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Saturday Open Thread: Non-Email Edition

A female Trump supporter in Iowa has been charged with election fraud for voting for Trump twice.

The fire on the American Airlines 767 at O'Hare is really scary. How did they get all those people (and a dog) off the plane in one minute?

In Syria news: The so called "moderate rebels" teamed up with the Al Qaida linked jihadists from Jabhat Fateh al-Sham (formerly Nusra) in yesterday's Aleppo assaults. The U.S. media just wants to talk about the wonderful moderate rebels. What a joke. How is JFS less a threat to the West than ISIS? It isn't. Earlier this month, there were reports JFS is readying attacks on the West.

This is an open thread, all topics (besides Hillary's emails and Comey) welcome.

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  • Display: Sort:
    So a friend was on another plane (5.00 / 1) (#2)
    by Towanda on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 06:33:59 PM EST
    at O'Hare, landing in time to get to the World Series game -- she used to work for the Cubbies so got seats, good but costly.

    But her plane was held on the tarmac for hours, because of the fire on the other plane, for lack of sufficient staff to deplane them or something.  

    She missed the game.  The first Series game in 71 years in her fair city of Chicago, where she was born and raised a Cubbies fan to live for that day.

    Lawyers, who can she sue?!  There oughta be a law about airport staffing.  

    (At least when we recently were diverted to Ottawa and held on the tarmac for hours, also for lack of sufficient staff, and with broken bathrooms as well . . . all that we missed was a restaurant reservation in a far better destination.  Or perhaps tarmac is just ugly everywhere.)

    Oh no, that's too bad (5.00 / 3) (#19)
    by ruffian on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 02:35:09 PM EST
    Even though it has been painful to watch, I would love to be there. I was so hoping we could win it at Wrigley - now we will be really lucky to win it at all. Those Cleveland pitchers are just phenomenal, and I think our young players are more nervous than they expected to be. Bryant had two throwing errors last night - that was when I pretty much knew the wheels were coming off the bus.

    I've been so obsessed I have not been on the internet much. At least it is keeping me away from election insanity for a couple of weeks.

    Parent

    There was nothing on the net (none / 0) (#20)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 02:38:12 PM EST
    Worth a plug nickel that you missed :)

    Parent
    Ruffian, I thought of you (none / 0) (#23)
    by caseyOR on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 05:01:42 PM EST
    During the game last night. Our boys did seem to panic last night. I hope Maddon is able to calm them down and refocuse their energy.

    Parent
    You guys... (none / 0) (#111)
    by kdog on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 11:23:08 AM EST
    must be losing your sh*t!  Game 7 for all the marbles!!!

    Best of luck tonight.

    Parent

    The Cubs need to channel them (none / 0) (#93)
    by jondee on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 07:34:47 PM EST
    some Ernie Banks, Hack Wilson, and Billy Williams pretty soon..

    Those bats have been room temperature at best.

    Though they're showing some signs of life tonight.

    Parent

    Cubs win, 9-3. (none / 0) (#99)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 10:56:04 PM EST
    It all comes down to Game 7 tomorrow in Cleveland.

    Parent
    Cubs win the World Series! (none / 0) (#120)
    by caseyOR on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 11:52:35 PM EST
    Being the Cubs, of course, they gave their fans an anxiety attack by going to extra innings. Still, they won!

    Parent
    CUBS WIN!!! (none / 0) (#119)
    by caseyOR on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 11:50:25 PM EST
    Ruffian, do you believe it? They won!

    Parent
    Nice story: (5.00 / 1) (#121)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Nov 03, 2016 at 07:48:45 PM EST
    The Post Game | November 3, 2016
    Cubs Fan Drives All Day To Listen To Game 7 At Father's Gravesite - "For six games, Wayne Williams failed to keep up his end of the bargain. But he came through for Game 7. Williams had made a pact with his father -- also named Wayne -- that if the Cubs ever made the World Series, the two would listen to the games together. Unfortunately, the elder Wayne passed away in 1980 at age 53. The Navy veteran, who was on the ground at Normandy on D-Day shy of his 18th birthday, never saw the Cubs win a World Series. But the younger Wayne did. And he made sure to share the moment with his dad. On Wednesday, Williams drove all day from his home in North Carolina to Greenwood Forest Lawn Cemetery in Greenwood, Indiana, to listen to the game by his father's grave."

    My late father was born and raised in Northbrook, IL, which was actually a rural unincorporated farm community and part of Wheeling Township back in those days. He, my paternal grandparents, my grandmother's siblings and my uncle were all very serious Cubs fans, and none lived to see this moment. But I can't help but think that they were all together, smiling and raising a toast somewhere in Heaven last night, after that final out.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    seriously? (none / 0) (#4)
    by Jeralyn on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 06:46:54 PM EST
    I would just be thankful I wasn't on the other plane.

    Parent
    Sure, she was thankful to be alive (5.00 / 1) (#7)
    by Towanda on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 12:42:03 AM EST
    but she's a Chicagoan, so she lives for the Cubbies.

    Parent
    Ouch (none / 0) (#5)
    by TrevorBolder on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 07:33:20 PM EST
    That is plain awful luck

    Parent
    Ouch indeed...standing only tix start at $1,400 (none / 0) (#6)
    by pitachips on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 08:24:06 PM EST
    Good luck with that. (none / 0) (#8)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 01:52:35 AM EST
    I was flying into Chicago-O'Hare from LAX on United in Nov. 2004, and ended up landing at Rockford Airport and staying there for five hours, because of a security issue at our original destination. Never heard what the issue actually was, but it was very annoying, because they could've bussed us to ORD in about 90 minutes, and instead they held us at the RFD terminal the entire time, as were the passengers from about 9 or 10 other flights. Finally, we were cleared to continue, and the flight from RFD to ORD took all of 20 minutes.

    Parent
    Rule of thumb (none / 0) (#9)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 08:16:38 AM EST
    If they don't want to land "there."

    I don't want them to.

    Separate issue.

    Do they have enough facilities to safely serve the public?

    Parent

    deplane (none / 0) (#29)
    by linea on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 07:47:58 PM EST
    is too odd. i realize it's standard american english but somebody needs to convene a linguistic counsel to change it to deboard.

    there is also a special word for disembarking a train but im fine with that. but airplanes and spaceships should follow the nautical usage, yes?

    Parent

    Disemplane? Unboard? (none / 0) (#122)
    by unitron on Sat Nov 05, 2016 at 09:49:53 AM EST
    Deboard sounds as odd to me as deplane sounds to you.

    Parent
    Queen of England Offers Restoration (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by Mr Natural on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 09:04:04 PM EST
    Queen Offers to Restore British Rule Over United States

    Addressing the American people from her office in Buckingham Palace, the Queen said that she was making the offer "in recognition of the desperate situation you now find yourselves in."

    "This two-hundred-and-forty-year experiment in self-rule began with the best of intentions, but I think we can all agree that it didn't end well," she said.


    - Borowitz, The New Yorker, October 29, 2016

    Strangers on a Strange Election (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 06:29:16 PM EST
    The 2016 U.S. presidential campaign as experienced by four writers originally from somewhere else.

    By Anu Partanen, Sayed Kashua, Chigozie Obioma, and Yiyun Li, The New York Times, October 31, 2016

    The first thing I noticed about Americans when I moved to the United States eight years ago was the passion they bring to politics. People I'd meet would both worship and hate their politicians, as though they were celebrity athletes. At the same time, as the cliché goes, Americans want their representatives to be people they'd like to have a beer with. In Finland, where I come from, most voters like their representatives to be people they'd never want to have a beer with, mainly because of the risk of slow death by boredom. The more dull and engineer-like the politician, the better. That could be the Finnish motto. Don't kiss my baby. Go fix my health care.



    "Ideology Can Generate as Much Hatred (5.00 / 1) (#50)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 07:07:42 PM EST
    - as Tribalism, by Chigozie Obioma, NYT, 10-31-2016 (same as preceding reference)

    In Nigeria, and across most of black Africa, what divides us is mostly tribalism and religion. We are not, as yet, divided by ideology. But here, the left-right ideological divide is tearing the country apart. Ideology can generate the same amount of hatred as religion and tribalism, and as is the case with places where the other two dominate, it is dangerous when a group acquires any appearance of absolute power. As American culture lurches toward the liberal left, I fear that it may be seeking such power.

    The left has developed a potent strategy against which the right simply cannot contend: characterizing those who do not embrace liberal values as morally bankrupt, using labels like "bigot," among the worst of insults to Americans. I have observed that the default dynamic of public interaction here is for people to try to parse the group's consensus, and for everyone -- every single person -- to navigate toward that. Most people will not say what they truly feel. This is what has confounded me most about America in the time I have been here: The fear of being labeled with a disparaging term -- often simply for articulating a perspective that does not align with liberal political values -- causes many to remain silent. Freedom of speech is being severely curtailed throughout the country.



    Parent
    So (5.00 / 1) (#54)
    by FlJoe on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 07:40:22 PM EST
    When Trump calls a Judge unfit because of his heritage we are supposed to shrug it off as "not embracing liberal values"?

    If the bigots and their enablers are felling bullied right now, I would chalk that up as a win for the common good.

    Parent

    Quite brave of you (none / 0) (#52)
    by TrevorBolder on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 07:16:37 PM EST
    To post that

    Parent
    "I" didn't post it. [lol] (5.00 / 1) (#55)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 07:42:25 PM EST
    The New York Times "posted" it.


    Parent
    The irony (5.00 / 1) (#56)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 08:20:51 PM EST
    An opinion piece criticizing the left as stifling the opinions of others,  posted in what is alleged to be the epitome of the liberal press.

    Heh.

    I,OTOH, prefer to call a bigot a bigot, a misogynist a misogynist, an Islamophobe and Islamophobe, ,etc, when  it is appropriate.

    Parent

    No True Scotsman, eh YMan? (none / 0) (#60)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 08:44:58 PM EST
    No, I just prefer ... (1.00 / 1) (#63)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 08:56:09 PM EST
    ... honesty.  The truth hurts, eh, Mr. Natural?

    Parent
    Ad hominem abusive (none / 0) (#71)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 03:53:37 AM EST
    cheap crude low rent innuendo

    Parent
    Ad hominem??? (none / 0) (#76)
    by Yman on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 08:07:58 AM EST
    Did you assume I was talking about you?

    Heh, heh, heh ...

    Parent

    Well (none / 0) (#61)
    by TrevorBolder on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 08:48:58 PM EST
    That piece is just a logical conclusion to what has been trumpeted on  college campus's lately

    Parent
    As opposed to what's being ... (1.00 / 1) (#62)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 08:54:19 PM EST
    ... trumpeted on the wingnut internet, talk radio and Faux News?

    Yeah - I'll stick with the colleges.

    Parent

    Sigh (none / 0) (#64)
    by TrevorBolder on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 08:59:38 PM EST
    Colleges are meant to enlighten, open young minds to all ideas,
    Not to indoctrinate

    Wingnut radio (as you call it) is for the already indoctrinated

    Parent

    Libertarians certainly command enough (none / 0) (#65)
    by jondee on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 09:20:23 PM EST
    capital to start an Ayn Rand or Milton Friedman University, so maybe to counteract the spread of "indoctrination", they had better..

    Though, the economics departments at both Harvard and the U of Chicago seem to fit the bill fairly well already.

    Parent

    libertarians (none / 0) (#67)
    by linea on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 09:47:04 PM EST
    are utopianists.

    and utopianists are just plain silly. doesnt matter if you are a communist utopianist or a libertarian utopianist. put down that plastic cup filled with boxed wine and leave the Student Union Hall because utopianists are just plain silly.

    Parent

    I don't know if they're utopianists (5.00 / 1) (#68)
    by jondee on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 10:01:56 PM EST
    so much as people who've taken the feelings other people have about sex and transferred them to money.

    Parent
    It's also a place (none / 0) (#66)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 09:26:14 PM EST
    ... to learn about bigotry, misogyny,  racism, etc.  To learn how to speak out against them.  To learn that words have consequences and how to stand up to their bigotry and fight against it.  To learn that - just because the bigots have the right to their opinions - doesn't mean you have to acquiesce to them in the name of "tolerance".

    BTW - You "sigh" a lot.  Is that supposed to convey your frustration in restating what you think is obvious?  Because, if so ...

    ... that's seriously funny.

    Parent

    Half of the Right terrorizes (none / 0) (#69)
    by jondee on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 10:14:15 PM EST
    children by telling them they could burn in hell for all eternity, and people are concerned about the Left intellectually "indoctrinating" college students..

    Parent
    Argument to Authority (none / 0) (#70)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 03:53:06 AM EST
    Took a class in logic in college? (none / 0) (#77)
    by Yman on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 08:10:04 AM EST
    Maybe you can get a refund ... or a refresher.

    Parent
    is this directed toward me (none / 0) (#92)
    by linea on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 07:22:54 PM EST
    for my anti libertarian post?

    Parent
    The Secret behind Trump's 'Secret Voters' ? (none / 0) (#1)
    by Mr Natural on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 06:28:25 PM EST
    thanks, I had updated (none / 0) (#3)
    by Jeralyn on Sat Oct 29, 2016 at 06:43:05 PM EST
    the post with that but forgot to hit publish. I've got it at the top now.

    Parent
    Interesting article for a Sunday (none / 0) (#10)
    by TrevorBolder on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 08:43:50 AM EST
    What to make of all this? First, the associations between religion and health should force us to re-evaluate religion's role in society and public life. Religion is often perceived negatively today, and at times it's well earned. But the effects of religious participation are often profoundly positive, a point too often neglected or ignored. The health benefits can be added to a long list of virtues found with an active religious life

    http://tinyurl.com/zwtz3z5

    There are distinct health benefits to (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by Repack Rider on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 12:27:20 PM EST
    ...atheism.

    On Sundays I ride my bike instead of sitting on a fat...pew.

    When I was a kid, I sang in the church choir.  My 96-y.o. mom, who lives by herself, has a driver's license, takes Pilates and French classes, has given up on religion.

    Hasn't seemed to hurt her.

    Parent

    I know, and you write books and have (5.00 / 2) (#14)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 12:30:28 PM EST
    True friends who would do anything for you, even if you blaspheme something or someone ;)

    Face it! You are doomed!

    Parent

    Atheism leavened with a little (none / 0) (#74)
    by jondee on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 05:25:42 AM EST
    Leaves of Grass..a little Lao Tzu..works for me.

    "And this our life, exempt from public
     haunt,
     Finds tongues in trees,
     books in running brooks,
     Sermons in stones, and
     good in everything"

    Parent

    My secret shame (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by Repack Rider on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 01:57:59 PM EST
    ...is that I listen to the local religious radio station while I drive.  It actually reinforces my atheism.

    For an omnipotent deity, God is curiously constrained.  He can't defeat Satan, and He gave his "only begotten son" to save us from sin.

    What, He couldn't have any more kids?  Why not?  He's "the father."

    And why go through all this convoluted process of sacrifice and resurrection to accomplish something an omnipotent deity should be able to do by fiat.  Looks to me like He tortured the Kid just for fun.  Could have given Him a little morphine, ease the pain, but noooo.

    It's the most "Rube Goldberg" approach to salvation I could imagine.

    Also, if God is "the father," who is the mother?  Only reason I am a father is because someone else is a mother.

    If humans are built in His image, does that mean God has all the human plumbing and internal organs?  Why would He need a small intestine?  What does He eat?  Does He have a male organ?  I know how I use mine, what does He use His for?

    Parent

    Maybe with the exposure (none / 0) (#11)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 11:28:55 AM EST
    of the evangelical movement as a hoax politics will be separated from religion and religion can stand on it's own two feet unencumbered by a political party that is viewed as an agent of white nationalism. Maybe the whole evangelical movement will collapse on it's own corruption.

    Parent
    Wouldn't it be nice if everyone just (none / 0) (#15)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 12:32:50 PM EST
    Lived by the effing beatitudes? It's endless Bible study where I live. Like everyone is hunting for loopholes in the code or something ;)

    Parent
    You know what's ironic (5.00 / 1) (#18)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 02:10:29 PM EST
    Most evangelicals tend to ignore the beatitudes. That's more of a Catholic thing. As far as bible study goes, I think for some people it's more of a social group than anything else.

    Parent
    So I'm only getting beattitudes out of Tim Kaine? (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 02:41:24 PM EST
    Actually (5.00 / 3) (#22)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 03:50:38 PM EST
    Tim Kaine is an excellent example of the beatitudes in action :). Hillary is John Wesley do as much good as you can for as long as you can for as many as you can :)

    Parent
    You complete me as I continue (none / 0) (#33)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 12:07:56 AM EST
    To attempt to live in the land of Bible Studies twice a week.

    Parent
    Most of these studies are so old it's pathetic (none / 0) (#13)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 12:28:36 PM EST
    And no comparison study to those who simply have good social support verses church membership. Human beings are social creatures, we need to belong. Too many churches preach exclusion, exclusion of gay individuals, exclusion of different faiths, the new evangelicals are frighteningly hateful and hate filled.

    I'd like to see recent studies done comparing the old service to others versions of Lutherans, Episcopalians, and other pre-evangelical versions of faiths compared to the new bright shiny hate mongering magical thinking selfish name it claim it Evangelicals. Cuz Evangelicals are dropping like flies around here.

    Parent

    Well (none / 0) (#16)
    by TrevorBolder on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 12:59:24 PM EST
    The study was published online May 16, 2016 in JAMA Internal Medicine.

    The study was conducted by the Harvard School of Public Health, not the Harvard School of Religion, so I think the researchers were just looking at health benefits.

    But if you feel that all attending religious services are evil racist bigoted misogynous evil doers, I doubt you would appreciate the health benefits determined by this study.

    I myself fall into the believe in God, do not attend services category, so , it was some interest to me.

    "Our results suggest that there may be something important about religious service attendance beyond solitary spirituality," said Tyler VanderWeele, professor of epidemiology at Harvard Chan School and senior author of the study. "Part of the benefit seems to be that attending religious services increases social support, discourages smoking, decreases depression, and helps people develop a more optimistic or hopeful outlook on life."

    http://tinyurl.com/hsgc5ev   The actual study

    Parent

    Bullsnot....the first 2 studies in this article (none / 0) (#34)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 12:21:46 AM EST
    You actually used are more than 15 yrs old. One of my best friends is a researcher. I've had some assistance in what composes good/relevant "studies" and how to find bias because of my medically challenged son. So bring it. The studies this article was based on are no longer relevant to the study of current sociology.

    Now you only connect to this Harvard "womens study"...foolish boy. The empowered women on this blog will shred this religious shit to pieces.

    I'll do it in the next few days...fear not. You know what makes women mentally and physically healthy as long as mortally possible? Good nutrition and control of their bodies and lives. Not bowing to idols and men with clay feet.

    Parent

    Well (none / 0) (#35)
    by TrevorBolder on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 04:26:41 AM EST
    I read the article in yesterdays USA today.

    I then googled the Harvard school and found the second study by the same author.

    You are more than welcome to reject the studies,

    I found them interesting, worthwhile and having  considerable merit

    Parent

    Not all studies are created equal (none / 0) (#36)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 08:43:12 AM EST
    Even when from Harvard

    Parent
    It's the health benefits of marching, Trevor, (none / 0) (#24)
    by Mr Natural on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 05:31:37 PM EST
    for armies and ideologies defined and empowered by religion.  Then there's the healthy exercise attending the forced diasporas, migrations, emigrations, running for the hills, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, by populations fleeing advancing religious hordes.

    For further details, consult anyone's history of any period.

    Parent

    I do not (none / 0) (#25)
    by TrevorBolder on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 05:34:53 PM EST
    Believe that was part of the Harvard study.

    I believe the Harvard study was conducted with the attendance to weekly religious services in mind, most likely restricted to this country, in this time frame.

    Parent

    Anything can be proven (none / 0) (#26)
    by Mr Natural on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 06:25:09 PM EST
    with a sufficiently narrowed study.

    The downside?  You'll know more and more about less and less.  In the limit, you'll know everything about nothing.

    I don't believe much but it does seem that church affiliation provides for people community in a nation starved of community.

    Parent

    I guess (none / 0) (#27)
    by TrevorBolder on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 07:10:14 PM EST
    It wasn't meant to be a historical thesis on religion,

    But more a health study.

    I just found the article interesting, especially as a health study

    Parent

    I'm not arguing. (none / 0) (#28)
    by Mr Natural on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 07:24:02 PM EST
    People need community.

    Parent
    John Prine.. (none / 0) (#73)
    by jondee on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 05:10:30 AM EST
    So if you're walking down the street sometime
    And spot some hollow ancient eyes,
    Please don't just pass 'em by and stare
    As if you didn't care, say "hello in there, hello"

    Parent
    everything happening in syria (none / 0) (#30)
    by linea on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 08:12:50 PM EST
    was caused by america's proxy war. the americans gave money and support and advisors and high-tech arms to the "moderate" islamists and turned the entire country into a failed state. i assume all the death and misery was to remove the russian naval base or maybe the goal was simply a failed state?

    For every season, (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by Mr Natural on Sun Oct 30, 2016 at 08:26:43 PM EST
    and every generation, a Vietnam.

    Parent
    I can't remember a time (none / 0) (#37)
    by CST on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 03:29:32 PM EST
    I wanted an election to be over this badly.

    Can someone wake me up on November 9th and tell me whether or not this country elected a racist, sexist, and in a lot of ways even worse - complete f*cking moron - as president.

    And don't give me that "he ran a business went to Wharton cr@p".  He's still an idiot when it comes to government.  As seen in the debates, and every time he opens his mouth.

    I know and the media (none / 0) (#38)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 03:53:24 PM EST
    treats him like a normal candidate of which he is not. It's like if Pat Paulsen were the nominee of a major party.

    Parent
    Uh, no (none / 0) (#39)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 04:15:03 PM EST
    Pat Paulsen was a professional comedian.

    Parent
    Donna Brazile Axed by CNN (none / 0) (#40)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 04:16:18 PM EST
    Is giving questions to one side a crime? (none / 0) (#41)
    by McBain on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 04:34:06 PM EST
    Or some kind of election rules violation? I'm curious why this story isn't a bigger deal.  

    Parent
    It's all private enterprise, as far as I know (none / 0) (#43)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 04:49:16 PM EST
    for everybody involved, the parties, the networks.  

    They control the message and they control the massaged, which is us.

    Parent

    The Primaries (none / 0) (#45)
    by CST on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 04:58:01 PM EST
    Aren't technically considered elections to the federal government.  That's why you can have things like Superdelegates.  The fact that voters can participate is really just a choice that the DNC made.

    Parent
    The Bernistas (none / 0) (#42)
    by TrevorBolder on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 04:44:17 PM EST
    Must be losing that loving feeling of all

    Coming Together

    Parent

    I've spoken with a lot of younger people (none / 0) (#44)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 04:51:35 PM EST
    lately.  They revile Trump but "Hillary" isn't far behind on the distrustometer.

    I put Hillary in quotes because none of us really knows her.  At this point, she's a product, a media package.

    Parent

    Funny stuff (5.00 / 2) (#59)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 08:36:46 PM EST
    I put Hillary in quotes because none of us really knows her.  At this point, she's a product, a media package.

    Really?  As opposed to most other politicians/celebrities/public figures, who you've only read about but you actually believe you "know".

    Heh.

    Parent

    Jeralyn has met her, likes her (none / 0) (#46)
    by McBain on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 04:59:05 PM EST
    but I think I  know what you mean.  When she speaks, every word seems so rehearsed.... not genuine.  She doesn't have her husband's gift for public speaking.

    Parent
    Peter Thiel: 'What Trump represents... (none / 0) (#49)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 06:48:09 PM EST
    'What Trump represents isn't crazy, and it's not going away' - USA Today, 10-31-2016

    Thiel ... said he was surprised by the level of outrage. He specifically called out a leading LGBT magazine, The Advocate, for running an op-ed that questioned whether Thiel, a prominent gay conservative, could still be considered gay for backing Trump.

    "The lie behind the buzzword of diversity could not be made more clear," Thiel said Monday. "If you don't conform, then you don't count as diverse, no matter what your personal background."



    Parent
    From what I gather about Thiel (none / 0) (#51)
    by TrevorBolder on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 07:14:56 PM EST
    Is that he thinks the people  (elites once again)  that have been running the world for years, have made 1 mistake after another, both parties.

    Much like the new economy is taking over, PayPal, Uber, Amazon,

    Thiel believes the same change should be made politically.

    And he specifically does not agree with everything Trump advocates, and especially every utterance from Trumps mouth,

    But he is the only apparatus for change...right now

    Now Thiel starting up a political operation would be interesting

    Parent

    Are you seriously suggesting Thiel (5.00 / 1) (#72)
    by jondee on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 05:01:20 AM EST
    is somehow NOT one of the "elites"?

    And what are these out-of-the-box, new ideas he's bringing to the table besides MORE privitization, deregulation, and the idea that the biosphere only exists for the Free Market to take a big steamy, toxic, dump on?

    Parent

    YES (none / 0) (#75)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 06:03:38 AM EST
    I'm still waiting, John Galt (none / 0) (#84)
    by jondee on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 10:34:49 AM EST
    let's hear some of these innovative, untried, "outsider" ideas someone like Thiel is likely to bring to the table.

    Parent
    The Biggest Outsider Idea (none / 0) (#85)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 01:31:55 PM EST
    Elect someone totally outside the system.

    Break from the Status Quo, or you will get more of the same
    A small touch of Thiel


    "To the people who are used to influencing our choice of leaders, to the wealthy people who give money and the commentators who give reasons why, it all seems like a bad dream," he continued. "Donors don't want to find out how and why we got here. They just want to move on. Come November 9, they hope everyone else will go back to business as usual."

    The election, he added, "is less crazy than the condition of our country" and he's voting for Trump because other politicians are "just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic."

    "This intolerance has taken on some bizarre forms," he said. "The Advocate, a magazine which once praised me as a 'gay innovator,' even published an article saying that as of now I am, and I quote, 'not a gay man,' because I don't agree with their politics. The lie behind the buzzword of 'diversity' could not be made more clear: If you don't conform, then you don't count as 'diverse,' no matter what your personal background."

    "Voters are tired of hearing conservative politicians say that government never works," Thiel said.

    "They know the government wasn't always this broken. The Manhattan Project, the Interstate Highway System, and the Apollo Program -- whatever you think of these ventures, you cannot doubt the competence of the government that got them done. But we have fallen very far from that standard, and we cannot let free market ideology serve as an excuse for decline."



    Parent
    That's a political gimmick, not an idea. (none / 0) (#89)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 06:52:56 PM EST
    TrevorBolder: "The Biggest Outsider Idea[:] Elect someone totally outside the system."

    Not only that, but it's one that voters in both Minnesota and California already fell for. They couldn't wait to rush the polls and elect former WWF superstar Jesse Ventura and aging action movie hero Arnold Schwarzenegger, respectively, as their governors. In both instances, the nascent appeal of both those candidates to voters was that of being an "outsider."

    How exactly did that work out for everyone?

    Parent

    I don't know (none / 0) (#91)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 07:11:18 PM EST
    That fella , the mayor of NY did all right as an outsider

    It all depends on the person,

    But it still is an attractive quality if voters are upset with the status quo.

    If the political system keeps serving up retread politicians, it will push voters to extremes looking for anything different

    Parent

    The political system didn't pick them (none / 0) (#98)
    by Yman on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 09:45:14 PM EST
    Voters did.  The that your party picked an extreme and unqualified candidate with the temperament of a spoiled child is a reflection of Republican voters.

    You own it.

    Parent

    Well (none / 0) (#102)
    by TrevorBolder on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 05:37:41 AM EST
    Try reading the Wiki Podesta e mails, the DNC had their thumb firmly on the scale, Ms Brazile was feeding Madame Sec debate questions.

    Both parties have a significant portion of the electorate that are fed up with politics as usual.

    The DNC cleared the field for Madame Sec, with Biden in the race The Bern is your candidate.

    RNC did no such thing, they did not clear the path for 1 or 2 candidates, in fact in turned into a demolition derby.

    But the end result, both parties have a equal number of voters that want change from the status quo.

    Parent

    You Putin (none / 0) (#104)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 06:01:38 AM EST
    trolls love spreading his nonsense don't you? So far the only thing you've succeeded in doing is by pushing Trump crashing the Asian markets this morning.

    Parent
    More sulky fairy tales (none / 0) (#105)
    by Yman on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 07:47:14 AM EST
    The DNC did no such thing, and only the Republicans chose an qualified, hateful, misogynistic, bigot.

    He's the head of your party,  because he reflects what your voters want.

    Parent

    Firing head coach Mark Richt last year ... (none / 0) (#100)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 11:19:34 PM EST
    TrevorBolder: "But it still is an attractive quality if voters are upset with the status quo."

    ... was an attractive option to many fans of the University of Georgia Bulldogs football program, simply because he similarly represented "the status quo." In reality, although he had won 82% of his games in a decade at Athens, that didn't matter to angry and unreasonable zealots who had visions of national championships in their starry eyes.

    One year later, with Richt now coaching at up-and-coming Miami, the bumbling Bulldogs have stumbled to a 4-4 record and are out of contention for even an SEC division title.

    The concept of seeking change merely for its own sake, when due solely to one's own misguided desires for instant gratification, has rarely if ever worked out well for those who sought such change in the first place. As far as your assessment of Mr. Bloomberg's tenure as New York mayor is concerned, I'd offer that nearly half the city would likely disagree with you regarding his performance.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    Putin is an (none / 0) (#101)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 05:03:42 AM EST
    outsider that would "shake up the political elites". And wanting to blow up the system has a name. It's called nihilism.

    Parent
    Like hell he did... (none / 0) (#106)
    by kdog on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 09:13:56 AM EST
    Bloombucks ate arse as Mayor, unless you're the type to bump into him at cocktail parties...only good thing you could say about him was he wasn't Rudy F*ckin' Guiliani.

    Jesse The Body, otoh, he seemed to do ok considering the two political cartels in the state legislature had no intention of working with him.

    Parent

    I find it hysterically (none / 0) (#107)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 10:04:42 AM EST
    funny that Trevor would praise Bloomberg when not all that long ago they were completely up his butt about something with soft drinks and a tax on the size. But then if you're really a Putin troll you would not know all that about Bloomberg.

    Parent
    I love ya GA.. (none / 0) (#108)
    by kdog on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 10:35:03 AM EST
    but I think you and many others here have Trevor pegged all wrong.

    Disagreement or a different political view does not make one the enemy or a puppet of the GOP or Putin or Pick Your Boogeyman. It's abundantly clear Trevor is not a Trumper...at least to me.

    Maybe when silly season is over we can pick each other's brains again instead of nitpicking and pegging...6 more motherf8ckin' days.

    Parent

    You know there's (none / 0) (#112)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 11:30:13 AM EST
    disagreement and then there's coming here deliberately spreading misinformation which is what Trevor does. I live in a red area. It's not like I never come into contact with Trump supporters. But at least to my face at least they are not spouting conspiracy theories. They usually say they don't like Hillary. I'm like fine whatever. Nobody is going to be liked by everybody.

    Parent
    Correct (none / 0) (#113)
    by TrevorBolder on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 04:18:21 PM EST
    Thank you,

    Never knew I was a Putin plant,

    Before that I was a Alt Right aficionado,

    And I forget what I was before that

    If they just loosened the tin foil, it would get the blood flowing again

    I will not be happy with the winner on election day,

    I have issues with both, and will not vote for either.

    Not quite in Philip Nolan status, I also believe that we will survive the next 4 years, no matter who is the victor.

    And I predict they will only be in office for those 4 years

    Parent

    You need to get it together (none / 0) (#115)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 04:59:50 PM EST
    The alt-right and Putin are one in the same. Putin has been funding the alt-right.

    Trevor, you support Republicans. All the Republicans are supporting Trump. Can you tell me the difference?

    I called my senators and my representative. They are okay with Putin interfering with an election. They are okay with Trump going on trial for fraud. The most truthful thing Donald ever said was that he could shoot someone on 5th Avenue and it wouldn't alter his support. How can you say you support down ticket Republicans and not Trump? They are one in the same.

    Parent

    I didn't praise Bloomberg (none / 0) (#114)
    by TrevorBolder on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 04:19:41 PM EST
    He wasn't a total disaster , coming in with no political experience.

    His nanny state proposals were quite ridiculous

    Parent

    It's good to hear an uber-libertarian (none / 0) (#95)
    by jondee on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 07:46:43 PM EST
    like Thiel acknowledge that "Big Government" can sometimes be utilized intelligently and resourcefully.

    Parent
    Exactly (none / 0) (#103)
    by TrevorBolder on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 05:37:45 AM EST
    Thiel speaks his mind, and is not a pre packaged product.

    He does not have both feet planted in any political camp.

    Parent

    They ought to go (none / 0) (#53)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 07:29:48 PM EST
    after Thiel about some of his crazy ideas and his suing of the media. He and Trump have that in common instead of the fact that he's gay.

    Parent
    Thomas Frank (none / 0) (#78)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 08:14:20 AM EST
    Takes on "The Elites"

    http://tinyurl.com/zrjapny

    Everything blurs into everything else in this world. The state department, the banks, Silicon Valley, the nonprofits, the "Global CEO Advisory Firm" that appears to have solicited donations for the Clinton Foundation. Executives here go from foundation to government to thinktank to startup. There are honors. Venture capital. Foundation grants. Endowed chairs. Advanced degrees. For them the door revolves. The friends all succeed. They break every boundary.

    But the One Big Boundary remains. Yes, it's all supposed to be a meritocracy. But if you aren't part of this happy, prosperous in-group - if you don't have John Podesta's email address - you're out.



    Parent
    And there's no one (none / 0) (#79)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 08:23:17 AM EST
    more elite than Donald Trump.

    Parent
    Wrong Again (none / 0) (#80)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 08:29:18 AM EST
    The Elites have always despised The Donald.

    Some upstart young kid , whose father had a decent real estate business in Queens, should just stay there!!!
    How dare he attempt to cross the river and enter Manhattans real estate market, that is solely for the elite, not some Queens riff raff.

    Lol, The Elites have always lived in Manhatttan,

    The Donald had to claw and scratch his way into that Manhattan real estate market.

    Much like Tony Manero, The Donald was not accepted by Manhattan


    Parent

    Heh (5.00 / 1) (#88)
    by vicndabx on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 04:18:01 PM EST
    "upstart" "claw and scratch"

    yeah, OK.  I wonder, do you actually live in NYC or have you ever?
     

    Parent

    The GOP (none / 0) (#81)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 09:41:24 AM EST
    elites it seems but plenty of other elites seem to like Donald especially Putin. Or don't you consider Putin part of the "elite"?

    Seriously as far as NY society goes it seems he's been a big part of it for around 30 years. And if you're talking about the old guard well, they don't accept anybody. They would think the same way about Hillary and Bill.

    Parent

    Just like Tony Manero.. (none / 0) (#82)
    by jondee on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 10:21:05 AM EST
    If Tony Manero had been born into a real estate empire and inherited a paltry what? 50 to 100 million? depending on who you talk to..

    Tony Manero. Oy.

    You better quit now Trevor, before you get too carried away and have young Donald working his poor fingers to the bone as a weaver's apprentice to help feed his family like Andrew Carnegie.

    Parent

    Roy Cohn didn't despise Donald (none / 0) (#83)
    by jondee on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 10:24:02 AM EST
    or maybe he just thought he was cute..

    Parent
    Oh ... my ... god (none / 0) (#86)
    by Yman on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 01:43:22 PM EST
    Donald Trump not an elite (snicker). A "young upstart kid" who's father had a "decent" real estate business (chortle) and who had to "scratch and  claw" his way into the Manhattan real estate market (guffaw!).

    That was funny.   Delusional, ...

    ... but seriously funny.

    Parent

    Ha ha ha ha (none / 0) (#96)
    by jondee on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 07:51:03 PM EST
    stayin' alive, stayin alive..

    Now I can't get disco dancing Trump outa' my mind.

    Parent

    Must ... Stop... (none / 0) (#87)
    by Yman on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 02:36:52 PM EST
    ... laughing ...

    A little reality/fact check for your Horatio Alger fairy tale.

    Trump's false claim he built his empire with a `small loan' from his father.

    Hahahahahahahahaaaaa.....

    Parent

    Naw (none / 0) (#47)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 05:23:57 PM EST
    they don't care. They kept insisting Bernie won the debates. It would not have helped Bernie anyway. He wasn't into answering questions.

    Parent
    every one i know (none / 0) (#57)
    by linea on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 08:21:24 PM EST
    is selecting hillary and mailing in their ballot. and most everyone i know was a bernie supporter.

    Parent
    Oh, I was just responding (none / 0) (#58)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Oct 31, 2016 at 08:31:50 PM EST
    to the person trying to spread dissension about Donna Brazile but honestly I thought she was a Bernie supporter during the primaries.

    Parent
    Uh, no. (none / 0) (#90)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 06:59:18 PM EST
    Donna Brazile was always in Hillary Clinton's corner this go-round. And if she did indeed forward a debate question to the candidate's advisors, then she was wrong to have done so.

    Parent
    If true, and it sure looks true, it was (5.00 / 1) (#97)
    by McBain on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 09:33:07 PM EST
    also wrong for the Clinton team not to tell CNN they had one of the questions in advance. This isn't helping her trust issues.

    Parent
    police shooting update (none / 0) (#94)
    by linea on Tue Nov 01, 2016 at 07:44:59 PM EST
    A grand jury has come to the conclusion that Mobile Police Officer Harold Hurst should not face criminal charges over a controversial June 13 encounter that ended with the death of Michael Moore.

    The grand jury's conclusion: "Officer Hurst acted reasonably, justifiably and in accordance with all applicable laws. The officer had a right to protect himself, and a duty to neutralize the threat to innocent civilians in this populated neighborhood."

    I wonder (none / 0) (#109)
    by FlJoe on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 10:38:51 AM EST
    what "basket" this guy fell out of?  
    The suspect in the deadly ambush shootings of two Iowa police officers appears to have argued with local cops in a recent video - after he brought a Confederate flag to a high school sports game.
     Good luck pinning this one on BLM.

    Yep (none / 0) (#110)
    by FlJoe on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 10:59:03 AM EST
    it was all about BLM
    He offered a tragically ironic explanation for his Confederate flag display in a comment posted on the YouTube video.

    "I was offended by the blacks sitting through our anthem," Greene said. "Thousands more whites fought and died for their freedom. However this is not about the Armed forces, they are cop haters."

    and according to neighbors he is a Trump supporter (no surprise there).

    Parent
    are there people on this blog (none / 0) (#116)
    by linea on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 07:43:22 PM EST
    who falsely accuse BLM activists of murdering police officers? or is this a straw man argument?

    Parent
    Neither (none / 0) (#117)
    by Yman on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 08:20:27 PM EST
    Good luck pinning this one on BLM.

    Pretty sure the comment was not addressed to people on this blog, but to those who have tried to falsely blame BLM for other acts of violence against police.

    Parent

    i had not heard this (none / 0) (#118)
    by linea on Wed Nov 02, 2016 at 08:50:09 PM EST
    so i googled it. you're right.

    Parent