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Thursday Open Thread

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Blog Related
Posted on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 11:56:34 AM EST
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    Thursday Open Thread | 215 comments (215 topical)
    Fat free half and half (5.00 / 3) (#10)
    by CST on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 01:40:52 PM EST
    So confusing.

    What's the other half if it's fat free?

    Skim milk? (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 03:59:20 PM EST


    Parent
    Over Xmas I Got Some... (none / 0) (#33)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:15:08 PM EST
    ...fat free whipping creme, and I forget what I was making, but it worked and tasted good.  

    I also buy, routinely, either fat free or low fat cottage cheese and sour cream.  Can't remember which is which, but I went to a Mexican joint the other day and got sour cream, which I never get; it tasted like butter to me, way too rich.

    I also want to know why 1% Central Market milk is good for over a month, and everyone else is around 2 weeks.  Milk never lasts over a week for me, so I don't know if it actually lasts that long, but that is the expiration date.

    Just remembered, alfredo sauce.

    Parent

    low fat I get (none / 0) (#43)
    by CST on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:26:29 PM EST
    But I thought cream rose to the top of milk due to the fat content.  If you take out the fat - isn't it just milk?  Or is there something else about it that makes it not milk?  To be honest, I don't know much about the chemistry of cream.

    I've discovered that I greatly prefer neufchatel cheese to original cream cheese - and many times high-fat content items just don't taste as good to me.  I'm actually more of a milk in my coffee person, I don't use cream at all, but at the office - you take what you can get.  Today that was fat-free half and half.  I'm mostly just confused as to how one achieves non-fat cream.

    Parent

    You may not want to knoe (5.00 / 1) (#46)
    by jbindc on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:32:55 PM EST
    Link

    In the U.S., half-and-half is typically half milk and half cream and contains about 12 percent fat, so how can such a product be rendered fat-free? Answer: by replacing butterfat (a mostly saturated fat) with corn syrup and adding chemicals and thickeners to simulate fat's texture and mouth-feel. The ingredients list: skim milk, corn syrup, cream (this is accompanied by a footnote reassuring the consumer that the cream adds "a trivial amount of fat" -- I assume because the product contains a trivial amount of cream) and "less than 0.5 percent of the following: Carrageenan, Sodium Citrate, Dipotassium Phosphate, Mono and Diglycerides, Vitamin A Palmitate, Color Added (Ingredient not in regular half-and-half)."


    Parent
    CST, maybe this article will help. (5.00 / 2) (#48)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:40:31 PM EST
    Fat free half and half sounds disgusting, I must say. Read this explanation by Andrew Weil.

    In the U.S., half-and-half is typically half milk and half cream and contains about 12 percent fat, so how can such a product be rendered fat-free? Answer: by replacing butterfat (a mostly saturated fat) with corn syrup and adding chemicals and thickeners to simulate fat's texture and mouth-feel.


    Parent
    Fat free 1/2 & 1/2 (5.00 / 2) (#55)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:50:12 PM EST
    Is extremely foul stuff.   I would stay away from it.   A little cream never hurt anyone.   Sugar and corn syrup are way way worse.

    "Mouth feel"

    Just ewu

    Parent

    The lower the fat content of (5.00 / 1) (#59)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:53:33 PM EST
    dairy products and, well, just about everything that touts itself as fat-free, means the sugar content has been jacked up.

    I will take the fat over the sugar any day.

    Parent

    I can't drink coffee without 1/2 & 1/2 (none / 0) (#73)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:27:27 PM EST
    I refuse to eat "cool whip" or "miracle whip".  Actual whipped cream is so easy to make.   How did that foul stuff ever find a market.

    I drink only fat free milk.   Other that that I do not eat non fat or low fat krap.  I'm the only one in my family who does not and I am the only one that is not morbidly obese.

    I could stand to lose 10 or 15 but who couldn't.

    Parent

    There is a better option (none / 0) (#75)
    by CoralGables on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:29:37 PM EST
    Eat whatever you want and run marathons. You burn that stuff up so fast it doesn't matter much what you eat.

    Parent
    Best option... (5.00 / 1) (#152)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:07:02 AM EST
    is eat/drink/smoke whatever you want, and be born with the metabolism of a hummingbird.

     

    Parent

    Float (none / 0) (#153)
    by FlJoe on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:12:40 AM EST
    like a butterfly, eat like a pig. that's the ticket.

    Parent
    That's me... (5.00 / 1) (#163)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:38:44 AM EST
    My winter Sunday morning ritual...eat two Sausage Biscuit w/ Egg from Mickey D's, smoke a buncha cigarettes, and run like the wind on the football field.  

    Well maybe not like the wind anymore, but at least like a stiff breeze;)

    Parent

    Those smokes take a toll on the speed (none / 0) (#179)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:44:47 AM EST


    Parent
    So they say... (none / 0) (#184)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:58:57 AM EST
    I still blow doors off some 20-something non-smokers.  And the youth movement on our team is asking off the field on kick coverage because they're "winded".  Winded my arse, these kids today are lazy!

    The smoking is more of an issue for basketball...I hit a wall during the first full court game, feel like I'm dying, but if I play through it I'm good for the rest of day.

    Parent

    Ready (none / 0) (#187)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:22:29 PM EST
    to test those lungs?

    Parent
    Not until... (none / 0) (#191)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:33:17 PM EST
    there is football field or basketball court 26 miles long;)

    Running for the sake of running has never appealed to me...if there is no end zone, goal, basket, or plate to reach my arse is walking.

    Parent

    I Am Going to Check That Out... (none / 0) (#84)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 06:00:15 PM EST
    ...because I eat a lot of fat free Cool Whip and fruit.  I don't buy it, the GF can't eat saturated fat, with her meds it gives her stomach cramps.

    I think it's de-licious.

    Parent

    Atkins, my friend (none / 0) (#125)
    by MKS on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:17:25 AM EST
    as protein is your friend.

    Parent
    atkins is my worst nightmare (5.00 / 3) (#141)
    by CST on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 09:40:13 AM EST
    You will pry bread and pasta from my cold, dead hands...

    Parent
    Yeah, linguini no more is sad (none / 0) (#204)
    by MKS on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 01:23:04 PM EST


    Parent
    Protein is... (none / 0) (#139)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 09:35:42 AM EST
    ...good, a couple times a week I have a smoothie of fruit and Myoplex Lite for breakfast, but saturated fat is not.  I like the taste and get tired of cereal.  

    I would say half the folks here, work, at some point have went on Atkins, all failed and even cheating just a bit results in gained weight.  Plus of course Atkins didn't exactly go the distance and there is a good chance he died of causes related to saturated fat.  Eating whatever you want, sans the carbs/sugars is not a healthy alternative IMO.
    ----------------

    Checked out the fat free Cool Whip, nothing out of the ordinary, there a little sugar, but no more than regular.

    As mentioned, I am a label reader, but I rarely look at sugar, so I checked out some things in the fridge.  There is nothing like mentioned above, but the circus cookies, which I already knew, had a lot of sugar, ditto for the gummies, even the ones with juice.

    Parent

    okay okay (none / 0) (#58)
    by CST on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:53:01 PM EST
    I take it back.  I didn't really want to know...

    We're all gonna die eventually I guess.

    Parent

    Honestly... (none / 0) (#62)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:02:46 PM EST
    ... I grew up on farm  my dad would go to the neighbors and pull milk from their milk tank, sometimes it was still warm.

    I grew up whole milk, and butter and cheese were german seasonings in my home.  But I have slowly went from that to almost everything low or non fat taking small steps.   And I did it for no other reason that I didn't want to be like my parents, who at nearly 70 who can't kick the fat and are in bad health because of it.

    My goal is by retirement, hoping for 55, to be at a place where I am eating about as healthy as one can be w/o giving up flavor.  So far so good, but what I really miss is putting away a pint of really good ice cream whenever I want.  Skinny Cow is great, but it's no MaggieMoo.

    Parent

    I think it is a question of balance. (5.00 / 2) (#68)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:11:13 PM EST
    As Julia Child used to say "Everything in moderation". I do not eat fat-free products because of the added sugar and chemicals needed to make them at all palatable. I do eat full-fat foods in moderate to small quantities.

    Too much sugar in whatever form you get it is just as bad, maybe worse, than too much fat.

    Moderation, my friend, moderation.

    By the by, my grandparents had a farm in central Illinois. The milk I had for breakfast when I would visit them had been in the cow not all that long before it appeared in my cereal bowl. It tasted so good, so much better than the store bought milk i had at home.

    Parent

    One of my favorite Julia Child sayings is, (5.00 / 1) (#76)
    by Anne on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:30:20 PM EST
    "Life's too short not to eat real butter."

    She was right!

    Parent

    Seriously (none / 0) (#77)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:34:03 PM EST
    I don't eat butter I put chemicals and hydrogenated soy bean oil on MY muffins.

    Parent
    Conola Oil & Butter... (none / 0) (#83)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:56:36 PM EST
    ...when oil olive won't work, plus it's soft.

    The only way butter is even an option is if you leave it out and I don't use enough to do that.  

    Parent

    Kalamata olive oil (none / 0) (#206)
    by fishcamp on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 01:36:55 PM EST
    is the very best for most everything in the kitchen.  Zorba told me about it and I've been using it exclusively since then.  It has an extremely mild, smooth, slightly nutty flavor.  I try to consume three tablespoons daily on toast and eggs and later on salmon and spinach.  Good stuff but hard to find.  Amazon has it.  Don't put it in boat drinks...

    Parent
    Honestly (none / 0) (#69)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:13:06 PM EST
    Except for skim milk fat free is not healthy.  As Casey says it just substitutes sugar for fat.  Which in your body instantly turns into fat and creates a really toxic substance as a side effect.

    Low fat or non fat things like cheese might be ok, but I wouldn't eat them.   But things like fat free salad dressing or cookies and stuff is like poison.

    Parent

    BBC (none / 0) (#70)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:18:45 PM EST
    But, as we came to terms with this unpalatable fact, the food industry got to work replacing the animal fats in their products with un-saturated vegetable oils. Some of the changes they had to make included altering the structure of the vegetable oil so it could be used in the place of solid fats. To do this the food producers used a process called hydrogenation which created a solid or semi-solid fat thought to be more appropriate for their food processing needs.
    Unfortunately, we now know these hydrogenated fats increase levels of dangerous trans-fats which are both bad for the heart and our cholesterol. Although trans-fats can be found at low levels in some natural foods these man-made versions meant it was likely we were eating more of them. Since learning of the dangers of trans-fats the food industry and our UK supermarkets have been working hard to reduce levels of them in their products.

    LINK


    Parent

    Milk... (none / 0) (#81)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:50:05 PM EST
    ...I use 1%.

    I am a label reader.  Cottage cheese is a good snack, I think that is low fat, not fat free. I probably eat a pint every week.  It's somewhat bland, but salt and pepper and you have something.

    Cheese, I got like 10 lbs in my freezer, I get WI cheese every xmas and bday in july.  I'll eat a good amount one day then either give it away or stick it in the freezer, where it sits until the next package, then it gets tossed.

    Heart disease runs in my family so fat is what I really watch.  Sugars and carbs, I can eat them without any weight gain fairly freely and I do.  Same with salt, my BP is very low, so I dress lots of stuff up with salt.  Used to be dangerously low, but then I got this job, just kidding.

    Salad dressing, OMG, even the good stuff sucks, I have tried low fat one time, never again.  I don't make them at home, ever.  But I get them at the deli here or take out because my GF loves salad, but generally stick with greek and balsamic.

    I do like a good cesar salad, namely the dressing.

    I am not that regimented, I just avoid certain as mentioned above, moderation.  Almost all snacks I buy are snack packs, right now I am on circus cookies(the frosted ones), I go through fads, but if I had a big box of them, it would be gone in one shot.

    If you saw me at the grocery store, you would think I have 10 kids with all the snack packs stuff.  From fruit chews to raisins to nuts to GD circus cookies, I love me some snack packs.

    Parent

    One, of many, really (none / 0) (#85)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 06:07:41 PM EST
    Sucky things about kidney stones is all the great stuff you are supposed to give up or cut down on.  Nuts being one.  I used to eat more nuts than average squirrel.   I can't any more.   Waaaaaa.

    Parent
    I Went of Soda... (none / 0) (#142)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 09:42:11 AM EST
    ...and was drinking tea, like 2 months later, stones.  No tea since and no stones in maybe 4 years.  I don't even really like tea and the doc didn't mention anything about nuts.

    I can't give up soda, but my new thing is drinking half and tossing the rest, at lunch and dinner, so I am down to a soda per day.  The weekends, much harder as my schedule isn't regimented and especially going out to eat, the water sucks and the soda flows so freely.

    Giving up nuts would be hard, right now I am on smokehouse almonds.

    Parent

    Bad news from Harvard Health (none / 0) (#143)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 09:54:37 AM EST
    Avoid stone-forming foods: Beets, chocolate, spinach, rhubarb, tea, and most nuts are rich in oxalate, and colas are rich in phosphate, both of which can contribute to kidney stones. If you suffer from stones, your doctor may advise you to avoid these foods or to consume them in smaller amounts

    Nuts really are one of the worst things you can eat for stones.
    Tea is nearly as bad.  Sodas too.  You should google this if yu have a history.
    My drink, know what Krystal Light is?  No sugar no calories.   It's kind of pricy.  I use the generic WalMart version.  They have dozens of favors.  Mine is orange.  It's not terrible straight but not great.  But, if you add a splash of orange or Apple (better for stones) juice it's actually great.  I also add the juice of two lemons a day.  Lemon juice is supposed to be one of the most effective things you can do to prevent stones.
    My urologist said if you do two lemons a day you can even cheat on some of the stuff you are supposed to stay away from.


    Parent

    More bad news (none / 0) (#145)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 09:59:07 AM EST
    Check out this oxalate list.

    nothing on the list is worse than almonds

    I used to eat LOTS of almonds.  Sadly no more.

    Parent

    Well (none / 0) (#147)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:01:46 AM EST
    Except beet greens and spinach

    Parent
    Doesn't (none / 0) (#159)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:21:26 AM EST
    the discussion of ailments make you feel old, old, old? It does me.

    Never had kidney stones thank heavens but I have had UTI and they are pretty miserable by themselves. Sodas are a problem for people who get UTIs and when I found out what they do to your teeth I pretty much gave them up.

    Parent

    Stones are not (none / 0) (#162)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:28:25 AM EST
    Exclusively a problem of the "old"

    Parent
    My Doc Said... (none / 0) (#158)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:17:45 AM EST
    ...give up the tea and if you get them again we will talk. So far so good, because that list doesn't comply with my diet.  

    The little crystal light packs they have here at work in the coffee area.  I lot of people seem like them.  I don't drink coffee and we have bottle water with our name on it.  It's spring water, not filtered city water.  

    I hope the stones don't come back.  I am tall so by Friday my back is always a bit sore, which to me feel like when the stones came on.  That muscle and my kidneys are right in the same spot.  I get a little nervous, but at least now I know what the stones are.  The first time it freaked me the F out.  I can't imagine getting them while driving or in a meeting or any place not home.

    Parent

    I dint think that list (none / 0) (#161)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:25:55 AM EST
    Fits anyone's diet.  The don't eat list was basically the base of my food pyramid.  I love spinach and all kind of greens.  A big no no.  Okra, corn, beans tomatoes and on and on,  
    There are a few things I refuse to give up.  Okra, corn.
    But I have really changed my diet.

    Funny what you said about the onset of an attack.  When it happened to me I was sitting on the couch watching TV.  (What a surprise, right).
    But yeah, if I had been driving or pretty much anything else I can't even imagine.

    Parent

    For ME It Was a Month... (none / 0) (#167)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:02:35 AM EST
    ...before a big diving trip to Bonaire.

    Imagine that happening 70 feet below the surface for the first time.  You can't just shoot up, slow and managed ascent, then a 3 min safety stop at 15 ft.  Stones and the bends would not be good.

    Now I would know and not be worried about it, but on a long flight would be torturous.

    Parent

    A splash of whole milk (none / 0) (#135)
    by fishcamp on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 08:50:54 AM EST
    in my coffee is what I use.  All those other healthy milk products, like Silk and almond milk,  turn coffee gray.  Can't stand gray coffee, it has to be tan for me.

    Parent
    Almond milk (none / 0) (#149)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:05:13 AM EST
    is evil

    Lay Off the Almond Milk, You Ignorant Hipsters



    Parent
    I would love to be able to drink real milk (none / 0) (#114)
    by McBain on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:42:37 PM EST
    fresh from a farm.

    I'm surprised so many people still believe the anti fat propaganda.  Real, natural fat is loaded with nutrition.  Drinking/eating healthy fat doesn't cause heart disease.  

    Parent

    For the most part (none / 0) (#128)
    by smott on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 05:59:22 AM EST
    High serum cholesterol is not especially caused by dietary cholesterol. You can raise it a couple points if you eat a couple cartons of eggs a week, perhaps, but high cholesterol, insulin resistance, diabetes, heart disease are much more related to blood sugar rises, I.e. Eating fast carbs, sugars, breads and so on.

    Glycemic index and glycemic load are what to watch, not so much the fat per se.

    Yeah the low fat craze was perhaps worst for folks subject to heart disease.  Have the eggs, have an extra egg even, just have half a piece of toast.  

    Parent

    I grew up (none / 0) (#140)
    by CST on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 09:38:36 AM EST
    visiting family on a farm, and we would get the warm fresh milk.  Honestly, I hated the stuff.  Being anti-cream for me has nothing to do with health, I just don't like it.  That being said, I'd have gone for regular half and half over "fat free" if it were available for my lazy mooching self yesterday :P

    The "low fat" cream cheese isn't so much low-fat as it is an alternative kind of cheese that has a lower fat content.  Again, I just prefer that kind of cheese.

    I am not a "diet" kind of person, although I too don't wish to grow up like my parents, I practice more portion control than restricting what I eat.  Heart disease also runs in my family.  And my parents, while they've gotten a lot healthier in the last few years, did a lot of damage to their health.  My Dad has already had 2 heart attacks, and quadruple bypass surgery.  But again, that's not really why I drink milk instead of cream, that's why I only eat a cup of ice cream instead of a pint.  As for SkinnyCow...  You may take my McDonalds, but you will never take my Ben and Jerry's!


    Parent

    I Never Drank It Warm... (none / 0) (#144)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 09:58:18 AM EST
    ...it was gross, and even to this day I don't like eating anything that reminds me of where it came from, so no meat with bones or fish with eyes.

    I like to pretend it all comes form a factory, not from living creatures.  I would love to go vegetarian, but bacon and chopped steak are things I am not ready to give up.  But for the most part, I am not a big meat eater.


    Parent

    No bones? (5.00 / 2) (#155)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:13:36 AM EST
    But the best meat is the meat closest to the bone...whether it's pork chops or a porterhouse, I lick 'em clean and make sure I'm the last to leave the table to gnaw on the rest of the table's bones.

    Parent
    Bro... (none / 0) (#164)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:46:59 AM EST
    ...I actually make my GF cut off meat if there is a bone.  She says the same thing as you, and I say there is one soul in this house that like my non bone eating ways, Pepper the dog.  She doesn't go near my GF when she smells meat.

    I dislike chicken on a very high level, it's funny because say we go to New Orleans, my friends will order the crazy stuff like frog legs, when I say 'what does it taste like...', you know the answer so not liking chicken means not liking a lot of stuff.

    When I was really young, my grandma used to cut chickens heads off and throw them at me and my brother.  We would scream and everyone would laugh at the headless chickens chasing us around.  My brother eats chicken and I have participated in butchering a lot of cows and I like beef.  So who knows.

    But every girl I have ever gone with with liked chicken before and didn't after.  I think when you eat less, it starts tasting gamey, and for me it's so foul smelling and tasting that I don't want to sit down and smell bird while eating.

    Parent

    I have no trouble eating (5.00 / 1) (#170)
    by caseyOR on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:14:06 AM EST
    chicken. Whne we were kids those damn chickens would peck at my sister and me. We hated them. No trouble eating them.

    The little lambs and the calves, well, a totally different story.We played with those babies on the farm. They were our friends. So, no lamb or veal for us. Ever. And I mean never ever.

    Parent

    Lambs and Calves... (5.00 / 1) (#173)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:21:39 AM EST
    are my friends too...they give the delicious bounty of lamb chops & veal cutlets.

    Parent
    Your poor special lady... (none / 0) (#165)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:53:55 AM EST
    it's hard dating a picky eater.  Cooking dinner or going out to eat becomes this huge project.

    Vegetarian or vegan, forget it...never again with that mess! ;)

    Parent

    I have a joke (none / 0) (#166)
    by CST on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:58:03 AM EST
    (that's not really a joke) with my friends that I "won't date a vegetarian".  I guess if I really liked him I might reconsider, but it's definitely a black mark.  The only thing worse than that is someone who "only eats american food".  Because no other country on earth could possible come up with anything that tastes good...

    And the only thing better than meat near the bone is meat inside the bone.  Love me some marrow.

    Parent

    Woman I'm seeing know... (none / 0) (#169)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:09:35 AM EST
    does not eat meat, only because she grew up on the Ital diet, and she does eat fish so there's something to work with.

    I got her to try Ox Tail, but it didn't go well.  

    Parent

    She ate italian and (none / 0) (#172)
    by caseyOR on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:21:11 AM EST
    does not eat meat? Clearly, she is not from Tuscany. I do not think of Italian food as a cuisine that lacks meat. Now, if we were talking Indian food, well, no meat.

    Parent
    Not Italian... (none / 0) (#175)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:32:33 AM EST
    Ital...the Rasta diet. Her parents hail from the Caribbean.

    Not too strict Ital though, hence the fish.

    Parent

    "Pescetarianism." (5.00 / 1) (#186)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:05:01 PM EST


    Parent
    I Dated a Vegitarian... (none / 0) (#171)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:20:10 AM EST
    ...and it was no big deal as most places have a good meat free menu.  The one thing I hated, ordering food, one place in particular that I ordered all the time "Yeah, can I get a turkey reuben, hold the turkey ?".

    But she, like me, loved pizza.  I hardly noticed and we lived together for a while.  Plus the jokes, I mean seriously, if your vegetarian girlfriend claims to not eat meat, you can't not laugh, even when you shouldn't.

    It reduced my meat intake for no other reason that she ate a lot of stuff I have never tried.  It was good for my health, and she wasn't preachy about it.

    Vegan would be hard.

    Parent

    Vegan (none / 0) (#183)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:58:55 AM EST
    I know a number of people that are Vegan. They eat a lot of processed food. To me if you're really going to be a Vegan about all you can eat is rice and vegetables or beans without going the processed food route.

    Parent
    no we didn't really either (none / 0) (#150)
    by CST on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:06:04 AM EST
    Although I have done it.  But I didn't like it cold either.  Too creamy in general.  Honestly I don't really like skim milk that much either.

    I'm the opposite with meat - I'll eat anything and everything, and I will definitely eat fish heads.  You don't like bone-in rib-eye?

    I prefer my food to seem like it comes from a real animal.  Not because I don't like animals, but because "factory" seems even worse.  My main thing with meat is to not eat a ton of it and when it's available pay the premium for "free range" or more humanely raised product.  It makes me feel better and it tastes so much better.  The best beef I ever had was when my parents bought a quarter of a cow from our friends in VT and we ate that for a year and a half.  Mostly though I eat a lot of seafood.

    Parent

    When I was a child we drank whole milk (none / 0) (#154)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:13:03 AM EST
    For many years we lived across the road from my uncle who had a dairy farm.   Not a big enough one to stink.  20 or 30 cows.  But we always got free milk.

    Then I got used to drinking non fat milk and now I really don't like whole milk.  Tastes greasy.

    Parent

    Funny story about cream... (none / 0) (#71)
    by Anne on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:19:14 PM EST
    A few years ago, I was in the kitchen area at work, and a fellow employee was pouring herself a glass of cream.  I looked at it and said, "are you just going to drink that?"  She said, "yeah - it's only got like 50 calories, so why not?"

    I picked up the container, and said, "yeah, 50 calories...in a tablespoon!"

    She burst out laughing, so embarrassed that she hadn't checked the serving size, and then she poured it down the drain.

    I still chuckle when I remember that.


    Parent

    It's 2016 and we're still stuck in the 80s (none / 0) (#112)
    by McBain on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:36:05 PM EST
    Fat is not bad!  Whole milk is better for your health than skim or non fat milk. We've been brainwashed into thinking fat and cholesterol are the enemies.  

    Parent
    Five myths (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by jbindc on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 03:58:38 PM EST
    Donald Trump tells about Donald Trump

    jb, I'm very glad (5.00 / 1) (#189)
    by fishcamp on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:27:20 PM EST
    you posted that. Link regarding Trump on Trump.  There's another guy at the gym who is a professional lie detector person.  Casually I asked him if he had ever tested a celebrity like Donald Trump, and he said you know how you can tell when Obama is lying?  You know the stupid answer, when His lips are moving.  Immediately he came out with a "gotcha" question.  Did I know why Trump was leading in the polls?  I answered because he's a wealthy, liar.  He couldn't wait to tell me how the Democrats have been blocking progress and Trump is offering changes.  He then said he's a 12 year member of the RNC something or other.  As I was leaving while he was still blathering, I said it seems like your brain is full of gotcha questions jjust like your precious Republican Party.  We had always gotten along fine in the past, however tomorrow we'll see.  He does lift more weight than me, and is younger, but never underestimate an old guy.

    Parent
    You seem pretty scrappy. :) (none / 0) (#200)
    by jbindc on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 01:17:23 PM EST


    Parent
    Well (none / 0) (#29)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:03:16 PM EST
    it's not like the news media is really going to challenge him on any of this stuff.

    Parent
    Yep (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by FlJoe on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:18:19 PM EST
    we are not only witnessing the total collapse of the Republican party, but also a total implosion of journalism. Ugly but fascinating.

    May we live in interesting times indeed.

    Parent

    interesting times... I'm hoping to keel over (none / 0) (#103)
    by Mr Natural on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 07:51:23 PM EST
    before they get too much more interesting.  lol.

    Parent
    It's like (none / 0) (#106)
    by Kmkmiller on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:03:33 PM EST
    Our democracy is binge eating bacon double cheese burgers again unworried about the consequences.

    Parent
    Well, the Wahington Post did! (none / 0) (#30)
    by oculus on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:13:27 PM EST


    Parent
    I don't think it's the news media (none / 0) (#32)
    by CST on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:15:03 PM EST
    we need to worry about with Donald Trump.

    They kind of hate him.  If anything, he's the only candidate they will challenge on this stuff.  The problem is that none of his supporters seem to care, and if the news media does challenge him, they will instead abandon said news media.

    Parent

    True (none / 0) (#36)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:17:04 PM EST
    if he says he could shoot someone and they'd still adore him needless to say the press is going to have no effect on his supporters.

    I have to say though I think the press has really lost the ability to do much at all these days.

    Parent

    The media (none / 0) (#40)
    by jbindc on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:18:52 PM EST
    I hope, will ignore him tonight and focus on the debate.

    But I'm not holding my breath.

    Parent

    Is there a debate tonight? (none / 0) (#65)
    by CoralGables on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:06:56 PM EST


    Parent
    This is What His Presidency Would Be... (none / 0) (#53)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:46:09 PM EST
    ...corralling money to his businesses:
    At the start of his campaign, he loaned his political operation $1.8 million. As of Oct. 1, he had given his campaign an additional $104,829.27 -- but he had also received $3.9 million from donors, which accounted for the vast majority of the $5.8 million his campaign had taken in by then. His campaign website features a prominent "donate" button on its homepage. Trump has spent $5.4 million, and interestingly, about one-quarter of his spending has gone to Trump-owned entities (mainly his private jet company).


    Parent
    The New Yorker: (5.00 / 2) (#54)
    by oculus on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:49:53 PM EST
    "Fox News just announced Clint Eastwood will be onstage tonight to address an empty house podium."

    Tucker Carlson in Politico: (5.00 / 1) (#88)
    by Mr Natural on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 06:33:56 PM EST
    Donald Trump is Shocking, Vulgar, and Right... and, my dear fellow Republicans, he's all your fault."

    About 15 years ago, I said something nasty on CNN about Donald Trump's hair. I can't now remember the context, assuming there was one. In any case, Trump saw it and left a message the next day.

    "It's true you have better hair than I do," Trump said matter-of-factly. "But I get more **y than you do." Click.

    Not everyone finds it funny. On my street in Northwest Washington, D.C., there's never been anyone as unpopular as Trump. The Democrats assume he's a bigot, pandering to the morons out there in the great dark space between Georgetown and Brentwood. The Republicans (those relatively few who live here) fully agree with that assessment, and they hate him even more. They sense Trump is a threat to them personally, to their legitimacy and their livelihoods. Idi Amin would get a warmer reception in our dog park.

    But just because Trump is an imperfect candidate doesn't mean his candidacy can't be instructive. Trump could teach Republicans in Washington a lot if only they stopped posturing long enough to watch carefully. Here's some of what they might learn:

    He exists because you failed.
    Truth is not only a defense; it's thrilling.
    Washington really is corrupt.
    He could win.

    Washington Republicans look on at this in horror, their suspicions confirmed. Beneath the thin topsoil of rural conservatism, they see the seeds of proto-fascism beginning to sprout. But that's not quite right. Republicans in the states aren't dangerous. They've just evaluated the alternatives and decided those are worse.
    His statement (none / 0) (#90)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 06:49:43 PM EST
    about the evangelicals who support Trump explains a lot.

    The article is interesting in many ways but the main thing he danced around is the fact that the GOP has not been telling the truth to their voters. If they had been telling the truth they would not be in the trouble they are in right now. They should have just said hey, we've lost the culture war. It's over and time to move on but they have not. They should tell them that no, tax cuts are not a solution to every problem in America. And on and on...

    Parent

    So let me see (none / 0) (#122)
    by jimakaPPJ on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 11:36:13 PM EST
    You actually think the "culture war,"whatever that means, is lost.

    Now, assuming that the Repub "leaders" had said that then there would be no need for said leaders.

    In fact there would be no need for a Repub party.

    Which, of course, is what you want.

    What the great unwashed are angry about is what they see as a lack of action by the Repubs in the past two years when they have had majorities in the House and the Senate.

    Parent

    Paul Kantner, of Jefferson Airplane (5.00 / 5) (#113)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:40:32 PM EST
    and Jefferson Starship, has died at age 74. He had a heart attack earlier this week.mcause of death is multiple organ failure and sepsis.

    Both Airplane and Starship produced some great music. Grace Slick's vocals were amazing.

    RIP, Paul.

    This has been a very tough month for rock fans. (5.00 / 1) (#118)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 09:50:15 PM EST
    When the truth is found to be lies, I think we needs us some Airplane at Monterey Pop Festival.

    We still have the music.

    Parent

    Just another (5.00 / 5) (#127)
    by Repack Rider on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:50:50 AM EST
    ...one of the people I encountered in my other life.

    Last time I saw Mr. Kantner was at a show I worked on at a local park maybe six years ago, where the Starship was on the bill.  I also worked on the 30th Anniversary Summer of Love show in Golden Gate Park in 1997.  Dude smoked like a volcano, always had a cigarette going, and for a lifelong cyclist like me it was a bit off-putting.   I have a photo on my website of Paul and my guitar player friend smoking a joint in a dressing room at Winterland.

    I worked a lot of shows with the Airplane in the '60s and early '70s, a few New Year's Eves, in 1969 a gig in Detroit that we had to do without our drummer and keyboard player who were in jail.  

    Gig in Griffith Park summer 1969 while both bands were in L.A. recording.  They were doing "Volunteers."  Played for free on a field, with L.A. cops in riot gear, lined up against one side of the field waiting for someone to light a joint.

    Fourth of July, 1969 with the Airplane at an outdoor festival in a place called Bullfrog Lake in Oregon.  Crowd broke down the fences and got in for free, promoters lost their shirts.

    Parent

    he also had a terrible alcohol problem (none / 0) (#160)
    by leap on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:24:41 AM EST
    Smoked like a chimney, drank like a fish. A constant detriment to himself and to the band. He did not take care of his health, so this did not surprise me.

    Parent
    Bummer... (5.00 / 1) (#136)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 08:51:36 AM EST
    Saw Paul Kantner w/ Starship last summer at The Great South Bay fest, for the first and only time.  Wasn't quite sure what to expect, I was pleasantly surprised at how well they rocked it.

    Two years in a row now I saw a legend there for the first time before they passed within the year...first BB, now Kantner.

    Parent

    my favorite tracks, imo the best JA ever laid down (none / 0) (#119)
    by Mr Natural on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 11:09:44 PM EST
    Plastic Fantastic Lover.

    and 3/5ths of a Mile in Ten Seconds.  Balin, Dryden, and Jack Casady carry it, with a little help from Kaukonen, Slick, and Kantner.

    Both were written by Marty Balin.  They were recorded when the Airplane was a very tight band.  Hot Tuna still plays this stuff, slowed way down.

    Acid isn't dead, though.  One example, the acid dripping Tito and Tarantula tune, After Dark.  They play it wearing Mariachi suits in the Tarantino - Clooney - Keitel - and oh yeah, Selma Hayek, flick, From Dusk till Dawn.  lol; I'm too old for this stuff, any of it.

    Parent

    Jorma! And Hot Fu**ing Tuna! (none / 0) (#124)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:08:26 AM EST
    Playing this weekend in LA...however the venue simply isn't my thing.

    Parent
    McCabe's is awesome (none / 0) (#134)
    by Dadler on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 08:50:38 AM EST
    I took fiddle lessons there from the greatest Charlie Daniels doppelganger in all of the L.A. Metro area. Go to the show, you pud. ;-)

    Parent
    Ha! I've seen some good shows there, (none / 0) (#138)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 09:24:05 AM EST
    last time was Dave Alvin.

    No alc. Hard, cramped, wooden folding chairs. No mas!

    Parent

    If you don't know Jorma... (none / 0) (#137)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 08:53:34 AM EST
    you don't know Jack!

    Parent
    Can I Be the First to Say... (5.00 / 1) (#193)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:36:33 PM EST
    ...the winner of last night debate was the guy who did not attend ?

    I have seen a couple clips, but the story wasn't near as long as the story about Trump collecting $6M for veterans.  Dare I say that was a genius move, I do.

    You have to admit, Trump knows what he is doing, at some point dumb luck doesn't let you skip a debate, fight with Fox News, and remain on top for like 6 months, by a considerable margin.

    Whatever you think of him, it's pretty clear in the political arena he is a formidable opponent and as mentioned, HRC better get her S together is she wants to beat this clown.

    You can say it (5.00 / 1) (#194)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:44:40 PM EST
    But you won't be the first.    It was a smart thing to do.   Cruz got pummeled.   His chances went from slim to none.

    Surprisingly the debate apparently got more viewers than the last time.  I'm pretty sure Cruz is wishing it had not.

    Parent

    Yep, Cruz's plan to (5.00 / 4) (#199)
    by fishcamp on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 01:12:24 PM EST
    carpet bomb Syria is hideous, especially when he gets that glaring, I dare you, stare.  His replacement plans for Obama Care were beyond stupid, they didn't even make sense.  I liked how he physically shredded Obama Care page by page on stage.  

    Another thing that bugs me during these debates is how the various governors never stop touting their achievements for their states.  Bush seemed a bit more together, maybe due to the cold meds he must be taking, since he sounded stuffed up.  I also liked Kasich more this time around.  He weaves and hand jives like a younger Bernie.  

    This could be my first political post.  I'm starting to run out of my other stories, well except for the ones I can't post online.

    Parent

    Cruz (none / 0) (#197)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 01:04:49 PM EST
    has now been judged a whiner it seems.

    Parent
    Not Many Politicians Can Pull Off Humor... (none / 0) (#202)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 01:18:08 PM EST
    ... Cruz is at the top of that list, but it sure as hell doesn't stop him from trying really, really, hard.

    Parent
    Meant to say earlier that (5.00 / 1) (#207)
    by fishcamp on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 01:52:20 PM EST
    I filmed Julia Childs once at the food and wine extravaganza in Aspen.  I'm basically a sports cameraman and had no idea how to shoot a food cooking show.  It was so easy I was amazed.  All the cameras lined up way back, plugged into their sound system , and rolled camera on her cooking and talking.  They had a mirror above her at a 45 degree angle to get the food cooking shots, so simple.  She had her crew bring the cameramen the food she cooked.  Great lady.

    Jim (5.00 / 1) (#211)
    by FlJoe on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 04:02:09 PM EST
    Pro tip: never start an argument with
    I haven't the vaguest idea if this actually means what it appears to say.
    DFH: Hollywood. (5.00 / 1) (#212)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 04:31:05 PM EST
    Now, as evidence goes that's entirely anecdotal, but I think it's probably reflective of what Hollywood was like until only fairly recently, whether they worked in cinematography, sound, engineering, art, props, location scouting, accounting, etc.
    Sure enough, at that level dept heads hire their friends, or friends of friends. It's all about "Who you know." Friends, or friends of friends, who are well qualified of course, if you ever want to work again.

    Case in point: Back in the day I worked on "Project Alf," a TV movie.

    What was unusual was that the very qualified lead sound guy was black. He was hired by the director, a white guy. They had been friends and colleagues for years.

    What was not unusual was that, as dept head, the black sound guy in turn hired all his qualified friends, and in this case the result was that everyone in the sound dept was black.

    Another example; the Mexican director/writer of "The Revenent" hired his well-qualified friend to shoot the movie. Not surprisingly, his very well-qualified friend was also Mexican.

    However, hiring a boom op or a DP is not even in the same galaxy as hiring the above the line actors/actresses for a global studio film project.

    I've said it before, at that level, hires that put the maximum number of "asses in the seats" are priority #1.

    "Memoirs of a Geisha" famously cast three Chinese actresses as the geishas, instead of Japanese actresses, despite geishas being, well, Japanese.

    The reason?

    Japanese potential for "asses in the seats" ~ 125 million.

    Chinese potential ~ ~ 1.4 billion, or over 11x times bigger potential than Japan.

    Maine governor (none / 0) (#1)
    by Chuck0 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 12:19:37 PM EST
    asking Maine residents to shoot drug dealers. In the same article he claims he's not advocating vigilante justice. How did this guy get re-elected?

    It could get very recursive, very fast (5.00 / 3) (#9)
    by ruffian on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 01:32:01 PM EST
    Should we shoot the gun dealers too, for dealing the guns that kill people?

    Parent
    with a plurality (none / 0) (#4)
    by CST on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 12:44:25 PM EST
    of the vote?

    Parent
    It was a rhetorical question. (none / 0) (#5)
    by Chuck0 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 01:13:25 PM EST
    Duh.

    Parent
    I was being facetious (none / 0) (#6)
    by CST on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 01:16:37 PM EST
    Also pointing out that he's never actually won more than 50% of the vote.  So theoretically if someone else got their $hit together they could beat him.

    Parent
    If the Drug Problem is That Bad... (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 01:51:08 PM EST
    ... maybe a dealer should run.

    Parent
    If you tob a bank (none / 0) (#14)
    by jbindc on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 02:00:01 PM EST
    And someone there dies of a heart attack because of it, you can be charged with felony murder.

    What's the difference?

    Parent

    Sorry, replied to wrong thread (none / 0) (#15)
    by jbindc on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 02:00:32 PM EST


    Parent
    The Actual Quote is Way Worse (none / 0) (#7)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 01:24:15 PM EST
    I tell ya, everybody in Maine, we have constitutional carry," he said. "Load up and get rid of the drug dealers. Because, folks, they're killing our kids.

    Not for nothing, but drug dealers got the same constitutional rights in regards to concealed weapons.

    Better yet:

    His reference to the concealed handgun law came amid several statements in which he discussed reinstituting the death penalty, changing Maine law to allow drug dealers to be charged with homicide if they can be linked to an overdose death, and getting tough on doctors who overprescribe opioid medications - a major factor in the current heroin epidemic.

    The notion that an OD is anyone's fault but the person who actually takes the drug, is absurd.  They would never charge a doctor or a liquor store clerk for an OD.

    Parent

    I want to be perfectly clear (none / 0) (#8)
    by CST on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 01:28:56 PM EST
    That I don't think they should be charging anyone with homicide for drug overdoses.

    That being said, I'm not sure your last paragraph is true.  They certainly can and do hold some bars/bartenders accountable for over-serving.  And look at what happened with Michael Jackson's Doctor.

    Again, I'm in no way advocating for this policy, just pointing out that it does kind of already exist in some areas.

    Parent

    Not for Overdosing... (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 02:03:46 PM EST
    ... they charge them with over-serving only when they hurt someone else.

    I had a good friend in high school that drank and entire 5th of vodka in like 2 mins, then went to school dance.  He was in the hospital for several days.  That is an alcohol overdose, getting drunk and running a stop light is not.

    The MJ case is not the norm by any means, that was a substance that the doctor controlled, he delivered and administered.  If your dealer is doing that...  Plus of course that is not something that is suppose to even be used outside a hospital.

    If I go home and take 20 Ritalin/Xanax prescribed by my doctor, and my heart stops, no charges will be filed.

    Parent

    That isn't true (none / 0) (#18)
    by jbindc on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 02:13:33 PM EST
    More than several cases have popped up over the last few years where do tors have been criminally charged when a patient overdoses.

    Link 1

    Link 2

    Link 3

    Parent

    The Links... (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 03:05:27 PM EST
    ...one is general discussion, the other was about criminalizing malpractice.  The other was about a doctor who saw 90 patients a day and charged on a per-prescription scale.

    How about it is extremely rare and only cases in which the doctor was, more or less, behaving like a drug dealer.  

    More than several is about right.


    Parent

    Yes (none / 0) (#132)
    by jbindc on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 07:13:47 AM EST
    It's not common, but it is starting to happen.

    Parent
    We had a rash of young people (none / 0) (#12)
    by jondee on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 01:56:07 PM EST
    die here in the last year because dealers were selling Fentanyl to people and telling them that it was Heroin.

    Talk about the ultimate buyer beware.

    Parent

    Actually they have (none / 0) (#120)
    by jimakaPPJ on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 11:11:33 PM EST
    Tulsa police and the Alcohol Beverage Law Enforcement Commission said that Debra Davidson over-served alcohol to a man who died in a car crash shortly after he left the bar.    

    Officials said that Jose Lozada wrecked his moped and died just a mile away from the bar. They said his blood alcohol level was nearly three times the legal limit. - See more at:

    Link

    Goggle "bartender charged for over serving" and you'll find lots more.

    Parent

    Does he want them executed... (none / 0) (#13)
    by kdog on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 01:58:10 PM EST
    before or after knockin' up the white wimin?

    Parent
    kdog, about your comment on the last (5.00 / 2) (#45)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:32:19 PM EST
    Open Thread about proposed Democratic debate;

    kdog, about the debate. (none / 0) (#203)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:16:49 PM EST
    Clinton did not ask for another debate. MSNBC and the New Hampshire newspaper, cannot remember its name, wanted to host a debate between Iowa and New Hampshire. They asked the three Dem candidates to participate.
    What the Sanders staffer said is incorrect and misleading.


    Parent
    Thanks Casey... (none / 0) (#133)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 08:18:35 AM EST
    that's a horse of a somewhat different color.

    Now I'm hearing Sanders will do this debate if Clinton agrees to add three more debates in March/April/May. A little gamesmanship at work on both sides I think, which is understandable, yet lame.  

    For the sake of the general election, I say again the more debates the better...it will only further highlight the buncha clowns running on the other side when the Dems have debates of substance and the Repubs have Piper's Pit debates.  The more that contrast is illustrated, the better.

    Parent

    I am all for more debates. (5.00 / 2) (#174)
    by caseyOR on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:23:32 AM EST
    Three more would be a good number. Even better would be to focus each one a specific policy area. Foreign policy, climate change and financial regulation/income inequality are three separate but interconnected policy areas i would like some in depth Q & A about.

    Parent
    And are we ever going to hear a discussion (5.00 / 3) (#196)
    by Anne on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:58:48 PM EST
    on women's reproductive rights and gender equity issues?

    Has there been a substantive, in-depth discussion about immigration?

    I'd like some discussion of social safety-net questions/issues, too.

    I suppose I should be happy that at least the Democratic debates have been miles ahead of the GOP version; I watched a little bit of last night's clown show, and once again, could not believe any sentient being could possibly want these people running the country.

    And did you see any clips of Carly Fiorina?  Lordy, that woman is toxic.

    Parent

    I believe that the state electorate ... (none / 0) (#42)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:25:16 PM EST
    ... met him at closing time after an all-night bender and took him home, only to wake up the next morning and ask, "Geez, who are you and why are you here?"

    Parent
    Nate Cohn has an interesting stat (none / 0) (#2)
    by CoralGables on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 12:31:47 PM EST
    out of Iowa.

    Polling done off voter registration rolls averages out at Clinton +9

    Random Iowa polling not using registration rolls averaged out has Sanders at +1

    Would be interested in how this stacks up in the GOP race.

    Yeah, (none / 0) (#3)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 12:43:32 PM EST
    that would be interesting.

    Parent
    I recently saw two of the Oscar nommed films; (none / 0) (#17)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 02:04:29 PM EST
    The Revenant and Joy (2x).

    Gotta say, I'm not blown away by either of them.

    I saw them both cold, iow, no idea what either of them were about, so no expectations.

    The Revenant was visually stunning, as you would expect considering who shot it, and the antagonist, Tom Hardy, is excellent. But the plot is really weak which limited DiCaprio's performance, imo.

    I saw Joy 2x because I wondered if knowing what the film was about when I saw it the 2nd time would make it any better. It really didn't. The only characters in the movie I cared about were Jennifer Lawrence's ex husband and the plumber.

    Both of these movies are "based on true events," but even with the "Hollywood-ization" of both stories they did not, imo, result in particularly good movies.

    Oh well, there are a lot of nommed movies I haven't seen yet, so there have got to be some gems in there!

    The only oscar nominated film... (none / 0) (#19)
    by desertswine on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 02:23:52 PM EST
    that I've seen this year was Bridge of Spies.  It was good but certainly not oscar-worthy.  Maybe it was just a bad year for me and the movies.

    Parent
    Seems like for me too. (none / 0) (#38)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:17:30 PM EST


    Parent
    I've seen 3 from the Best Picture category (none / 0) (#21)
    by CoralGables on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 02:42:01 PM EST
    The Big Short, The Martian, and The Revenant.

    None of the three gave me the impression they should win the award.

    As for Joy, it's not up for Best Picture, but rather Jennifer Lawrence is up for Actress in a Leading Role.

    Parent

    Spotlight (5.00 / 1) (#24)
    by MKS on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 03:00:57 PM EST
    Great ensemble cast. Restrained subtle performances.....

    Parent
    Yes, that is my favorite of the ones I have (none / 0) (#50)
    by ruffian on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:42:27 PM EST
    seen too. Have not seen Revenant yet.

    I did like The Big Short too. No restrained performances there, but they fit the story, and I thought the writing was great.

    Parent

    I do like J-Law, but man, this film didn't give (none / 0) (#41)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:20:15 PM EST
    her a lot of opportunity, imo.

    Which means she'll probably win the dam thing...

    Parent

    I enjoyed The Martian (none / 0) (#22)
    by CST on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 02:43:14 PM EST
    But I'm not sure I consider it an "oscar" film.  It was fun and entertaining for approximately two hours.

    Parent
    "fun and entertaining" is a level (none / 0) (#34)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:15:35 PM EST
    neither of the films I saw managed to attain!

    Parent
    The Revenant's been called (none / 0) (#100)
    by Mr Natural on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 07:34:22 PM EST
    meaningless Pain Porn.

    Ritualised brutality. Vengeful blood lust. Vicious savagery justified by medieval notions of retribution. We all know how dark the world can be these days. A world where men are garrotted and impaled. Where they're speared and disembowelled and have their necks slashed and their genitals sliced off. Where they're killed for no other reason than revenge. This isn't Raqqa, though, it's The Revenant: the hottest blockbuster of the season, winner of three Golden Globes a week ago, nominated for 12 Oscars last Thursday and yours for around £10-£15 this weekend at your local multiplex.

    It's a tale of "revenge, retribution and primal violence", according to the Guardian's Peter Bradshaw, "as thrilling and painful as a sheet of ice held to the skin". This is praise, by the way. It's "unthinkingly, aggressively masculine," says GQ. That's praise too.

    The film is based on a true story of the American frontier from 1823 and I'll summarise the plot for you: man seeks revenge, man gets revenge. That's it, basically, for two and a half hours, though there is a brief reprieve when you get to see Leonardo DiCaprio being mauled by a grizzly bear. Early reports suggested that he was raped. But no, that's a fate reserved for one of the two women who appear fleetingly on screen. (The other one is slaughtered. But don't worry, you have no idea who she is so you won't actually care.)

    It's also a mirror.

    Parent

    Didn't actually care about most of the (none / 0) (#105)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:01:46 PM EST
    characters in the movie, though I think that was a result of the writing, much more than the acting.

    That's a pretty accurate review.

    Parent

    I'm still trying to digest (none / 0) (#23)
    by Kmkmiller on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 02:47:46 PM EST
    The oscars so white controversy.

    First I think its a travesty.

    Second I recently watched BELOVED, Demme's movie based on Toni Morrison's awesome novel.  And the fact that movie totally bombed at the box office seems to be part of the problem too.

    Parent

    SNL Did an Awesome Spoof... (5.00 / 1) (#44)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:28:28 PM EST
    ...last Saturday.

    Even though the city was shut down, they put out one of their best shows.

    There was tweet going around:

    The older, white, male votership doesn't hate women, gays, black people. They're just not as interested in their/our stories.


    Parent
    That is it in a nutshell (none / 0) (#47)
    by ruffian on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:39:55 PM EST
    I guess a tweet really is a nutshell.

    It astounds me to think of all the movies about men's stories I have seen(and loved - there is no problem there). But just try to get most mainstream men to go see movies that are about women, without a woman dragging them.

    Same true for the racial divide.

    Parent

    A movie about men is (5.00 / 6) (#51)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:45:38 PM EST
    a movie. A movie about women or people of color or lgbt or anything else is a niche film. Chick flick, gay flick, etc.

    I am always taken aback by reviews of movies that have all or mostly all women characters because i have read so many such reviews where the biggest criticism is the lack of substantive male characters. I never read a review of a movie filled with male characters that laments the lack of substantive female characters.

    Just saying'.

    Parent

    Agreed. (5.00 / 1) (#115)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:42:45 PM EST
    One of my own pet peeves about films dominated by strong male characters usually arises whenever an actress of obvious -- and sometimes superior -- talent is misused in a throwaway supporting role relative to the guys, one in which she's sometimes treated as little more than a passing addendum.

    One such throwaway role this year can be found in "The Big Short," in which Oscar winner Marisa Tomei is cast as Steve Carrell's wife, and her screen time is so limited that were you to have to get up to use the john, you'd likely miss her completely.

    The luminous Janet Leigh received top billing alongside Frank Sinatra and Laurence Harvey in the 1962 political black comedy-thriller "The Manchurian Candidate," yet her one-dimensional role as Sinatra's love interest is so insubstantial that a judicious film editor could have relegated all of her scenes to the cutting room floor, and the audience would have been none the wiser as to her absence, and the film likely wouldn't miss a beat.

    Meanwhile, "Manchurian" co-star Angela Lansbury was relegated by producers to second-tier status in the credits, and she's so compelling and dominating while onscreen that her character of Mrs. Iselin has since been immortalized by the American Film Institute as one of the 50 great villains in cinema history. Go figure.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    Yeah (none / 0) (#63)
    by Kmkmiller on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:03:34 PM EST
    But there's an uncomfortable set of questions implied there....

    1. what are those stories?

    2. even if you had a set of AA film executives green lighting production of those stories would there be return on investment?

    See.  Now I know I'm not saying the right things just know that when it comes to race issues I can be for reparations.... But I am also a very staunch demand side thinker on market economy issues.  I don't think Hollywood can create a demand that may not be there just by creating a supply.

    In short, what i said above: BELOVED made no money.  

    Here's a fun interesting article  about what I'm getting at....

    Link

    And while it got a third season and even though I'm a huge fan, I have to admit there's little demand for this show compared to, say, THE WALKING DEAD.

    Parent

    Consider also that audiences found ... (5.00 / 1) (#107)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:06:02 PM EST
    ... "Beloved" to be rather slow and ponderous, even though it received great reviews. If you want to see an example of a great African American film that was outright snubbed by the Academy, I'd suggest that you next watch Spike Lee's "Do the Right Thing."

    I would also note that while ethnic and racial minorities comprise 35% of the U.S. population, they make up 44% of movie audiences. So the notion that there's somehow not a market for their stories is ludicrous.

    There have also been a lot of critically acclaimed films that were box office flops. The 1939 MGM Technicolor musical "The Wizard of Oz" never turned a profit until the studio re-released it ten years later to capitalize upon Judy Garland's then-popularity as a young adult star. And "The Shawshank Redemption" (1994), which is today a veritable staple in the cable TV's film rotations, proved itself a huge disappointment at the box office when first released in 1994, recouping only 60% of its costs through ticket sales.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    imo, if the notion is that the half-dozen or so (none / 0) (#110)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:18:20 PM EST
    studio heads who make the big decisions regarding the big films make those decisions in any way other than the way their company's research told them would have the chance of making the most money, that is notion is ludicrous.

    Parent
    We all have unconscious biases. (5.00 / 1) (#116)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 09:23:15 PM EST
    Those biases don't have to be overt to still affect our decision making. That said, filmmaking is a business in Hollywood, and as is the case in most industries, the studios probably put a lot of effort into marketing and research. The question then becomes, what are their parameters?

    If I have one overriding complaint about the films produced today by the Hollywood studios, it's that so much of their work product is often so uniform and redundant as to appear to be made by a cookie-cutter. Their preferred target audience is apparently so narrow, one wonders if they think people stop going to the movies once they reach age 30. And I daresay that's a complaint which has been repeatedly leveled at studios since all of us were under 30.

    And honestly, how much better would "Bridge of Spies" have been, had that film been instead produced by an independent studio, rather than subjected to the heavy hand of Steven Spielberg and his DreamWorks Studio? It's not that I necessarily found it to be a bad film, because it wasn't. But for the story Spielberg was trying to tell, it was overproduced and overdone, when smaller would have probably been better.

    I realize that the studios have to make money, but they appear to have become increasingly over-reliant upon the production and success of big blockbusters, to the extent that the singular failure of any one of these overblown movies with runaway budgets might be enough to put the studio which bankrolled it out of business, much the way that "Heaven's Gate" pretty much ruined United Artists as an independent enterprise in 1980.

    Does Big Hollywood even know how to make and market a good small film any more? Food for thought.

    Okay, gotta go. Great discussion. Aloha.

    Parent

    Big Hollywood has no interest in small films. (5.00 / 1) (#117)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 09:40:11 PM EST
    Huge, global, tentpole films are their business model.

    More (much more, sometimes) than 50% of their revenues come from overseas.

    The percentages of US minorities has remarkably little to do their "maximize ticket sales" responsibilities.

    Parent

    That's the point though (5.00 / 1) (#109)
    by ruffian on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:15:36 PM EST
    Black people go see movies with mainly white casts all the time, if they want to go see movies at all, they have to. Why will white people not see movies about black people? That is the reason movies about black people have lower demand - they don't attract many white people.

    Beloved is not a great example - it is based on literary fiction, not a mainstream genre. It was not made for a mass market movie audience. I saw it in the theater when it came out because I loved the book, but I don't even know anyone else personally that saw it.

    Parent

    True dat. And, generally, why don't males (none / 0) (#111)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:30:22 PM EST
    of any ethnicity care go see "chick" movies/sports/etc, although women are more than happy to go see "guy" movies/sports/etc?

    Why, generally, do all genders and ethnicities prefer to see movies with relatively beautiful people, vs unattractive ones?

    Why are all genders and ethnicities generally more willing to see a movie than read the book the movie was based on?

    Etc., etc.

    Parent

    I think it all boils down to the path of (none / 0) (#130)
    by ruffian on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 06:04:24 AM EST
    least resistance. People in general are not likely to opt for that which seems like more work. It is a challenge to relate to someone very different than yourself, even for 2 hours watching a film.

    Luckily for the film industry there are those of us that like to run away from ourselves as fast and far as possible!

    Parent

    Why don't you actually take the time ... (5.00 / 1) (#87)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 06:32:33 PM EST
    ... to examine the issue, before you hasten to label the #OscarsSoWhite protest a "travesty" on the apparent basis of your having recently viewed a single African American film, "Beloved"?

    Here's the problem. First, consider that African Americans comprise somewhere between 13% and 14% of the entire U.S. population.

    Now, consider that in the 87 years of the Academy Awards (1928-present), there have been 1,740 nominations for acting in the four major categories, of which African Americans have received only 66 of them.

    That's only 3.7% of the total. Further, of the 344 Oscars that have been awarded to date for acting in those categories, only 19 of those gold statuettes have the names of African Americans inscribed on them. That's only 5.5% of the total. And frankly, the only reason those numbers are even that high is because prior to 1983, it used to be far worse.

    Before Louis Gossett, Jr. that year became only the 15th African American actor or actress to be nominated for an Academy Award and only the third to actually win the Oscar (as best supporting actor for "An Officer and a Gentleman"), only two African American performers had ever won an Oscar for acting -- Hattie McDaniel in 1939 for Best Supporting Actress ("Gone With the Wind") and Sidney Poitier in 1963 for Best Actor ("Lillies of the Field').

    When Diana Ross was nominated in 1972 for her performance as legendary blues singer Billie Holliday in "Lady Sings the Blues," she and fellow nominee Cicely Tyson ("Sounder") were only the second and third African American women respectively to ever receive nominations as Best Actress in a leading role. The first was Dorothy Dandridge for "Carmen Jones," back in 1954.

    As noted prior, the first African American performer to be nominated for an Academy Award was the aforementioned Hattie McDaniel, who won in 1939. She remained the only African American to be nominated in any category until Dorothy Dandridge received her Best Actress nod in 1954. Whoopi Goldberg ("Ghost") in 1990 became only the second African American to win an Oscar as Best Supporting Actress, and further, she was only the ninth actress to ever receive a nomination in that category.

    Sidney Poitier was the first African American to receive a Best Actor nomination, for "The Defiant Ones" in 1958. It wasn't until 1969 before Rupert Cross became the first African American to receive a Best Supporting Actor nomination ("The Rievers"). The next time in that category wasn't until 1981, when Howard Rollins got a nod for "Ragtime."

    It took until 1985 before a movie produced by an African American was finally nominated for Best Picture (Quincy Jones, "The Color Purple"). And it wasn't until 2009 before we saw another (Lee Daniels, "Precious" and Broderick Johnson, "The Blind Side").

    In 2014, Oprah Winfrey became the first African American woman to produce a film nominated for Best Picture. Her film "Selma" was bested that year by Steve McQueen's "12 Years a Slave," which made him the first producer of African descent to win for Best Picture.

    In the category of Best Direction, out of the 438 directors and co-directors nominated for an Oscar over the nearly nine decades, 425 of them have been white males of European ancestry, which is about 97.5% of the total.

    It took until 1991 before an African American was even nominated as Best Director (John Singleton, "Boys 'n the Hood"). To date, only two African American directors have ever been nominated for their work. Astonishingly, the acclaimed director Spike Lee is not among them. Steve McQueen was the first person of African descent to win as Best Director in 2014 ("12 Years a Slave"), in addition to his award as producer, but he's British.

    As an aside, only four women have ever been nominated, and only one woman has won (Kathryn Bigelow, "The Hurt Locker"). Only three Asians have been nominated, all male -- Hiroshi Teshigahara in 1965 ("The Woman in the Dunes"), Akiro Kurosawa in 1985 ("Ran"), and Ang Lee, who won the Oscar both times he was nominated, for "Brokeback Mountain" in 2006 and "The Life of Pi" in 2012.

    At age 25, Jennifer Lawrence already has more Oscar nominations (four) than legendary African American actor Sidney Poitier ever received during his entire acclaimed 50-year career (two).

    Denzel Washington has the most Academy Award nominations among African American screen performers, with six (four for Best Actor, two for Supporting Actor), and is the only African American to have won more than one Oscar, as Best Supporting Actor for "Glory" (1989) and Best Actor for "Training Day" (2001).

    In other Academy Award categories, when you consider the wealth of contributions that African Americans have made to American music in our history, it's rather eye-opening to realize that African Americans have received only 3.3% of all Oscar nominations for film music.

    It took until 1984 before the rock star Prince became the first African American to actually win an Oscar for Best Original Score ("Purple Rain," 1984). Isaac Hayes won for Best Original Song in 1971 ("Theme from Shaft"), incidentally becoming the first African American to win an Oscar in a non-acting category.

    In 1972, Lonne Elder ("Sounder") and Suzanne de Passe ("Lady Sings the Blues") became the first African American screenwriters to ever receive Oscar nominations. To date, only five other African Americans have been thus honored in the categories of Best Original Screenplay and Best Adapted Screenplay, which represents only 0.08% of the total screenwriting nominations since the Academy Awards began in 1928.

    So, if you have an alternative explanation for these very apparent and still-ongoing discrepancies in both nominations and awards from the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences, other than the Academy's institutional bias, I'd sure love to hear it.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    Is the awarding of statuettes over the years (5.00 / 1) (#95)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 07:05:11 PM EST
    so different, statistically, from the makeup of the industry workers in the various Oscar categories?

    I'll save you the time, the answer is, in broad strokes, no.

    However, look at the dramatic under-representation of Hispanics and Asians...

    Parent

    Exactly. (none / 0) (#98)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 07:27:36 PM EST
    At present, it is estimated the 77% of Academy voters are white male. And that percentage has likely mirrored Hollywood's general workforce at large. Minorities and women have long been vastly under-represented in the film and television industries.

    To be sure, things have improved somewhat over the last 30 years or so, but not nearly to the extent that's necessary to reflect society as a whole -- particularly in the greater Los Angeles area, which arguably has the most ethnically and racially diverse population of any major metropolitan region in the entire country, save perhaps for New York City.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    If you are talking about that little pie slice (5.00 / 1) (#126)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:32:06 AM EST
    of humanity that represents Oscar noms, you are, in the main, talking about Beverly Hills, Bel Air, and the 'Bu.

    Those particular one percenters are very, very, well represented among the noms, I believe...

    Parent

    Probably. (none / 0) (#176)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:34:22 AM EST
    But I suspect what you noted earlier, which is that Hollywood's entire professional workforce as a whole -- not just the guys at the top -- was long dominated by white males, save perhaps for the landscapers, groundskeepers and custodians.

    My great-uncle (my maternal grandmother's younger brother) was a cartoonist / animator for Disney from 1940 until his death in 1961 at age 55, and in group photos I've seen of him and his animator colleagues, they're all white guys except for a couple shots from the '50s, in which a single woman was included. Not a single minority colleague in sight.

    Now, as evidence goes that's entirely anecdotal, but I think it's probably reflective of what Hollywood was like until only fairly recently, whether they worked in cinematography, sound, engineering, art, props, location scouting, accounting, etc.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    I meant (none / 0) (#101)
    by Kmkmiller on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 07:42:05 PM EST
    The situation with the oscars, the academys institutional bias, is a travesty.  

    And totally my bad shoulda been more clear.

    Parent

    Okay, you're forgiven. (none / 0) (#108)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:07:38 PM EST
    ;-D

    Parent
    feel free to crucify me here (none / 0) (#56)
    by CST on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:50:55 PM EST
    But man, sometimes I feel like the only person who just doesn't "get" Toni Morrison.  Not as a person, just as a writer.  I really am not a fan.  And no, it's not the subject matter, give me some Zora Neale Hurston/Maya Angelou any day of the week.  But Toni Morrison - meh.

    Parent
    Are you trying to start a (none / 0) (#60)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:58:13 PM EST
    literary flame war? :-)

    I do like Toni Morrison. I think her writing is brilliant. I also like Zora Neale Hurston and Maya Angelou. They each have a different voice, style, story to tell.

    Parent

    How dare you. (none / 0) (#61)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:58:29 PM EST
    I loved her first book, but couldn't finish a one after that...

    Parent
    Too much (none / 0) (#67)
    by Kmkmiller on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:08:04 PM EST
    Metaphor?

    Lol, this could get ugly.

    Parent

    I won't flame you (none / 0) (#129)
    by ruffian on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 06:00:45 AM EST
    I love Toni Morrison, though I can't say all of the stories or characters stick with me in a lasting way. I love the writing and the mental place it takes me when I read it.

    Song of Solomon...I remember reading that book and being entranced...but I could not tell you today what it is about.

    Parent

    If You Like 'Based on Real Events'... (none / 0) (#26)
    by ScottW714 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 03:26:20 PM EST
    ...Legend is pretty good, It's about identical twin mobsters in ~1960 England, Ronni and Reggie Kray.  One of the brothers was clinically insane, like pathologically insane.

    Tom Hardy plays both parts.

    Like all British movies, I highly recommend turning on the subtitles.
    --------------------

    I really like the Martian but stopped watching Black Mass.

    I also like going into movies blind.

    Parent

    Thanks I did enjoy Hardy in the Rev. (none / 0) (#35)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:16:29 PM EST


    Parent
    Any fish out there sarc (none / 0) (#20)
    by fishcamp on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 02:39:14 PM EST
    We've got sails and swords out in the deep, mangrove and mutton snapper on the patches, and allegedly bonefish in the Everglades.  Too windy and rainy for me.

    Calico and Johnny Bass lately, though 15' swells (none / 0) (#31)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:13:31 PM EST
    forcasted for this weekend.

    Going to St. Maartens in April, hope to land some Tarpon!

    Parent

    If true (none / 0) (#37)
    by jbindc on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:17:20 PM EST
    this is kind of weird

    Sanders operatives accused of posing as union workers in Vegas

    Operatives working on behalf of Democratic presidential candidate Bernie Sanders have been accused of donning pins implying they are culinary union workers to lobby for votes in several Las Vegas hotels.

    "We can confirm multiple reports of Bernie Sanders' campaign staffers attempting and gaining access to Employee Dining Rooms at Las Vegas Strip properties," Culinary Workers Union Local 226 said a statement shared with The Hill.

    "We are disappointed and offended. It's completely inappropriate for any campaign to attempt to mislead Culinary Union members, especially at their place of work," the group's treasurer, Geoconda Arguello-Kline, said in the statement.

    "We strongly condemn anyone falsifying their affiliation with the Culinary Union in order to gain access to properties and we will cooperate with casinos and hotels so that this matter is fully resolved," Arguello-Kline added.

    SNIP

    Sanders's campaign did not immediately respond to requests for comment from The Hill.
    If I told them once, (5.00 / 2) (#79)
    by KeysDan on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:40:04 PM EST
    I told them a thousand times: no Birkenstocks and no fedoras.  But, no, they wouldn't listen.

    Parent
    It gets weirder (5.00 / 1) (#190)
    by jbindc on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:30:49 PM EST
    Link

    Senator Bernie Sanders has built his insurgent presidential bid around being Mr. Clean, but several outside groups are now accusing his campaign of playing dirty.

    Sanders's campaign in Iowa has included League of Conservation Voters and AARP logos in recent mailers it's sent to prospective caucusgoers, a subtle effort to tie himself to those groups, if not implying an endorsement. But neither group has backed him. The AARP, which represents retirees, does not endorse candidates, and the League of Conservative Voters, an environmental advocacy group, is supporting Sanders's Democratic foe, Hillary Clinton.

    And now news has broken of what is potentially an even more bald-faced deception, in Nevada, where Sanders supporters have reportedly been posing as members of Las Vegas's powerful Culinary Workers Union Local 226 to try to rally labor support ahead of the state's Democratic caucuses on February 20.

    For a candidate who has boasted about not taking money from billionaires and never running a negative political ad in his life, the moves raise questions about the iconoclastic Vermont lawmaker's campaign just days before the make-or-break Iowa caucuses.




    Parent
    The campaign (none / 0) (#78)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:36:18 PM EST
    manager spoke about it was strange. Something about how they were dressed in Bernie campaign gear and going into commercial kitchens.

    Parent
    I wonder if the local DA (none / 0) (#121)
    by jimakaPPJ on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 11:25:16 PM EST
    will indict then for false ID?

    ...donning pins implying they are culinary union workers to lobby for votes in several Las Vegas hotels.


    Parent
    One good thing (5.00 / 1) (#123)
    by jondee on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 11:44:16 PM EST
    is that nobody has to worry about them bombing the hotels or murdering the employees to stop them from "killing babies".  

    Parent
    Actually that is a claim that (none / 0) (#148)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:03:05 AM EST
    has no proof.

    If they will lie and cheat about this, who knows what will turn them???

    Parent

    Susan (none / 0) (#49)
    by FlJoe on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:41:15 PM EST
    is not helping either
    When asked why she is not supporting fellow "feminist icon" Hillary Clinton, Sarandon cited Clinton's vote for the Iraq War and added that it's "patronizing to women to think that we all follow our genitalia to pick candidates."

    Sounds icky to me(YMMV).

    Yeah....not sure where her (5.00 / 2) (#52)
    by ruffian on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:45:57 PM EST
    genitalia is located...

    Such an idiot thing to say. How may Dem women went ahead and voted for McCain/Palin, because of a woman on the ticket?

    Am I excited to vote for a woman - you bet! Would I vote for her if I didn't think she was best qualified for the job? Uh, no.  

    Parent

    What was idiotic was the question Sarandon (5.00 / 2) (#74)
    by Anne on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:28:21 PM EST
    was asked, which was more or less "why aren't you supporting the woman?" so I completely understand her taking offense.

    In my experience, I get "so how come you're not supporting the woman?" or "so, you're a Democrat, right?  Guess Hillary's your candidate."

    It's annoying, and insulting.

    Parent

    She could (none / 0) (#80)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:46:47 PM EST
    have said it without being insulting though.

    Parent
    Susan Sarandon has long had a reputation ... (5.00 / 1) (#91)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 06:49:48 PM EST
    ... for forthrightness and bluntness. I agree with Anne; the question which was posed to her was both insulting and patronizing. Sarandon's not known to be either demure or ingratiating and speaking for myself only, I find that to be a rather rare and refreshing quality among Hollywood celebrities. We don't hold that against Warren Beatty, so why should we apply a double standard to her?

    Parent
    Yes, and I do admire that about her. (5.00 / 1) (#131)
    by ruffian on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 06:09:35 AM EST
    But if it was the question that was stupid, I wish she would have directed all of that bluntness and forthrightness against the stupidness of the question instead of patronizing the supporters of the other candidate.

    Parent
    The press (none / 0) (#92)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 06:53:33 PM EST
    asks insulting questions all the time. You can be blunt without being insulting. To me she was just crass. Anyway her response probably hurt the campaign more than helped.

    Parent
    Perhaps, but only to the extent ... (none / 0) (#97)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 07:18:19 PM EST
    ... that anyone may actually be paying attention to Sarandon's political opinions.

    Parent
    Reporters (none / 0) (#82)
    by FlJoe on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:52:45 PM EST
    asking offensive questions, check. Stereotyping your politics, check. Supporters saying "inartful" things, check. No big deal really.
     

    Parent
    Did Sarandon support Kerry? (none / 0) (#86)
    by smott on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 06:31:39 PM EST


    Parent
    No, because she's a big fan of Dick Cheney. (none / 0) (#93)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 06:56:45 PM EST
    C'mon. Of course she did. In fact, in 2004 she publicly urged fellow 2000 Nader campaign supporters to not make the same mistake twice.

    Parent
    Perhaps your question is (none / 0) (#57)
    by caseyOR on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 04:51:08 PM EST
    where is her brain located?

    Accusing women who support Clinton of "voting with their vaginas" is a pretty common line of attack from Sanders supporters.

    It is really quite insulting.

    Parent

    On a hygiene note (none / 0) (#66)
    by jbindc on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:07:15 PM EST
    If women are voting with their vaginas, then I demand some wipes and sanitizer at the polls!

    :)

    Parent

    You can certainly (none / 0) (#64)
    by Kmkmiller on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:06:32 PM EST
    Imagine what would happen if she implied AAs voted for Obama only cause they followed their skin color.

    So no.  Not helping.

    Parent

    99% (none / 0) (#89)
    by thomas rogan on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 06:35:49 PM EST
    About the same percentage of blacks voted for a Democratic presidential candidate as the percentage of votes won by one party dictators.  
    If 99% of whites voted for the republican you'd be calling them all racist.

    Parent
    You know, you might have a valid point, ... (none / 0) (#96)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 07:15:08 PM EST
    ... if Republicans weren't forever trying to demonize African Americans in order to pander to the worst fears and instincts of ignorant white voters.

    But, hey, thanks for playing.

    Parent

    Super PACs both good and bad? (none / 0) (#72)
    by Kmkmiller on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 05:23:25 PM EST
    Link

    Think I got this link business under control now.

    The winner of the undercard debate tonight (none / 0) (#94)
    by CoralGables on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 07:04:33 PM EST
    looks like it will be Jim Gilmore.

    That means it could be the last appearance on the debate stage for all of them.

    GIlmore (none / 0) (#99)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 07:31:00 PM EST
    I thought he had already dropped out.

    Parent
    I think everyone thought that (none / 0) (#102)
    by CoralGables on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 07:42:20 PM EST
    But tonight he was on his game (no one even knew he had game)

    Parent
    So many (none / 0) (#104)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Jan 28, 2016 at 08:01:30 PM EST
    of them I cannot believe are still hanging around. I mean Rand Paul, Carly etc. I guess they're all hoping for miracles where Jindal et al just gave up hoping for them.

    Parent
    Not as interesting as low fat (none / 0) (#146)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:00:04 AM EST
    diets and Hollywood...

    Here's a video of the killing that the media doesn't seem interested in.

    To save time pick it up around the 8 minute mark.

    There's no doubt he had his hands up. When did he drop them? Before after he was shot?

    I don't watch videos (5.00 / 1) (#156)
    by CST on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:14:37 AM EST
    of people dying.  And I am not going to start now.

    It would have been infinitely better if they managed to capture him without killing him.

    I can understand in this circumstance why an officer might have felt fear for his life considering they were known to be armed and had vocalized a willingness to use them.  It still would have been greatly preferable to take him alive.

    You are making a classic mistake though of assuming that the "media coverage" is lacking and that is why there is a lack of outrage.  Police kill hundreds of people every year, but we only talk about very specific egregious cases.  We don't talk about the rest of them for the most part, and the media certainly doesn't cover all of them.  They've covered this one a lot more than most.

    Parent

    Jesus Jim... (5.00 / 2) (#178)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:43:25 AM EST
    ...would it kill you find a link that doesn't have a popup stating Hillary should be in prison ?

    It no wonder you have no clue, that website is a cess pool and I would greatly appreciate you not linking to such a fowl website, I am at work.  That video is everywhere.

    If you can't figure if his hands were up when he was shot, I would suggest contacting a opthamologist.

    If you want to demonize the FBI, say he was losing his balance or not going for his gun, but to suggest you can't tell if his hands were up is being disingenuous at best.

    Parent

    It's a "liberal" thing (none / 0) (#181)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:50:52 AM EST
    You wouldn't understand

    Parent
    Yeah... (5.00 / 1) (#188)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:25:40 PM EST
    ...we tend to not have lying eyes.

    Parent
    Well.. (none / 0) (#205)
    by jondee on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 01:26:25 PM EST
    it might be an improvement over his other favorite site, Breitbart, where the regulars spent MLK Day railing about "darkies looking for a hand out".

    Parent
    I watched the video. (5.00 / 1) (#192)
    by Chuck0 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:33:34 PM EST
    Looks to me like he got out of the vehicle with his hands up. Then a few seconds later, he started reaching into his coat pocket. That's when he got shot.

    Parent
    But (none / 0) (#151)
    by FlJoe on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:06:13 AM EST
    why didn't he just comply with the cops in the first place? I have heard that refrain from the apologists time and time again. Not this time, I wonder why?

    Parent
    No you dont (none / 0) (#157)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 10:16:12 AM EST
    :)

    Parent
    Hard to tell from that video (none / 0) (#168)
    by McBain on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:08:13 AM EST
    but that won't stop people from pretending they know exactly what happened.

    Parent
    Well Video is Pretty Good Evidence (5.00 / 2) (#177)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:36:24 AM EST
    To me this is unlike shooting an unarmed black guy over a parking violation.

    His hands were not up, he was wanted by the FBI, and after stating on the TV, which surely the FBI saw, that he would rather die than get locked up in a concrete box, this a justified shooting IMO.

    He was going for a pocket that they later discovered a loaded weapon in.  No one will even know what his motive was, but from the video, his hands were not up when he was shot.

    The exact quote:

    "I have been raised in the country all my life. I love dearly to feel the wind on my face, to see the sun rise, to see the moon in the night. I have no intention of spending any of my days in a concrete box."

    I would argue he got his wish, because there was no way he wasn't going to jail and probably prison.

    Parent

    But (none / 0) (#182)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:52:47 AM EST
    If he had just "followed instructions" he would be fine, right?

    Parent
    Well, it's certainly never stopped you. (none / 0) (#185)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:59:50 AM EST


    Parent
    Video... (none / 0) (#180)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:47:57 AM EST
    ...for anyone who doesn't want to crawl inside Jim lunacy.

    Youtube.
    9min mark is where the truck starts slowing down.

    Parent

    Sanders finally agrees to NH debate (none / 0) (#195)
    by jbindc on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 12:51:29 PM EST
    Now awaiting DNC approval.

    So I guess (none / 0) (#198)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 01:09:27 PM EST
    we're going to have four more including this one?

    Parent
    Probably (none / 0) (#201)
    by jbindc on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 01:17:56 PM EST


    Parent
    And to add some fun into the mix (none / 0) (#203)
    by jbindc on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 01:22:26 PM EST
    Forecast is for a snowstorm to blow through Iowa "sometime Monday night into Tuesday morning", with predictions of 1-6 inches in some areas.  Now, Iowans are much heartier people than those of us here in the Mid-Atlantic,  but it could very likely depress turnout for both parties.

    (And with any weather forecast, it could be completely wrong too).

    That's probably correct, Howdy (none / 0) (#208)
    by McBain on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 02:07:13 PM EST
    If he followed police instructions he'd still be alive.

    Friday Humor, Somewhat (none / 0) (#209)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 03:01:56 PM EST
    Are you zero APR loan ?
    Cause you don't seem to understand my terms and you are showing zero interest.

    Are You a Beaver ?
    Cause daaaaaaaaaaaaaamn !!!

    Would you like a raison ?
    How about a date ?

    Hey Girl, Feel My Sweater.
    Its made out of boyfriend material.

    You must be wearing space pants cause your A is out of this world.
    Nope they are softball pants cause my A is way out of your league.

    On the radio earlier.
    I don't think I ever used a pick-up line, but I find them humorous.  Do guys actually use them ?

    et al (none / 0) (#210)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 03:08:55 PM EST
    Scott, I know nothing about the site except it posted the video. There are others that have now posted it and FNC finally showed a wee bit of it this AM. Don't know about the others. This one is the official FBI film.

    And yes, at 9:23 he clearly has his arms, with hands attached, outstretched. Then he turns to his left and his hands fall. Absent better video with sound you can't tell if he dropped his hands before he was shot or not.

    McBain, most likely. Of course people are already asking why the confirmation at night in the middle of nowhere. Plus, he had not attacked anyone and there was little chance of that happening.

    CST - That's true. We are selective about our protests and they are always tied to power and politcs.

    FlJoe - This is the basis of the protest.

    APPLICABLE PART OF ARTICLE 1 SECTION 8
    To exercise exclusive Legislation in all Cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten Miles square) as may, by Cession of particular States, and the Acceptance of Congress, become the Seat of the Government of the United States, and to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards, and other needful Buildings

    I haven't the vaguest idea if this actually means what it appears to say. That the Federal Government is limited to purchasing land to be used for:

    for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards, and other needful Buildings

    It seems to boil down to the definition of "other needful Buildings." Thousands of acres of land doesn't seem to be covered.

    The issue of the BLM combined with the EPA has reached fever levels in some parts of the west.

    Obama Outlines Rules for Closing Gender Pay Gap (none / 0) (#213)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 05:04:39 PM EST
    The Obama administration on Friday issued new proposals requiring all companies with at least 100 employees to disclose salaries broken down by gender, race and ethnicity. Obama's latest executive action would cover all companies with more than 100 employees, representing some 63 million workers.

    The plan comes seven years after Obama signed the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, designed to make it easier for women to bring pay discrimination lawsuits. It was the first bill Obama signed into law and just nine days after he took office.

    However, progress towards equal pay has been slow. When the Ledbetter bill was passed, women were paid an average of 77 cents to every dollar earned by a man. Today it is 79 cents. The median wage of full-time working women is $39,600 compared to $50,400 collected by men.

    Obama said women from ethnic minorities fare even worse. "The gap is even wider for women of colour. Black women collect 60 cents for every dollar, and Latino women 55 cents for every dollar a white man earns," he said.

    LINK

    No mention as to what they will do with that information.

    Interesting that the same folks (none / 0) (#214)
    by jondee on Fri Jan 29, 2016 at 11:23:41 PM EST
    who are now championing the narrowest possible interpretation of Article 1 Section 8 are the same folks who still favor the widest intepretation imaginable of the Second Amendment.

    Speaking of equal pay ... (none / 0) (#215)
    by christinep on Sat Jan 30, 2016 at 12:30:38 AM EST
    I understand that Lilly Ledbetter has just endorsed Hillary Clinton as a champion in working for women's equality.

    Thursday Open Thread | 215 comments (215 topical)