:40 PM EST
    link

    It's off of 15. Have never been there, but I drive by it on my way up to Harrisburg.

    Parent

    But they applaud Rev. Wright (that he was (5.00 / 2) (#189)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:30:00 PM EST
    misundestood)? Not like any religion school here in TN. They must have given out tickets to some fans.

    Parent
    Monica Goodling (none / 0) (#209)
    by kredwyn on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:38:13 PM EST
    graduated from there and went on to Regents for her law degree. Seems she forgot some of the tenets in the covenant.

    Here's the wiki link.

    I don't know anything about the college beyond that it wasn't on my list of southeastern PA colleges to look at as a HS senior.

    I did get as far up as Bucknell.

    Parent

    Heh..he believes in evolution... (none / 0) (#122)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:11:46 PM EST


    No one since Charles Darwin.... (5.00 / 6) (#134)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:15:17 PM EST
    ..has done more to advance the theory of evolution.

    Parent
    LOL (none / 0) (#136)
    by Emma on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:16:11 PM EST
    Hahahahaha!!!!!!

    Parent
    Speaking of muddled (none / 0) (#125)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:12:40 PM EST
    That would be the word for Obama's poll results here.  He probably didn't want muddled.

    Seems like the audience (none / 0) (#145)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:19:36 PM EST
    is stacked for Obama.  I predict that the CNN talking heads will announce that Obama is the winner.

    I missed the first part - did anybody ask him about Rev. Wright?

    No Wright yet (none / 0) (#151)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:20:53 PM EST


    Parent
    Here we go... (none / 0) (#154)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:21:35 PM EST


    Parent
    Talking about it now. (none / 0) (#156)
    by MichaelGale on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:21:38 PM EST


    Parent
    He denied he was his spiritual advisor. (none / 0) (#162)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:22:45 PM EST


    Parent
    I think he watched her answers and (none / 0) (#147)
    by athyrio on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:19:50 PM EST
    had his aides whispering potential answers to him to use...

    Jeremiah Wright - Meet the Bus (none / 0) (#165)
    by Anne on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:23:12 PM EST
    you've been demoted from spiritual mentor to Just my pastor."

    That one may have teeth.

    I thought he had openly called him his/a (none / 0) (#170)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:24:45 PM EST
    mentor and advisor?

    Parent
    he is on the record saying he was his (none / 0) (#203)
    by Andy08 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:36:26 PM EST
    "sounding board" (NYT, RS) and I think he also said that he was his morla compass but can't remember where did Iread that. He alwayss refered to him as much more thatn "his pastor" that's why the Wright relationship is so troublesome. Your pastor ain't like an uncle to you.


    Parent
    He's been saying spiritual advisor... (none / 0) (#171)
    by kredwyn on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:24:50 PM EST
    for quite a long time. Does he really think that the demotion's going to carry any weight this far into the game?

    Parent
    kicked under the bus (none / 0) (#172)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:25:07 PM EST
    along with Grandma!

    Parent
    Anne, I have seen the light...... (none / 0) (#176)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:25:52 PM EST
    ...nothing has teeth with this guy. People willingly get under the bus for him.

    Parent
    Ha ha, the audience as a little slow getting... (none / 0) (#166)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:23:39 PM EST
    ...that one. And Reverend Wright got a hand in Messiah College, who would have thunk it.

    Must be a very liberal thinking religious (none / 0) (#177)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:26:13 PM EST
    school. Huh?

    Parent
    I actually thought... (none / 0) (#195)
    by Alec82 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:33:09 PM EST
    ...his comments about Islam were very good, and accurate.  But Indonesia is a far cry from the Middle East.

    Parent
    Apparently there are few Messiah students... (none / 0) (#196)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:33:23 PM EST
    ...in the crowd. This is from their website:

    Due to space limitations and security constraints, attendance at the Forum is by invitation only. At this point, all tickets have been distributed or allocated for Messiah College students.

    To maximize the number of Messiah students sharing in the excitement of this event, the College is also simulcasting The Compassion Forum for a live "watch party" for students. Unfortunately, due to the extensive staffing demands of the Forum, the College will be unable to accommodate "watch parties" for off-campus groups or organizations.



    Parent
    hahaha (none / 0) (#173)
    by TheRefugee on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:25:14 PM EST
    me and bob casey share like a minute of time in catholic school.

    MY gawd...Suharto? (none / 0) (#178)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:26:18 PM EST
    Tolerant....my gawd...his foreign policy credentials with moslems just went down the toilet.  

    That was a real screw up (none / 0) (#188)
    by RalphB on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:29:52 PM EST
    Suharto the dictator was no Gandhi  :-)

    Parent
    The "brand" of Islam... (none / 0) (#179)
    by LoisInCo on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:26:25 PM EST
    So it was like classic coke and not new coke?

    The applause (none / 0) (#181)
    by Grey on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:26:54 PM EST
    is not uniform.  Several times, less than half the audience (fewer than that, actually), were applauding.
    was he there during Suharto or Sukarno? (none / 0) (#190)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:30:55 PM EST


    He's been to Kenya (none / 0) (#197)
    by Kathy on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:33:34 PM EST
    "several times"?  Since when?  He throws out Pakistan the other day and now this.  I think someone needs to peruse his passport files.  It seems strange he has never mentioned these multiple trips in his books.

    Parent
    I think he arrived in the late 60s.... (none / 0) (#212)
    by Alec82 on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:39:06 PM EST
    ...right around the time Suharto took power.

    Parent
    Now torture. He's getting all the good (none / 0) (#193)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:33:03 PM EST
    questions.

    We don't torture...except (none / 0) (#198)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:33:38 PM EST
    a certain group at TL that we are torturing with our campaign.

    Jeralyn, it's not that his questions were easier. (none / 0) (#204)
    by Teresa on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:36:32 PM EST
    They were better to answer - poverty, torture, etc.

    that is easier (none / 0) (#217)
    by TheRefugee on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:40:54 PM EST
    Obama can seem no-nonsense on questions like that..hillary gets asked questions where any answer other than obfuscation would harm her with one or another type of voter.  Every voter is against torture.  BS.

    But at least at the end they could have thrown the inane:  Is god for you?  

    Parent

    Let's meet up in the public square (none / 0) (#206)
    by stillife on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:36:43 PM EST
    and get a Unity Pony!

    thank god they're almost out of time - snark (n/t) (none / 0) (#207)
    by DandyTIger on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:37:15 PM EST


    Thanks Jeralyn (none / 0) (#221)
    by diplomatic on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:41:37 PM EST
    You kept up pretty well.  I hope all this work you put into TalkLeft will pay off.

    OK, now the CNN heads are lecturing (none / 0) (#223)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:43:54 PM EST
    Democrats on how they should talk about faith.  I'm switching off.

    new thread, this one closing (none / 0) (#224)
    by Jeralyn on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:44:40 PM EST
    post-forum thread here.

    She should not have opted to go first (none / 0) (#225)
    by suisser on Sun Apr 13, 2008 at 08:45:34 PM EST
    I'm sorry that she did, it worked against her. Took the crowd a while to warm up and she didn't have that great end cap opportunity to schmooze.

    CNN Faith Forum, Live Blog II | 218 comments (218 topical)