In Case You Were Wondering, Blue Dogs Opposing HCR

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Other Politics
Posted on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:13:35 PM EST
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You don't need them, so it does not matter, but in case Dems were going to try and placate them, Blue Dogs say no to health care reform.

Gene Taylor (D-MS), Jim Marshall (D-GA), Travis Childers (D-MS), Charlie Melancon (D-LA), and Walt Minnick (D-ID) all announced they are voting against health care reform. This really simplifies things if you ask me.

There is no need to placate them in any way. Forget them and move on to those who will vote for health care reform. Same with Republicans in the Senate. Other than Snowe and Collins, none of them will vote for it under any circumstances. Since the Progressive Block in the House is insisting on a public option, then look for people willing to vote for that and negotiate with them. If that means not Snowe and Collins, then do not talk with them. I WOULD talk with Dem Senators, like Ben Nelson, Mary Landrieu and Kent Conrad, even if they will vote No, because you need their vote for cloture. But they need to understand that all discussions must accept a public option as non-negotiable. This should simplify things considerably.

Speaking for me only

< Is Kennedy The Obstacle To The Public Option? | Ras Poll: Removing Public Option Craters Support For HCR >

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In Case You Were Wondering, Blue Dogs Opposing HCR | 21 comments (21 topical)

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Incidentally, (5.00 / 1) (#1)
by andgarden on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:15:44 PM EST

If Gene Taylor were in the Senate, I'm pretty certain he could be gotten for a procedural vote.

: Gene Taylor is my rep. :( (none / 0) (#21)
by MrConservative on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 05:24:12 PM EST

Only vote for him because I know the Republican that would replace him would be even worse.

As someone (5.00 / 1) (#2)
by Ga6thDem on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:17:26 PM EST

who lives in Ga I cant imagine why anyone would try to placate Marshall. I don't know about Obama but he wouldn't endorse Kerry in 2004. I just don't undertand him anymore.

It will simplify things greatly (none / 0) (#3)
by Slado on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:21:52 PM EST

You won't get any health reform and nothing will pass.

Great plan!!!!!

Don't need their votes (5.00 / 4) (#5)
by Big Tent Democrat on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:24:22 PM EST

in the House.

In the Senate, I only need Nelson and Landrieu on cloture.

But in the end, if Nelson and Landrieu want to be known for blocking health care reform, then that's their choice.


Right in theory (5.00 / 1) (#7)
by Slado on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:29:35 PM EST

but even progressive leaning senators don't want to own this alone.

I'd say about 20 senators want full blown progressive healthcare no iff ands or butts, another 30 or so want it but aren't willing to do it alone and then you have the rest.

The political question is do the 55 to 60 senators you're referring to want to own whatever bill is produced with no conservative support?

My gut is telling me they won't without the cover of some sort of partisan compromise.

It's a gamble on both sides. Republicans risk losing any input by standing strong and hard core democrats risk failing because 5 to 10 democrats don't want to cram something through.

If this wasn't the reality Obama wouldn't be pushing for compromise but who know, he is smarter then all of us after all.


They do not want to own its failure more (none / 0) (#12)
by Big Tent Democrat on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:37:05 PM EST

: Good point (none / 0) (#15)
by Slado on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:38:17 PM EST

which is why the most likely scenario is a bill that we both hate....

Have an actual vote (none / 0) (#17)
by MKS on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:39:38 PM EST

Even if--in the worst case--there are not enough votes to pass, make Democrats take a stand....


Since the bills that have (none / 0) (#4)
by dk on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:23:48 PM EST

already passed through committee in both the House and the Senate have a "public option" instead of a public option, can we start from scratch too?

Probably too late (none / 0) (#6)
by Big Tent Democrat on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:25:04 PM EST

But we can pick it up next year, subject to reconciliation rules.


That makes no sense to me. (none / 0) (#8)
by dk on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:29:37 PM EST

If the bill will be passed without the blue dogs, why pass a bill that only blue dogs will love? Why not pass actual reform?


Cuz it's too late (none / 0) (#11)
by Big Tent Democrat on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:36:34 PM EST

Becasue they can't (none / 0) (#13)
by Slado on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:37:11 PM EST

if all the blue dogs side with republicans nothing passes.

BTD is right in that such a scenario is unlikely. Some of them will come along with only the slightest acknolegements or concessions.

The big question is how much less then a truly progressive bill will bring enough Blue Dogs into the fold.

BTD is of the opinion it won't be enough to make even a hard core progressive sweat, the WH for whatever reason is less confident. Hence the wishy washiness.


Cuz Dems are terrible negotiators (5.00 / 3) (#16)
by Big Tent Democrat on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:39:07 PM EST

: I'm of the opinion (5.00 / 1) (#18)
by Slado on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:57:57 PM EST

that from a purely political perspective Obama and Co. have totally botched this.
This shouldn't have been this hard.
I'm glad they've done so but can admit with a good plan of their own they could have sold it.
Instead they let congress muck it up and here we are.

I was just informed on another blog (none / 0) (#9)
by inclusiveheart on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:31:55 PM EST

that this is a "delicate time" and that we should continue to pander to those who oppose healthcare reform so that the public will think they are bad people. I was just told that that is "politics". My question is then, when can we expect leadership and some good old fashioned governing?

Those guys are from MS not MI... (none / 0) (#10)
by steviez314 on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:33:16 PM EST

I couldn't figure out how Michiganders could be against HCR.

: What's Miss? MS right? (5.00 / 1) (#14)
by Big Tent Democrat on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 12:37:41 PM EST

I do not deal with Mississippi in my life.

The Blug Dog sideshow ... (none / 0) (#19)
by Robot Porter on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 01:05:45 PM EST

was always irrelevant. Been saying so for weeks.

And your endgame strategy is spot on.

If this thing gets passed, blogs could play an important role in explaining the "public option" and other aspects of the plan.

This plan is complicated, and the start up costs aren't huge, so blogs could ease some of burden on the White House by adding clarity to the discussion.

The "public option" in H.R. 3200 needs a lot of help if it's going to work.

: Why Can't Obama explain why we need this? (none / 0) (#20)
by BrassTacks on Wed Aug 19, 2009 at 04:18:06 PM EST

He needs to tell America that we NEED this bill and why we need it!