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Tuesday Open Thread

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Blog Related
Posted on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 11:53:35 AM EST
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Where I am it is the afternoon. Where a lot of you are, it is still the morning. So I am calling this "Tuesday Open Thread." I suspect there will be a few more today.

This is an Open Thread.

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    Tuesday Open Thread | 170 comments (170 topical)

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    Polls, polls (5.00 / 1) (#2)
    by andgarden on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 11:57:11 AM EST
    polls:

    Florida: McCain leads 47 - 43 percent, compared to a 46 - 44 percent Obama lead July 31;
    Ohio: Obama has 44 percent to McCain's 43 percent, compared to a 46 - 44 percent Obama lead least time;
    Pennsylvania: Obama leads McCain 49 - 42 percent, unchanged from July 31.

    Not good enough.

    Should have MoE. (5.00 / 0) (#10)
    by Fabian on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:03:54 PM EST
    It makes close races look like even more of a toss up.

    I'm both happy and sad about living in OH.  Happy because we'll get some attention.  Sad because we'll get bombarded with sleazy campaign ads.  

    Parent

    I understand (5.00 / 1) (#19)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:07:47 PM EST
    the Ayers ad has started running in OH. Apparently it's effective if those poll numbers are correct.

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: Obama is very unlikely to carry OH. He's not making an economic plea to the voters of that state.

    Obama has dumped a ton of money into FL only to worsen his numbers. Exactly how is he going to win in Nov? I don't think he's going to do it out west either. NV being a state that borders AZ and I don't know how it's going in NM.

    Parent

    Fox (none / 0) (#151)
    by daria g on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:10:31 PM EST
    All over a story about documents connecting Ayers to Obama that they've just gotten access to?  I'm not familiar with what's going on but expect they'll pound away at it as long as they can.

    Parent
    Where's that pony again? (5.00 / 4) (#5)
    by janarchy on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 11:59:42 AM EST
    California Hillary Delegates Protesting.

    Don't read the comments. It's like sticking your hand in a blender. Pity that so many Obama supporters have no f'ing idea what democracy is supposed to be like.

    Can someone name me one other convention where any other single candidate and his/her delegates were treated in such a shoddy manner?

    I usually don't like Gloria Allred (5.00 / 2) (#15)
    by americanincanada on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:06:00 PM EST
    but I am glad she is a Clinton delegate from CA. if there are any moves to silence or browbeat Clinton delegates you can bet we will hear about it.

    Parent
    I feel the same. (5.00 / 2) (#50)
    by janarchy on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:18:35 PM EST
    I am just sick reading about how they keep trying to stifle the HRC delegates. And it's not because I am/was a Clinton supporter -- this is wrong no matter who it is. If they're doing it to anyone else's delegates, then shame shame.

    Then again, I'm the idiot who got annoyed that Kucinich was kept out of the debates too.

    Parent

    Wow (5.00 / 1) (#66)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:22:23 PM EST
    I too am part of the idiot club. Nothing aggravates me more than pickin on the little guy. i may not agree with Kuchinich on everything but I respect that he has principles that he feels aren't worth compromising and I like that he is willing to put himself out there(despite the faqct that half of his own freakin' party is willing to mock him).

    Parent
    Exactly (5.00 / 1) (#90)
    by janarchy on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:33:51 PM EST
    I have a very close friend who has been a die-hard Kucinich supporter for the past 6 years. She's worked for both his presidential campaigns. While I know he had no chance of getting very far, I respect his right to try and do. And in all honesty, the little guy's got more integrity and more principles than most people in Washington. He stands by his convictions and does something about them which is highly admirable.

    I really dont care who the candidates were being kept out -- saying 'you can only show up if you have this arbitrary percentage of the voters' is just plain wrong. Even if it's less than 1% (I'm looking at YOU, Joe Biden), your supporters have a right to speak and a right to be heard. And maybe, just maybe, if the underdog gets heard by enough people in a national forum, more people will sign on with him/her.

    This whole roll call thing is just nauseating and the stupid Obama supporters I've seen are completely clueless as to WHY we're so angry and WHY this is wrong. I feel like I'm fighting the same fight I had with Republicans back in 2000 over Gore v. Bush and why those votes should all be counted too.

    It's pathetic that the DNC has chosen to take a page from that play book and gone running with it. Then again, why should we be surprised? Left talk radio became a mirror image of right talk radio. MSNBC became a mirror image of Fox. Why should this be any different?

    I hope some day people learn their lesson. Sadly, like Bush as president, it will come too little too late.

    Parent

    The whole debate thing (none / 0) (#113)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:45:09 PM EST
    struck me as very Survivoresque. Each debate we were expected to  "vote off" a nominee. It struck me as very childish.

    Parent
    Considering (none / 0) (#143)
    by janarchy on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:04:41 PM EST
    the entire primary season seemed to be run like an extended version of American Idol (and still is!), it's not a bad analogy.

    Parent
    I am baffled (none / 0) (#116)
    by Steve M on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:48:15 PM EST
    How does Paula Jones' lawyer end up as a Clinton delegate?!

    Parent
    Perhaps (none / 0) (#125)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:53:07 PM EST
    some people see Hillary as an entity SEPARATE from her spouse. Happy women's equality day, we aren't chattel.

    Parent
    You know (none / 0) (#141)
    by Steve M on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:03:39 PM EST
    I think that was more than a little rude.

    If someone sued my wife and tried to embarrass her and wreck her career, I think it would be weird if they wound up as one of my political supporters afterwards.  That doesn't mean I think I am my wife's chattel.

    Parent

    This is the type of burning question I (none / 0) (#128)
    by oculus on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:55:12 PM EST
    wish Jeralyn would use her floor pass and blogger media credential to pursue.  Inquiring minds want to know.  

    Parent
    I wish I had been paying (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by Fabian on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 11:59:51 AM EST
    attention to previous primaries and conventions.  This is the first one I've paid close attention to, primarily because of the active blogosphere and I have soooo many questions!  Most of them are along the line of "Is this the way these things usually go?".

    I hope not, because things don't look like they are going all that well this year.

    From the Jay Cost article (5.00 / 2) (#8)
    by lilburro on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:01:23 PM EST
    BTD posted, a line I wanted to draw attention to:

    Hopefully for the Obama campaign, the risk of passing over her will not materialize into electoral damage. Instead, pro-Hillary Democrats will see McCain as Bush III, and they'll be so hungry for change they'll pull the lever for Obama. Of course, hope has no place in one's coldly rational decision calculus. There is a non-trivial chance that the party will fracture - not necessarily at the Denver convention this week, but in the living rooms of Democratic leaners in Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan, etc., sometime before Election Day, as they quietly decide they like Hillary best, McCain second, and Obama third.

    Terrifying.  But that sounds like reality.

    Make an ad that attacks Bush already Obama!  No one will hold that type of negative politics against you.

    Project much Howie? (5.00 / 5) (#14)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:06:00 PM EST
    The GOP has nothing to do with why the party is divided this time around and everything to do with party leadership, Howard Dean included. Does he really believe anyone is going to buy the BS he is selling?

    He wasn't Speaking Of Dem Divides (none / 0) (#86)
    by daring grace on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:32:19 PM EST
    He was responding to a question on the morning show on MSNBC about the Dems reaching out to other groups, traditionally Republican groups like Evangelicals, for example, to find common ground on issues like poverty, climate change.

    He was contrasting that with the Republican SOP of targeting, demonizing and dividing constituencies.

    Parent

    As opposed to (5.00 / 1) (#109)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:42:37 PM EST
    who? Donna sat on national television and said the Democratic party didn't need Latinos or working class? Daschle went on national Tv and said that white men were a GOP demographic. They allowed their undeclared pundits to call people who chose Clinton uneducated racists. The Democratic leadership shouldn't toss stones since they live in a glass house.

    Parent
    As Opposed To (none / 0) (#138)
    by daring grace on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:00:55 PM EST
    the Republicans.

    Parent
    Joe Scarborough blasts David Shuster (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by TheRizzo on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:08:13 PM EST
    Wow, what a great exchange!!!

    http://newsbusters.org/static/2008/08/2008-08-26MSNBCMJ3.wmv

    Wow, is it jet lag? (none / 0) (#154)
    by daria g on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:25:55 PM EST
    All the cable talking heads are losing their s***.

    Scarborough: "Oh, you're independent just like all the journalists on this station."  And it gets worse from there!

    Parent

    Wow (none / 0) (#158)
    by Steve M on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:57:29 PM EST
    That was some good stuff.  Maybe I'm missing out by not watching this show.

    Parent
    Testy (none / 0) (#175)
    by TheRizzo on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 03:14:11 PM EST
    No question Joe is getting sick of the over the top left liberal bias around there.  He is starting to get fiesty.  Especially after that shovel comment by KO last night,.

    Parent
    Well (none / 0) (#177)
    by Steve M on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 03:51:00 PM EST
    it's kinda funny how former GOP congressman Joe Scarborough has been as tough on the Bush Administration and the war in Iraq as anyone on TV, and then along comes David Shuster to try and act like Scarborough is wedded to whatever the GOP does.  I'd be annoyed too.

    Parent
    Bad Tracker News (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by BrianJ on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:09:32 PM EST
    Rasmussen:  McCain and Obama tied 44-44 w/o leaners, 46-46 with

    Gallup:  McCain 46, Obama 44-  as far as I can tell, McCain's biggest lead since March

    Obviously, the excitement of Joe Biden's FUTURAMIC! campaign didn't do much for voters.

    Bad news, indeed (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by andgarden on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:10:56 PM EST


    Parent
    And not likely to get better. (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by Anne on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:12:48 PM EST
    I think the Invesco Extravaganza is going to make it even worse.

    Parent
    I think so too (5.00 / 1) (#37)
    by americanincanada on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:14:37 PM EST
    It plays right into the hands of McCain's celebrity ads. As does CNN's constant shots of hollywood stars in the room last night.

    I have a really bad feeling about the debates, McCain's VP pick (which I still believe will be Palin), the polls and the election.

    Parent

    If McCain nominates a woman (5.00 / 0) (#81)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:30:24 PM EST
    I will likely vote for McCain.  Democrats can talk all day about women's rights, but I know now that it's all talk.  Queue the right wing preachers opening and closing the DNC convention.

    We'll have a strong Democratic Congress that will just have to learn how to fight with Republican presidents...it will be good for them, a growth experience.  And women will actually have a platform in the top levels of Goverment.

    Why is it that the Republicans are the party of firsts?

    First Woman and AA on the Supreme Court.
    and

    possibly
    First Woman elected VP.

    Parent

    I was in a meeting with (5.00 / 1) (#107)
    by sleepwalker on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:41:31 PM EST
    Pat Schroeder in the early nineties. The topic was medical research, but over coffee we talked about the prospects for a female president in either of our lifetimes. She said that she believed the first female POTUS or VP would be a Republican. She said that when the R's decided to do it, they would get behind her, and support her all the way. I am excited about the possibility of John McCain choosing a female running mate because after the Republicans shatter the glass ceiling, a female Dem candidate may actually have a chance.

    Parent
    Dream on (none / 0) (#160)
    by Upstart Crow on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:14:35 PM EST
    Apparently she isn't even being vetted.

    Parent
    Not sure who you're (none / 0) (#173)
    by americanincanada on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 03:02:26 PM EST
    talking about but as far as Sarah Palin goes eh confirmed late last week that she has submitted papers. Also, McCain's vetting team has been seen twice in and around Juneau Alaska.

    Parent
    For the record (5.00 / 2) (#124)
    by Steve M on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:52:30 PM EST
    Thurgood Marshall was appointed by LBJ.

    Parent
    Souter by Bush (none / 0) (#135)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:59:55 PM EST
    The GOP got punked. Heehee

    Parent
    Wow, you're ridiculous (none / 0) (#89)
    by andgarden on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:33:19 PM EST
    Seriously, what do you think of Clarence Thomas as a Supreme Court Justice?

    Your line of reasoning is absurd, and if I were you I would be embarrassed to even have committed it to writing.  

    Parent

    ANITA HILL (none / 0) (#92)
    by Desired User Name on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:36:04 PM EST
    Me and friends were joking that McCain will nominate Anita Hill for VP.

    Listen, I just hope he doesn't pick Hucklebee or Romney. I do think he picks a woman, Obama will be in big bigger and biggest trouble.

    Parent

    If McCain picks a woman (none / 0) (#96)
    by americanincanada on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:38:27 PM EST
    especially one with as compelling a personal story, not to mention a strng stance on energy and taking on oil companies, as Sarah Palin...Obama will be finished.

    Parent
    If a female VP (none / 0) (#100)
    by lilburro on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:39:05 PM EST
    stands by and claps as they take away Roe v Wade, that will be a shameful day.  

    Parent
    Roe V Wade will not be overturned(?) (5.00 / 1) (#119)
    by Desired User Name on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:49:32 PM EST
    As I have seen many on TL say, the Repubs "need" Roe V Wade because any mention of it gets the Religious Right foaming at the mouth and emptying their pockets! Without it the Repubs lose a BIG marketing tool and fundraising ruse. It must remain to keep the Religious Right in full on FERAL MODE.

    I am female and I should be really "freaking out"
    about the potential of losing Roe V, but what did Obama do about Bush's latest  BS trying to claim any mode of Birth Control as a form of "abortion"? Not much, all he did was sign HillPac's petition.
    Hillary was on that shizz ASAP and doing everything she can/could and can.

    But Obama? Again, as far as I know he just signed the petition... Hell I did that too and I'm not even running for POTUS. [not yet anyway]*smirk

     

    Parent

    Leaving Roe v Wade (none / 0) (#129)
    by lilburro on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:55:27 PM EST
    in the hands of Republican strategists, who may or may not see the truth in what you're saying, just does not work for me.


    Parent
    Roe V Wade has entered the building (none / 0) (#147)
    by Desired User Name on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:07:27 PM EST
    I can't afford to give it insurance or even a minimum wage---a.k.a. It doesn't work for me EITHER! I was merely stating what many on TL comments have said in the past and once reading it, it rang out as a real possibility of truth for the seedy Repubs.

    I don't want RoeVWade to be overturned, surely no way, NOT, but in a way it's almost as if that'd be a real way to get women FIGHTING AGAIN.

    Okay listen, I won't go off on any ranting tangents about The Revolution and lack there of, but just note, I have neither seen nor heard Obama doing much for women and so when people state "McCain is going to appoint judges...OMG RoeV" and the like, I am more interested in hearing what the heck Obama is going to do!

    I'm not hearing it! And the HILLPAC PETITION made it louder that I wasn't hearing anything from obama.

    Parent

    Roe v Wade is already almost gone (none / 0) (#134)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:58:31 PM EST
    They limited third term abortions. The Democrats stood by and allowed that to happen(some of them women).

    The Supreme Court boogeyman doesn't phase me in the least. Whether it be McCain or Obama the only way women are going to get their power back is to push back with all their might on Congress.

    Parent

    PUSH BACK (none / 0) (#150)
    by Desired User Name on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:09:50 PM EST
    EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    pardon the multi-exlcamation points, but
    hey, you deserve them!

    Parent

    Kay Bailey Hutchinson, Condi, (none / 0) (#131)
    by prittfumes on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:56:28 PM EST
    or none of the above? Then who?

    Parent
    How many times do we have to say it? (none / 0) (#136)
    by americanincanada on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:00:13 PM EST
    Sarah Palin (safe bet and very popular if you read the freeper blogs)

    Meg Whitman

    Parent

    Thanks, American. (none / 0) (#181)
    by prittfumes on Wed Aug 27, 2008 at 12:35:18 PM EST
    That'll teach me to slow down and read instead of skimming.

    Parent
    Shorter Gallup (5.00 / 0) (#55)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:20:01 PM EST
    Women are P*SSED.

    Parent
    WOW!! McCain moves ahead - no Biden bounce (5.00 / 0) (#85)
    by Josey on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:31:16 PM EST


    Parent
    She is ridiculous (5.00 / 0) (#28)
    by TheRizzo on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:11:46 PM EST
    A complete and total embarrassment.  Watching her speech last night was great fun.  Can't wait to see her ousted.

    527 (5.00 / 2) (#34)
    by Desired User Name on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:14:28 PM EST
    I am wondering how many of you have seen the new ad called "Barack Obama: Opportunity?" which is currently #6 on the Viral Video Charts
    http://www.viralvideochart.com/

    I'm disturbed by how many digs the Repubs are getting on Obama and how few he is getting on them. It seems every ball the Obama camp hits gets slammed back by a bigger and thicker bat.

    This is troubling. This new ad is seriously a good one in so much as it hits gut level AND THAT IS WHAT Obama needs to be doing.

    WHY were they so good at attacking the Clintons and are so inept at attacking McCain?

    Is it because they had so much help from the Repubs in attacking Hills and Bills?

    I'm concerned how damn good the Repub ads are getting. Seriously worried.

    The problem is that they found (5.00 / 2) (#60)
    by BrianJ on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:20:57 PM EST
    Obama's Berserk Button.

    All of us have something or some subject that we get angry even thinking about.  Someone verbally attacks our family members, mentions an ex-spouse, questions some accomplishment we're proud of, etc. and we lose the capacity for rational thought in response.

    For Obama, that something is his standing as a Very Serious Person.  McCain ran "The One" more or less randomly, seeking a weak spot, and Obama and his supporters went nuts.  McCain knew he'd hit a sensitive spot, so of course he's done it again and again since.

    (A man's temper, by the way, is almost never a Berserk Button itself.)

    Obama and his supportes need to stop responding to these attacks because those attacks only make it even more obvious how vulnerable Obama is (or how vulnerable they think he is).

    Parent

    Yup. (5.00 / 1) (#75)
    by Fabian on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:28:46 PM EST
    I knew this was going to happen.  The GOP would start probing for Obama's sore spots and after they found one, they'd keep poking to see how loud he'd yell and how high he'd jump.

    What I didn't predict is that this particular attack would be so effective.  

    Parent

    Beserko-Rama--A-Boom-Boom-aling-dong (5.00 / 2) (#77)
    by Desired User Name on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:29:12 PM EST
    Yes yes, they found the button and all hellaciousness and frenzy breaks lose for the Obama Camp. THAT IS NOT GOOD!

    BUT it is the Obama Camp that busted out the whole "how many houses" attack on McCain and NOW it's lobbed right back at him.

    It's the Obama Camp that busted blab about "Mccain is such an old, aged, ancient Man"--the ageism made way for the "THE ONE" ad which in essence made fun of Obama's youth.

    What I am saying is that Team BO are just asking for it and TeamJM are ready willing and able to dish it back full throttle.

    This is bad news for us DEMS and is stinking very smelly like the 527s that crippled Kerry. AND YET these ads are still TAME by comparison to what Kerry got. I mean wow, it's not even the GE yet!

    Parent

    McCain (none / 0) (#112)
    by Nadai on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:44:53 PM EST
    was on Leno last night joking about his age - saying his Social Security Number was 8, stuff like that.  Not particularly funny but clearly he's not going to freak out at being called old.  Obama needs to find out what will make McCain lose it and hit that.  This is more likely to p!ss off old voters rather than McCain.

    Parent
    If the Paris Hilton ad is persuasive... (5.00 / 1) (#167)
    by Upstart Crow on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:37:19 PM EST
    Surely the thing to do is focus on accomplishments and policy, and not on Obama's longing to be a rock star.

    The little MO show last night was all about selling us on the PERSONALITIES of the Obamas. It presupposes that I'm fascinated with their backstory, and want to learn all about their fist bumps. I couldn't care less. I don't find them all that interesting.  

    Clearly, this election is my "berserk button." I'll go back on my medication now...


    Parent

    SORRY FOR MULTIPLE (none / 0) (#168)
    by Upstart Crow on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:38:18 PM EST
    My computer hit ITS berserk button today.

    Parent
    If he felt that way... (none / 0) (#162)
    by Upstart Crow on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:20:31 PM EST
    Surely the thing to do is focus on accomplishments and policy, and not on wanting to be a rock star.

    The little MO show last night was all about selling us on the PERSONALITIES of the Obamas. It presupposes that I'm fascinated with their backstory, and want to learn all about their fist bumps. I couldn't care less. I don't find them all that interesting.  

    Clearly, this election is my "berserk button." I need to take my medication if I'm going to read these blogs.

    Parent

    If he felt that way... (none / 0) (#163)
    by Upstart Crow on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:23:43 PM EST
    Surely the thing to do is focus on accomplishments and policy, and not on wanting to be a rock star.

    The little MO show last night was all about selling us on the PERSONALITIES of the Obamas. It presupposes that I'm fascinated with their backstory, and want to learn all about their fist bumps. I couldn't care less. I don't find them all that interesting.  

    Clearly, this election is my "berserk button." I need to take my medication if I'm going to read these blogs.

    Parent

    clever video - (none / 0) (#101)
    by Josey on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:39:33 PM EST
    comparing Obama's half-brother's hut with his Rezko-discounted million dollar home.


    Parent
    Apparently (5.00 / 0) (#40)
    by janarchy on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:15:38 PM EST
    God will 'gift' them with phantom voters just like the RBC gifted Obama phantom voters in Michigan?

    Either that or the fix is in deeper than we thought.

    At this point, I'll put nothing past the DNC or their nominee. Nancy wants to keep her job -- it's cushy and she doesn't have to do anything to keep it!

    Nah.... (5.00 / 0) (#82)
    by Maria Garcia on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:30:48 PM EST
    ...she just knows that if all those newly registered voters get the sense that Obama is a loser they might not be so inclined to vote. Their new coalition has an awful lot of previously disengaged voters and I don't think they got involved this time around to back a loser.

    Parent
    Tough on McCain? (5.00 / 0) (#47)
    by Fabian on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:17:56 PM EST
    Bully for her.  Now, Madame Speaker, what about Bush and Cheney?  Gonna get "tough" on them too?

    What does everybody think.... (5.00 / 1) (#51)
    by kdog on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:18:54 PM EST
    about the 9 year old pitcher in Connecticut being banned from taking the mound in his league for being too damn good?  Link

    I think it's awful...for both the 9 year old phenom and the other kids.  How are the other kids supposed to improve if the best pitcher in the league is forbidden from playing?  How are they suppose to learn about defeat and dissapointment?  Plus, they are denied the opportunity of getting a hit and the accompanying sense of achievement in the face of long odds.  Not to mention what it teaches the phenom..."don't excel at anything, it will only bring you grief".

    It makes no sense to me, no sense at all...this "nanny state everybody gets a trophy" crap has gotta stop, or our future will be severely lacking in achievement, instead we will be wallowing in an abundance of mediocrity. I mean what's next...banning a 9 year old math whiz from advanced mnath classes because he makes the other students feel inferior?  Sun god help us.

    They're scared (5.00 / 1) (#115)
    by Nadai on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:47:09 PM EST
    he's going to hit some kid in the head with a 40 mph fast ball.  It's not simply that he's good.

    Parent
    According to the link.... (none / 0) (#146)
    by kdog on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:07:14 PM EST
    not only is he fast, he's accurate.  The kid doesn't appear to have control issues...he throws hard and he throws strikes.

    Besides, that's why the kids wear batting helmets.  There is always a risk of injury, whether the pitcher throws 30 mph or 40 mph.  

    Parent

    Even the professionals (5.00 / 1) (#155)
    by Nadai on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:34:54 PM EST
    aren't always accurate.  I'm not saying I would have tossed the kid myself; I don't know what I would have done had the decision been mine.  I'm just saying it isn't a matter of "He's too good, get rid of him."

    Parent
    IWhere is the kid supposed to pitch? (none / 0) (#87)
    by oculus on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:33:07 PM EST
    Anyhow, I do recall a girl's softball game that lasted forever because the other team had a terrific pitcher and our team didn't.  Then the game was called on account of darkness and had to be replayed.  

    Parent
    Ya lost me.... (none / 0) (#152)
    by kdog on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:17:31 PM EST
    don't the games go faster with a lights-out pitcher?

    It's the games where the pitchers can't get anybody out that get called for darkness...no?

    Parent

    Well the team with the lights-out (none / 0) (#161)
    by oculus on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:16:50 PM EST
    pitcher was loaded with much better hitters than our team.  Very long innings when they were at bat.  

    Parent
    Gotcha.... (none / 0) (#165)
    by kdog on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:30:30 PM EST
    no mercy rule?  In my softball league if you're up 15 runs after 4 innings, game over.

    I hate that rule because a 15 run lead ain't as insurmountable as it sounds in beer-league softball, besides I'm a disciple of Yogi Berra..."it ain't over till its over".

    Parent

    This was before the dawn of what I call (none / 0) (#171)
    by oculus on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:58:56 PM EST
    the "unmerited self-esteem" era!

    Parent
    Well-coined... (none / 0) (#174)
    by kdog on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 03:11:38 PM EST
    oculus...well-coined.

    Of course this gets me thinking of my little league days....in the 11-12 years there was this pitcher who was a monster, ya know...the 12 year old who already has a beard.  I musta been 0-20 against him, but when I finally ripped that first single...oh baby what a feeling!  I remember it like yesterday.  Too bad the kids in CT are being denied the chance at that kind of thrill.

    Parent

    Ah, Little League... (none / 0) (#178)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 05:32:14 PM EST
    ...the memories! I liked the after game taffee and Pixy Sticks the best.

    Not only are they denied the chance of the best this kid and the thrill that goes with it, they're basically being told they're losers.  "He's too good and you suck, so we won't let it happen.".  Let the kids play.

    It didn't look like his pitching was all that unearthly anyway.

    Parent

    I heard that on the noon news (none / 0) (#91)
    by nycstray on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:35:17 PM EST
    I thought maybe I didn't have enough coffee in me.

    We're already seeing the effects of "everybody gets a trophy" and yes, it is indeed CRAP.

    Parent

    I hear the Mets... (none / 0) (#118)
    by desertswine on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:49:03 PM EST
    are looking for a closer. Hmmmm....

    Parent
    But then we'd have to ban... (none / 0) (#149)
    by kdog on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:09:47 PM EST
    Chase Utley and Ryan Howard from the upcoming Mets vs. Phils series...the kid might get hurt:)

    Parent
    I can't get you tube behind my job's firewall (5.00 / 0) (#57)
    by vicndabx on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:20:29 PM EST
    but if this is what I saw this AM on MSNBC - there was a telling line he had about creating a new Dem party that's willing to forego differences/squabbles for the sake of winning.  This "new" party would encompass broad swaths of the electorate.  It sounded to me like party discipline of the Republican kind - at least for election purposes.  While I don't necessarily think this is a bad idea, IMO this wasn't the year to try it.  At the very least, we should've had the DNC and other prominent Dems out there telling us Dem voters that was the plan so everyone could've had that in mind as we struggled to gain consensus on a nominee.

    PELOSI (5.00 / 0) (#65)
    by Desired User Name on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:21:59 PM EST
    "Pelosi says polls shortchange Obama"

    Um, are you sure it wasn't,

    "Pelosi says The Clintons shortchange Obama"

    Pelosi? She's on my "short list". ha ha
    "She'd be on anybody's short list", given her antics!

    She has come to epitomize the word BUM in the sentence, "Vote The Bums Out!"

    BTD, my nomination for (5.00 / 2) (#73)
    by LatinoVoter on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:27:41 PM EST
    Obama's Worst Enemies Part 3: His campaign.

    Apparently they thought nothing of planing a fundraiser on 9/11.

    Which I should say (none / 0) (#140)
    by LatinoVoter on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:02:10 PM EST
    is very ironic considering they tried to smear Bill Clinton by spreading a lie that he had been giving speeches on 9/11.

    Karma and all that.

    Parent

    Monday night was wonderful according to (5.00 / 1) (#74)
    by mogal on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:28:41 PM EST
    according to my Mother, a county delegate for
    Cliton. "It's her party and she is going to support it."  

    I was surprised, must have been a good add last night. I didn't watch any of the festivitiesit it would have been to painful.

    I would like to hear what you all think?

    Way tp stimulate the Republican base... (5.00 / 0) (#76)
    by Maria Garcia on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:29:04 PM EST
    ...nothing like Nancy Pelosi taking a premature victory lap to get those GOP foot soldiers out.

    funny story (5.00 / 6) (#80)
    by athyrio on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:29:57 PM EST
    I went up to a Denver cop and I was on my electric scooter pulling my walker behind me and I have white hair and appear a tad frail and I asked him if he would tazer me and he said yes ma'am you bet I would....I said to him well could you please tell me what we should do then about my pacemaker as that might kill me and he went white as a sheet and said he really was at a loss for words....I just wanted the cops to know that older people might have health issues and that should be taken into account...he honestly acted as if he never thought of pacemakers before and it appeared to shake him up....Then I said to him, I am just wanting my freedom of speech thats all....as guaranteed by the constitution...He smiled weakly and I bid him a good day...

    I bet you were the highlight of (5.00 / 2) (#99)
    by oculus on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:38:44 PM EST
    the Denver PD briefings this morning.  

    Parent
    LOL I bet so too and as I told him that (5.00 / 1) (#106)
    by athyrio on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:41:22 PM EST
    I pulled down the collar of my shirt and showed him the pacemaker which sticks out quite a bit and he really went pale as a ghost...If that helps them go a tad easier on some of us it is certainly worth it....I worry about that alot..(so does my doctor)

    Parent
    But, please be cautious. Remember, (5.00 / 1) (#122)
    by oculus on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:50:12 PM EST
    law enforcement is trained to act or not acct based on the circumstances at the time.  You could get caught up in something and have no way to exit.

    Parent
    Give the badges... (none / 0) (#137)
    by kdog on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:00:53 PM EST
    a little extra hell for me will ya?...:)

    I'm jealous...I kinda wish I was a senior so I could talk to the man like that without fear of an unwarranted arrest or worse...or maybe I just wish I had the stones:)

    Parent

    Don't wish away... (5.00 / 1) (#166)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:33:11 PM EST
    ...your youth, my friend.  Old age will be upon you sooner than you think.  It starts with a few cracks and creaks getting out of bed in the morning or the eyesight going or being more hung-over than you ever remember and rolls like a snowball going downhill from there.

    It's not easy being old...

    Parent

    It ain't all peaches and cream.... (none / 0) (#169)
    by kdog on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:43:42 PM EST
    being young either...we all have our crosses to bear:)

    Some heavier than others, as you know more than most.  Hope you're feeling well, or at least as well as can be...ya old goat you:)

    Parent

    Today's been a decent day... (none / 0) (#170)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:49:06 PM EST
    ...so far.  I seem to be recovering OK from surgery Thursday before last.  Of course, the viodin doesn't hurt any!  Thanks for the well wishes.  

    Hope you're doing well also.  Haven't seen you around the last few days--I was wondering if you got yourself banned.  Just a little vacation perhaps?

    Parent

    Yep...unplugged for the weekend (none / 0) (#176)
    by kdog on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 03:26:32 PM EST
    is all...enjoying the end of the summer.  I'm good bro...eating and getting high so I've got nothin' to complain about:)

    Take 'er easy for all us sinners man...

    Parent

    Good for you. (none / 0) (#179)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 05:48:44 PM EST
    Everyone should unplug and see going on in the real world once in awhile.  Summer is just about gone too.

    Too easy, I'm afraid.  They're giving away free Rage/Flobots tickets for tomorrow and there's no way I could possible do that.  

    Parent

    comments close at 200 (5.00 / 1) (#120)
    by waldenpond on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:49:47 PM EST
    as it bogs down the post.  Your comment was 220.  Was not against the comment rules.

    When you post, check out the number... I delete OT items and insults first and then bring the post down to 200.  If your number is too high, it will likely be deleted.

    You can't (none / 0) (#133)
    by Nadai on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:58:22 PM EST
    always tell when you're going over the limit, though.  I opened a new window to post this, and when I did, the total comments on this post was 121.  I just did a quick refresh prior to posting this comment and now it's up to 129.  I wish there was some way to fix that.

    Parent
    great article! (5.00 / 2) (#126)
    by Josey on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:53:49 PM EST
    Obama bloggers and Obamedia rarely, if ever, mention all Hillary's campaigning for Obama.

    WaPo -  
    http://tinyurl.com/67u24t

    >>>>The work of the next phase of Clinton's career has been going on doggedly, and often with little notice, since she suspended her campaign on June 7. She's been a campaign emissary for Obama to the Sheet Metal Workers union; to Hispanics and others in New Mexico and Nevada; to older women in South Florida who still haven't quite accepted the loss of what for some of them may be their last chance to see a woman elected president.

    BlueDude - Welcome to TalkLeft! (5.00 / 1) (#130)
    by Josey on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:56:19 PM EST


    I'm not certain why (5.00 / 2) (#139)
    by miriam on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:01:06 PM EST
    the debates are being mentioned as possible game-changers.  Other than the Kennedy-Nixon debates (and the change there was apparently due to Nixon's 5 o'clock shadow and not his performance), how have the debates affected any race?  Bush was much worse than abysmal against Kerry in all three debates---Kerry lost the election.  Bus was worse than abysmal against Gore--Gore lost the election via the SC (like Nixon's beard, the  eye-rolling apparently did Gore in and, like Nixon'd defeat, it had nothing to do with the issues or the superior knowledge of Gore and Nixon.) As between Kennedy and Nixon, Nixon had more experience, but Kennedy had a sense of humor.  (Obama has no sense of humor; McCain does.)    

    The so-called debates are a sick joke. They are not even debates, but gotcha moments for the media.  Obama will bore everyone to death with long, confusing orations and McCain will be applauded for snappy comments no matter how wrong or mistaken they are.  If anyone is depending on the "debates" to put Obama over the top, you might want to leave now.  

    You know (5.00 / 1) (#156)
    by daria g on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:41:24 PM EST
    I hear Biden didn't cry about Hurricane Katrina.

    lol...pot calling kettle, etc. (1.00 / 0) (#44)
    by PssttCmere08 on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:17:05 PM EST


    Athyrio....hopefully you have saved some (1.00 / 0) (#105)
    by PssttCmere08 on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:41:18 PM EST
    lives...wish I could have seen that exchange :)

    James Carville (none / 0) (#3)
    by americanincanada on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 11:57:29 AM EST
    For those who missed his comments last night.

    LINK

    Don't worry, they have a "plan" (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by andgarden on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 11:58:44 AM EST


    Parent
    Who are they? (5.00 / 1) (#7)
    by janarchy on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:00:24 PM EST
    Cylons?

    Parent
    Are they going (5.00 / 2) (#11)
    by standingup on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:04:47 PM EST
    to text the message to us?

    Parent
    "Send money!" (5.00 / 0) (#16)
    by Fabian on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:07:41 PM EST
    I got yer text message right here.


    Parent
    at 3 a.m.? (none / 0) (#142)
    by prittfumes on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:04:20 PM EST


    Parent
    I'm starting to get a visual of (5.00 / 3) (#24)
    by Anne on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:08:59 PM EST
    one of those typical family trips, where Dad "knows" how to get to their destination, "Mom" knows they are hopelessly lost, is sitting there with the map pointing to where they need to be, and "Dad" just refuses to give up on his "plan."

    Hours later they arrive, Dad triumphant that he got them there without having to use any silly map (or in this world, now, GPS), only to find out that the event they were to attend ended hours ago, the hall is empty, and all that remains are some half-filled balloons, plates with half-eaten pieces of cake on them, and wet confetti bleeding dye into the paper tablecloths.

    Parent

    Anne- (5.00 / 0) (#64)
    by magisterludi on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:21:56 PM EST
    you never fail me.

    Perfect analogy. Makes me really appreciate the man I married, who plots the course with me, not for me.

    Parent

    Yeah (5.00 / 4) (#39)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:15:16 PM EST
    they have a "secret plan" to win the election. It's called "magical voters".

    Parent
    See the Pelosi quotes (5.00 / 0) (#45)
    by janarchy on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:17:08 PM EST
    further on down the page. She apparently is certain there are magical voters who will coming scurrying out the woodwork to do her bidding!

    Parent
    Well (5.00 / 1) (#54)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:19:59 PM EST
    I can't help him I promised to use my magic for good, not evil. (Still trying to figure out how I made those little blue letters Hee hee)

    Parent
    Playing "Hide The Message" (5.00 / 3) (#9)
    by stefystef on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:02:44 PM EST
    Carville hits it right on the head, as usual.
    Except he doesn't realize there was never a "message", it was always about building around a MAN, not a MESSAGE.

    It was always about Obama, not the Democratic Party.  And that's why the DNC may fail in November.  

    Parent

    but even if Obama wins - (5.00 / 0) (#52)
    by Josey on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:19:35 PM EST
    how do we hold him accountable on nothingness?
    He's flip flopped on many issues or evaded making specific proposals.

    Parent
    I love James (5.00 / 2) (#36)
    by TheRizzo on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:14:37 PM EST
    Carville is usually very much on the money.  He is blunt.  Puts out his biases but still gives legit advice for everyone in the party.

    This is on Obama to reach out and win the support.  Like he said its not like Clinton can just sign a piece of paper and automatically get all her voters.  This isn't about what Clinton can do anymore, its about what Obama can do.

    Parent

    Question: (none / 0) (#12)
    by mike in dc on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:04:57 PM EST
    From a political standpoint, what is the purpose of this blog, and the comments section, from August 29th onward to November 4th?

    What's the purpose of your comment? (5.00 / 3) (#17)
    by TheRealFrank on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:07:42 PM EST
    What's the meaning of life?


    Parent
    Pfffft (5.00 / 1) (#104)
    by Desired User Name on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:41:01 PM EST
    and "Is There a God?"

    and why does eating beans make the air go funny?

    Parent

    Um (5.00 / 3) (#18)
    by lilburro on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:07:44 PM EST
    to make it to Nov 4th with eyes wide open about Obama's strategy and chances?

    To be "reality-based"?  Or is that not enough of a purpose.

    Parent

    And this would help Democrats in November... (none / 0) (#38)
    by mike in dc on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:15:03 PM EST
    ...how, exactly?

    Parent
    The cheerleading section is thataway --> (5.00 / 4) (#46)
    by andgarden on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:17:41 PM EST


    Parent
    How is (5.00 / 2) (#48)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:18:20 PM EST
    sticking your head in the sand and cheerleading helping? That's the same strategy Bush had for Iraq. Just clap louder, right?

    Parent
    President McCain appoints 3 new justices... (none / 0) (#69)
    by mike in dc on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:24:55 PM EST
    ...to Supreme Court.
    President McCain authorizes bombing of Iran.
    President McCain vetoes universal healthcare bill.

    Hey, if you can live with that, more power to you.

    The time for infighting ends on August 29th, as far as I'm concerned.  Nothing positive or productive will come of it.  If anything, it will hurt your cause, such as it is, within the party.

    Parent

    It's so much easier for you to tell us to shut up (5.00 / 2) (#72)
    by andgarden on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:26:41 PM EST
    than for you to say what, if anything, you think is wrong with Obama's strategy.

    It puzzles me why that is.

    Parent

    Is this (5.00 / 4) (#95)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:37:13 PM EST
    the best you can come up with? Obama has thrown universal health under the bus. Supreme court? Cass Sunstein? Obama will cave into the GOP and bomb Iran if he needs to look "strong". He's flip flopped on that issue too.

    Quit blaming the voters that Obama has spent months trashing and start pounding on Obama to get off his duff and get to work. He's spent more time on vacation since the end of the primaries than he has trying to unite the Democratic base. You can try to silence voters all you want but you aren't going to be in the voting booth with them where they can make their statements known. Obama's supporters are absolutely the worst advocates he has.

    Parent

    Honey, Vinegar, Flies (5.00 / 1) (#103)
    by blogtopus on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:40:53 PM EST
    Learn about it.

    Parent
    ROFL (none / 0) (#111)
    by Josey on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:44:40 PM EST


    Parent
    "Infighting" (none / 0) (#157)
    by daria g on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:51:32 PM EST
    That's nice that I'm not free to criticize Obama as far as you're concerned.  So what?  Your string of comments just now suggests that those of us on this blog shouldn't say what we are saying.  That's also negative and counterproductive.

    Parent
    Sorry (5.00 / 2) (#61)
    by lilburro on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:21:19 PM EST
    how are any blogs helping Obama in November?  I haven't noticed yet.  Should we pretend the polls haven't been sliding?  Should we call Bill Clinton a racist, that successful and oft deployed blog electoral strategy?

    The blogs have been behind Obama the entire summer and what benefit has that had?  This isn't going to come down to blogs.

    Parent

    Not my goal (5.00 / 2) (#63)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:21:47 PM EST
    to help Democrats.

    My goal is to tell you what I think.

    I happen to think that COULD HELP Dems, but that is not my goal.

    Parent

    Aren't there... (5.00 / 4) (#68)
    by DET103 on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:22:48 PM EST
    ...enough blogs out there that have given up integrity, truth and purpose in their work to focus solely on being a campaign surrogate for Barack Obama to satisfy you? I assume I can check you off the list of people upset by the blind-following of many behind George Bush into disaster? When you accept the behavior as your own, you can no longer take the high road.

    Parent
    Why (5.00 / 0) (#20)
    by Nadai on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:07:50 PM EST
    don't you tell us what purpose you'd like TL to serve, and, more importantly, how you think that purpose can be achieved?

    Parent
    To make you fee really uncomfortable (5.00 / 7) (#25)
    by andgarden on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:09:08 PM EST
    when you click over and read it.

    Parent
    You're right (5.00 / 1) (#53)
    by blogtopus on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:19:36 PM EST
    Close it down, Jeralyn! No offending sounds in the presence of His Greatness.

    Parent
    To write what we think (5.00 / 1) (#56)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:20:06 PM EST
    Cheerleading can be found elsewhere.

    You know where too.

    So stop acting like an idiot.

    Parent

    a McCain whitehouse? lol (2.00 / 1) (#32)
    by MrPope on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:14:11 PM EST


    Parent
    I am gonna ask that you be banned (5.00 / 1) (#59)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:20:53 PM EST
    from the site.

    I am banning you from my threads immediately.

    Do not comment any further in my threads.

    Parent

    Mr Pope (none / 0) (#67)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:22:28 PM EST
    is banned from my threads.

    Parent
    New McCain ad (none / 0) (#13)
    by MichaelGale on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:05:58 PM EST

    3 AM

    you aren't supposed to link (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:12:06 PM EST
    to McCain promotional material.

    That said, he is appealing to Clinton Democrats(and exploiting the rift Howard Dean and his merry band of mauraders created). Congratulations Democratic leadership numbskulls.

    Parent

    Oh...I'm sorry (5.00 / 2) (#71)
    by MichaelGale on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:26:30 PM EST
    I have been here for awhile but honestly didn't know that.  Please delete.

    Thanks

    I just wanted TL to see it since it just came out.

    Again, apologize

    Parent

    I didn't understand that position (none / 0) (#97)
    by waldenpond on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:38:29 PM EST
    There was one (yesterday?) that was posted and the discussion was around rather it was an effective ad and who it was targeting.  I thought is was too dark and rather boring.

    Campaigns are based on marketing.  Not discussing the marketing leaves out a legitimate part of the debate.

    BTD... what's your opinion?  TChris doesn't like it.  Do you think it legitimate or not?

    Parent

    I linked to one (none / 0) (#153)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:21:14 PM EST
    for discussion purposes so it is Jeralyn's call.

    Parent
    Oh (5.00 / 2) (#31)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:13:12 PM EST
    geez, that is a really good ad. It makes me want to ignore how bad McCain's ideology is and vote for him. He's really agressively going after Hillary's voters. Much more so than Obama is.

    Parent
    I can't wait to see (5.00 / 2) (#49)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:18:29 PM EST
    who he unveils for VP with him going with this trend. It will be interesting to see if he picks a female to bring it all home. The GOP has to be positively busting a gut at the ineptness of the DNC and its collective leaders. Everytime I see Nancy, Howard, and Donna I can't help but think of the three freakin stooges.

    Parent
    You're kidding, right? (none / 0) (#33)
    by andgarden on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:14:17 PM EST
    I think it's a terrible ad. It's got typical Republican scare images.

    Now as to going after Hillary voters, that's a different story. That might work.

    Parent

    Agreed (5.00 / 2) (#42)
    by americanincanada on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:16:05 PM EST
    He is courting Hillay's supporters, of whic I am one, a lot more aggressively than Obama. who are we kidding...Obama is not courting us at all...

    Parent
    I just saw (5.00 / 1) (#58)
    by janarchy on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:20:44 PM EST
    the funniest ad about that on Fox last night. It was a woman who said she was a Clinton delegate but now...psssst, she's voting for McCain! She was very upbeat and said it was okay for Democrats to vote Republican.

    I have to say it was a very funny and upbeat ad, even if I just laughed at it. Whoever is doing his promos is phenomonal.

    Parent

    and the Dem leadership did it to themselves (none / 0) (#98)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:38:32 PM EST
    She had the audacity to question whether or not she could vote for Obama and rather than press her to find out why and answer those questions they stripped her of her delegate status. McCain saw an opening and took it. Have I mentioned how dumb I think our party leadership is within the last 15 minutes(Alright, yes I believe I have)?

    Parent
    They're the gift (none / 0) (#148)
    by janarchy on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:09:01 PM EST
    that keeps on giving.

    Un-f'ing-believable.

    Parent

    yeah (none / 0) (#159)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:59:12 PM EST
    thats a pretty powerful spot.

    Parent
    well (5.00 / 0) (#62)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:21:44 PM EST
    that's my point. It works on Hillary's voters. If he had left the Hillary promo out of the ad, it wouldn't have worked as well. The Hillary haters in the GOP certainly must be having to swallow hard when they see these ads! LOL!

    Parent
    Hillary's voters (none / 0) (#79)
    by MichaelGale on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:29:24 PM EST
    I don't think so in re Hillary's voters.  Me, I think it is using her and I don't like that one bit.

    Parent
    Of course he's USING her (5.00 / 2) (#117)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:49:02 PM EST
    and he's doing so pretty effectively. He is peeling the scab off a wound the DNC created. If you want to be angry be angry at the DNC because they are the ones that created this dilemna by rigging the election to favor one candidate over the other.

    Parent
    Exactly (none / 0) (#84)
    by Dr Molly on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:31:03 PM EST


    Parent
    Gee, wouldn't it be nice (5.00 / 3) (#35)
    by Fabian on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:14:31 PM EST
    if Obama had spent two months uniting his base instead of schmoozing evangelicals?  I guess Obama had "other priorities".

    Parent
    Ouch (none / 0) (#83)
    by Dr Molly on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:30:49 PM EST
    Hillary is going to be really p!issed off when she sees that.

    Parent
    iirc - Hillary responded to that ad - (5.00 / 1) (#121)
    by Josey on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:50:09 PM EST
    by saying she "did not approve the message."
    Acknowledgement from Obama blogs?  chirp, chirp
    Except there was a DK diary written by a former Edwards supporter.
    Obamabots just can't bring themselves to affirm Hillary - and yet wonder why PUMAs aren't getting onboard.

    Parent
    I'm sure she is (5.00 / 2) (#123)
    by cawaltz on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:50:50 PM EST
    That said, keeping her around to "protect" Obama is going to keep sucking the air out of the Obama campaign. Quite the crux.

    Parent
    That's the second one I don't like (none / 0) (#110)
    by waldenpond on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:43:57 PM EST
    Too militaristic... if I didn't know better, I would think it was a Guiliani ad.  Typical Repub ad.   I see them using Clinton but I don't see them going after her voters presenting Clinton like that.  Second ad: thumbs down.

    Parent
    The funny thing is (none / 0) (#43)
    by cmugirl on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:16:05 PM EST
    she apparently hasn't been paying attention - the polls to date always showed Obama consistently OVERperforming in polls.

    Pelosi could be correct - (none / 0) (#78)
    by Josey on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:29:21 PM EST
    Dems are outpacing Repubs in voter registration - and conservative radio and TV talkshow hosts are not encouraging Repubs to register.

    Oh, man. This reminds me (none / 0) (#93)
    by oculus on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:36:19 PM EST
    of NH and Hillary Clinton followed by media and Obama surrogates dissing her.  But, it is fine with me for Sen. Biden to express his emotions too.

    No. (none / 0) (#132)
    by oculus on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:58:10 PM EST


    Parent
    Only superficially.... (none / 0) (#94)
    by kdog on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:36:42 PM EST
    it matters, not as much as you or I would like, not as much in substance as in stlye...but it matters.

    Under Obama or McCain we will still have war, occupation, drug war, prison nation, and a general lack of liberty...in that sense it doesn't matter.

    The difference is, imo, under Obama the lower classes will get a couple extra bones thrown their way.  McCain will throw the military industrial complex and the wealthy the extra bones.  Under Obama, our standing in the court of world opinion will certainly rise...not so under McCain.

    But when it comes to the stuff that really matters...that really really matters...it makes no difference, you're absolutely right.  That's why I can't vote for either one, though I obviously prefer Obama over Mccain for the superficial reasons.  

    Or Maybe (none / 0) (#180)
    by dissenter on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 05:57:42 PM EST
    An invitation to attack other countries because we look weak

    Parent
    IIRC I heard much the same rhetoric in 2004 (none / 0) (#114)
    by MO Blue on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 12:45:11 PM EST
    How did that work out?

    Are you kidding me? (none / 0) (#145)
    by daria g on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 01:06:57 PM EST
    Dean, foot in mouth.  WTF.  That is unacceptable.  Rove and others DID do some heinous things all about dividing this country for their own political gain, but come on, Dean, that is such a stupid thing to say.

    How would she know that they (none / 0) (#172)
    by zfran on Tue Aug 26, 2008 at 02:59:02 PM EST
    are "tapping" into these voters who are "unreachable." If they truly cannot be reached, how does she know?

    Tuesday Open Thread | 170 comments (170 topical)

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