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Hagel: ISIS War Costing $7 to $10 Million a Day

Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel said at a press conference today the Pentagon is spending $7 to $10 million a day in the fight against ISIS.

"We're generally spending roughly, since this effort started, $7 million to $10 million a day. That's being funded out of OCO, overseas contingency operations," Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel said at a Friday press conference. Commonly referred to as war funds, the money isn't subject to congressional budget caps.

He said the Pentagon will ask Congress for more funding.

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  • Display: Sort:
    $9,000,000,000-$10,000,000,000 For Three Years (5.00 / 5) (#1)
    by squeaky on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 03:39:36 PM EST
    And I am sure that the 3 year estimate to take out ISIS is underestimated, and the $10,000,000 a day figure will rise over the course of 6 years.

    Someone is getting super rich.

    Don't worry about (5.00 / 7) (#2)
    by KeysDan on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 03:43:17 PM EST
    costs, that's what the social security trust fund is for.

    Parent
    Tomahawk Missiles run $1.6M (5.00 / 3) (#3)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 04:34:36 PM EST
    ...each, Smart bombs over $100 grand, that is not including the carrier group, the planes, all the technology being used to figure where in the hell to drop them.

    When the normal worlds budgets for anything, they don't say it cost this amount which is basically the difference between current and additional costs.  

    You add in everything it takes and allocate the portion to the project, like man hours, stuff pulled out of inventory, depreciation on assets, and so on.  The fuel alone to support the carrier group exceeds $10M a day I would imagine.

    Hagel is full of sh1t, it how the Iraq was cost x amount of dollars per day, but at the end exceeded every number ever published by a factor of 1000 and now is around $1.7trillion and still counting.  $10 million a day, GD do they think we are suckers.

    From the link:

    Asked Thursday how much the U.S. was spending, Rear Adm. John Kirby, a Pentagon spokesman, said the department is still working to calculate official costs. He added that he "wouldn't be surprised if the answer that we come back with once we do the pencil work is different" than any estimates.

    ...
    Without action from Congress, the budget caps, known as sequestration, would return in October 2015, the start of the 2016 fiscal year. Under President Obama's five-year budget, the Pentagon projects that it will need more than $535 billion in fiscal 2016. But under the budget caps, the Pentagon is expected to receive less than $500 billion, leaving a $35 billion budget gap.

    And yet we can wage war for $10M a day...

    Parent

    $1.7 trillion is without war benefits (none / 0) (#6)
    by jtaylorr on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 06:01:40 PM EST
    With benefits current Iraq costs are estimated at more than $2 trillion. With interest the final costs could be upwards of $6 trillion.

    Parent
    Where are (5.00 / 3) (#4)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 05:17:12 PM EST
    all those Republicans screaming we are bankrupt? All of a sudden there's crickets coming out of their corner.

    Parent
    Hardly crickets (none / 0) (#7)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 06:10:08 PM EST
    they are actually praising Obama for the first time in 6 years.

    Parent
    One wonders what three years and this (5.00 / 4) (#5)
    by oculus on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 05:25:42 PM EST
    enormous sum of money will accomplish.

    Parent
    I believe (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by lentinel on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 08:08:40 PM EST
    what it will accomplish is the further deterioration of our quality of life.

    I believe it will lead to the further domination of the State over our lives.

    I believe it will contribute to the further enrichment of seedy corporations like Xe Services or Academi - formerly known as Blackwater.  

    I believe it will result in many deaths.

    I believe that it will put us in grave danger.

    Parent

    Further Deterioration? (none / 0) (#24)
    by squeaky on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 09:44:15 AM EST
    Sounds like it can't get any worse for you. My sympathies.


    Parent
    If one subscribes to the proposition (none / 0) (#12)
    by christinep on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 09:17:23 PM EST
    that the ISIL movement--via stated intent & aggressive recruitment--is a movement that would necessarily expand without forceful intervention, then containment or effective reduction may well be an acceptable result.

    As to whether one subscribes to that proposition (and I do) is a judgment call.

    Parent

    I believe the ISIL movement's (none / 0) (#14)
    by oculus on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 12:42:06 AM EST
    Goal is to expand. But I do not understand how the U.S. can stop this expansion.

    Parent
    perhaps so. (none / 0) (#17)
    by cpinva on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 07:48:09 AM EST
    but, there are several arab countries in the area whose rulers face more direct danger from ISIS/ISIL, than the US does. if the US stayed out of it completely, it would force those countries to:

    1. use their own assets to fight them.,

    or (most likely)

    2. try and buy them off with oil money.

    the whole place is just one huge hotbed of corruption anyway. it's full of unelected "leaders" (more like ongoing criminal enterprises), desperate to keep those oil revenues pumping into their coffers. this is what gives ISIS/ISIL the ability to recruit, all the disaffected now have a group that lets them target their anger at their non-lives, towards those they feel are responsible for them having no life.

    let's see just how strong those country's militaries are, going against a group more organized and armed, than just a mob in the street.

    Parent

    And after this... (none / 0) (#31)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:22:31 AM EST
    . try and buy them off with oil money.

    What do they do??

    Why use the money to attack western countries.

    Parent

    Do you really think... (5.00 / 1) (#61)
    by unitron on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 02:49:35 PM EST
    ...that once bought they're going to stay bought?

    If so, why don't we just bribe them to stay in the ME and leave us alone?

    Parent

    According to Edwin Starr... (none / 0) (#33)
    by Mr Natural on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:23:04 AM EST
    Send the bill (5.00 / 2) (#8)
    by Chuck0 on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 06:24:36 PM EST
    to Bush and Cheney. This mess is all attributable to them. War via lie and a complete lack of planning and understanding of what they were doing by ridding Iraq of Saddam. Like him or not, he was a stabilizing factor there. I think the both belong in prison.

    Amen (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 06:32:20 PM EST
    Instead both, certainly Cheney, still making millions off the military industrial complex to clean the mess they made.

    Parent
    I certainly (none / 0) (#16)
    by lentinel on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 04:04:33 AM EST
    agree that Bush and Cheney are doing fine and making money.
    But I do not agree that all the money we're spending in involved in "cleaning up" the mess they made.

    Where's the cleanup?


    Parent

    Sure. (none / 0) (#10)
    by lentinel on Fri Sep 26, 2014 at 07:29:18 PM EST
    Bush and Cheney belong in prison.
    But the current president says that we must move on.

    So - he moved on.

    And now he is Bush and Cheney redux.

    This current mess - involving us - making us the face of resistance to ISIS - this is on him.


    Parent

    while I do think that ISIS (5.00 / 1) (#13)
    by ZtoA on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 12:17:22 AM EST
    or ISIL, or what/whoever, needs some military addressing from the US. I don't think that will solve any issues over time. Partly it is political here in the US and is called for - it is OK to bow to political necessities sometimes. I also think a military response to humanitarian threats is good. But a new ongoing war waged by the US will not work. So, oddly, I agree with both views.

    I'd like to see a PR response to these terrorists groups. Fight online social media PR with online social media PR.

    Yes, certainly something better (5.00 / 3) (#19)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 08:25:25 AM EST
    Than the few ads they created to discourage teen recruitment here.  These guys murder everyone but the horror of what they do to young girls and women, women activists in particular..how is all this not something more than a blurb?

    Is it because we are in the middle of and tolerating a war on "the unlucky" (poor) in this country, and that's mostly women and children?  And almost none of us are activists anymore.  It's too much trouble to show up and genuinely care?

    It is an opportunity and a time for the world to wake up.  I know if we all worked for lives of equality for Middle Eastern sisters and their baby girls it would blow up every shred of the Republican war on women in the US, like a bunker buster, but would that be so bad?

    How is the price tag on this endeavor coming in this low though?  The coalition is contributing a lot of cash, they did for the first Gulf War too because they all felt threatened by Saddam.


    Parent

    Agree (5.00 / 1) (#20)
    by ZtoA on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 09:19:10 AM EST
    I don't even know if the US even has a PR response to ISIL, ISIS. The CIA can fight dirty doing things for the US but not in the official name of the US. 'Creative' is IMO what might be a good idea. What fights fear? Beheadings create fear and revulsion in people. Maybe hope and humor. Fight terror with what appeals to young people in a technology that they use.

    Our Captain could come up with a few zingers in the humor department. All creatives would need to do would be to show up at their computers, which they do anyway. If just a small portion of the response budget was re-directed to social media counter moves it might help.

    Not saying ALL the budget. Not saying no military response at all. Not saying the US 'officially' mocks ISIS/S, and I actually was thinking about other kinds of 'redirecting' humor not direct mocking. Get women to do the humor too. Call them out on their sexist basis. Yes, I agree with you, the more I think about it, that modern untethered free women are an extremely deep issue for them. It's an issue they are not addressing directly, but it's there.

    And it could be humor with a message of hope. I know this sounds naive, and idealistic, but ISIS is naive and idealistic and is appealing to that demographic.  

    Parent

    "You know what I'm not?" (5.00 / 2) (#21)
    by ZtoA on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 09:31:57 AM EST
    campaign on social media. Cool young people saying "you know what I"m NOT?" --"I'm not gonna fall for slick advertising like ISIS in order to cut people's heads off".... "I'm not going to waste my life wishing for virgins in heaven" said by a woman.

    Gotta get someone funnier than me, and cooler and more connected tho. And a lot younger.

    Parent

    Instead of 72 Virgins, 72 blow-up dolls. (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by Mr Natural on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:40:36 AM EST
    I wonder what sort of youtube videos Capt (5.00 / 1) (#23)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 09:43:23 AM EST
    Could come up with with 20 volunteers for all tasks?

    Parent
    Interesting idea here re a cell (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by oculus on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:38:47 AM EST
    phone app for some indigenous people in the area of India where recruiters to communism are also active;

    National Geographic

    Of course, to this segment of India's population, $50-100 U.S. is a fortune.

    Parent

    More options than ever (5.00 / 1) (#44)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:57:51 AM EST
    To create social shift.

    The oldest son of our researcher friend was listening to the adults whine about poorly serving trade agreements.  He tells us all his generation will usher in guerrilla capitalism and we don't even know what it is.

    Of course I don't know what it is, I'm old.  So he explains it to me in his generation's terms.  I told him he was crazy.  Slept on it, woke up the next morning and over coffee thought , "That kid is right, they can squeeze the whole world as hard as they want to and it will only create fissures that leak :)"

    Parent

    Sort of an alternative of this (none / 0) (#58)
    by Zorba on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 02:28:23 PM EST
    "Guerrilla capitalism" sprang into being in parts of Greece as their economy fell apart and unemployment was so high.
    They developed a rather elaborate barter system where people exchanged goods and services.  In many parts of Greece, they even developed their own alternative "currency."  Basically chits that you could store online or even, for people not "plugged in," you could get paper chits.
    If you were in the network and, say, you were a barber, you would cut someone else's (who was also participating) hair, and he paid in these "alternative currencies," which maybe he had gotten from someone else when he built her a cabinet, or whatever.  Then the barber takes the chits and exchanges them for food, or clothing, or whatever, from someone else in the exchange.  No "official" money changes hands.  No taxes owed, no taxes paid.
    (Of course, Greeks have been evading paying taxes for a long, long time.  Part of the reason, but not the only reason, that the Greek economy fell apart in the first place.  Which is a subject for another post.)
    At any rate, this is hijacking the thread.  
    But the kid you spoke to was right.  On a global level, this type of thing could create huge social shifts.  Unplug from your country's and the world currencies, take control of your local economies.  (Even if you're not using a barter system and are still using the official currency, you're still not paying taxes.)
    And this type of system could also help the women in these countries, who often are not allowed to work, to make money.  But maybe they can sew, grow food, raise some chickens, or whatever, to have something they can "trade" for other things they need.
    Where's kdog?  I bet he'd like these systems.   ;-)

    Parent
    I will share the Greece linkage (none / 0) (#77)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 10:13:32 PM EST
    With "E".  See where this leads discussion, borrowing his mind utterly.  The kid has been "paying bills" from his computer screen for the things he wants since he was 15.  Scary :)

    His father sometimes wants reassurance that the oldest is on the right path.  What is the right path ahead?  Do I think your kid has what it takes?  Well, Robert Reich says trade school and it looks like he just long jumped trade school.  Path ahead?  Who knows what that is?

    Parent

    Bowing (none / 0) (#15)
    by lentinel on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 04:00:01 AM EST
    to "political necessities" is Obama's forte unfortunately.


    Parent
    fair enough. (5.00 / 1) (#18)
    by cpinva on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 07:51:17 AM EST
    so, what's your solution? or do you actually have one?

    I don't claim to have one, because I'm not privy to all the information required to come up with one that makes sense, and might actually work.

    Parent

    So what? (5.00 / 2) (#22)
    by ZtoA on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 09:33:50 AM EST
    He is who he is. Not perfect. Yet the job and the position do call for political necessities at times.

    Parent
    Yes (3.67 / 3) (#25)
    by squeaky on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 09:47:01 AM EST
    Compromise, and getting others on board with you is part of the job, unless you are BushCO where you do whatever the f' you want.

    I think lentinel prefers the fascist type of leader, strong and dependable, no bowing down to anyone.

    Parent

    An artistic touch maybe? (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 10:07:05 AM EST
    The only thing I'm good for right now is guarding the door while you guys work, but I have my uses :)

    The torturing of the female activist before they murdered her for our enjoyment....the edge, and I'm completely over

    Like I said though, I think I could make a good door guard :). Make sure you guys aren't disturbed

    Parent

    The political (none / 0) (#28)
    by lentinel on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 10:53:20 AM EST
    necessities, as you call it, to which he is bowing is to the screeching of the Republican party.

    He also has an eye on the midterms.
    Can't appear to be the weak ones.

    But I think that his inability to stand his ground (if he has any deep convictions) is his downfall.

    He held out for awhile, but then caved.

    Bowing to political necessities is OK sometimes I suppose - but in this instance it will waste billions of our dollars, cost many lives of the innocent, put targets on our backs, and will probably result in the loss of both the White House and the Congress to the Republicans in 2016. Assuming, of course, that there will still be elections.

    As Jeralyn wrote:

    (Obama) was determined to assist Iraq rather than putting us into another war. I wish he kept that position, because this war is going to be a disaster for us.


    Parent
    Buy ISIS (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by squeaky on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 09:57:14 AM EST
    It seems to me that there is plenty of money to buy ISIS. Everyone has a price, and of course the price would come with strings attached.

    Saudis and other oil rich nations, plus 50% of the 3 years cash we would spend ($5 billion), plus kick in another $15 billion from other countries.... I think we should make an offer. A cash solution will be mutually beneficial. No more war, no more killing. Of course the strings would be a few adjustments to Sharia law regarding killing...  OK... well we would have to get everyone to stop Death as a criminal penalty including ourselves.. a small price to pay to end this horrible war, no?

    But what would the bomb sellers think? Oops.  can't do that. Think of the all the children who's families would be out of work.

    Squeaky, I assume you've got your (1.00 / 1) (#36)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:29:06 AM EST
    tongue over your eye teeth so you can't see what you're writing....

    But if you actually mean it please remember that the people you're buying aren't for sale. They are ready to die for those 72 virgins and a seat in paradise.

    Parent

    Oh, I See (5.00 / 1) (#38)
    by squeaky on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:32:50 AM EST
    Own shares of military stock..?  you must be getting rich off all the profits from death.

    Parent
    You still don't get it (1.00 / 1) (#39)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:34:49 AM EST
    It isn't about money to the radical muslims.

    Parent
    Millions for defense (5.00 / 1) (#43)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:42:33 AM EST
    I suggest we ask the Koch brothers to pay, after all they wouldn't find dealing with a Caliphate very profitable.

    Parent
    Sure It Is (5.00 / 3) (#47)
    by squeaky on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 12:29:41 PM EST
    Don't you know the song Money Can Buy Me Love?

    And if not love, lots of real estate, food and mosques.

    Parent

    Did you watch Maher last night talk about (5.00 / 2) (#54)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 02:14:23 PM EST
    His flip a district project? The R on the panel told Maher he couldn't unseat the guy he chose.  Maher says sure I can, the guy only won by 29,000 votes last election.  That's like what? Half a Bon Jovi concert?

    Dangerous ISIL extremists and those they have fighting for them at the moment = half a Bon Jovi concert :)

    Bill Maher thinks he can change that many minds in a few months :).

    Parent

    Who's Maher? (none / 0) (#55)
    by squeaky on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 02:15:15 PM EST
    Bill Maher (none / 0) (#56)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 02:17:04 PM EST
    Don't Know Him (none / 0) (#57)
    by squeaky on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 02:18:36 PM EST
    Have heard the name before though...  Teevee Talking Head?

    I do not do teevee...  

    strictly Netflix, and occasionally Amazon Prime.

    Parent

    He used to do a show (none / 0) (#59)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 02:28:28 PM EST
    With a panel called Politically Incorrect.  And he is often politically incorrect but he presents rock the boat questions to a usually very mixed panel of socially prominent individuals.  He is a comedian too, with a lackluster film career that he can make fun of..

    Parent
    OK (none / 0) (#60)
    by squeaky on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 02:43:52 PM EST
    Read up on him.... mixed bag..  more +s than -s...

    do you like him?

    Parent

    Never completely (5.00 / 1) (#66)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 03:21:44 PM EST
    But he isn't afraid to venture into muddy waters.  Has great minds on his panels like Neil deGrasse Tyson.  He almost always caucuses with the Liberals.  He will load a panel wingnut heavy sometimes though just so everyone can re digest and remember what they are all about.  Watching those episodes can be painful, feels like torture.

    He very publicly donated a million dollars to Obama's campaign after Citizen's United just to make the Conservatives on the Supreme Court squirm and wonder if they had just done something really stupid, he squeezed every bit of mileage he could get out of that donation too.

    I want to see how he does with Flip a District, he promises to go completely negative on John Kline.

    Parent

    I like his offer to Bristol Palins' ex (none / 0) (#62)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 02:50:03 PM EST
    Levi in 2008:

    In any event, we here at Real Time have taken the liberty of purchasing the website FreeLevi.org. And I will be happy to give the site over to you if you want to use it to get folks to contribute to some sort of liberty fund so you can get enough money to get out of that frozen meth lab they call a town. And even if the money doesn't come in, listen to me, it's not too late: just grab your skull bong, climb out the window, and get on the highway. I can't actually come get you, or even let you stay at my place because I'm pretty sure you'd smoke all my weed, but just call me from a pay phone, I know of a safe house you can stay `til after the election, it's like the witness protection program for baby-daddies.



    Parent
    I think we could buy out (none / 0) (#30)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:19:39 AM EST
    Their low ranking.  The oldsters with the power might not go easily, but I would think it is an option for their " boots on the ground".

    Parent
    How would we keep em bought though. (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by oculus on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:22:56 AM EST
    Our military offers education (5.00 / 2) (#37)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:32:34 AM EST
    To usher you into civilian life. Something like that that works regionally?  Wouldn't work for the real bad guys, but gives the impoverished a choice instead of just the hope of martyrdom.

    Small business seed money?  A start for yourself.  A different reason to get up in the morning.

    Parent

    Would Work (none / 0) (#34)
    by squeaky on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:24:51 AM EST
    We can set them up in the Leavant somewhere..  sign an agreement

    but, IMO, too much $$$$ is being made by those who make money from war, and that industry carries a lot of weight, to put it mildly.

    Parent

    That industry is making the oil rich (5.00 / 1) (#40)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:37:03 AM EST
    Monarchies pay right now.  They are doing tequila shots and jumping through hoops on fire in celebration. Someone had better cut that off before that grows into..........

    Parent
    Maybe we could spend some money (none / 0) (#29)
    by Slado on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:03:01 AM EST
    It's like (5.00 / 1) (#80)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 11:58:30 AM EST
    Hillary says. Religious nuts of all stripes take our their problems on women and blame all their problems on women.

    Parent
    But it's not about religion (1.00 / 1) (#45)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 12:04:21 PM EST
    sarcasm alert

    I went to the same mosque the Oklahoma Muslim who beheaded his co-worker today. I live ten minutes away!

    The Imam was Imad Enchassi the last I heard. He was a friend of mine. He is a Lebanese-born Sunni who hates Israel.....

    They sold Milestones in the book shop...calls for replacing all non-Islamic governments with Islamic ones....Yahya Graff, another white convert to Islam, had that prayed for the destruction of Israel and America.

    The imam...., Suhaib Webb, is hailed as a moderate by liberals in the United States but he was the one that explicitly told me that according to Islam, three choices are to be given to non-Muslims: convert, pay the jizyah tax and live under Islamic rule, or jihad.

    link

    Parent

    Any names for these 'liberals' (5.00 / 1) (#46)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 12:07:31 PM EST
    who in fact hail Suhaib Webb as a moderate?


    Parent
    Ask and you shall receive (none / 0) (#50)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 01:02:03 PM EST
    According to a strategy report by the UK government, senior UK government officials, including representatives of nine of the biggest Whitehall departments, consider Webb as a notable, moderate leader for mainstream Muslims

    Link

    Parent

    Fail (5.00 / 2) (#53)
    by Yman on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 01:41:52 PM EST
    1.  The UK government is not "liberals"
    2. The UK government is not "liberals in the United States
    3.  You might find an anonymous posting on a rightwing blog attributing statements to Suhaib Webb convincing.

    I find them utterly laughable.

    Parent
    If you insist - lol (none / 0) (#65)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 03:21:41 PM EST
    The Imam Suhaib Webb of the Islamic Society of Boston is a renowned "moderate" and -- of course -- a darling of the mainstream media. The hopelessly clueless and compromised Boston Globe reporter Lisa Wangsness wrote an egregious puff piece on him in May 2013, right after the Boston Marathon jihad murders perpetrated by two members of the Islamic Society of Boston.

    Boston Globe

    Parent

    LOL - You're quoting the same, ... (5.00 / 2) (#70)
    by Yman on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 05:18:20 PM EST
    ... Islamaphobic, wingnut from Jihadwatch, not the Boston Globe.

    Most importantly, the only "evidence" you have to support this silly claim ...:

    The imam...., Suhaib Webb, is hailed as a moderate by liberals in the United States but he was the one that explicitly told me that according to Islam, three choices are to be given to non-Muslims: convert, pay the jizyah tax and live under Islamic rule, or jihad.

    ... is an anonymous posting on a fellow, Islamaphobic, wingnut's blog.

    Parent

    Try reading the link and the (none / 0) (#75)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 07:17:21 PM EST
    link to the Boston Globe article.

    Parent
    You should take your own advice (5.00 / 1) (#76)
    by Yman on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 09:03:15 PM EST
    I read it, which is how I know that the only one that called him a moderate was your wingnut buddy on his Islamaphobic blog.

    ... and your quote was not from the Boston Globe.

    Parent

    Just because James hasn't read the (none / 0) (#78)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 08:46:57 AM EST
    Article in question doesn't mean anything, it's what the anonymous blogger wrote about it that counts.

    Parent
    Both of you need (none / 0) (#81)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 12:35:59 PM EST
    to research the reporter.

    Parent
    No, we don't (5.00 / 1) (#89)
    by Yman on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 01:12:50 PM EST
    You need to provide the evidence to back up your claims.  But you won't, ..

    ... because you can't.

    You may find the word of a fellow, wingnut Islamaphobe convincing.

    Rational people, OTOH, don't.

    Parent

    Why don't you tell us what the article in the (none / 0) (#85)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 12:49:09 PM EST
     Boston Globe says, James?

    Parent
    One reporter (none / 0) (#68)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 04:15:51 PM EST
    from one newspaper doesn't represent the entire Mainstream media, James.

    Parent
    Yes, except the present ruling government in (none / 0) (#51)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 01:06:40 PM EST
    London is Conservative, which is not known to be a liberal party.

    What to try again?

    Parent

    lol (none / 0) (#63)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 03:08:13 PM EST
    Uh, the word is moderate...

    You guys are funny.

    ;-)

    Parent

    Yes, but not as funny (none / 0) (#67)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 04:14:41 PM EST
    as someone describing the present government of the U.K. as 'liberal'.

    Parent
    The conservatives in the UK (none / 0) (#69)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 04:48:46 PM EST
    are far to the Left of the conservatives in the US.

    Time Magazine

    Do you think our conservatives would tolerate a single payer health care system if they were in power????????

    But no matter. The media loves them some moderate muslims and their water carriers in the left wing Internet can always be depended to play word games, a la Humpty Dumpty.

    Parent

    The British didn't have an entrenched (5.00 / 1) (#73)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 05:32:43 PM EST
    health insurance system to coddle the way the Republicans do here, so the comparison on this one policy issue is irrelevant to the issue as to whether they would be considered liberal here.

    The nearest thing to Republicans in Britain,  then, by your own assessment, would  be members of the National Front who would be likely to agree with your assessment of the threat to Western Civilization by the scary Muslims over a pint at the local Bee and Bouquet.

    Sadly, however, nobody in their right mind would call them 'social liberals', let alone liberals.

    But no matter. The media loves them some moderate muslims and their water carriers in the left wing Internet can always be depended to play word games, a la Humpty Dumpty

    Find some water carriers beside the reporter for the Boston Globe on this side of the pond, instead of playing semantic games that don't hide your lack of evidence for your initial claim, Mr. D.

    "Did I say liberals?  I meant the liberals in Britain, the Conservatives.  They're liberals, because they're for single-payer like me, a social liberal, not like the Republicans here who aren't liberals.  Oh, no, I'm not like those National Front people, but they aren't 'social liberals' like me.  Are they????????????????????????"

    Parent

    Heh - an anonymous post ... (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by Yman on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 12:43:06 PM EST
    ... on Jihad Watch, a right-wing, Islamaphobic, conspiracy blog headed by a guy who is a hate group leader and claims Western culture supremacy.

    Oh, ... wait a second ...

    Who does that sound like ...?

    Parent

    You know what?? (none / 0) (#49)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 12:58:46 PM EST
    You didn't mean to but you nailed it.

    Western culture is supreme.

    And since the guy is under a death sentence for leaving Islam I can understand why he doesn't want his name on the Internet.

    Parent

    Not me (none / 0) (#52)
    by Yman on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 01:35:45 PM EST
    That wasn't me ... it was the right-wing, Islamaphobic, hate group leader.

    But it's not remotely surprising that you think he "nailed it".

    Parent

    So you don't think (none / 0) (#64)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 03:16:12 PM EST
    Western culture is supreme???

    Why am I not surprised?

    ;-)

    Moral equivalency with the beheaders, honor killers,  gay stoners and women rapers...

    MAHER: No, that's not true. Not true. Vast numbers of Christians do not believe that if you leave the Christian religion you should be killed for it. Vast numbers of Christians do not treat women as second class citizens. Vast numbers of Christians

    snip

    -- do not believe if you draw a picture of Jesus Christ you should get killed for it. So yes, does ISIS do Khmer Rouge-like activities where they just kill people indiscriminately who aren't just like them? Yes.

    snip

    MAHER: So to claim that this religion is like other religions is just naive and plain wrong. It is not like other religious. The New York Times pointed out in an op-ed a couple weeks ago that in Saudi Arabia just since August 4th, they think it was, they have beheaded 19 people. Most for non-violent crimes including homosexuality.

    Maher


    Parent

    Actually, I don't (5.00 / 1) (#71)
    by Yman on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 05:26:32 PM EST
    You do realize there are many other cultures besides "Western culture" (however you define that) and the ME, don't you?

    What am I saying?  The guy who thinks that Puerto Rico, the Bahamas and the Virgin Islands are part of Latin America.

    Heh, heh, heh ...

    Parent

    BTW - Which culture was it ... (5.00 / 2) (#72)
    by Yman on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 05:28:48 PM EST
    ... that gave us the Holocaust, again?

    Oops ...

    Parent

    The Spanish Inquisition (5.00 / 1) (#74)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 05:36:30 PM EST
    the Albigensian Crusade, the Hundred Years War, the Three Hundred Years War, the War of Jenkins' Ear, the French and Indian War............

    Parent
    Mordiggian 88 (none / 0) (#82)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 12:38:25 PM EST
    You need to check your calender....

    today is 9/28/2014....

    And Western Culture is not the culture that allows radicals to form terror groups and kill,kill..

    Parent

    Which culture (none / 0) (#83)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 12:41:36 PM EST
    stopped it?? Which culture stopped communism??

    And which culture, despite Obama's wishes, is attacking ISIS?

    Parent

    Western culture, which liek every culture ... (5.00 / 1) (#90)
    by Yman on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 01:14:31 PM EST
    ... has it's good and it's bad elements.  But you, like most people with little experience with other cultures, think that yours is superior.

    Funny stuff.

    Parent

    And if one wants to be proud of today's' products (none / 0) (#91)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 01:24:53 PM EST
    Of Western Culture like Adrian Peterson beating his son bloody, or Ray Rice knocking his wife around in an elevator, or the activities of the Westboro Baptist Church, or the crazies in the Air Force that want it to be a branch of the Christian faith, one can be.

    Parent
    In this culture the bad guys (2.00 / 2) (#96)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 03:11:46 PM EST
    become outcasts.

    For whatever reason you just hate our culture.

    Figures.

    Parent

    Outcasts? (none / 0) (#99)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 03:30:14 PM EST
    Like the people who wore Ray Rice jerseys to a Ravens game?

    Like the people who defended Adrian Petersons' 'discipline' of his 4-year old son?

    Next, you'll be telling me about this bridge in Brooklyn that you're trying to get off of your hands.......

    Parent

    And no, I don't think there's any culture (none / 0) (#101)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 03:41:44 PM EST
    on Earth peachy-keen 100% flawless including Western Culture.

    OTOH, being blind to the faults we still have that are unsolved and preaching that we're superior to everyone else isn't how you sell Western Culture, IMHO.

     

    Parent

    Communism died of its failures, not (none / 0) (#84)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 12:47:17 PM EST
    Because of a boycott or anything the Western powers did.

    As for Obama not wanting to fight ISIS, that's the funniest thing you've written today.  Did you get that from the socially liberal Fox News?  Or was it IBD?  Or was it WND?

    Parent

    And here's an excerpt from the article (none / 0) (#86)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 12:54:56 PM EST
    Days later, bombs exploded on Boylston Street. And the unlikely face of the Muslim community in its time of crisis became this 6-foot-5-inch, blond-haired, blue-eyed former hip-hop DJ whose grandfather was a fundamentalist Christian preacher.

    ...The next day, the imam and his staff flew into action, planning a vigil, rallying volunteers, setting up trauma counseling. Upon learning later in the week that the bombing suspects were Muslims, Webb condemned the attacks, calling the suspects "criminals and enemies of society" and disassociating Islam from their acts.

    Yep, sounds like a real threat.  I'm surprised he hasn't been locked up yet.


    Parent

    Glad you brought the article up (none / 0) (#87)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 01:09:02 PM EST
    that was then. With the Hamas war against Israel, Webb's moderate "openness" mask has slipped in recent weeks. In a series of increasingly hostile social media posts to his tens of thousands of followers, Webb has been less than brotherly to Jews and Israel. Some examples: "2 children massacred by the Israeli army as it `defended itself ' 2day." "Modern Israel: Pioneers of Terror in the Holy Land." "Israel: America's Frankenstein monster."

    2 children massacred by the Israeli army as it "defended" itself 2day. God! Help Palestine! God! Help the Children! pic.twitter.com/w2XOux8EMB
    -- Suhaib Webb (@ImamSuhaibWebb) July 21, 2014
    Modern Israel: Pioneers of Terror in the Holy Land http://t.co/ou1ASYNEZR via @suhaibwebbsite
    -- Suhaib Webb (@ImamSuhaibWebb) August 9, 2014
    Israel: America's Frankenstein monster http://t.co/WvKIU9ieec via @Salon
    -- Suhaib Webb (@ImamSuhaibWebb) July 20, 2014
    Webb posted a cartoon of Netanyahu sitting in a Gaza-shaped tub of blood, waving a butcher's cleaver at screaming children. "Tells the story," was Webb's comment on the blood libel.



    Parent
    Did he or did he not (none / 0) (#92)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 01:27:28 PM EST
    Issue a statement condemning the Marathon Bombings?

    You're so far up the you-know-what of your anonymous blogger, that you can't realize that you're just jibbering now, quoting his stuff.  

    Good luck with that one.

    Parent

    The Israeli forces (none / 0) (#94)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 02:26:03 PM EST
    under the command of the leader of the country killed innocent children, innocent Palestinian children.

    That they were 'collateral damage' and not the intended targets is besides the point.

    If you or yours died in a similar manner, I doubt that your family would be comforted by the fact that the deaths were unintentional, whether by one side or the other.

    Run that by me again, how is that a blood libel?

    Parent

    So all those people who died (none / 0) (#88)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 01:10:45 PM EST
    opposing the expansion of the Soviet Union died for nothing.

    Wow.

    Parent

    who are you talking about? (none / 0) (#93)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 01:32:37 PM EST
    The freedom fighters in Hungary, who we did nothing to help?

    The people who died in Vietnam, which became Communist anyway, and is Communist to this day?

    Who died that led to the Berlin Wall being torn down?

    As usual, you would rather smear than discuss, and score points than stick to the facts.  

    Parent

    Actually I was thinking of some (none / 0) (#97)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 03:16:55 PM EST
    friends who died trying to keep the world safe so that people like you could write such things.

    Parent
    Ah, yes, the old (none / 0) (#98)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 03:27:37 PM EST
    "you're not appreciative/patriotic enough" shtick.

    You know, there's an old custom, from vaudeville times, of having the American Flag come down from the rafters and the band strike up a patriotic tune in order to get the audience interested and stimulated again.

    I don't know why you think the same tactic that failed with others would work with me.  You don't know my life well enough to make such statements.

    As a matter of fact, your wrongness about my experience with firearms, working in a factory, and distorting my political views as being outright pacifism lead me to believe that perhaps your track record of telling me about myself isn't all that great, but, as we are told by the Prophet:

    Can the Cushite change his skin, or a leopard his spots? If so, you might be able to do what is good, you who are instructed in evil.




    Parent
    Everyday (none / 0) (#79)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 11:57:52 AM EST
    women are murdered by spouses.

    Parent
    Well, the Breitbart link won't win you (none / 0) (#35)
    by Mr Natural on Sat Sep 27, 2014 at 11:28:47 AM EST
    many hearts and minds here, but it is what it is.  

    I wondered about that guy who breached the White House fence the other day.  He was carrying knives and a hatchet.  Gotta wonder.

    Still, if you've ever walked past the White House fence and seen those nasty patrol dogs wearing their Hannibal Lector masks, man, who would risk it but a zealot or a nut?

    Parent

    $1 Million / minute was the burn rate (none / 0) (#95)
    by Mr Natural on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 03:01:45 PM EST
    during the height (or depth, depending on your perspective) of the Iraq war, according to something I once read, somewhere.  No cite.  The rate, equal to $525 billion/year, sounds incredible, but may have been reached for a month or two.

    I think it was at least a billion a month (none / 0) (#100)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Sun Sep 28, 2014 at 03:31:21 PM EST
    in the early stages, but occupation and supporting the occupying troops would cost more afterward, methinks.

    Parent